15 weeks - please advise on EASY. UT or OT naps?

[creations]

I'm so glad to see you've had some success with the first nap and resettling the second into a better nap 

I'm just dashing off now to get DS ready for a toddler group but I'll be back later with some more.

You're doing it!  You're doing great!!
 

[creations]

A time at 2.5 hours and he actually gave me a 1 hour nap both Sunday wnd Monday morning

Brilliant! So I would leave it a couple more days and focus on the other naps.  This one though, if the nap doesn't go longer after 2 or 3 more days maybe increase another 5 - 10 mins.  You don't want to over do it too fast but being overly cautious doesn't help either. At worst he gets OT and wakes up screaming at 10 or 20 mins and has to be re-settled.

And then he did a 40min nap, woke up crying, amd was easy to settle for another one hour nap.

This sounds UT.  So he is tired enough to settle for the nap initially but then not tired enough to transition, when he wakes he still feels tired and cries. Depending what A time you did before this I would look to increase again.  Be ready at the 40 mins, maybe pop in a few mins before to see him through that transition so that he doesn't wake up too much if possible.  We need to gauge whether it's the A time or whether it's ST needed here to teach him to stay asleep.

Do you remember the A time you used for your LO's short naps?

Our routine was unconventional. DS had silent reflux and it was around this time I was getting him started on meds plus fighting the 40 mins naps, plus we had an unavoidable appointment twice per week which meant car naps for 40 mins were all I could offer after the first nap of the day. It really wasn't ideal.  The thing at this age is that the A time feels like quite a jump and it increases quite quickly up to 6 months (going to 3hrs or more), the sleepy baby days are over and baby is so much more alert and ready to DO stuff (gaze at you, roll, hold toys) so although no one wants an OT baby you also don't want to be playing catch up for another 2 months with an A time that's too short.

Keep sight of the successes though. And may I also suggest you plan to take a minimum of 30 mins to yourself during the first nap. Go and lay down in a dark room and breath deeply. it can help soooooo much, the laundry and dishes will wait, they really will.  Or get yourself to the back/front door and get some air, look at the tress if you have any, the sky...getting some air and light is so energizing after being stuck in a dark room shush/patting.

Keep going

[Fefekabob]

Thank you for all the great advice. The last one about taking a nap is a little tough given that my 2 year old boy would tear the house apart!! 😜😜

But, I am coordinating the second nap to occur at the same time as DS2. He naps from 1-3 every day so I really try to make the day work in favor of giving me a little alone time to sit on the patio and enjoy the beautiful California weather.

I am truthfully very surprised at how much of an increase in A time he needed. I extended the first one to 2 hour 45min and he has been doing 40-50 min naps and then resettling for another 30 min nap. Then the second A time is about 2 hour 30 min and then he does a 35 min nap followed by some shh/patting to sleep for another 10-20 min. (Because its always so close to his next feed)

I almost think he should do 3 hours in the morning but it just seems so soon! I thought they do 3 hours at 6 months... Not at 4!! But he is definitely very alert and wants to be very much involved in all of big brothers activities. It's so nice having an active toddler around for entertainment! Or else I would not know what to do with him!

Creations, do you think 3 hour is pushing it or should I try it? I just worry that because he needs to feed every 4 hours, that he will only get a one hour nap at best.

[creations]

The last one about taking a nap is a little tough given that my 2 year old boy would tear the house apart!!

Oops! Sorry!
Great that you have worked out a routine to get some Y time when they both nap at the same time though!

3hrs does sound long yes, but, if you feel he needs it (and I agree it kind of looks that way doesn't it) then give it a go. I often think that routines go off track and stay off track when we don't have the courage to do what our LOs need simply because the guidance times don't fit. Worst that happens he gets horribly OT and you get a few rough days whilst you bring his A times back down again.  Is he self settling for all naps now?  Does he ever transition alone?  I must say I wonder about that second nap being so short, 35 could be OT and he isn't getting a decent nap length even after resettling, are you sure this is due to feed times and not OT??

Whether you move to 3hrs or not I think you'll need to be a little creative about fitting feeds in with naps. If necessary bring a feed early so he can have a decent nap length - I know he doesn't really want a feed before 4 hrs but he may be willing to take one just before a nap (then couple mins A to just make a gap there) so he can have a really good sleep.
Do you want me to look at the E and S times to see where things might be shifted?

