BabyWhispererForums.com
SLEEP => Sleeping For Toddlers => Topic started by: cuckoochick on July 29, 2014, 19:53:17 pm
-
We really need some help. So we've been just in survival mode since having G. Her sleep has been rubbish but more recently improved but she's not an independent sleeper and won't go to bed for anyone but me and now AP is not really working. Plus she either STTN or we get a 2hr NW. No apparent rhyme or reason.
When I was in hospital,having my appendix removed, she was either up unto, 10:30pm for ILs or DH had to drive 40miles to get her to sleep.
In the daytime, she goes to sleep easily for her naps. MIL sings to her and DH usually either cuddles or rocks her. Takes a few mins. BT she nurses to sleep. She has always been easy to get into bed once she's fed to sleep but more recently, she wakes more easily and is then a nightmare, like tonight. She was asleep but then woke as I got to her door. An hour since and I've rocked her, cuddled her, lay next to her cot, patted and she still won't sleep. She's playing with me in there (same as for NWs) but if I leave the room, she loses the plot. If I sit out of her eyeline she screams. She goes from playing to full on screaming with big fat tears rolling down her face very easily. If I send DH in, she screams as though he's hurting her. The 2hr NWs are driving me insane- we probably get the anything from 2-3 times per week, regardless of her routine. DH is in there now- she's either screaming or playing- yep singing in there now and it's been 1.5hrs trying for BT now. AP isn't working as well for him at BT if I have enough of it- he usually lies on the sofa bed in there but it takes sooooo long for her to go off and if he moves and she hears back to screaming. I am getting pretty over it and we need to do something about it.
I've always put off because of the reflux, illness etc or because I'm at work but with me being off, now is the time.
So how on earth do you do this with a spirited monkey? She's walking around the cot or throwing herself around and I worry she's going to get hurt. Do I need to lose the nursing before bed entirely? I've got my first night out in over 19mos coming up in 3 weeks and so we need her to be able to go to bed for DH as I don't fancy coming home and having to get her to bed at 11pm or whatever!
Her routine is variable especially as it's school holidays so we are being a bit flexible with WU especially after NWs we try to sleep as long as we can. She went to 1 nap early at 8mos and has always been v high A times/LSN.
Wake up 7:30am usually
Nap 12:30/1-2/2:30 we usually try to limit this to 1.5hrs now as with 2 hr nap,she won't sleep any longer than 10.5hrs at night and we were getting EW so we thought it might help but we sometimes let her have 2hrs
BT: 7:30-8 but tonight it is 9pm and she is still larking about/screaming.
NW is usually 1:30/2 for around 2hrs. Nothing works to get her back to sleep.
Please help. Xxx
-
I can't help as I am having almost exactly the same thing with my 12 month old. Except she used to go to sleep just fine and now doesn't. I wondered if it was separation anxiety and am doing a very very gradual withdrawal, which is how I STed in the first place...but it's not going brilliantly.
I am waiting with bated breath for the words of wisdom. In the meantime I lie next to her cot, hold her hand, and play suduko on my phone under the cot so she can't see it!
-
Nicola have you tried an even shorter nap? Sounds weird I know but on days we cannot wear E right out (and I mean the park 3-4 times plus 2 hrs swimming as wearing her out!) she will only do a good night on a 45 min to maybe 1 hr nap. I really don't like it as I have no time at all to do stuff but we are down to one brief nw (& one night of sttn!) so I have to pick my battles!
E screams too if she is in her crib and I am not touching her - but in my arms she flails too. I do the phone under the crib too - scrabble ;). I think though for it to work the feeding association needs to be broken yk? E is on bottles and a few weeks ago I swapped her bottle to before the bath.
-
I think I'd agree the feeding right before sleep needs to go. You don't have to stop nursing completely but maybe do as Heidi suggested and feed her before bathtime. The shorter nap is also worth a try if she's very LSN.
I wonder from what you've written whether (given your/DHs presence isn't helping anyway) she actually needs to be left on her own to settle to sleep? Possibly for a spirited LO your presence in itself is enough to keep her from settling? I'm not suggesting for a moment that you let her CIO or anything like that, but that even though she isn't and hasn't been an IS, you may need to use something more like WIWO?
Is her room pitch black? Does she have a lovey?
-
Hey sweetie. Honestly, I think you need to do WI/WO or it's not going to work. Her age, and spirited traits really don't bode well for much success with GW UNLESS YOU WANT TO BE DOING IT FOR MONTHS :-\ (sorry I didn't mean to use caps)
I think it sounds like most of this is prop related :-\ do you have a plan or thoughts on what you can and can't do with regards to ST....if you can handle the crying (or if DH can) then I would invest in some ear plugs and either sit in the room out of sight reassuring when you need to, or do Wi\wo.
