Support and Chat thread for moms of early waking toddlers

[samijoe]

oopsy, forgot to mention to deb...

in our birthclub there are 4 of us due with lo's.  we have ALL experienced mysterious NW'ings with our lo's.....especially as we near the end of our pregnancies.

don't want to scare you, just wanted you to know and expect it.


sami

[Pitkin2]

Hi Layla

Yes you're right I'm a bit tired with christmas stuff and working etc and I just pushed everything too soon.

Today I gave him 2 hours and he's gone off fine at 7.15 pm after story. 

Yes I will do it a bit more slowly tomorrow.

Once again thanks - I'll let you know how we're doing.  He's staying at my parents tomorrow and I bet he sleeps until 7 am!!!!!!!!

Emma

[debo620]

Sami, great to hear from you--havn't seen you around at all. hope all is well. thanks so much for sharing your experience with Avery.

I do think thats what Noah was doing last night, manipulating. goodness I don't want him to cry... its just frustrating you know. I went in intially because he was screaming but after that I don't think I really did anything to encourage it. but maybe he just wants to see me and then screams when I leave etc. you'd think he give up a little earlier then 2hrs later...

so you guys have given me somethings to think about. I know that if I ever have to go to his room it takes way longer for him to go to sleep. so I aways pray when i hear him wake that he doesn't start crying. DH doesn't usually handle the NW but maybe he'll have to start if this is a seperation issue.

that said, when Noah is rested, he'll wake, talk self settle etc WITHOUT calling for me. so he's quite used to waking and having me not go in. I think the trouble is when there is something bothering him. don't know how to deal with that wihout him expecting me there, kwim??

on a side note, and honestly I don't know wha bearing this has, he has finally broken through on the 2nd  2nd year molar--looks like the whole tooth has popped.

so today, Noah has napped 11:50-2, I am glad because he had an awful night, but is 7pm okay for bed?

[samijoe]

Deb, i think if you want you can still put him to bed at 7pm tonight...just know how long it takes him to fall asleep, as opposed to worrying so much about it.  He had a good nap today, he probably could make it to 730pm--so don't expect him not to play until then at least.  And btw, i totally think it is ok for him to play himself to sleep.
You could just stick to 7pm for awhile....so on days where he doesn't nap so well or so long, your goal is 7pm.  And on days where he does nap well, you can put him in for 7pm for your peace of mind...or in the hopes that his bedtime will settle somewhere after this time.

hmm hth
sami

[debo620]

so am I crazy here or what?

I totally 2nd guess my bedtime because he is soooo grumpy and occasionally rubbing his eyes from 5pm onward. even on that good nap. he is getting frusrtated, crying easily etc.

[samijoe]

Could he be bored?

He's been up a few hours...maybe he needs a change of scenery??

Um....could he be hungry??  My dd gets ridiculous when she is hungry....very grumpy.  On the other hand, when she is tired, she gets clutzy!

Don't give up on him yet....and remember, everything takes a few days, right?

sami

[Layla]

Deb, i think its common for them to act like that around that time. Mine too gets grumpy (on a good nap day) around that time ... i think its just how some toddlers are. Its the end of the day.... they get tired but still doesn't mean that they are anywhere near their true "bedtime". I usually have bath around that time so mine gets kinda distracted.

[debo620]

yah I guess I just get confused what to do after such a bad night! yes he had a 2hr 10 nap but thats after a 9hr night.

to me he must be just the littlest bit OT from all this wacky sleep, and I don't mean day to day--I mean overall. he hasn't has any good days/ good nights combined where I feel like he may have caught up a bit.

so I always thought earlier nap, earlier to bed was the way to correct this, has this changed???

I put him to bed a few minutes before 7, and he was mostly quiet, with fussing every once and a while, and asleep I think by about 7:30pm

so thats it!

[debo620]

thanks Stacy. I get it all.

I think I'll do early nap and early bed for a few days then, just as a catch-up stractegy. maybe just 15minutes, just to see if it helps. I am always playig catch-up and thats the problem.

its his overall mood thats really troubling, hes not my happy boy anymore...even DH is really noticing it.

[Aly Mac]

Big Hugs Deb.  I guess it's hard thinking about their sleep differenlty as Stacy says - not baby sleep anymore - I never thought about it like that.  

