Night weaning a 12 month old - Advice needed

[Atomic1010]

Hi - my little boy is 12 months old next week.  Since about 9 months old he has woken twice a night and I have breastfeed him. I do not bf to sleep I should add and put him back in the cot drowsy. Anyway, the two night wakings have been occurring between 11.30-12.30 and 2 and 3.30. He usually wakes for the day at 6 am and has a regular bedtime of 7-7.30pm.

He is on three meals a day albeit the amount he eats varies considerably. He is almost 11kg but eats less than other babies his age.

Given the regularity of times at which he wakes making us think it's habitual waking and the fact that I am going back to work next month, we decided to night wean last week with the aim of removing one of the feeds as I don't think he is waking for hunger.  Although I am not sure as when on the breast he does guzzle away.

So daddy has been going into settle him for the first wake up for the last four nights. Obviously my LO hasn't liked this change and has had hysterics and it has taken him a while to get back to sleep. We have found on two occasions that daddy has settled him, only for him to wake up 40mins later screaming again. At which point I have gone in and fed him as we aren't sure if he waking from hunger.

My questions are:
1) how do I know if LO is really hungry?
2) assuming LO is not hungry - are we going about this the right way, and if not, does anyone have any better suggestions on how we might go about this? Have tried reducing length of breastfeed to just two minutes each side and being doing this for at least a month.

Ive read up on wake to sleep but as the wake up time can vary by over an hour I don't fancy the idea of sitting awake by the cot for potentially an hour or so.

Any thoughts appreciated! Thanks

[Atomic1010]

Can believe I have had no replies ..thought there would have been loads of mums with some tips for night weaning 

[jessmum46]

Sorry you haven't had any replies yet . I'll see if I can get some others who have been through it to pop in and offer some advice.

For now - what does he have in the day in terms of breastfeeds?  Just morning and BT or are there other ones too?  I know he doesn't have large amounts in the way of solids but does he have a good variety including fats and proteins?  What about snacks?

For naps and BT - is he always fed as the last thing before sleep?  Just wondering as although you say you put him down drowsy, LOs can still become reliant on a feed to get them into that fuzzy warm pre-sleep state even if they technically fall asleep on their own.  Have you ever put him down fully awake or without a feed first?  One of the first things I'd do would be to clearly separate eating and sleeping for naps and BT with a story and make sure he gets used to going into bed fully awake.  You might need to sit with him and offer verbal reassurance (try not to hold/pick up as these can easily become props) until he settles, and the work on gradually getting out of the room.  What do you think?

I think at 12 months you have to trust in the fact that a LO who is on a reasonable diet (they can eat like sparrows sometimes in terms of solids and that's ok) and some milk does not need night feeds.  He may have become accustomed to them and feel hungry (just the same as you or I would if we were late having dinner one day) but a couple of nights of feeling a bit of hunger will not do him any harm.  He certainly shouldn't be needing feeds as close together as 3-4hrs overnight - you would expect a baby of 4 months to be able to go that long. 

I think if you've worked on going down fully awake at BT and you know he is able to self-settle (albeit with you there to start with), then at night I would probably just drop all feeds and when he wakes sit back by the cot and encourage him to go back to sleep using your voice.  If you want to keep one feed then do that instead - whatever works for you.  But set a rule e.g. no feed before 5am. It's likely that you will have a few rough nights and need to be up with him for an hour or longer at a time, but he should learn quickly if you are consistent

Hope that helps to start and others may be on soon to offer their experience x

[anna*]

Hi there.

I don't think you need to worry about hunger. I mean, yes he may be hungry but he's not going to waste away, and hunger passes. It's possible to be habitually hungry - if you set an alarm for 3am and got up to have a sandwich, after a couple of nights you'd probably start to wake up hungry. So I would just push through and not worry about it. He'll make up the calories the next day.

I think you're doing the right thing. Personally I wouldn't feed at all at this point. If he wakes 40 mins later, settle him again. At this age it can be confusing if you will sometimes feed him but not at other times - after all, he doesn't understand your rationale.