It will probably take hours....but progress will be fast....I promise :-*
-
Thanks ladies, we're off out but I'll be back. Thanks so much :-*
-
Medi is quite spirited too - and would never fall asleep if I was there watching her as she'd just want to play. If she's not settling I do wi/wo now too.
-
Sorry to keep hijacking, tell me to get lost and start my own thread if I'm annoying you...but Z will bang her head on the bars, pull her own hair, vomit......that is why I did GW as I don't want her to hurt herself. But you are right Zacs Mum - we are not doing brilliantly. How do you keep them safe during sleep training if you do wiwo?
-
Hugs! We had to do WIWO with dd2 as she is a spirited little miss and I had gotten into the habit for NW to just bring her into bed with us and then transfer her back when she was asleep. (it worked brilliantly until she was about 1yr) She then started to play around in our bed and so 1 night when dh was at his mom's recovering from knee surgery dd2 and I did wiwo. It took me 2 hrs but she went back to sleep and the next night it only took an hr and now at 16 months she STN (minus teething or sickness) At bedtime we put down she stands up and cries I usually go back in 1 time and then she puts herself to sleep. Same with nap. It is hard and she of course woke up dd1 in this process (small house) but now 4 months later SOOOOOOO worth it as we all sleep and actually dd2 sleeps later then dd1 in the morning!
-
Sorry to keep hijacking, tell me to get lost and start my own thread if I'm annoying you...but Z will bang her head on the bars, pull her own hair, vomit......that is why I did GW as I don't want her to hurt herself. But you are right Zacs Mum - we are not doing brilliantly. How do you keep them safe during sleep training if you do wiwo?
Honey I'd start a new thread so we can all support you there too and give specific advice on your LO
-
Ok, I've updated my old one, it's called how to get my twins to sleep (can't do links, sorry!).
Cuckoo - good luck! I'll be watchig with interest!
Thanks everyone!
-
GW would not work here...it is all or nothing with this kid! She was really using me as a prop (wanted to rub my hand or arm to fall asleep) so I started a modified wi/wo where I did sit by her crib for a bit and then left, instead of just in & out quickly. Mostly now she is just grizzling as she falls asleep, almost a weird loud mantra that sounds bad but is not at all like her "I need you now" cry.
-
Hi ladies, sorry for my rudeness in not replying. It has been a busy few days.
We have got to do something- BT tonight is horrific. It's 9:15 and she's still awake. I'm sat in the dark of her room. She is alternating between screaming and losing the plot to playing. I'm sat out of her sight and actually silent. She is now just rolling around in her cot but at least lying down now as I must have put her down 30times. I need a proper plan of action as I'm going to have to start working on an evening soon preparing for work. She nursed tonight but I think she was a bit UT at BT tonight as she wasn't tired at all so I took her into C's room for extra stories. Back in and she was just wild. We didn't have a bath tonight so I'm wondering if that hasn't helped but to be honest, probably clutching at straws.
Since I posted we had that monster BT, then the next night a 2hr NW and last night a STTN. Tonight we're obviously in the I'm not going to bed club.
I am so so cross with myself for letting it get this far. I feel like it is going to be so much harder now that she is older. She is so so relentless and v v angry. C was a breeze compared to this! :o but then I also feel bad for putting her through it.
So what on earth do I do? Do you think WI/WO will work better? She is losing the plot so am I literally going to be in and out of the door? Do I use a sleepy phrase? She doesn't really have a lovey but I'm trying to get her to take one. If she's standing up, do I lie her down? I'm terrified she's going to really hurt herself as she's in a sleeping bag. Am I allowed to comfort in the cot at all or am I best to say/do nothing?
She finally seems to be settling down now and is more still and quiet. Not sure if she's asleep yet as she hasn't started snoring yet! 😜
Thanks x
-
Oh lo don't beat yourself up. You know my T...he was ridiculous for a long time and we had to re ST so many times but now, he's great. You will get there :-*
Do you feel in the fight mindset to do this? Got DH on board? If so I think you want to first get some. Ear plugs, and run through a plan with DH as this will probably take a week. (Not screaming for a week, but a good week to really turn the corner to no crying IS at BT etc yk)
You really have two options.
