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SLEEP => Sleeping For Toddlers => Topic started by: Carmela's Mom on May 17, 2006, 16:44:23 pm
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I am having nap/sleep time issues. I just can't seem to find a time that works for everyone.....Carmela is up between 6-7 in the morning. I never wake her because when I used to, I paid for it all day long. She was awful. So I let her wake on her own. She barely ever sleeps past 7 though. I have had her napping at 1:00 which worked well for the most part (she'd try to refuse sometimes but I'd put her to sleep by 1:30 by rubbing her back for a few minutes). She'd sleep until 2:30-3, sometimes 3:30. But bedtime was at 8 and I really think she's just not tired by then. It takes her 30-60 mins to fall asleep then.
So I am considering moving nap to 12:30 but I am afraid she's going to not fall asleep and try to skip naps....or maybe I should push bedtime back to 8:30 but everything I read says its too late.
Any suggestions???? How much awake time is your child getting before nap and before bed?????
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I'm in the middle of this situation too. My ds used to have an Awake time of 6 hours before nap1 and 5 hours before bedtime and was working quite well. On days i let him nap for longer he was ok to be put down for bedtime at 4:30 or 4:45 hours of awake time but this past week he's just not tired by then. He sings and crawls and plays in the dark for 30-45 mins... or wants us to be in the room playing with him!!!!!!!
I'm trying to move nap back in 15 mins increments each week. So far, i've been putting him down at 5:45 awake time for nap and then that makes him go to bed at 5:15 awake time. He's been doing better, taking 15 mins to settle to sleep. I'll keep doing this for a week more and then move back another 15 mins so we end up in a 5:30 awake time for both periods which is my goal.
I must say that my plan B was getting used to that super late bedtime. I had set my mind into it just in case my main plan does not work.
I beleive that bedtime is a timing that works for you. So if you, your household, dh and dd are ok with 830, then that would be a great bedtime no matter what everyone thinks about it.
HTH! i'll let you know how it works for me!
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Margot will drop off like clockwork 5.5 hours after she wakes from her nap. Wake time between morning wakeup and nap time varies since she doesn't go down early for her nap even if she is tired --we've tried--but it's usually 6.5 hours from wakeup, which I think is longer than most lo's her age (21 months). we just go backwards from wakeup time because she has 3 "set" times--she pretty much always sleeps 10 hours at night, falls asleep 5.5 hours after nap and naps for 1.5 to 2 hours. If Carmela has certain times llke that that don't vary I think you have to go with those and let the other times fall how they may.
Margot also takes 30 to 60 minutes to fall asleep--usually between 8 and 8:30. But she is content to chatter away in her crib so she goes in it around 7:30 ish. I have often wondered if the earlier naptime would help but it just doesn't seem to be an option for us even though Margot quickly falls asleep for her nap--she absolutely refuses to go upstairs until her sister leaves for school at 12:45. I'd love to know it the early naptime works for you though--I may start shipping my older dd off to school early!
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My first son at the age of exactly 2 (now 10) started not wanting to sleep at 8 0'clock, after having a daily sleep from 1.30pm-3.30pm. It would take him so long to go to sleep, like an hour. He also would not be tired enough to nap earlier in the day.....so we dropped his day sleep altogether. This worked wonders! He would start to get tired by late afternoon but adjusted quite quickly, with the odd earlier bedtime.
Enter son number two! All I can say is read the posting "split posting/ walk in walk out" kerrisspencer!
Kerris
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hi my toddler is 25 months too his routine is he wakes 8-8.30 plays til 9ish, his nap is between 1.30till 4.30 sometimes i have to wake him at 5 then bed 8-9pm. i know everone says thats too late but it works for us, since i had DS#2 i hav tried to put him to bed earlier about 8 so i can have some time on a night. so recently he's waking 8 ish but he is sooo happy playing in his cot, he is really active i think thats why he needs so much sleep.
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Thanks for all the replies. I am still trying the 12:30 nap, but she has been playing a lot and both days I've had to put her to sleep myself by rubbing her back, something I don't want to do....BUT she's falling asleep faster at night so I guess it's working??? She's only been napping 1.5 hours so maybe that is why she's sleeping faster at night. We are going to continue with 12:30 nap and I'm going to try to not put her to sleep for a few days and see if that works at all.
Thanks and for those of you that are going through this as well, please keep me posted on your progress.
