Author Topic: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse  (Read 6633 times)

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Offline Bridge203618

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4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« on: January 18, 2007, 17:39:13 pm »
My daughter - Emily has never slept well - normally getting up every 3 hours -sometimes 2 and occassionally less often (1 week around christmas of really good only getting up 2 times a night) but lately it keeps getting worse. She used to be swaddled but really started hating it - so much that it really wasn't helping her sleep - she was getting up every 2 hours or more and it was hard to get her back to sleep cuz she hated being in the swaddle. So I gave up on swaddling. First she would sleep for an hour or 2 but last night she was up every 1/2 hour - I ended up on the couch for part of the night (with her) and then our bed after DH went to work (neither of these i want to make a habit of but have been happening too frequently lately) - I don't know what to do. She either wakes up when I put her down or shortly there after. She was sleeping a little longer parts of the night like 2 or 3 hours once or twice, but progressively getting worse.

She also is abad napper - always has been. She takes 2 or3 sometimes 4 naps that are short - usually 1/2 hour to hour (normally closer to the 1/2 hour) and she wont' go in her crib for naps - she wakes up right away and wont' go back to sleep - morning nap in her swing - other naps are while being held unless she is in her car seat when we are out and about.

Last night i tried CIO - some what - i let her cry for a bit then went in and tried to calm her down - didnt' work - i turned on her ocean wonders aquarium which did settle her down. ONce it went off i turned it on again and left the room. she was fine till about2 minutes after it went off- then she started crying. I let her cry for 15 minutes then went in and tried to soothe her - again patting and with the aquarium, but she still wouldn't quit crying or attempt to sleep unless I picked her up. She gets very mad and just wants to be held :(

I don't know what to do - i am at the end of my rope!! Please help

Offline RegMum

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Re: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2007, 18:01:50 pm »
I don't know how much help I can be - my 3.5M DD is a pretty good sleeper, but I certainly want to give you my sympathy - when you are standing over the crib for what seems like the hundredth time in a day, it feels like you will never get a moment's peace again... 
DO you have your DD on an EASY schedule?  Do you follow the 4Ss for sleep that are in the BW books, and are described elsewhere on this site?  If you post these, the more experienced and helpfull folks will have have more to go on....it could be that she's overtired, that you don't have a consistant routine etc.

Offline momofclaire

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Re: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« Reply #2 on: January 18, 2007, 18:14:41 pm »
I would highly recommend not using the Cry it Out method.  It doens't work and will cause more trouble.  You want lo to trust you and letting her cry it out breaks that trust.  Can you post your daily routine?  If you don't really have one maybe post what you would like it to be.  Also have you read any of the BW books? 
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Offline Bridge203618

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Re: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« Reply #3 on: January 18, 2007, 19:56:17 pm »
I haven't read any of the BW books yet. I have had plans on checking them out at the library, but haven't made it there yet. Maybe I could do that on Saturday.

We don't have a real tight specific routine - but here is how it normally goes.

she normally gets up about 9 or 10 - although today was 8 ish. She isn't normally in a big hurry to eat but sometime within a 1/2 hour she eats. I like to keep her first feeding in the 9 o clock hour and not run into the 10 oclock hour, but not always an option.

She usually plays for about 1 hour (or so) and then I put her in her swing. She normally gets fussy after a bit and I turn the vaccuum on. She falls asleep and normally sleeps for 45 minutes, sometimes a little more or less.

Then we play - nothing specific and eat about 12 or 1230 (3 hours after her first feeding) - usually 2-3 hours after her first nap she gets fussy and tired (lately it has been about 1 or 2) - and i walk with her and sit with her at times (depending on her mood - she prefers to be held standing up) and I run the vaccuum. Usually these things put her to sleep. I have been trying to get her to sleep for at least 1 hour (today 75 minutes) but sometimes that isn't an option. This nap is normally taken on my shoulder.

She would then eat again 3 hours after her second feeding. My DH usually gets home about 4 and normally he gives her the 3rd nap in a similar fashion as the 2nd nap.