1) sit in the room. Only interact when she is really upset but try to to PU or touch. Sitting on the floor across the room is a good spot, or by the door. Once she is asleep you leave. The next day do the same thing and hope she starts to settle herself in the cot. After this you can move out the door. This can work if she gets manic when you leave and you feel it's too hard for you to be working out her mantra/angry/real cry etc.
2) WI/WO. (Happy to elaborate etc if you prefer this)
I think wi/wo will work faster. It's also likely to make for one angry long first night though. If you can get through the first night you will be ok. We always comforted on WI with words to start with ie it's time for sleep now darling, you need to lie down and go to sleep by yourself. But if things got too hard to bear I never felt a quick PU and cuddle then back in the cot after a min or so hindered. Some kids though will latch on and you may loose progress.
Both my kids were in sleep sacks too. I guess it is hard because they can hurt themselves. If so I would comfort as usual (ie if you weren't st) but then go back to it once she comes down.
Does any of that make sense?
Lots of hugs and love Nicola you can do this!
-
Also forgot to say that with both my kids when they started to take forever to settle with me trying to apop it was really their way of telling me they wanted to do it on their own, but couldn't....so it ended up being exhaustion that eventually enabled sleep ::) not fun for anyone
-
So it's nap-time and I clearly don't have a plan. I'm sat where she can see me but faced away. She's alternating from screaming to playing. It seems silly to be sat here while she's playing but if I leave then she gets worked up v quickly but perhaps wi/WO would signal it's sleep time more. Idk? What exactly do I do with WI/WO? It took her an hour to settle with me in the room last night but at that rate she won't be settling for a nap. Is it try for 45mins still? Her routine has been pushed too far forward because of these nights and DH and I stupidly let her lie in because we were so exhausted too. I'm so cross with myself today because I clearly don't know what I'm doing. I know she isn't CIO as I'm sat here and she's now blowing raspberries having a whale of a time.
-
She ended up going to sleep after 25mins. I hate the crying but now that we've come so far, I know we have to go on. I'd really appreciate any thoughts so I can formulate a better plan for BT tonight. She is not going to be happy with not nursing and as it's our only feed, I feel as though if I drop this, I might as well stop BFing altogether. Really it is just for AP now and it's losing it's magic anyway. But then I also feel desperately sad but I know of she thinks there's an option for boobs she's going to go nuts.
We're thinking of changing up the evening routine so that the girls will have a bit of supper and milk before their bath, then teeth brushed and stories together and then new BT for G. Why do I feel so bad about this? C is v distressed at the crying but I guess it's best to do this while she's on school holidays and can lie-in to catch up.
Any thoughts greatly appreciated x
-
No useful thoughts, but lots of hugs. She sounds determined and very clever - makes ST tough but otherwise these are brilliant qualities to have and you must be really proud of her.
-
Thank you. :-* She is v bright. I knew they would both have different personalities but they are so v different. G is so so determined. This is a fab quality in her but also makes her a bit more scary to handle! Ha! She goes from 0-60in a few seconds! Ha! She's brilliant and I know once we get this sorted, it will be so much better for her and for us all. She will just not go to bed for DH and really we'd like to have a bit more flexibility now x
-
Of course. And you will get there, and it will all be better for it.
I didn't see your bit about dropping the feed. I have just stopped BFing as I will have to start travelling for work soon so I wanted the girls to get used to no BF before there was no BF and no mummy at the same time. But it was horribly sad, and I am still a bit sad about it. But things that helped me were building in a special cuddle before bed where we read a story and cuddle really close, and remembering that BFing is just a part of being a mum, and that now they are older we have so many more ways to show our love - cuddles, songs, stories, pancakes for breakfast, trips to the swings.....and so I did all of those things for a bit, cried a lot....and got roaring drunk one night for the first time in about 2 years!! 😄 I'm here if you want to talk about it though. It is sad, but it's a lovely thing to have done for both of you, and you have given little G such a good start!
-
Sorry Hun...it's been night time here so I only saw your posts now.
If your going to do WI/WO you will have more crying. But like I said, it works much quicker (I think) and is less confusing for them.
I would talk to her during the day about how she is going to sleep on her own tonight, then do your BT routine. Nursing at BT is fine IMO. I still give T a bottle before bt ::) Z had a BF at bt till 18 mths too. After BT routine say your sleepy phrase and pd into the cot then WO. Once at the door take a breath and listen. Don't panic and run back in or you may miss what her crying is telling you. If she starts to cry an I need you cry then you WI - say your sleepy phrase and then WO.
