13 mo and need help with feeding routine

[hrk]

Hi!

I would like some input on our feeding routine.  With the transition to one nap, it seems that I need to get so much in before he goes down, otherwise he wakes from nap hungry/earlier.  We were having increasing nwings until we put back in the bottle of formula for night. 

So, any suggestions are welcome.  Even posting your routine may help give suggestions.

Routine:

6-6:30 wake for meds (reflux)

7:00 2T oatmeal mixed with 3T apple/blueberry sauce and 1/2 banana (or 1 egg and 1/2 banana); doesn't usually drink much here but 1-3 oz of 7 offered, approximately

8-9 somewhere I offer the rest of the milk in a sippy as he seems hungry; he might take another 2-3; usually there is left over that is rolled in to his nap bottle

Reflux meds with lunch, as it has gotten so early!  Want them in before nap, also...
10:00-10:30 I have been offering lunch lately!  He is getting drowsy, and I feed lunch and a bottle to keep him from waking hungry.
Lunch: including fruit, veg, something else, and 7 oz sippy; he takes a couple oz.  Offer the rest of this sippy and the extra from the morning (there is always extra) at about 10:45.

Napping begins somewhere between 10:50 (absolute earliest) to 12:15 if we are out and about.  Today it was from 11:20-2.

3:00 Cheese and something else with water

4:30 he is getting crankier; last dose of meds 4-4:30.
5:00-5:15 I usually end up feeding him, but would like it to be later to have dinner with dh and eventually closer to bedtime to get rid of top off; eats fruit/veg something else; offer milk and he has about 3 oz

6:50 5-8 oz of formula, reinstated as he began waking a lot at night. 

Any suggestions?  Thanks in advance to anyone adding there two cents!  :-)

[~Natalie~]

Hey Jean  

What if you switched the:
3:00 Cheese and something else with water
10:00-10:30 I have been offering lunch lately!

That way he is getting snack before nap which should hold him through and then lunch is later which can then get him to a later dinner without a snack in between.  Although I would make lunch right away and not wait till 3

[EloysH]

Hi Jean,

A few things come to mind straight away..

Same as Natalie I would make lunch as soon as he wakes from the nap.. and give a substantial snack 30 mins before the nap. Jarrah loves ot have his lunch on the table within 15 mins of waking from his nap!
Maybe Heath is not hungry enough to eat his lunch at 10:30 as he is essentially eating/ drinking milk every hour or hour and a half till then.  I find with Jarrah that he needs at least 2 hours between snacks/meals in order to work up a good appetite. 

On the milk: we don't give much milk, but on the days where I give him more than 100ml of milk (which is less than 1/2 a cup) I really feel it spoils his appetite for his lunch or dinner meal. I checked it out with the early childhood centre.. they don;t need any milk at all if there's enough calcium in their diet..

I don't know that much about night waking for food, but maybe he is needing the formula at night because he needs more protein and carbs for food during the day?  It's just an idea, you haven't specified his meals in detail so I am guessing.

I was given advice from the Early childhood centre nutritionalist to give protein and carbs & veges for lunch.. so more like a dinner meal, it gives them more energy to sustain their active bodies throughout the day. The dinner doesn't need ot have protein. it is more important for hte lunch meal to caontian the prtein and carbs. We eat the wrong way round with the substantial meal at dinner it should be at lunch.


I'll show you Jarrah 'smeal schedule below it might help as Jarrah takes his nap the same time as Heath, but I warn you I spend a fair bit of energy coming up with varied ideas for his food all the time.. it's my hobby. Although I usually make a weeks worth of the meat and carbs bit of the dish and freeze, and do the veges and fruit part fresh everyday. 

6:00am wake
6:15 breakfast -  one weetbix with goat milk and 1/2 bannana on top
                       -  1 chopped kiwi fruit
                       - 1 slice of toast with tahini paste or vegemite     
                       - water to drink       

or               -  2 slices of toast and 2 chopped fruits like watermelon and peach.             

8:30 -9:00am Snack  -  Fruit (eg one whole bannana) & water

10:30am - Snack  - Water and cheese, and some water crackers or one corn cake, or a sheet of seaweed paper (ugh!) occasionally 100ml of goat/cow milk

11:00 - 11:30am nap for 2 - 2.5 hours

Lunch when he wakes 1:00 -2:00pm always carbs and protein and veges.  I am still working on putting more raw veges into his diet.
-chicken casserole and couscous and grated carrot
-or spagetti bolognaise with wholemeal pasta and peas
-or lentil pilaf with rice, carrot, currants & spinach
- or tuna pasta in tomato based sauce with mushroom, cheese and peas & spinach
- fried rissoles made from  grated tofu, carrot, sweet potato and carrot & egg

Snack 3:30pm - 4:00pm  I try to make this a lighter snack as it can easily ruin his appetite
Usually 100ML of goat milk with
 1 small pikelet,
or some water crackers
or grated carrot or cucumber slices ,
or watermelon,
or papaya or kiwi fruit,

Dinner: :5:30  ---- he can't wait he gets too whingy
Now if lunch was quite heavy  or he has already had red meat I usually just do  steamed  green veges (small chopped peices of broccolli, snow peas, peas, asparagus) and some carbs like coconut rice or couscous or wholemeal pasta with cheese sauce.  Sometimes I do scrambled eggs or fritatta.
But if lunch was lighter then I will LOVE to cook 2 lamb cutlets with garlic and do steamed veges and rice. He loves chewing the meat off the bone!! 