I agree, the afternoon is normally, bored, hungry etc.  Maybe schedule in a regular thing at that time that you know he'll be grumpy. My Dh is home in the afternoon around 3 or so, and I let him play with L in around that time.  Daddy time, but also a change of face -for both of us.  Even though L is an angel, by the end of the day I am tired (as i"m sure you are).

I think if you get a good afternoon/evening routine in place before the new bub, it will make it so much easier when the bub arrives.

I also worry about L getting OT, but I"m trying to roll with it now.  I was confusing her tiredness with OT - you have to remember that we all get tired at the end of the day regardless.

Big hugs to you hun - I know how you feel. so easy to get lost in the nap fixing!

ON a different note - L slept to 6am today with no NW - yah!!  went down like a dream at 9, I woke her at 9.45 - she kept rolling over to ignore me to go back to sleep! - but she's ok when she's up.  Then it took her 20mins or so to go down for her afternoon nap.   Around 1.20 now instead of 1 - should I change anything guys?  or just leave it. if it takes her 20 then it takes her 20? it did escalate today as her teeth are hurting (cna't wait for this teeth thing to be OVER!)

ps. we posted at the same time.  I foudn the first few days of less naps, L wasn't herself, and it's worrisome when they are such happy kids otherwise, but it really only took  a few days for her to be happy.  I havne't even been doing this a week and it's worked great. I stick to the times regardless. Up at 6, naps at 9 and 1/1.15 and asleep by 6.30.  Try not to worry about his mood, and just stick with it!!!

[LisaM]

Aleesa - how long does your lo sleep in the afternoon?  Just wondering how long she is up before bedtime?

My dd at the moment does 4 hrs before bedtime and I have been reluctant to stretch this for later bedtime in case I make her even more OT and also later bedtimes have made no difference to wake time in the past but I do know that I will never get a later wake up if we don't go later at some point.

Seeing as I moan on here daily now about the NW and naps etc, I should say that yesterday was better.  The am nap was still rubish, took her 30 mins to go off and then only had 35 mins and was very unhappy then she had an hr in the afternoon (which is the most we ever get) but was still totally miserable when she woke which is what I hate soooooooo much.  Then bedtime 4 hrs later and straight to sleep and she actually slept from 6pm to 5am which is amazing for her.  I did hear her at 2.45 and then at 4am but she went back off straight away.  I am so confused now about nap times though because she keeps doing weird stuff.  Today I went for 3.5 hrs after wake time and she took about 20 mins to go off so not too bad, the problem is I prefer earlier as I know I will have trouble getting her to take 2nd one if its later in the afternoon.

Looking at the advice to Deb, I wonder if we have the same thing going on with the NW - they started again after she had been ill and I had stayed in the room with her to fall asleep.  Now she wakes almost every night for 2-2.5 hrs.  I always put it down to OT (the reason she stays awake so long) but maybe she is trying to get my attention.  We try not to go to her but eventually what happens is she makes noise for ages then after 2 hrs etc she finally starts to lose it because so tired I suppose and can't get herself back off?  I just hate that she looses so much sleep and never makes it up with good naps, infact as I said naps are much worse right now which could be cos of OT, could be cos getting ready to switch to just one!!!!!! 

Do you think I should start trying to implement one nap or do you think I need to wait til NW have stopped etc? 

Deb - I'm with you on the overanalyzing etc, its so hard to change when I've been obsessing about it since birth really because she has had problems with sleep from day one.  I'm gonna try and take some of the advice for myself because I know I cannot control everything and it just drives me mad trying!

[Aly Mac]

LisaM -I would stick to two naps if there are NW.  they tire them out so much, that I think at Grace's age, she would need it. But I can only go by my lo!  We are working on 3hrs A before the second nap and 4hrs A time after - and that's asleep, out to it 4hrs later, so I start the bedtime routine (dressed, goodnights, bf) around 3.5 - if it's bath night, 3.45.  With xmas though we have a few get togethers at people's places, and I must say I will probably let her stay up an extra half/hour, if she is happy.  I know it could stuff things for a few days, but we still need to be flexible.

[samijoe]

So I'm interested Deb....he fell asleep at 730pm last night.....

what happened ...any nw'ings, up early???

hoping good thoughts for you.



sami

[debo620]

awake at 6:30  , heard him once around 4am roll-over and laugh

[Aly Mac]

yeh deb! or should I say Noah!