Her dinner feeding is in 3 more hours and we try not to let her at least start a nap past 6 - My goal is no napping at all after 6 but depending how well she goes down for nap #2 - nap #3 is sometimes late. About 30-60 minutes after her "dinner feeding" I give her rice cereal. She normally gets tired between 8 and 9. It used to be more like 9 or 930, but lately sooner - i take her up to her room - in the dark and rock and feed her (all her feedings are BF'ings) and put her to bed. She normally falls asleep pretty easily but sometimes I have to take her down stairs to the vaccuum. I usually run a Vaccuum CD all night but I am pretty sure it doesn't work.

She normally sleeps 30 minutes to an hour and then is up again - she used to to this once or twice and then sleep for 3 hours or so but lately not so lucky!

Any suggestions?????

LAtely unless she wakes up wide awake getting her to sleep isn't that hard - it is keeping her there.

Also she has ALWAYS been a very alert baby (wide eyed and looking around in the delivery room) and can go from dead asleep to wide awake like nothing!

Offline momofclaire

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Re: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« Reply #4 on: January 18, 2007, 20:15:36 pm »
Ok I first recommend getting and reading the first book and the Baby whispere solves all your problems book.  But here are some very helpful links.  Don't get overwhelmed just try to fix one thing at a time.
here is a link about an EASY schedule for your lo age
https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=10385.0
Here is a link about pat/shh, which is a sleep training tool.
https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=26672.0
I know it says for babies under three months but since you have not tried it I would go with that first.  Pu/Pd should be used as a last resort and although you may feel like you are there we have other tools that you can try first.
Here is a link about EASY
https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=63534.0
And here is a link about starting EASY after 4 months
https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=69369.0

Ok I know that is a TON of reading but since you don't have the book it should really help.



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Offline Colin Macs Mom

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Re: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« Reply #5 on: January 18, 2007, 21:59:49 pm »
I agree, it's very important that you read the books. EASY is not always easy, but the rewards for your hard work are tremendous!
Jessica
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Offline Bridge203618

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Re: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« Reply #6 on: January 19, 2007, 02:40:04 am »
Ok so i went and got the book you suggested from the library. Seems i have a bit of reading to do - hopefully I can find (make) the time this weekend and start this sometime next week. She has a dr appt on monday so i guess i should wait till after then. Do you really think that this method will help with her 1/2 hour to hour naps as well as the waking? I don't believe that Emily wakes due to hunger - her biggest problem is that she can't/won't soothe herself and put herself to sleep - so when she moves or wakes she cries - waiting a few minutes doesn't help either. I do think she could be over tired cuz she has never napped well. I hope I didn't wait too long for this method. I also hope this will help me get out of the habit of her NOT napping in her bed.

I quit swaddling about a week ago because not only was she getting out of it (been doing that for about 1 month) but she was really mad when she woke up and it became increasingly harder to get her back to sleep and it wasn't helping her sleep anylonger than 2 -3 hours at a time. She definitely has found her fingers and loves to suck on her hand (just not enough to soothe herself) was I right in quitting the swaddle?

I am sure I feed her too much throughout the night lately - mainly cuz it is the only way to get her to sleep.


Offline momofclaire

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Re: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2007, 13:42:55 pm »
I think the concepts in the BW book will help with a lot of things.  You should probably first try to get her on a schedule.  It doesn't have to be super strict just an order of events so she knows what to expect.  I would try to implement easy starting now. 
I quit the swaddle at about 6 weeks. Claire hated it.  It just depends on the baby.  If she uses her hand to self soothe then I think you should let her have it. 
Did you read the link on EASY? 
Getting her on easy will help.   Then you can try some sleep training tools like pat/shh  and if needed wake to sleep.  I know this means nothing to you right now. 
Let me know if you have questions.  I would be glad to help.  If I can't help there is someone around here who can I am sure.
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Offline Bridge203618

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Re: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2007, 15:22:01 pm »
I have a question about the pu/pd method - if/when i use that. Say it takes me the whole "S" time and it doesn't work - what do I do then? my LO has never put herself to sleep and I am sure it will take some time to teach my 4 month old to soothe herself.

Offline RegMum

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Re: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« Reply #9 on: January 19, 2007, 16:03:19 pm »
Check out this sleep interview: https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=451.0
About half way down, "Q:  One is, if I’m doing pu/pd for the start of a nap, how long should I continue it – is there a point where I should just give it up for that sleep cycle?"