You will be in and out for a bit, but then you will figure out her mantra, or settling cry, or she it'll start to try to settle herself and you may then only have to go in and out a few times in say z20 mins before she drops off. You then do WI/WO at NW etc. if your going to try to wean the Bf at night it's a good time to do it too. Go CT on the lot.
Could DH or you take C and have her away from the crying. Or put some kind of white noise between the rooms temporarily? The other focuses on G and getting her to sleep on her own?
-
Thanks sweetie and don't worry, you gotta sleep! :-*
So, BT was before I saw your reply but DH did BT tonight!!! We did stories in C's room and G had a bottle. She loves books and is v excited to be having stories in C's room. It wasn't particularly calming but I figure it will get easier. Then DH took G into her room while I stayed with C for more stories and cuddles. He sang to her for a while and then put her in her cot and continued singing to her for a few minutes. He gave her a lovey to cuddle and then sat out of her eyeline. He shhhed if she got really upset and lay her down a few times but she went to sleep in about half an hour. That is a big improvement on the other night which was an hour. I guess now we need to work on getting out of her room before she is asleep but I'll take where we are for a bit for now.
It hasn't really sunk in that I think we've stopped BFIng. I fed C until 18mos too and I kind of feel guilty but I think it would be harder to get her off and into bed if I keep the BT BF.
-
I've always used WIWO with my 2, both of them always struggled with any form of STing with me in the room. If I sat on a chair doing GW they would have gone on forever ::).
We had a bit of a relapse with Megan at a similar age (DH got into the habit of cuddling her to sleep when I was poorly - then guess whose job it was to fix the issue ::)). I did a fair bit of sitting on the landing out of her sight, and intermittently saying 'its sleepy time Megan'. Often the crying was much more in line with her being annoyed and cross rather than full throttle need iyswim?
Unless it makes them really worked up, it is a great STing tool.
I think I would just try and explain to C what is going on. She isn't much younger than M is she? M would def be able to understand that she was very cross with Mummy, but she needed to learn to sleep nicely now that she is getting bigger so she has enough energy to play. And that Mummy and Daddy need enough energy to play as well.
How did it go this evening?? Like you say, you have started now so really need to see it through, and in just a few days all should be an awful lot better :-* :-* :-*
Just seen you reply - glad it is better - hugs for the end of BFing but I think you are right that it would be harder xxx
-
Thank you. Liz :-*
We have explained to C and she seems to understand but doesn't like the crying. She has lullabies playing in her room but G is SO loud it's difficult to drown her out! Anyway, it's school holidays so if C is up late she will lie in and copes well with later nights. I need to pull G's routine back as we've gotten into this cycle of late to bed and late up or late up because of the long Nw and then with her high A times it's been hard to pull back even when we've cut her nap to 45mins. I've decided we'll have to take the plunge and just get her up at 7:30 tomorrow (she was asleep by 20:50).
But yes, I was pleased with how she settled for DH tonight. Xxx
-
I understand Hun. Z found TOms crying quite distressing too. Even with explaining they still feel 'sad' and worry don't they poor little kiddos. We actually turned his white noise up loud as well while we did it ::)
The first few days are tough, I totally agree about waking her, even after the late BT. You can go for EBT if you need to or cap that nap to get back on track but honestly, I think this is a prop issue and things will settle as you move forward (they did with us anyway at this age :-\ )
Hugs and sending vibes of strength xx
-
I hope your night was okay.
-
Thanks. She STTN. We woke her at 7:30 as per the plan. Some of the settling issue was for sure UT I think because well we can't have it all (early To bed and a lie-in) so DH and I want to get that 7:30 BT back even if it means being up at 7am! It's been ridiculous her not going to bed until 9pm and C even as nice as an 8-8:30 lie-in has been!
-
Nic, I'm following just so I can add any help that I may be able to. I don't really have experience of WIWO to this scale, we do it with Ben on the odd time now that he needs it but he is not in Miss G's league at all so a very different story!!
The only thing I will say is that I've found that the rare NWings we do get now have been when the nap has been before 1pm (we have a WU of 7.30/8am usually) and/or longer than 1.5-2hrs. I think Ben needs at least 5 hours A time either side of the nap. BT here is 7.30/8pm, roughly 12 hrs from WU, and we generally get 11.5-12hr nights.
I know you've got more issues going on than nap length/time that need to be tackled first but something to keep in mind too.
Good luck honey, I'm rooting for you :-*
-
Tonight isn't going so well. She's losing the plot for DH. I am lying within Charlotte and I feel sick. She napped 1.5hrs today until 2:30 (she settled for her nap within 10mins). I'm worried she is UT. DH is in there shhhing and you'd think he was murdering her. I am beside myself here.