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Carmela's mom--our late nights also seem to be resulting in earlier wakeups so Margot is sometimes only getting 9.5 hours sleep at night plus a 2 hour nap. the nanny got her down 15 minutes early today so she only napped for 1.5 hours. I'm also going to try an earlier bedtime tonight with the hope that it results in a later sleep in the morning. When Carmela has a shorter nap/earlier bedtime what happens to her morning wakeup time?
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It really depends. It used to be that I could guarantee that if she was up more than 30 mins after I put her in her bed, I was guaranteed a wake up for 6 or earlier. But now she seems to still wake up between 5:45-6 but gets herself back to sleep within 10 mins and she sleeps until 6:50-7:10.....but that's only been the last two mornings (since I put the alumunium foil on her windows!!!)
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Oh what fun this age is. I have been trying to work out my DD for so long now. No soon as I get it she gets ill!!!!!
I really want her to go to sleep at 7pm and sleep to 7am as I have another lo. What I have been finding is that if I put her down too late she will sleep for too long and then not go to bed until really late. Or the worst one is she is crying out every 30 mins from 3am!!!!! I hate it so much.
I reckon DD's day should look a bit like this.
Wake 0630/7am
Sleep 1pm
Wake 230ish
7/730 bed.
The other day she slept an extra 30 mins and she was up 2 hours longer before bed.
Not sure if I am going to pay today as she slept lots in the day. I wasn't sure how much to let her have because she's been unwell and up at night a lot.
Gosh it's a hard one.
J
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Well this morning she was up at 5 a.m.!!!!!!!! Yesterday she screamed hysterically at nap and then only napped for 50 minutes so I am PRAYING that its her teeth or else I am DEAD next week when the baby comes home too!
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Hey Julie, my first guess is that Lottie is overtired since her nap is being a bit late. I would try to put her down for nap 30 mins earlier (a 6 hours awake time at most) and then bedtime no later than 7 (even 630 0r 645) that should fix her night wakings.
Crying out every 30 mins at night could indicate overtiredness or teething so giving a pain aid before bed should also be helpful.
HTH!
Carmela's mom... i'm speechless... things seemed to be going so well. i can't think of anything else to suggest so I'll pray for carmela to settle and be a good girl for when lil bro comes home. DOn't worry, everything's going to be fine, you just keep up the good work you were doing and relax!
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Carmela's mom--do you think the short nap could be related to having the longer sleep in the morning? I swear with Margot she just has a max # of hours she'll sleep in the day. If she naps 1.5 hours she'll sleep 10 hours at night but if she naps for 2 hours we get 9.5 hours tops at night. I'm figuring it's teeth as well or that we're at that dreaded stage where the 1 nap starts interfering with night sleep but they still need it to get through the day.
Florencia, how has shifting the nap worked for you? Are the naps and night time sleep the same?
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I really don't know. I do know that if she sleeps longer than 2 hours, it interferes with her falling asleep at bedtime. But yesterday she woke up crying hysterical and didn't even calm down when I walked in. Now today she napped 1.5 hours (her normal) and whined a bit when she woke up but calmed down right away when she saw me. She's still tired after her nap - yawning, etc. but I am not putting her in until 8:00. I put her in earlier last night and I'm afraid that had to do with the earlier waking. I just don't know.
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Hi there,
Sorry for hijacking your post. DD had 3 hours nap yesterday. Woke a couple of times in the night but we just told her it was bedtime and she went back (I think she was use to us being there after the last 7 days of illness). In total she did 12 hours.
I have tried putting her down earlier and it can make a difference. I tend to have more of a problem with putting her down late as it can cause her to sleep to much and not be ready for bed at 7pm. We can also swing from too much sleep to too little sleep. Then when illness and teeth throw us off I don't know what to do to get us back on track.
What I did notice is that if she sleeps for more than 1hr 40 (1 sleep cycle) she will be awake chatting for over an hour when I put her down at 7pm. If she does go down straight away the second half of the night she wakes up. I obviously only spot this when I've had a few weeks running of no illness etc. We still want DD to do 7til7 so I know I'll probably have to wake her up to perserve the sleep if we do get a run at it.
I have no way of predicting when she will wake in a good mood but it can take her a good 30 mins to calm down. I don't know why she gets so funny about it. I stick to the same routine when she wakes. Sofa with duvet, biscuit and drink, cbeebies.
As a baby DD slept loads and I guess still does to some extent. She was one of the first to go to 1 nap and I don't know if that is also telling me that she will be one of the first to drop the slept. Am I right in thinking that the toddlers that nap for long periods have later bedtimes?