[Fefekabob]

Haha, just when things couldn't get worse... He had a lot of NW last night. All from getting loose from the swaddle. He had been shifting at nights for a few days now and really tries hard to get his hands out. But last night he was dead set on a mission and there was no consoling him when I reswaddled. He was in hysterics at 11:50am and then again after his 1:30am feed when I swaddled him tight. So for today's nap, I left one arm out. He took a 30 min nap and then was wide awake. His A time was exactly 2.5 hours because he seemed so tired and cranky. I assumed it was from the rough night so I didn't push him to 3 hours. But with a wake up like that (all smiles) I probably should have kept him up longer.

Anyway, so now we are at his second feed of the day and he's falling asleep at the bottle. (1 hour after his nap). I guess I will keep him up another 30 min and try and give this one arm out thing another go.

I know it's going to be a really rough transition out of the swaddle, but he's almost close to rolling over so I just have to keep at it...

[creations]

Sorry no advice on weaning the swaddle. I only swaddled naps until 10 weeks and never at night so I'm no help.

[Fefekabob]

Well, the naps got really bad without the swaddle. I mean like 20 min only three times in the whole day. It was a pretty exhausting weekend. But, interestingly... He did much better at night without the swaddle and every time that he would normally cry out for me, I heard him sucking on his fingers and put himself back to sleep.

So today I decided to try swaddling only for naps and he did a little better. Still took only a 40 min nap in the morning, a 40 min one in the afternoon, but then I shush/patted and extended it another 48min.

I think I have a bit of a ST issue for naps because he doesn't ever go through a nap transition alone. On one hand it's convenient for everyone if I just shh/pat for 5 min so he gets the rest and I get to be with DS1. But on the other hand, I really need to start teaching him how to nap on his own.  I'm thinking maybe after he gets over this "learning to rollover" milestone, I can really buckle down and ST properly. It seems to be one of those milestones that he wants to practice even in his sleep and he is not as relaxed as he could be. And waiting a few more weeks will mean he is also a little bit older and can handle PU/PD. The shh/pat method seems to have become a prop.  I always stop before he is asleep, but he still needs it to get to that sleepy state.

Looking at our whole situation, I guess things could be much worse. But it does depress me a little that my baby can't take long naps on his own. Such a contrast with DS1!

[creations]

I'd generally suggest sticking with your routine until other things (rolling, swaddle change etc) are more settled but yk if you want to try an A increase to see if he will transition there really isn't any harm in that. You know the risk, OT nap and needing to be resettled, it's no worse than getting 40 mins naps because of removing the swaddle.  if it's rough you chalk it down to a bad day and start again the following day.

Honestly ALL babies need comfort before sleep. If you are stopping the shush/pat before he nods off you are doing the right thing.  Even at 3yo my boy gets a cuddle on my knee with little rocking to music for 3 - 6 mins (1 to 2 tracks on a CD) before climbing into bed and snuggling down. He is a totally independent sleeper but even so when he struggles with his sleep I go to him and give him another cuddle or stroke his head, it's quite a regular thing here as he has lots of anxiety dreams related to developmental leaps and catches every cold going.

I can understand the frustration of your LO not transitioning alone yet. have you tried holding off on the W2S to see what happens? he might fuss then self settle? Or no chance??

[Fefekabob]

Thanks for the advice.  Haha, tbh I am so scared of W2S!! It's failed me so many times! I'm sure I'm doing something wrong but I could certainly try it again.

But first I am going to try extending A time to 3 hours.  And I am going to change up his feeding a bit and give less at his usual time and then top off right before the nap.  It would be better for him anyway because of his reflux. I'll see how that goes and let you know.

And I am starting to realize that I shouldn't expect so much of my little baby. He was in the womb only 4 months ago. I can't expect him to know how to sleep exactly how I want him to sleep! He's still learning... He will get there someday. I think my exhaustion sometimes gets the better of me and I complain too much.

Anyway, going to go to sleep now so I'll have some energy for my boys tomorrow. Thanks again for the tips. I'll keep you posted.

[creations]

I think my exhaustion sometimes gets the better of me and I complain too much.

Oh that happens to all of us