3 1/2 mo old waking every 2 hrs at night

[lynnef]

My son eats great all day & night, and sleeps great during day naps. But when it comes to his night sleep, he's waking much too often and I can't figure out why or how to get him to sleep longer periods of time.

To give you some background, he eats every 3 hours from 7a to 7p, stays awake 1.5-2 hrs with 4 naps that are 45-60 min each. We put him to bed at 8:30, and attempt a dream feed at 10p. If he took the dream feed, I'd expect him to be hungry again at 4a-ish, and then start his morning again at 7a. But for the last 5 nights we can't get him to drink all (or sometimes any) of the 10p feed (we try not to wake him fully, but maybe we should??). Which, understandably, leaves him hungry and he then wakes up at 12a (eats), 2a (Binky), 4a (eats & diaper change) and again at 7a.

So, my question and plea is, how do we fix this?? I've been putting him down for naps with a Binky and if he spits it out and cries, I let him cry up to 10 minutes and he usually falls asleep on his own (sometimes I put the Binky back in after he's exhausted himself & he always falls asleep after). This has been my attempt to get him to settle himself, which I hoped would be used in night time sleep. And I've let him cry at night a bit too, but his cries are different (more desperate) and he never settles himself.

I always put him to sleep awake, swaddled, and with a Binky.
He is exclusively breastfed, usually on both sides, sometimes refused 2nd breast.
He is 3 ½ months old.
Activities during awake times are a range of play mat, bouncy seat with music/play arch, or sometimes just watching mom shower, do dishes, etc.

[jessmum46]

Hi hun, and welcome.  Have you read any of the Baby Whisperer books?  When you say you leave him to cry for 10 minutes, is he full-out crying or is it a mantra cry/trying to settle himself (more of a rhythmical monotone noise)? 

Tracy Hogg (the author of BW) was completely against any form of CIO/CC for any length of time - she always believed there was a gentler way to teach LOs to sleep independently without leaving them to cry alone and breaking their trust in you.  Even the researchers who promote CIO/CC would not recommend it for LOs under 6 months so please don't leave him to cry as it is unlikely to achieve much in terms of helping him sleep better.  That said, if you are willing to help teach your LO to sleep using gentler methods and can commit to not leaving him to be distressed alone, then you will get some great help here  

Could you post your day in EASY format?  e.g.

E 7am
A 7-8.30
S 8.30-9.30 etc

I suspect he may be in a bit of an UT/OT loop somewhere if all his naps are between 45-60 mins so there might be some changes to his routine we could help you with.  Multiple night wakings can be due to OT at bedtime.....  Other thoughts - do you think he wakes for the paci?  Is he teething?  Does he have reflux?

[lynnef]

Hi there. Thanks for your reply. Yes, I've read Tracy's most recent BW book and the crying I've let him do is just rhythmical settling noises. I once tried the other CIO once and it killed me and didn't work. I definitely know his cries now & realize when he needs something vs just settling himself.

His easy schedule looks like this:
E 7a
A 7-8:30/9a
S 8:30/9-10a
E 10a
A 10-11:30/12
S 11:30/12-1p
E 1p
A 1-2:30/3p
S 2:30/3-4p
E 4p
A 4-5:30/6
S 5:30/6-7p
E 7p (bottle of breast milk)
A 7-8:30
S 8:30 (bedtime)
Dream feed attempted at 10p, but only 1/2 bottle taken and unable to rouse to finish.

Then the trouble starts. 2a nw to nurse, 4a nw for diaper change, 5a NW for binky, 7a wake for morning feed.

We only give the paci to fall asleep & he doesn't wake when it falls out. And he doesn't seem to have reflux.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

[lynnef]

I also forgot the 12:30 be for binky (although he didn't do that one last night).

[Erin M]

Have you tried giving the dream feed at a different time?  Sometimes varying it by 15 minutes or so will catch him in a different stage of sleep and he'll take it more easily.

Routine-wise, I'd say that you might want to try to get him on a day where he's awake 7-7 instead of 7-8:30 -- being overtired can sometimes create night wakings (though at 13 weeks, we'd expect that he would be eating overnight, but I understand wanting to get rid of the other wakings).  Are his naps usually 60 or 90 minutes long?  You might be due for an A time increase in which case you'd be able to shift BT around.