I guess it will all come out in the wash.
Good luck
J
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Wow Julie we sound very similar I think
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Our day yesterday looked like this and we had a whole night's sleep:
745wake up
1hr 40 nap (didn't actually go down until 2ish yesterday because of various reasons)
720ish bed
woke this morning at 7ish.
Will be interesting to see what happens today. I'll try and post it in case it helps your situation. She seems over her illness / teeth thing at the moment.
Good luck
J
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Wow looks like you had a great day yesterday. Carmela's nap was 1 hour and 30 mins yesterday. We put her in for bed at night at 8:00 p.m. and she fell asleep at 8:25. She cried out at 2:00 a.m. for a tiny bit, and then again at 5:00 a.m. but she went back to sleep until 7 a.m. So all in all, not too shabby. I am not sure why she is waking though. I don't know if its her molars poking through or if she is just so overtired.
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Wow,
the way you discribed the 2 and 5am cry out is exactly like our DD. I am not sure but last night we put her in a heavier grobag. There are just so many variables it's doing my head in.
J
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I spoke to my husband about our game plan this morning. He agrees with the theory that you can put them to bed, but can't make them sleep. Carmela does not need us to fall back asleep at 2:00 or 5 so he thinks we should put her to bed at 7:30 p.m. (which is 1/2 hour earlier than we are doing now) and leave her until 7 a.m. and let her learn to sleep during those hours....he also thinks that we should stick with the 12:30 nap and let her adjust to that as well. That's basically what I've been doing but I'm looking to change things up again and he thinks we're just changing way too often and that if it is her molars or just her, we will never know because I am constantly changing things, which is true.
Another thing we are going to try to do is limit our play time after dinner. We are usually done wiht dinner at 6 p.m. and then we head outside to play. But I think we are going to skip that for awhile and do it earlier in the day. After dinner is going to be bath time and then she can play a little with her toys inside (so she doesn't get as riled up) and then 7:00 we start our bedtime routine. It's tough though because DH loves his outside time with her and he won't be home in time to do that anymore. So we'll see how it goes.
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We are the same. I think we've tried so many different things but no sooner as we crack it some illness pops up etc.
Yesterdays sleep was from 1pm to 230pm ish. We put down at 730 and got 13 hours out of both of them. Soooooooooooooooooo nice as we've had so many wake ups this last 2 weeks.
One thing I do know is that if I do the bath with the both of them on my own they settle much better but I prefer the help on the other hand.
I'll try and post back when we have a waking so we can hopefully spot the pattern.
J
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I am not sure what's going on with her. Last night I heard her once at 4:20 but it seriously was for a few seconds. I have a feeling that she's up more than I hear though because she is so tired. From the second we get her out of bed in the morning, she's yawning, rubbing eyes, etc. She is clearly overtired. I pushed her nap forward 30 mins and am going to do the same with bedtime. I don't know how else to handle it as it seems the earlier I put her to bed, the earlier she wakes...and the same with naps. No matter what time I put her in, I only get 1.5 hour nap. I hate seeing her so tired :(
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How dark is your DD's bedroom?
We recently got much darker blinds and it has helped us a lot.
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I actually had dark out shades in her room. Wasn't dark enough so I went and put alumunium foil on the windows under the shades. It is DARK. It actually worked well at first but then she went back to her old non sleeping ways.
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We went out to lunch today and DD didn't get back for her nap until 3pm. We only let her sleep her usual amount but I am expect a bad night!!!
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How did it go last night?
With us, we put Carmela to bed 10 minutes early. We figure we'll take it really slow moving it back to 7:30 and see if she wakes earlier. She woke at 12 and 4:20, both for like 5-10 minutes and then fell back asleep on her own and woke at 6:00 a.m.
Now with the 8:00 bedtime, she's been waking at those times, staying up a bit longer but then sleeping until 6:30-7. So I am not sure which is worst. Starting our day at 6 or more wake ups. We are going to aim for 7:45 for the week and then make up our minds if we want to keep it at that or move it forward again. We'll see.
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It's funny how such a little difference can make such a difference.
Well last night was a bit of a surprise. I put DD down around 8ish. It took over 30 mins for her to get off but she didn't get up until 8ish this morning. I didn't hear a thing from her. You'd think that is great but instead DS2 was up on and off all night. I just didn't get his cues yesterday because we were out and he missed his nap. I think he got overtired and what struggling to breathe with the snuffles. This is so annoying because he's been sleeping through since 12 weeks so I was hoping if DD settled we'd get some sleep again!!! How stupid for ever thinking I might get some sleep. Remind me never to brag again. I shouldn't have opened my trap when I said both of them slept 13 hrs and we got to stay in bed to gone 8am. I haven't got a clue where I am since that!!!!!