-
I'm holding your hand. She's angry, remember, not sad. And she is a clever girl and will learn quickly.
Poor all of you though.
-
Oh love it is hard. I cried in Toms room when I had to ST him.
Do you think the shying is working? - I really think maybe she would respond better to you not being in the room rather than actively shying/near the cot. What do you think?
-
Hugs hun, holding your hand too as you wait. Fwiw I also agree with Sara - I'd get out of there and give her space to settle xx
-
(((Hugs)))
I wonder if it is a case of 'near yet so far' making her so cross :-\. Especially since you lying with her has resulted in playing, messing and all sorts in the past.
Thing is, even if she is UT, she should be able to lie in her cot, cuddle her lovey and chatter to herself for a bit.
It once helped me to remember that it becomes a battle of wills. I was just about to cave in (with DS who is rather spirited with sleep!), when I suddenly wondered why I was going to? And lose to a 15 month old. It was almost like as soon as I had that thought he started to settle. Must have sensed I was determined ;).
I always prefered to ST myself. I think I felt better being 'in the thick of it', but it is obviously different when there is a BFing issue as well :-\.
Lots of love :-* :-*
-
It once helped me to remember that it becomes a battle of wills. I was just about to cave in (with DS who is rather spirited with sleep!), when I suddenly wondered why I was going to? And lose to a 15 month old. It was almost like as soon as I had that thought he started to settle. Must have sensed I was determined ;).
This is totally me with T too. I had to think differently. I'm the mum, I can do this. I can be more patient than a toddler. I won't give in. :-*
-
Thanks ladies. I've talked to DH and got him to agree that he won't shhh. I asked him if he thought she'd settle better without him and he felt nervous about it too that she was yelling so much with him there. She was upset when DH took her away from me into her bedroom. He is sure that she was so mad because she wanted to be with me. I know she is cross and I know that we need to keep going but tonight it felt really awful, like I was doing something horrible to her. I think that combined with her not being that tired meant she had a lot of fight in her. I'm solo tomorrow night as DH is at work so fingers crossed that will go ok.
She didn't end up settling until 8:30 again tonight. Her day was
7:30
Nap 1-2:30
We were aiming for BT at around 7:45-8pm. After a 1.5hr nap, I knew she wouldn't go to sleep after 5hrs.
Maybe we'll need to try WI/WO but I'm worried to do that tomorrow night when I'm on my own, although I can't sit in there for an hr while she's screaming either as C will be on her own and she's finding the crying distressing. Maybe she'd be ok with the iPad but I don't like doing that for ages unless I really have to.
Thanks for holding my hand through this. X
-
Good luck tonight xxxxxxx
-
Good luck honey, stay strong x
-
Good luck for tonight. You can do it.
-
Thinking of you :-* :-* :-*. But also thinking of all those lovely evenings you will get back soon as well. I know it has been pretty rough for you :'( :-* :-*.
-
Not going so well. I foolishly thought I could maybe just feed her a bit but now realise CT seems to be the only way. Feel so cruel and downright horrible. She's v cross. C is in bed with the iPad- been almost 40mins now and G is showing no signs of settling. I've probably made it all much worse.
-
Now she's started playing
-
Although that's a bit frustrating, it proves that she's not really unhappy! She sounds so cute!
I shouldn't worry too much about C, she sounds sensible and can enjoy some iPad time.
When I STd I used to keep saying in my head "they aren't sad, they are tired and cross, and they will definitely go to sleep in the end". Which is true, but hard to remember sometimes. And every awful BT you get through is one closer to the end result of independent sleep.
The other thing I used to do was reward myself. So, for every 5 mins of screaming I got a square of green and blacks salted caramel chocolate.....mmmm
Keep going. We are all cheering you on!
-
Here with you hun, keep it up :)
-
I've just had to sleep train my 16mo again after a few months of constant rocking whilst she was teething and then devopmental.
The first night it took 2 hrs of wi/wo and DH was away on a stag weekend that night. It was horrendous (and a large glass of wine was called for once she finally gave in) but most of the crying was anger and frustration not truly upset.
She caught on pretty quickly and within a week I am now walking out, she whinges for 30 secs and then puts herself to sleep. I never thought we would get there again but we did and you will too.
Like pp said it was only once my attitude changed to it being a battle of wills and enough was really enough that I could follow it through. Wish I'd done it weeks earlier!