Offline Colin Macs Mom

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Re: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« Reply #10 on: January 19, 2007, 16:40:00 pm »
Bridge, before you give up the swaddle you might want to try this -

https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=55977.0

It's a different sort of swaddling method that's nearly impossible to break out of, and LOs hands are under their chin so they can suck fingers if they want. Might work much better for you!
Jessica
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Offline momofclaire

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Re: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« Reply #11 on: January 19, 2007, 17:34:34 pm »
Bridge- I wouldn't do Pu/Pd yet.  Since you haven't put lo on easy and haven't tried shh/pat I think you should try that first.  Pu/Pd is a last resort type thing.  It can be rough on baby and mama.  I would work on the first steps first.  I have not had to use pu/pd so if you choose to go that route maybe someone else can jump in with advice.

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Offline Bridge203618

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Re: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« Reply #12 on: January 20, 2007, 19:14:22 pm »
Maybe I should post this in a new thread but I thought I would try here first. Since Ihaven't read much of the book yet we are just starting with a general routine - trying for 4 hour but she has always been on 3 hour so not sure how that will go. What do I do when she gets up from S and not ready for her next E yet? She doesn't sleep long just yet and I am not trying to fix all her sleeping issues just yet (next week once ihave time to read more on the book and be more strict) what do I do? Also the directions for starting at 4 months say to use pu/pd but I am not going to start that yet. Should I try the SHHH/Patt method (problem I see with this right now is she is 4 months old and she pretty much cries to be picked up so not sure this will work, plus she can't always hear my shhhh cuz of the crying) or just concentrate on routine (currently naps aren't in her crib and we have various props for nighttime sleeping) and cure her sleep habits after the routine is in place? I am just afraid - new routine - making her sleep in her bed for naps and trying to teach her to fall asleep without props on her own is too much too quick. Also why 7 am is the suggested time to start? I would prefer an 8 oclock start and 8 oclock end, is that a problem?? She is used to more like 930 - so I thought 8 might be good. TIA

Offline momofclaire

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Re: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« Reply #13 on: January 20, 2007, 19:44:53 pm »
I have an eight to eight sch if it works for you then great.  I don't think it's a problem.  I am unsure why 7 is the start time. I think it's more important to keep a 12 hour schedule.  KWIM?  I wouldn't do PU PD but maybe someone who hasn't started easy until 4 mo can tell you why this is advised and if they have experience with it. 
I am going to try to find someone that didn't start easy from the start.  OK  Could you post waht your day looked like yesterday because I am sure it will be helpful to whoever is reading this.  Thanks  Hang in there.
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Offline Bridge203618

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Re: 4 month old sleeping habits getting worse & worse
« Reply #14 on: January 20, 2007, 20:39:21 pm »
We didn't really start the routine this today - which isn't going as well as planned, but partly cuz I tried to get DH to give her a bottle and she doesn't eat as much then. We did get her up at 830 though and started on a 4 hour plan but regressed to 3 hour. She did sleep better last night (woke up about 4 times from 9-12, then woke at 3, 530 and 830).

Today:

830 - up and ate
1030-1145 - nap
1230 ate - but only about 1 oz
2-245 - nap
315 - ate again - normal BF'ing
playing right now.

I hope to have her eat again at 6 or so, cereal at 7, and bed at 8.

Easy is a little harder for me since we started cereal at night but I don't give it to her with a feeding I usually give it 30-60 minutes aftewards and I know many don't suggest solids till 6 months, but I truley believe she is ready.

yesterday she didnt' get up till almost 10

She had a nap from 1145-1230
Ate again at 1:30
Nap from 3-3:30
Ate at 515
then we gave her another nap right after that - a short 30 minute cat nap
Bed was about 9 - was supposed to be 8 or 830 but I wasn't home and she wouldn't take a bottle for DH so it was harder to get her to sleep.

As you can see the routine didn't work well yesterday - partially cuz of the short nap in the PM. That is one of my problems, the routine is hard to stick to cuz she doesn't nap long enough and then wants another nap shortly after a feeding around 5 or 6.