Tonight I've gone for a 7.10 put down. DD did a late nap because of waking late this morning and appointments etc. She had 1hr 30ish. She cried when I put her down this evening but that doesn't surprise me because she's been going to bed nearer 730/8pm last week. My reckoning is that this would normallly cause the wakings in the 2nd half of the night so it'll be interesting to see. I was on my own tonight for the bath and I really needed to get them down as I sensed DS was starting to get overtired.
We shall see what tonight brings.
What happens to your lo's sleep if they just have a nap in the car. Is the night time sleep any better??
J
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I really don't get DD. I reckon it must be teething as I can find nothing else to explain it. She's been sleeping through for over a week. I think we had one tiny blip but we've been out and about, stayed in and done everything else I would normally think would cause wakings. I've even put her down at various times and had various nap lengths. One day she napped from 3-5 and still went down and slept all night.
I just hope the other 4 teeth come through soon if it is that. The other reason I think it must be teeth is because her general behaviour has improved and her eating is beyond belief. She's tried Ryvita and pate, eaten chicken, eaten eggs, carrots and almost anything I've put in front of her. She went to a party yesterday and tried everything and anything. It's been almost a year since she even ate some of these things.
How are you doing???
J
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Sorry I had a baby 3 weeks ago so I haven't been around too much.
We are still the same. Takes her about 30-45 mins to fall asleep at night...she is averaging about 9.5 hours at night and 1.5 hour nap. I don't think its enough sleep, but I am not sure what else to do about it. She still didn't get her last two molars and I know one is trying to come through, so I am hoping once she gets them our lives will get back to "normal" whatever that is!!!!!!!!!!
I am just so sick of always double guessing myself. One second I think I should put her to bed earlier for nap and bedtime, then the next I think maybe later. Then I wonder if our bedtime routine is too long, too short, etc. It's just making me mad...especially now with a newborn to worry about his sleep!!!
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Julie--Margot does the second half of the night waking when she falls asleep right away or a bit early. For her it usually means she was overtired at bedtime, crashes and then has the nightwaking.
My older dd went to 1 nap at 11 months and we had to stop her nap at 4+ years because she was going to school in the afternoon so she may surprise you by keeping her nap for a long time. One thing we did have to do when my older dd got closer to age 3 was limit her nap to one hour or else she would resist bedtime. I'm not sure that that would work at this stage though. Like you we seem to swing between too much and too little sleep and it just seems too hard to figure out what is the "right" amount of sleep for them.
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Oops sorry all replied to an earlier post. Carmela's mom--congratulations on baby #2. Hope all went well and that he soon starts sleeping through the night for his momma!
Likewise driving myself crazy trying to figure out what the "right" thing is. Is Carmela still waking in the night? I think at this point you just have to go with what will be the easiest for you to deal with given that you will be dealing with ds' night wakings for a while. Carmela is getting pretty solid sleep, maybe a little on the short side but really not to bad. So just go with it for now.
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Hi Carmela's mom,
Congratulations. Did you have a boy or another girl?? Hope it all went smoothly and things are settling down.
How old is Carmela now and what does her day look like re. food, sleep etc??? Has Carmela ever slept through i.e 12hours approx??
Lottie has been doing better. We still get the odd blip which seems to stem from emotional things from the day. She's a sensitive one sometimes. It still feels like we swing from one point to the next. From too many snacks to not enough. From too much sleep to too little. It's bloody draining. And now there's two to worry about!!! The only thing I can say is that although the first few months are tough babies seem so much easier. The check list is much shorter to keep them happy.
Perhaps rather than us trying to solve this the whole time we should just share the difficult of the not knowing (ok Mrs Freud I'll stop talking now).
The only other thing I can suggest is what worked for us a bit is that we offered to give a treat in the morning if she slept in bed all night. It worked but then I dropped it because I didn't want it there the whole time. Last night we had a blip (both of them were unsettled for some reason) so tonight I've promised the special treat (anything for a nights sleep).
Stay in touch. Try and get some help around to make things easier if you can.
Best wishes
J
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Are you still around? I just saw this thread and am wondering how your DD is doing. Mine is still the same. She's waking early now, napping 1.5 and taking forever to go to sleep :(