4 weeks old - too much daytime sleep?

[marilyn73]

My 4 week old seems to nap all day (I also have 2 DD - age 3 and 5) - then awake fussy in evening, and wakes a few times at night.
I'm basically following EASY. But it goes something like this:

8:30am - wakes
8:30 feed
9:45 - 12:00 nap
12:00 feed
1:00-3:30 (sometimes later) nap
3:30 feed
4:00-5:00 nap
5:00 feed
somewhere from 6:00 - 7:00 - feed and then to bed "for the night".

then up and down several times from 7:00pm - 12:00am - with a "dream feed" at the end - sometimes 11ish, sometimes later/earlier.

2:00am feed
5:00am feed

start all over again.

My question is whether I should interfere with the daytime long naps in an effort to improve evening and nighttime sleep?
The daytime naps are EFFORTLESS - I sometimes let my 3 year old hold her baby sister when I actually want to wake her - and she will remain conked out while being held for upwards of an hour, and then I can stick her in her bassinet for another hour.  This is what happens between the morning and afternoon nap.  Sometimes I place a happily sleeping baby in the nice warm bath to get a bit of awake time - again, often around lunch because of dozing off after being fed.

Anyhow, perhaps it's all early days.  But I've had great success with EASY for my first 2, and am inspired  to get a bit more predictability in our days, and more sleep at night.

[lauradj]

Congratulations on your third lovely little lady! 
I've included a link below for you to take a look at.  You could try and wake your LO after 2 hrs and see if it makes a difference.  It's sounds like she's entered the phase where she's confusing her days and nights, so a nap cap might help.  At the same time, 4 weeks is still really, really young, so try not to stress too much just yet.   

Typical Amounts of Day and Night Sleep

[weaver]

Congratulations on your new little person!

It all sounds completely normal to me.    including the sleepiness. 

The fussy period in the evening can sometimes to due to overstimulation - one thing that helped us over that hump was to start doing her evening feed in the quiet of the bedroom and to aim for a regular BT for her.  Also implementing the DF properly helped a lot.  If your new little one is BF, then two NFs are completely normal, 2 and 5 am were our times too. 

She may be wanting to cluster feed if she's awake a lot in the evening, do you think that's a possibility? 

[Martini~]

Have you considered waking her at 7am? You could squeeze a feed there and add some additional A during day. I know the she is really little but at 1mo I would expect her to be out of her sleepy newborn phase and needing some A during day, as expecting 13,5h night sleep without a period of even short activity would be slightly too much:). WDYT?

Btw waking at 7am could help you in making more feeds during day. Would this waking suit your older s routines?

[marilyn73]

Hello, I decided to carry on with the late waking routine, and naps as they come - I love the sleep in since I have a 6 year old to get off to school and a 4 year old still at home.  Also, even with a 9ish am wakeup, baby usually falls right back asleep after I feed her.  Sometimes she has good awake time, but then will do a nap-feed-nap - all blended together.

On occasion we have "perfect" naps days - 2 longs, and a supper time catnap.  But no matter what, our evenings are still out the window.

Baby usually has her last "nap" between 5-6pm.  She wakes from that, has a feed, and then gets cranky pretty quick.  I've been consistently doing a bath right after, a little activity time while drying off in front of the fireplace, then feeding and straight to bed - 7-7:30, depending on on the cat nap.

THIS is the issue - after my awesome bedtime (or so she lets me think), she is up and down all evening.  Sleeps for 30-60min at t a stretch, then one of us walks around the house (usually DH) with her.  She's not really upset - just won't settle.  At times she cries but is easily soothed.  She does not want to be fed and lets me know if I try.  She will keep falling asleep in our arms, but whether we put her down drowsy, or wait  until she's in a deep sleep, it just won't stick.  On occasion I dump her in her crib wide awake to tend to someone else, and she falls asleep on her own.

How do I break this routine?  Some mornings, if baby is still asleep at 9:30, I WILL wake her - but she can't stay awake after feeding.  And if we go anywhere (library, groceries) - I'll be ready to leave by 10, and she's immediately asleep in the carseat - until 12 or later.