[jessmum46]

the crying I've let him do is just rhythmical settling noises. I once tried the other CIO once and it killed me and didn't work. I definitely know his cries now & realize when he needs something vs just settling himself.

Brilliant!!  That sounds like you are doing exactly the right thing - good on you for making the choice not to let him CIO   We can definitely all help you to improve things from here and you'll get loads of support from all the great Mums (and a few Dads!) on here.

Looking at your EASY, does his morning nap typically start closer to 1.5h after waking or 2h?  Do you work by A times or are you going by the clock at the moment?  It might help (if you could) to post an actual day rather than an ideal EASY as the ideal one has quite a lot of variability - 30 mins either way can make a big difference.  If you could record what time he wakes, sleeps, how long he sleeps for and what his mood is like when he wakes (happy or still tired/crying) that would be really helpful.

I do notice you have quite a long day from 7am - 8.30pm - typically we try to aim for a 12h day so if awake at 7am, bedtime by around 7pm.  A long day can contribute to LO becoming OT and that can be one cause of NWs.  Short naps can also cause OT - if all your LOs naps are short that may be contributing too, though it's difficult for me to say without seeing a real day.

As a guide - LOs at 3 months are typically managing 1h20-30 A time, increasing to nearer 2h by 4 months which is when the transition to a 4h EASY typically occurs.

Will check back later if you get time to post again and hopefully can advise you a bit better x 

[jessmum46]

Routine-wise, I'd say that you might want to try to get him on a day where he's awake 7-7 instead of 7-8:30 -- being overtired can sometimes create night wakings

Great minds think alike

[lynnef]

Thanks ladies. I'll try to start transitioning to a 7p bedtime. Maybe that will help. Today looked like (his morning was off clock wise, but I was trying to listen to him & let him
Sleep if he needed it):
E 7a
A 7-9:15a
S 9:15-11a
E 11a
A 11-12:30
S 12:30-1:30 (awake 1:30-2. I was out & unable to feed, although he didn't fuss or seem hungry)
E 2p
A 2-3:15
S 3:15-4
E 4p
A 4-6p
S 6-6:45p
E 6:45p
A 6:45-8:30
S 8:30

This is where we're at tonight (I didn't see your posts until after putting him to bed). 

And he is awake & happy after his feeds, but usually wakes up crying (assuming he's hungry). Sometimes he wakes up quiet & content.

Does this help??

[jessmum46]

Often waking up crying is a sign that LO was OT when they went to sleep and aren't fully refreshed after the nap.  Generally if LO is refreshed they tend to wake up gradually and calmly. 

It sounds like you have a quite a good napper on your hands as he did a good sleep in the am even after 2h15 A time which I would have thought would be a bit much for him at his age.  Was his second nap out and about?  It's quite hard to interpret that one if it was as some LOs sleep better when out and moving, others not as well.  Later in the day I suspect the 45 min naps were a bit of OT creeping in as he was doing full A times after short naps.  Usually if LO has a short nap (<1.5h) it's recommended to shorten the following A time a bit.

I'd probably try to bring his A times back a bit to nearer 1h45-2h max, obviously taking account of his cues if he needs to go down sooner.  If he has a short nap, I'd make the following A time even shorter, possibly around 1h30 but may be a bit more or less - takes some experimenting to find out what works.  If you combine that with shortening his day he may be less OT at BT and that might go some way to helping with the NWs.

Not sure if it will help you but for some ideas here's a link to a transition from 3h to 4h EASY in steps: http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=120362.0

The other potential issue may be the paci which could be becoming a bit of a prop - in that he needs it to go back to sleep.  However, we can have a look at this once we try to eliminate the possibility of OT x

[MMRK]

Hello Ladies, I was looking through posts and this one is so close to my situation. Was wondering what you decided about the paci? My son is 3 months today and weighs almost 16 lbs and has 4-5 NW per night. I have started to feed him again but wondering how I can get him to stop waking. Thoughts?