FWIW it is possible to just keep one NF. I nursed my daughter at night until 18 months, because with a 5am feed she would sleep until 7am, but without it we would be up for the day at 5am. So if it works for you, you could keep one feed but YOU decide the time. So you could do a 10.30pm dream feed, or an early morning feed.

The other thing with my daughter I found I had to put her in her cot (at night and for naps) totally awake. Not 'drowsy' (eyes heavy, head on shoulder) but absolutely awake. The 'drowsy' thing was a prop for us, and she would wake up and not know how to get back to that state by herself.

[Atomic1010]

Thanks both so much for your replies, much appreciated.

I don't bf before naps but I do at bedtime, so I will move that to earlier in our bedtime routine and put the story in its place. Although tbh he usually is awake after the bedtime bf when I put him in his cot and he self settles, but perhaps it is best to remove this association of a bf right before sleep.

I understand what you have said about dropping all feeds in the night (although Anna I am a bit confused about what you have written on this as it seems to contradict?) and I did wonder whether we were confusing him by keeping the latter of the two night time feeds.i just thought if we dropped them one at a time it would be easier for him, and us, but perhaps I am just prolonging the agony for us all instead!

He has started waking at 5.30-6 ish for the day now rather than 7ish. Not sure whether this is a consequence of what we have started with the night weaning or teething but it's not great when we are having disrupted nights. Hope it soon passes! Thanks again.

[anna*]

Yeh I realised what I wrote is contradictory. I guess I'm saying, if you want to keep one feed, do it, but make it on your terms i.e. decide what time is right (a 10.30 dream feed or an early morning hours feed) and don't nurse him outside of those times. After my son I had a morbid fear of early mornings, so from what you've written if you could dream feed at 5am and that would see him sleep until 7, I would definitely do that.

[Atomic1010]

Thanks Anna. We decided from last night to send Dad in both times DS wakes as think it will be less confusing for him.  So far it's going ok and my LO settles relatively quickly after Dad goes in rather than the hysterical crying we have had. How long should it take for LO to break his waking habit? I was thinking it would take a weekis that realistic?

[anna*]

Yeh I would expect to see a difference inside a week

[Atomic1010]

Presumably LO won't be waking and crying when this is all done! but will get himself back to sleep?  Also what should dad be doing when he goes in? At the moment he talks to him gently and sits with him til he falls asleep. This only takes 10-15 mins.

[anna*]

Yep. He may wake, but he won't need help to go back to sleep. I would try and get dad to only stay until he is calm, then take a step away from the cot. If he starts to cry, try to reassure him using only his voice, then once he's calm take another step away from the cot. The aim is to be out of the room before he falls asleep.

[roimata9]

I night weaned my boy a bit younger, but dropping all feeds was the only way it worked. I think he was rousing slightly and crying to see if this would be the feed time.
He may find it hard because you've changed quite a few things at once, going from mum coming in, picking him up feeding him; to dad and not picking up or feeding. I didn't touch my DS when we did it, just went in, sat out of sight and sung his sleep song. It only took 3 days for us until he slept through!

[Atomic1010]

Well for the first time ever my LO slept through til 5.30 this morning woo hoo! Unfortunately I kept waking up expecting to hear him so didn't have as much sleep as I could have done.  I went in and fed him at 5.30 in the hope he might nod off again for an hour but no such luck!  I hope early wakings aren't going to be a result of sleeping through the night. If so what can I do? I suspect not much if he isn't tired.

[anna*]

If they persist after a week or two you can try tweaking the routine, and you can try Wake to Sleep. But lets see how things pan out. Yay to sleeping through!!

[Atomic1010]

Thanks Anna :-) fingers crossed it continues and he gets back to waking at a better hour. He slept for over two hours this morning, clearly making up for the early start!

[roimata9]

I would probably not feed him at 5:30, just try to resettle like a NW. Otherwise he'll think 5:30 is wake up time! I wouldn't be surprised though if he starts having shorter nights or naps since he's not waking all the time.