help for mom with PPD 9 m/o TONS OF PROBLEMS

[anielasmommy]

thats the problem though she will not AP to sleep unless shes tired enough so if i just go in and AP nap if shes not ready she screams bloody murder and after screaming for 45mins i can AP her to sleep KWIM? its absolutely horrid. then she will nap 30-40 mins if im lucky sometimes only 20...she only seems willing to nap after 4.5+ hours A time which doesnt leave time for 2 naps. i feel so hopeless!

[babybarr]

What about 1 nap and a super early bt?  So she napped 12.30-2.30pm what time did you do bed?  Maybe try that nap time but with a 6.15/30pm bt?

[anielasmommy]

ok she no matter what wont sleep more than 11 hr nights so early BT just means early rising.. and i did try again lol
she just woke up at 5am and then the day was even longer.
today she had one 2hr nap with me she was sooooo OT last night was horrendous. she had only napped 20 mins all day and then of course we had company and she was like yeah right im napping! i am creating a monster too with the co-sleeping now its like co-sleeping and all night nursing! idk what to do im miserable depressed and exhausted...this is clearly not a solution but i feel like i cant even handle the repercussions of my actions to try and get her to sleep independently again. then i feel guilty for "not being a good mom" b/c im depressed and withdrawn during the day so i feel like the least i can do is cuddle with her in bed. i am just completely hopeless

[A pair of Charlies]

No Kami, you are not completely hopeless. You are not. 

You are trying. But I think we are at a point where we were some months back. The AP seems to be how she gets to sleep; my guess is that she thinks that's how she gets to sleep. Sleep training. PUPD isn't great for a lot of spirited babes because they can find it too stimulating. And I think, personally, that mother's of spirited babes also have a lot less give available after a full on worn out day keeping up with a spirited little soul.  All that stress on both sides isn't always condusive to sleep!

For us, PUPD was a nightmare of screaming and hysterics. It wasn't for DS or for me. So I did Gradual Withdrawl, which in my opinion can be really good with spirited little ones - when I did it, there were quite a few Mamas on the spirited threads having success with it too (Sherry Lynn, former EASY mod is one). BUT, it's down to the baby - some find it too much to have Mama in the room. I think Liz had to do WIWO, for example. For me, I was DS's sleep prop - like you - and I did GW. Initially I took it slow, then did it over 2 weeks. There was crying, but I stuck to my plan and it wasn't long. I was there the whole time to comfort and reassure - sleeping became DS's decision and he really liked that I think.

I can help you with GW if you would like.

Right then, your EASY. May be that she's working towards the transition a little earlier; not unheard of. Her am nap - how long do you give her? Will she sleep in a buggy if you're out and about easily?

On EW days, how about bringing the am nap a little earlier to give you a 2 nap day?

I do think that a lot of it is down to a consistent way of her going to sleep - so she knows and is confident in herself getting to sleep. And that is hard. But so worth it when you get there. 

Let me know if you want a hand

Charlotte

[anielasmommy]

of course i want you're help charlotte!! what are the GW methods again?

i do shoot for 2 naps during EW days. she will not nap in the buggy even if shes beyond exhaustion.

i never wake her from any naps ever i wait and see what she will give me lol today she had 1.5hrs...now shes fighting BT..she was going down smoothly but then a neighbors dog barked and it was all over. now her dad is in there trying to get her down (hes ACTUALLY been helping me lately)

i know the AP is a mess i am such a jerk b/c she was doing beautifully in the independent dept. and was only waking to feed 1-2 x at night..its just been so hard b/c shes never napped consistently ever seemingly no matter what i did..and i got to the point where i just couldn't deal anymore.

last night i kept her in the crib all night. she woke 5 x and i nursed her each time b/c i really could not handle the alternative...i had to pat her a few mins each time as well.

its so hard now b/c its not just crying its crying and calling mama mama in her sweet little voice and it breaks my heart!

[A pair of Charlies]

Hi honey

Just came to check on how things were on your thread to see that I hadn't come back to you on GW! 

How are things now? How is she getting to sleep and how long does it take? How many wakings and how do you resettle?

Hoping I can help you put together a plan! Is DP helping out more now? Would he be able to do GW with you (so take turns on first few nights to settle / sit in the room) or at least be there to give you support (and note the all important times)?

Hugs 

[anielasmommy]

i have been trying my best to do a set nap and BT to at least get somewhere. she naps at 12 (AP'd for now to get in a routine) then bed at 7pm. she did good yesterday but then woke at 9 930 was up and out of her crib at 10...then we went to my bed together at 10:30 she didnt sleep until 11, was up at 1 1:45 2:45 4 5 6 7 for the day. she keeps screaming crying. idk what to make of it. she has the top teeth coming they already cut...
now if i consistently put her in the crib to sleep after a NW or nursing she wakes up 5 mins later and starts screaming...

