Need help!

[haleytreat]

I have posted before about wether or not to use a pacifier when I first started with the EASY routine. Well i caved! And now I am in the same boat. My problem is I want to use it as the great tool it can be but how do i also wean her from wanting it every time she wakes? Maybe that isn't possible though. I just keep changing my mind on if she is attached or not. sometimes she will sleep almost all night without needing to be replugged and then she will go on a long stretch of needing it every hour starting at 2/3 am. She is a week away from 5 months. It has been a great tool to lengthen her naps so that is another reason i don't want to give it up but maybe i have to. Does anyone have any advice? I really hate doing pupd so that is another reason I don't want to give up the paci, when she wakes up early i like how the paci will help her sleep in rather than doing pupd but maybe i just need to change my attitude on it?

so basically i am asking is it possible to sleep train but also keep the paci? Or is that just mean since she would get it sometimes but not others?

[trimbler]

Hey there, sorry you haven't had a direct answer to this yet, but I see you've been given that link about paci pros/cons, did you find that helpful? I don't have experience with it as neither of mine were interested in the slightest - I did kind of want them to use if it were helpful, but that just didn't happen. However I know other mums on here have come up with tricks to help them to replug themselves, such as putting several in the cot so there's more chance of them finding one when they need it; or sewing one onto a mitten which baby wore and could then replug easily. I'm sure others will chime in with personal experience now that I've given your post a bit of a bump

[haleytreat]

Yes that link was helpful thank you! Sometimes I think I know that answer but I just won't listen! We have only been on a routine for 3 weeks. The first week went great. I took the paci away and i didn't have to do much of pupd after the first day. she was sleeping without waking up and taking good naps. Then around the 6th day naps started going away and she started getting up early and having nw. After a few days of that, I decided to try the paci again instead of pupd. I think selfishly on my end that was easier but now I am complaining again about having to replug her at night. Part of me feels if i think its a prop then get rid of it and stop complaining but then I think if i just hold out a few more weeks i bet she can replug herself so suck it up. But this week i started swaddling again to see if that would help. Well its helped at naps but not at night so much. I feel she wakes herself up when not swaddled. It stresses me out at night bc she has learned to roll over (not when swaddled - just when she plays). but at naps she very easily can take a 2 hour nap without waking more often than not or i just have to replug her and she will go right to sleep. When she isn't swaddled she is a huge thrasher! Before i swaddled her, she would be more awake and be playing in her crib and it would take a lot longer for her to go back to bed when i went to replug her. Now more often than not when she wakes i replug her and she goes right back to sleep. But she is getting up every hour almost from 230 am on and that is killing me! Part of me feels i should just ride it out and be grateful she is as good as she is. She really doesn't cry/scream at all. Part of me wonders if something else is going on and thats why i have to replug her. Is she teething, hungry or what. I don't know maybe i just worry too much! HA! I am totally rambling! 

i just started zantac to see if that will help with her spiting up and her fighting me to eat. Sometimes i feel she has reflux and then other times I don't. So i am trying just so i can rule it out.

She will be 5 months on the 15th. She was born a week early so based on the wonder weeks schedule she is only 20 weeks. I do feel she is on the lower side of A times too. I also wonder if my expectations are too high of her too. I don't know??

Maybe someone could look at my routine and tell me if it looks ok and maybe I will just go from there.

11/9
NW to replug - 1, 4, 6
wu 7 - i woke up (went to sleep at 710 on the 8th)
E - 4 ounces
S - 905 - 11 (in crib at 903 - swaddled with paci - kept paci whole time)
E - 11 4 ounces
S - 1255 - 250 (in crib at 1250 swaddled with paci - kept paci whole time)
E - 3 5 ounces
S - 450 - 530 (in crib 445 - swaddled with paci)
E - 630 6 ounces
S - 8 (in crib at 703 - swaddled with paci but wanted to play - unswaddled her - played a long time in crib but fell asleep with paci in on own)
E - 11 7 ounces


11/10
NW - 1145, 1, 4 (at 4 NW she didn't go back to sleep till about 5 - again not swaddled this night)
E - 4AM 4 ounces - wondered if was hungry so fed her
wu - 7
E 715 3 ounces
S - 840 - 1035 (in crib 830 swaddled with paci and replugged at 10)
E  - 11 5 ounces
S - 1240 - 215 ( in crib swaddled with paci - went right down - woke at 215 but she tried to put self back to sleep - i got her at 230)
E - 245 5 ounces
S - 428 - 530 (in crib swaddled with paci)
E - 615 4 ounces
E - 7 4 ounces (fed her again since only took 4 at 615)
S - 745/8 (in crib 738 swaddled with paci - went right down but kept tossing her head around so didn't fall asleep right away)
E - 11 7 ounces

11/11
NW - 230, 330, 430, 530, 620
WU - 7
E - 7 4 ounces
S - 9 - 1108 (in crib 855 swaddled with paci - replugged at 1020)
E - 1110 6 ounces
S - 1255 - 230 (in crib 1250 swaddled with paci - replugged 140, tried at 230 but woke up)
E - 310 - 2 ounces
E - 430 - 4.5 ounces
S - 445 - 520 ( in crib 440 swaddled with paci)
E - 630 3 ounces
E - 7 2 ounces
S - 740 (in crib 715 swaddled with paci - got up after a few min and talked in crib till i gave paci again and then went to sleep)
E - 1030 6 ounces
*slept till 7 this morning but had to replug her at 230, 3, 430, 515

[trimbler]

Hi there, sorry to have taken so long to get back to you. As I said I don't have experience with the paci but will see if I can find someone else to chime in with their experience on that... With swaddling, we don't recommend it once they can roll over, I see why you want to but if she can roll during play then she might suddenly do it whilst swaddled, which could be dangerous I wonder if you've tried swaddling with just one arm out - if she prefers to roll front to back in one particular direction then perhaps leave the arm out that she would use to roll that way, iyswim?