I'd like to reset her schedule…just don't know how.  I don't think keeping her up later is really an option.  She's totally "done" by 7, and frankly so are we.

Suggestions?

[marilyn73]

p.s. DD is now 8 weeks old, breast fed, and growing well.

[lauradj]

TBH hon, this still sounds really typical of her age.  Typically that interrupted early evening sleeping is attributed to OT and I would recommend a catnap but as your LO is already getting two naps and a catnap, perhaps she's not ready for bed when you put her down?  If you could post your EASY, it would make it easier to provide suggestions. 

[marilyn73]

This was yesterday basically:

9:00-9:30am  - wakes for the day - or I wake her if she's still sleeping at 9:30.
9:30 am - feed
S - 10:30 am -12:30 pm
12:30 pm - feed
S - 1:30-3:30 pm
3:30 pm feed
S - 5:00-5:30 pm
5:30 pm - feed
6:00 pm - bath
6:30 pm - feed
7:00 pm - to bed.
7:45 pm - awake
7:45 - 10:00/11:00 - asleep for 30-40 min stretches - some nights maybe a 2 hour stretch.
dreamfeed/awake feed, depending - 10 or 11.
12:30 - feed and straight to sleep
6:00am - feed and straight to sleep
9:15 am - awake today.

As I said, this was yesterday. 12:30-6:00 sleep was awesome.  Typically I feed at 10/11 pm, 2 am, 5 am, maybe 7am. and then up for the day at 9:30.

I would say that awake time is not long enough in the morning, and in the evening, it seems like a second catnap happens - not actually sleep for the night.  I don't know about OT.



   

[lauradj]

Thanks for posting your EASY.  I wonder if the reason she's having difficulty settling is because 7pm is too early for her to go to bed, given that she's not waking until 9am?  Although I know you're loving the later wake up in the morning, I do wonder if waking her at 7am might help regulate things a bit better for her?  For example, when my DS was the same age, his schedule looked like this:

7am WU/E/A
8:30am S
10:30am WU/E/A
12pm S
2:30pm WU/E/A
4pm S
5pm WU/E/
5:30ish bath time
6pm E (cluster feed)
6:30 S
10pm DF
7am WU

For me, this worked well because it guaranteed me (usually) a solid 8 hours of sleep.  I know you mentioned you like to let your DD sleep in because it makes managing your other two children in the morning, easier.  If that is something you'd like to maintain, so be it.  Try to keep in mind, this is the prime age of the 'witching hour'.  My DS went through it a smidge earlier and there were nights where we would have him in a sling, in his swaddle and just walk him around until he drifted off and stayed asleep.  At that point we'd slip him into his crib with fluidity that would impress Houdini.  We also used The Happiest Baby on the Block settling technique (it's very much in line with Tracy's teachings) and it worked quite well for DS. 
This is likely just a phase and it will pass as she gets a little older but from my PV, I would try an earlier WU for a week and see how that affects things. 

Average A times- BOOKMARK ME!!

[marilyn73]

I may just try the earlier wakeup - maybe 8:15 as a compromise, since this is when #1 catches the bus.
I agree that she is sleeping in too late for the bedtime we are attempting - but I'm caught at both ends - she absolutely cannot stay awake if woken earlier, yet she absolutely can't last any longer in the evening.
Clearly, forcing the bedtime isn't working, so starting with the morning might be more logical.
My first 2 were picture perfect baby whisperer babies.  They ran like little clocks.  I'm totally sold on the concept - can't wait for it to "kick in" for this one!

[lauradj]

You know it's coming!  It always takes a bit for LO's to get themselves all sorted to the outside world but I agree that the earlier WU will likely help.  DS could never last past 7 either.  Hope it helps!

[marilyn73]

You know, I might not be so impatient if I was younger and less experienced.  At 41 with 2 angel babies already, I'm expecting to run a tight ship around here