Good luck :)
-
Hang in there Hun. Tonight sounds lie, it was extra tough without DH there so hopefully tomorrow (is he home..?) if he is there things will be easier on you and you can both make a good go of it over the next few days.
Are you doing WI/WO now?
-
Thanks ladies, your support means a lot. I couldn't do WI/WOnas I was on my own and when I did pop out just to check on C she was beside herself. I was pretty much just sat in the room silent for the most part, saying our sleepy phrase when she was really upset and lying her down occasionally. Her little chest was heaving with the sobbing but eventually she did just settle, started rolling around and was silent for about 10mins and then went to sleep. I know how ridiculous it sounds me being sat there while she's messing around but tonight wasn't the night to start WI/WO. DH will be here tomorrow night so we can do it then although actually I'll need to start tomorrow at nap time. G is having immunisations tomorrow so hope they don't throw her off kilter. What exactly do we do? Is there a sticky? Never done it before as once we STed C that was it.
Bless C was such an angel. She pretty much watched the entire Toy Story 2. ::) I finally got downstairs at 8:45pm as G went to sleep at 8:30 again. She fell asleep early in the car for her nap today but as I wanted to get her BT earlier I thought it wouldn't hurt to have her up earlier in the afternoon to ensure a long enough A to bed but it just bit me on the bum with her being up until 8:30pm anyway! Need to get that sorted too as it's now 9pm, I've sat down with a coffee and am meant to be starting some planning for my new job which I'm so stressed about.
I am really sad about giving up BFing like this. It feels a bit of a trauma for us both but I'm not sure there is a way around it because she wants boobs at BT.
Thank you all for your support. Xxx
-
It'll be worth all this heartache real soon hun, it doesn't take long for the penny to drop with these little ones. Holding your hand and kicking your bum (gently) when you need it xxx
-
There is a sticky for WIWO on here somewhere :).
Basically though you put them down, say goodnight and sleepy phrase and walk out. Stand at door and listen - when they cry return and say the sleepy phrase and walk out again. No waiting to settle etc. Only return for an 'I need you cry' and stay out for anything else (catering, whinging, fussing, mantraing). I think the trick is SLOW with this one. Really listen etc, otherwise you end up in and out like a yo-yo and wind both of you up. A few deep breaths to listen and think is often what you both need to have a chance to settle. When I used it one of my kids used to WAIL as I turned and walked out, a great big scream, but it would soon settle into something far more sensible iyswim?
If you can get WIWO to work it is a great tool. Mine used to realise when I was about to start it, just remember from before, and actually it is pretty boring so they would tend to just settle pretty quick afterwards.
GW has never worked for me. I found WIWO pretty easy with DD as she is a pretty textbook baby/toddler. DS has always been harder for everything ;), but with GW he would just never stop. I wonder if for some kids it is just quite confusing? Too tempting to just keep going?
-
Yes for sure, I mean I know giving her a tiny BF won't have helped but she was fighting it all the more for ME. I know for a fact that if DH had been there she'd have settled MUCH quicker. Such a little monkey. Right WI/WO tomorrow it is then. She's screaming anyway (for the vast majority of the time) so I suppose we don't really have much to lose. :(
I was upset tonight because my living room windows were wide open and the monitor was on the windowsill full blast with her screaming. I really hope my neighbours don't think I'm leaving her to CIO. :'(
-
Most people don't think much about crying kids honey - I mean - it is pretty normal isn't it??
Usually when I overhear one it just makes me smile the next time they are telling me their child/ niece/ grandchild etc is a little angel ;).
-
I honestly think Hun if you stick with WI/WO for 3 days you will see vast improvement and have the confidence to carry on. Get some earplugs if you find the long period of crying hard. They do take the edge off (I needed them doing WI/WO because even out of the room I struggled ::) )
I assume DH is home now for a good 3-5 days so you can do WI/WO with support? It's really hard doing solo bt during st so well done Hun
-
Giving WI/WO a try now for nap time. I'm stood outside of her door. She's crying but she's not really screaming. I'm holding back. Hoping that she'll settle much quicker than with me being in there. Also wishing I'd have had an excuse of an errand to run so that she could have fallen asleep in the car! ::)
She's doing ok. Sort of crying and talking.
-
Ladies she did it!!!!!! I didn't even have to go back in. At some points she was laughing, others shouty crying but at no point did she CIO. She went to sleep on her own!!!!!' ;D
I should know to trust you ladies!!! Thank you 😘😘😘
PS she did this at around 7mos too for her nap but never at BT. Fingers crossed tonight goes ok.
