Re: Three Year Old Throwing Tantrum at Bedtime and how to get him to nap

[carybear]

oh my gosh this post seriously could have been written by me, in fact I was just about to post the same message!  How funny! 
Does any one have any ideas of how to get DS to actually go to sleep easier at nap time too? We really can not give up naps yet, despite his DESIRE to.  he just gets so grumpy that by the time I have dinner ready he's trowing fit after fit that I can't get him settled down if he doesn't take a nap. But then, if he does I sped 2 hours trying to get him to be quiet and go to sleep at bed time!  It's hard enough getting my 5 week old to sleep I can't do this with DS as well.  BTW DS has been doing this for MONTHS not just since the baby was born.   Any advise would be greatly appreciated.   
thanks. 

[Florencia]

Hi cary bear, I splitted your post on a different topic so you can get personalized advice on your case.

Nap resistance is a toddler thing. In fact they will resist ANYTHING they can as their toddlerhood lasts so all you can do is provide as much oportunities for sleep as you can, but not get into a power struggle cause you're likely to loose that battle LOL.

MAny moms here have found success with quiet time, that is, you provide a reasonable wind down routine (books, bye bye to toys and stuff in the house/street, songs, whatever) and pop him into his crib/bed. You let him know it's naptime for everyone in the house but and he can go to sleep whenever he wants, the only thing he needs to do is to stay quiet in his room for a while. LEave him with a couple of stuffed animals, soothing music, a couple of books and a blanket on the floor (in case he decides to jump out of bed). This leaves him options to do as he wants just not escalate and understand this moments as his quiet time.

If you try this and after a while he's still trashing around his room, only go in when he's getting too loud and remind him to go back to bed or stay quiet. He'll eventually go to sleep if he's tired enough.

HTH and good luck!

[carybear]

that is kind of what I do already, usually he'll fall asleep, if not then he'll do it at 5 pm...grrr  It wasn't an issue before the baby was born but now they're sharing a room and he's good at waking/keeping her awake. 
So now my question is: do I just let him skip naps and deal with Ornery over tired DS until bed time all so I can get him to sleep easier at bed time?  Even then we're looking at 30-60 minutes of singing, playing and getting out of bed over and over.... I'm just at my whits end for both of my kids right now and their lack of going to sleep at bed time.  I really just can't spend an hour in their room everynight, it's just too tiring.

[Florencia]

Then my suggestion would be to offer older ds quiet/naptime on a different room (yours) to stop him from waking younger sibling. I would never suggest you to skip naps and having an overtired lo for bedtime, all the oposite, the purpose of my suggestions are to avoid overtiredness and to provide as much sleep oportunities as possible.
An early bedtime (super early) on days of no nap should help you settle your son easier. Even then if he's only jumping out of bed but not crying or desperate for your intervention, don't intervene. Only go in when he's crying or the trashing around escalades. He'll go to sleep when he's tired enough and it'll be less stressing for you if you're not inside the room for the whole process.

HTH!

[Fenella]

Hi i really feel for you i have a 3year old and a 5 month old and it can get very difficult.  When Luke was first born jack was still having a 2hr nap during the day but did find getting him to go to bed at 7pm became impossible.  Since then we have tried a couple of things.  Firstly giving up naps (he is the last of a large group of 3 year olds to still nap) but like you the evening/afternoon became very difficult.  However on a few occasions i put him to bed 1/2hour - 1 hour earlier and he woke at his usual time the next day.  I don't know if this is something you could try.  The other thing that sometimes works well is to make the nap as early as he will take it and only allow 1 hour max.  For us it was 1.30-2.30 and we found he would be asleep by 7.30.  Sadly i don't think there is a fool proof way to deal with giving up naps.