DP does help more but not at night. DD is still very much i need mommy...even if DP goes in and rocks her and signs trying to get her to sleep she will scream bloody murder (he tried recently for 45mins) then the second i went in to get her she stopped crying...

[A pair of Charlies]

Okay. 

Could she be thinking that how the whole sleep thing works is that she goes to sleep in the crib, wakes, then goes to sleep with you, nurses when she wants. And that's what she feels is normal. So when you put her back in her crib instead, she's thinking "what the hell are you doing?! this isn't how i get to sleep! this isn't where i sleep!"

What do you think?

When I used to bring DS into my bed (became a habit  ), it started when he woke at 5am. But then the wakings just got earlier and earlier until it was midnight and he was expecting to go to my bed - because he thought that was where he slept. Like the putting him in the crib was some elaborate sleep preparation / foreplay, before a proper night's sleep in my bed.  Wondering if she could be going through the same?

So, how would you feel if you slept on her floor next to her cot / bed? There to comfort and reassure, but not to cuddle to sleep etc, until she gets the message that she sleeps in her cot without your help, just your presence? And once she's good with that (a couple of days later), starting to move away from the cot gradually when she's put to bed to go to sleep over a few weeks until you're at the bedroom door sitting on the floor while she choses to lie down in her cot and go to sleep when she is ready, without your help? And then you sit on the other side of the door for a night or 2 (only while she goes to sleep - not all night!!)?

What do you think?

[anielasmommy]

well shes still in my BR her crib is in there. shes not the kid of baby who will even go to sleep if i am standing there the whole time. i can hardly get her to sleep with me! lol we just had a 1hour battle to sleep and shes in my bed. the past few nights she wont even sleep in the cot period.
i KWYM about the whole this is the way i sleep. i realise that is what happened. she used to sleep all night in her cot period for months and months. then when the PPD hit about 2 months now i guess i felt guilty and what not so i just started bringing her into my bed. i can certainly try the whole im sleeping on the floor next to you thing but i really don't think she will take to it at all. she is very super duper spirited lol i mean seriously will not quit on something she will just flip out worse and worse until i give in. i know im setting a good example by doing that either but her pead said shes too young to have "behavioral problems" so basically its all in my head even though i know how she is but shes so little its not like i would punish her or anything.
i do have another BR however i live in a real rough neighborhood right now and i do not feel comfortable putting her in another room. God forbid we get robbed again and i can't get to the baby or something happens to her KWIM? im trying to get out of this place but its hard its so cheap here and i am broke still...

[A pair of Charlies]

Okay.

Let's make a deal? You don't want her to sleep in your bed forever, right? But she's in your room, so she's still got you close by?
Tell me when you're ready, and we draw the line. No more sleeping in your bed - she sleeps in her cot. End of.

So, you are there and you reassure but don't intervene - let her make the decision to lie down or stand up, to sleep or to cry. You stay with her, say only your key sleep phrases and try to say them a few mintues between each at most. So you set the example, it's quiet, it's calm, and this is how we sleep. Sleep on the floor close to her first or pull the bed & cot right next to eachother.

But there is one very simple key thing. You don't give in. She sleeps in her cot.

I know she's spirited. And she knows her own mind. That's not a bad thing 

With DS, things really turned around for us when I realised that he was going to make his own decisions. I can influence the decision - put him in his bed, in his pjs, nighttime music, calm & quiet, I lie down and go to sleep next to him. But whether he laid down or not, slept or not - I couldn't make that decision for him. I could influence it. I could help set the scene and lead him to make the choice (stand in cot or lie down to sleep - after 40mins of standing, lying down seems more logical to them!).

If I had taken him out of the cot after 20mins or 40 (the first night) - it would have only made it harder.

I think with Aniela (and I could be wrong), but she knows her own mind and she is clear on what she wants. She slept merrily in her cot at times you were sure she wouldn't - she's independent.  Give her the opportunity and give yourself the chance to start healing you. 

Here to work with you on it when you are ready. But it has to be a line drawn - from that day, she sleeps in the place you put her. Same room as you or not - her bed, your bed. And trust me; those cuddly sleeps together will still happen by chance and they are all the more lovely when you're both rested! 

Big hugs honey  Stop beating yourself up and see your good

[anielasmommy]

TY Charlotte. idk if im ready or can handle that yet. my PPD seems to be heading for the worst again. i need to see a doc but dont have insurance right now...

anyway i will let you know when i start! TY for you're help and time i really appreciate it.

[A pair of Charlies]

Just PM me when you're ready. Start a new thread so you can get support too. And we do it together, ok?

I found at this age, that DS often wanted less input from me and to get into his bed to sleep. He just didn't know how to go to sleep at that point; but my holding him or trying to help made it harder for him to settle. Not sure if that's the same with DD; just a thought.

Keep talking sweetie  Want to help 

[anielasmommy]

TY
Aniela is the opposite shes going through some stuff right now and shes all over me all night practically sleeping on top of me. shes waking a lot less now though.