-
Wooooo!!!! See, Mummy?! Don't underestimate Miss G! Well done you and loads of luck for later xx
-
Hi hon. I've been reading along. I dont have much to add cos I ST my spirited dd when she was tiny so not sure how i would handle it had she been older.
But just wanted to add (((hugs))) and let u know you're doing great with her. Fwiw I did have to use wiwo once with dd when she had gotten into a habit of call backs for huggles after an illness. It was brutal cos she got sooo angry and cried and screamed a lot but I stuck with it and within a few days she was back to IS. I'm sure u know this but consistency is key especially with spirited los. As u know give an inch and they take several miles :)
Good luck x
-
Great job hun! Knew you (and she) could do it xx
-
Well I knew BT wouldn't be as easy. Fingers crossed.
-
Well done love. I always found naps easier than bt too...just trust she can and will do it. You got some choc and wine ready for once she's asleep? :-*
-
Here with you hun. Take confidence in the fact she did it earlier. Means she can do it again :) hang in there xx
-
Should I be staying with her until she's calm? Everytime I leave she loses the plot. It feels like going in is making it worse but she's thrashing around and really yelling. I rubbed her back and she calmed but as I left she just roars and isn't really settling.
-
No, you don't stay until they are calm. You return, check, say sleepy phrase and leave again. Same as PD for an older baby - you just PD, say phrase and leave.
Both of mine roared when I turned and left - it must be really infuriating!! - but if I stayed and held back a bit you could start to see a settling pattern after the initial roar iyswim?? Then they may escalate again and I would enter again. It does take a few days for them to figure out the pattern, but again, you are there, they know you are, it is just that you are not doing as they wanted/expected.
(((hugs)))
-
I'm not sure if I am hanging back too much or what. She is just crying and crying. So I take it I shouldn't be lying her down either? It's hard to know what the crying is right now because we've always tried to avoid any crying whatsoever.
-
She is soaking in sweat now from all the crying. She is seeming to quietened down but I hate to think she's going to fall asleep from exhaustion. She's quiet in between roars now. Why does this feel like I'm letting her CIO? :'(
-
Sme as Liz here. I found I really had to take a moment to breathe in and out while listening because as you leave they do a big protest yell!
Tom got sweaty too...it's not very nice but it's bound to happen - particularly if it's hot anyway. She will cool down.
I know it's horrid, but your not leaving her to CIO. Take comfort in that your helping her learn to sleep on her own and that she is angry and tired not scared and alone. :-*
-
It isn't CIO because you are there to respond if she truly needs you, you are monitoring the situation, you are popping in and out to reassure. If it was CIO at this age you would do none of those things.
If she is quietening down I think it is because she is working out that there is a pattern to this 'I cry and Mummy comes and tells me it is sleepy time, but she doesn't lift me, or BF me, or sit chatting to me'. It is that type of thing really.
It is hard - I know it is - and I probably have a bit more tolerance for this side of stuff :'( :-\ :-\. Thing is, I just couldn't give up every night or evening :-[ :-[. My job is too demanding and if I had made a mistake :-\ :-\, and it is even worse for DH :-\. Plus I tried GW and it just did not work.
I think it is important you remember that bit - you have tried GW and lots of other things before :'( :'(.
-
The other important thing I found at this age is that apop wasn't actually working anyway anymore. It sounds like this is the case with G too :-\ when it gets like this it's awful on everyone
-
She went to sleep after about 30mins so it was less than last night with me in there. But it was obviously harder. Gah- I can't even have wine as I'm on a diet!!!
Thank you ladies. I knew I had to keep going even if I felt like rushing in and cuddling her (which probably wouldn't have gotten her to sleep anyway!)
-
No it wouldn't have. If she's anything like my spirited dd then it would have made her more mad when I tried to leave and would have ultimately taken longer.
30 min is awesome for first night! Well done you!
-
Great job!!
-
Oh honey, the thing is she can have all the cuddles she needs once you have sorted out this blip. You can sneak an extra 3 in tomorrow morning ;).
30 mins isn't bad at all, remember the next few days will still be horrid :'(, but then you should start to see some improvement :). Which is long overdue and very much deserved by yourself and your DH :-* :-*.
-
30 mins isn't bad at all, remember the next few days will still be horrid :'(, but then you should start to see some improvement :). Which is long overdue and very much deserved by yourself and your DH :-* :-*.
^^ this
What about a gin and diet tonic (or vodka lol)
Well done Hun. 30 mins is great!