Just had a look at the routine over the last few days, nothing really jumps out at me except for the difficulty settling at BT - I'd have probably tried pd around the same time as you did but of course she didn't settle... I'm not sure whether UT or OT though, normally I'd suspect that a shorter A time would be needed after the evening CN, but you tried that... Will have to think! I can't help wondering whether there might be discomfort with all those wakings, but then again it could be the paci prop - will see if I can find someone to advise on that (((hugs))) you must be tired!

[haleytreat]

Thank you! I tried unswaddling last night since it doesn't seem to matter for NW and she only got up twice! what the heck! I think I will give it a week with unswaddle at night and see how that goes. If it doesn't go well I will try the one arm out. Worth a shot at least!

I find it hard to figure out A times sometimes with her. The naps are hard when she takes a short afternoon nap and a short CN. I don't want to put her to bed at 5 for pete sakes!

[becj86]

Hi, I kept the dummy for DS, he just needed it but having said that, he replugged himself at 5 months. giving it to her to play with during A time can help develop that skill.

I think you could have a care of too much day sleep too early in the day. She's taking a monster nap 2hr after she wakes which is average for 4 months but generally by 5 months, baby is awake 2:15-2:30 before a nap and I wonder.if she's making up for the broken night with the shorter A times and long am naps.

Any medical issues/ discomfort like illness or teething at play? Just wondering as there was a 20min nap waking in there and also those frequent wakings through the early hours of the morning could be that too. How does she behave when she wakes at night? Is she hungry? I don't see any feeds after the DF.

[haleytreat]

I have tried to feed her but she will still get up after an hour or two so I am pretty confident she isn't hungry. Replugging her at 530/6 could be hunger but i replug her so she will hold off eat at 630/7 as i don't want to start my day at 530 . I also don't really think it is teething since it happens more often than not and since she will typically go back to sleep once i plug her. I am thinking that although the swaddle helps her not move around as much, when she actually wakes up enough to realize she can't use her hands she gets ed  and that is why she wakes up more often. We shall see this week  

When she wakes sometimes she is just playing. She doesn't cry during those times, just fusses. But that is how she is at all times. She rarely cries. But maybe that is because I haven't really let her fuss long enough to cry?!?!? Maybe I should not go in until she is crying.

I like your idea of having the paci during play time so she can learn to mess around with it and replug herself.

I thought the same way about her typically always taking a really good long nap in the mornings and that being because she is up so much during the night.  With her being on the low side of A times, should I cap it at 1.5 and see how the next few days goes with that?

[Martini~]

Hi Honey! popping in to second or not some paci ideas:).

In general 5-6mo is still quite early for self repluging so you may try to teach her that's a you said through a lot of practice during daytime activity. I would probably ditch it fully at that age to get rid of the problem Honey. Have you considered that?

[haleytreat]

Thank you! Well I have and I tried that for about a week and it seemed easier to give it to her instead of doing pupd. I had to do that to extend the morning and extend the naps. I know you are right i should probably get rid of it but I'm just trying to wait it out and see if maybe it has something to do with the routine.

[becj86]

Yeah, if she's not crying, just playing, leave her to it.

[haleytreat]

ok thank you. So how long should her naps be at this age? I will try to extend 2.10 A times and see how that goes.

[haleytreat]

Also the last two nights I have stopped swaddling her and she seems to sleep better. Only waking at 430 and 530 and up for day at 630. I replug her at 430 & 530, which I am ok with at this point. I will look to increase her A time a bit and make sure she doesn't go past 2 hour naps so she doesn't sleep so much during the day. Should I also try to do wake to sleep to try to get rid of the 430 waking? Or just wait a bit? Maybe I'll try to feed her at 430 but just a few ounces to see if that helps her stay asleep till 7ish? Thoughts?

[trimbler]

Hey that sounds like good progress And I'm much more comfortable knowing you've ditched the swaddle too, for safety's sake Yes I think I would try a little feed around 4.30am and see what she does with it, she's still young after all. If she's really not interested then at least you'll know. Or of course you could try wake to sleep, I've never tried it myself, too scared but many mums here have had great success with it, especially if it seems to be a habitual waking rather than hunger. I think I'd probably try offering the feed first though, since if she's hungry she may just wake for milk at a different time, and I'd prefer to feed at 4.30am than at 5.30am - more chance of getting back off to sleep afterwards, IME.

The classic nap routine for this age would be 2x 2h naps, plus a CN late afternoon, but they're all different... Have you seen chronological EASY samples, 4-6 months ?
Just for ideas, you'll need to find what's right for your own LO, but we're here to help if we can I don't think I'd cap that morning nap but others may disagree, I'd rather try pushing out that first A time, but we'd tend to suggest just pushing one A time to start with, hold for a few days and see how she responds, and then start working on the next A time. Otherwise you could just end up with OT short naps

[haleytreat]

I know right! yah! 

Yes I agree about the swaddle - I am not stressed about it anymore either Yeah I am scared to do the wake to sleep too - feel i will do it wrong anyway

Yeah I think I will work on the A times and naps before thinking of removing the paci. So when you say just push one A time do you mean just make one A time longer but not the rest? When I looked back at the logs I have when she was sleeping 8-7 i noticed she wasn't getting as much sleep at naps as she is now (I was doing more pupd instead of her sleeping) so maybe that is why she stopped sleeping as well at night because I seem to have her taking good naps now.

[trimbler]

Yeah that's quite possible, you fix one thing and something else goes wrong But extending the A times should help to resolve it, and yes, I mean extend one A time initially but not the rest. Once she's got used to that, work on the next one, and so on...