[carybear]

It's funny, he doesn't seem to wake up the baby during nap time, he just keeps her awake at bed time.  I started telling him that he doesn't have to sleep just be quiet and "rest"  the result is that usually he'll fall asleep without much of a fight. we've even changed nap time to "rest time" around our house.  My mom got him to take a nap at 11:30 on Thanksgiving, should I try to move his nap from 1 to 11?
I'm sure he still needs the naps since if we're in the car he'll fall asleep without a fight.  That and the overtired monster I get if he misses his nap are my he still needs the sleep ques.  But what should I do? if he naps he takes until 9-10 to fall asleep with a 8 pm bed time too. Moving it to 7:30 doesn't usually do any good unless he's missed that nap.  But if I put him to bed at 7:30 I'm still in there from putting DD down for the night. 
Uggh! it's just so hard! All I want is kids who go to sleep and then stay asleep!  Is that really too much to ask? Sorry for venting here but DS won't sleep right now either. GRRR

[lilmonkey]

All I want is kids who go to sleep and then stay asleep!  Is that really too much to ask?

Yes, I think that it is too much to ask from them.     DD can be like this sometimes as well when she takes too long a nap (more than 2.5 hrs) or wakes up from her nap at 3 pm.  It would seems that she needs to be awake for about 6-7 hrs before she can go to sleep easily.  Both ladies have given really good suggestions.  With us, I am trying to shorten her nap to 1.5 hrs max to have bedtime at 8 pm.  On some days when there is no nap or just a catnap in the car then bedtime is super early.  I was afraid that she would wake earlier in the morning but this does not seem to be the case. 

It must be very frustrating for you with two los and I can see myself in your shoes next summer.  Can't wait... 

[Katet]

My 3yo 4mo still naps 1-3 hours, but he it is verbally "rest time" (he doesn't have to sleep).... I will wake him after 1 hour if we have had a quiet morning & will have a quiet afternoon, but if I know the morning has been busy & I can get some major running around (park/ garden) before bed then I will let him go for 3.
Bed time around here is about 8pm, but sometimes he/we delay it, often for more Daddy time.

One thing I think is VERY important with a 3yo is COMMUNICATION... have you tried talking to him about what you need & seeing if he can explain why he finds it hard to go to sleep & see if he can offer solutions... my ds will say he needs more stories etc... we have a pretty long wind-down routine, takes about 1/2 hour with stories teeth etc, but it works well for us & saves on the singing/talking

Also maybe if he does do ok with no nap until say 4pm give him his dinner then & then a snack before bed... my friend has an almost 4yo who has dinner at 4.30 as any time after that is hopeless... he goes to bed at 7pm & up for the day at 6.30... at first she hated that early bedtime, but now enjoys the long evening as the trade off to no nap... she also found that when her 1yo napped she got 1-1 time with her 4yo & that was a good benefit too.

[carybear]

IF he takes his nap I don't let him sleep longer than 1.5 hr because then the struggle gets even longer at night. 
Today he missed his nap completely and seemed to do just fine, we had no major blow outs and he went to bed fairly easily.  The baby was up longer than he was. 
I'm guessing my biggest frustration is that I still need that nap for me.  I usually rest then too.  so I guess I'm just having a hard time giving up MY nap too.  LOL
I think I'll try moving dinner time up a bit, I know my kids will appreciate having more time between dinner and bed time. 
Thanks for all the advise. Here's to it working right?

[Katet]

My SIL now 4yo gave up her nap at age 2 & a bit & when SIL fell preg with #2 she found that if she got her dd to sit on the floor in SIL Bedroom with some books & puzzles for "quiet time" SIL could also have a rest... not always fall asleep, but a rest non the less. she set a clock on a timer firstly for 10mins & gradually got it to 1 hour which it still is to this day, although her dd#2 is 17mo & SIL doesn't need the nap now but her dd#1 goes to her own bedroom to read, do puzzles or things like that until the timer goes off & SIL gets a break too.
When ds#1 stops napping I plan to do the same, although ds#1 loves to read the clock, so I will just pick a time he has to stay for KWIM, as he wants a "clock like Mummy & Daddy from Santa"