-
Well done sounds like you're doing well. I think I may need to do WI wO with my 11.5 month old so I'm watching closely. Keep up the good work x
-
30 mins is amazing. There is a lot of crying and I daresay a few times she will crash from exhaustion but that's not the end of the world. You're doing great.
-
Amazing! Keep at it lovely, you're doing fab and so is Georgia. It'll all be over before you know it xxx
-
Thinking of you today and hoping you got a good night xx
-
Thanks ladies. She STTN. Today, however, we were held up running errands so for her nap she's fallen asleep in the car and transferred into the cot. ::) hopefully it won't affect it too much. BTs are always worse than naps but it wld have been nice if we'd had another successful nap settling today under our belt. I keep trying to talk positively about her cot but she doesn't look impressed! ;D
-
Well done - bet you feel a bit better after sttn too? :)
I don't think you will be set back with the car nap, fx for tonight.
Just letting you know we had regression on day 4-5 I think as well...all LOs are diff, but you will prob get one just as you think yay we're done ::)
-
How'd it go?
-
Thanks for checking in. You are not going to believe this...I took her into her bedroom and she started yelling loads and loads because I guess she knew what was coming. So I sang to her for an extra bit and got her super relaxed and then laid her in her cot, stroked her hair and face for a few minutes until she was relaxed and calm but not falling asleep. I then walked out of her door and she cried out for 30 seconds then went silent. She was shuffling around and then cried out after five minutes but I didn't need to go in and she went to sleep without crying. Don't know if it was just a fluke but it was amazing. I think maybe in our anxiety to do this STing we've not been building the sleepy mood and to make it a nice experience so I'm going to try the same again tonight and hoping that I can calm her. It was probably just a fluke but I'll try to keep calmer and get her more relaxed which is not always easy as she's generally a go go go go go go go go drop kinda gal! DH and I were like :o :o :o we've had a busy morning out at the park and she fell asleep in the car again ::) but I'll update tonight after BT (which will probably be monstrous given my post here!)
-
You are well on your way though. The penny of WIWO has clearly dropped, so really you should be in a position to ride out the regression when it comes, and iron out any glitches in the bedtime routine, and then finally move forwards ;D.
My DD needs an entirely different wind down to DS, even now. Took me a while to figure it out. DS just crashes, he is always happy to go to bed as a chronic Ewer. DD needs cuddles and stories, and her lullaby CD playing else she kicks up a fuss. Gets OT very easily and then misses her window ::) ::). Somehow I assumed I would be able to do both kids the same yk?
-
Well we're in the throes of BT. I did the same as last night, she's moaning and grizzling a bit but hasn't all out cried so far. I'm wondering if I might be doing too much to get her really comfy but she is not going to sleep with me in the room and besides when we do C's BT we have lots of quiet snuggles with her before we leave so I figure it's no different really but will keep an eye on it. At the moment I'm avoiding sitting in the chair with her because that's where she'll associate being BFed so I'm cuddling and singing (and swaying her a little!) but it's just to calm her from crying at being taken into her bedroom. I've then put her in her bed and continued to sing, gave her the lovey and stroked her face and arm.
She's quiet now so fingers crossed! X
-
How are things love? Settled?
-
Thanks for checking in sweetie. We had a bit of a setback as G had an ear infection and she's also cutting 3 teeth at once (one of which is a pre molar- my kids seem to get their teeth in funny orders!). Settling for naps and BT is going ok but we had a terribly long NW the other night and we didn't handle that so well. We need to be ready to tackle those properly now we know that the antibiotics are kicking in and she's getting better.
-
Teeth absolutely suck. Poor old G! How is little C coping?
-
Thanks for checking in sweetie. We had a bit of a setback as G had an ear infection and she's also cutting 3 teeth at once (one of which is a pre molar- my kids seem to get their teeth in funny orders!). Settling for naps and BT is going ok but we had a terribly long NW the other night and we didn't handle that so well. We need to be ready to tackle those properly now we know that the antibiotics are kicking in and she's getting better.
Oh honey that is tough. We're in the throes of winter here and it's been a nightmare with infections and flu. Luckily now T is older the St isn't such an issue but I remember last year after every big winter virus or bug we had to go through it again ::) just remember progress is still progress so when your all well and ready she will hopefully adjust quicker :-*
-
Oh no! Fingers crossed she's better soon xx
-
Thanks ladies. She seems to be fine now. Her teeth are driving her a bit nuts but she's ok. Settling really well at BT and she has STTN the past few nights. I feel like the settling is going well, I'm just dreading the next NW as that's when she's TOUGH!!!
-
:) great update. Well done G!