Bedtime 6:45pm - 7pm.
Now if he is teething and I do errand with him in the pram I do give him more snacks than keep him occupied cause he has tantrums in the pram often.  So the snacks in the pram are water crackers, cruskits, corn cakes, rice cakes, teething rusks, and dried mango/apple.  Sometimes his appepite gets spoilt fomr this but at least it keeps the peace!

HTP!

Eloise

[EloysH]

excuse the spelling I accidentally hit "post" before checking over

[hrk]

Thanks Natalie and Eloise!  Eloise, additional thanks for your routine and the lunch ideas.  I must admit I am terrible at cooking meat as I am a meatless eater myself.  I will say I am fine with Heath eating it, but haven't felt comfortable with red meat, personally.  I do cook it, but usually involves me touching it as little as possible or plunking it in a pan with some seasoning.  I guess I have been doing the Super Baby Food ideas, as it is a pretty meatless book.  Has lots of ideas for protien.  It is hard to try new recipes.  Eloise, your ideas look great for lunch!  Doing mostly organic foods, also. 

So, do I am thinking per Natalies suggestion that I keep the milk before nap?  Just not with snack?  Today he had no milk with breakfast; gave him snack at 10 and he was hungry.  Took 3.5 oz with it.  Thinkinig I will still do the bottle before nap, as I know he will be hungry if I do not.  Then luch after nap.

Thanks a ton for the suggestions and ideas.  I really appreciate it!!!
Jean :-)

[hrk]

Eloise, I also meant to ask that if you make a weeks worth, does he still eat it by the end of the week?  Heath gets bored eating the same thing, unless it is lentil loaf.  lol

I make a lot of veg soups and pull out the veggies before I add any tomatoes, since they are terrible for his reflux.  I use a low sodium broth for any of his food.  Also, oven roasted chicken, lentil loaf, pb or tahini sandwiches, broccoli/brown rice dish, veggie patties (he loves these), toast, egg (m, w, f, sat), cottage and string cheese.  I use the dha/ara fortified oatmeal cereal for breakfast with applesauce for the mornings he doesn't have an egg and fruit.  That is what I can think of now. 

What pastas do you make ahead?  The couscous, (I haven't seen coconut rice-is it sweeter?), and what is your cheese sauce made from?  I haven't done that as most sauces are processed cheese, here.  I haven't looked for a homemade recipe.

Thanks again, gals.  Hope our food selections/routine don't seem too crazy, lol.     

[EloysH]

yeah I woul,d do the milk before the nap you can see that we have a snack before the nap too just ot make sure he's not going to bed hungry.

I do make a weeks worth but i freeze them in small containers so I can pull out different ones each day.... I just reheat in a very small saucepan with a little water and the lid on low heat.

Oh thanks for your food ideas..  soup.. I haven't tried that yet. great idea. There's no rush to give them meat anyway.. as long as they get their protein in other ways!

I will post the recipes later today I have to go to jarrah now.. he's awake!

[EloysH]

So you are like me a bit on the busy side with all the cooking & organising menu's !!!  Yeah I make my own stock too, the packed stuff is just too salty.

Pastas: 

break spaghetti into small bite size peices before cooking, cook as usual

Pasta Sauces:

Vege Sauce:  Fry up 1 chopped onion, 1/2 clove garlic, chopped mushrorom, asparagus, snowpeas, 12/ can tuna (if you want to add protein), few table spoons of tomato paste, few table spoons of crushed tomatoes, pit of pesto, 1/4 cup of water. ISmmmer till veges are soft. 

Cheese Sauce: Melt one tablespoon butter in a pan and then add one table spoon of flour. Mix together it will go lumpy and dry.   On low heat slowly add milk and stir intil it turns into a thick sauce.  Add grated cheeses, tasty and mozarella so sauce is nice and thick.  Add wilted spinach, chopped parsely (both greens for calcium) cooked mushrooms or whatever to make it a bit healthier.


Coconut rice:  Normally cooked brown or white rice is too dry for Jarrah to eat...  so I try to make my rice into a pilaf or add a sauce to it .. sort of like risotto.  Coconut rice is just my latest craze.         So when I make rice I do it by absorbtion method, in addition to the water I add about 1/2 cup of organic coconut milk from a can, and (because we have the the next ingredient in the garden) finely shedded kaffir lime leaves.  It gvies a wonderful aroma!  The rice turns out alot moister and tastes of coconut. It works better with the Basmati white rice as opposed to brown rice.

The couscous is just a substitute for the brown rice.. I usually add that to a beef casserole or chicken casserole.. so it is very wet, mixed into the casserole by the time he eats it.

We're not having much luck on fish... he likes grilled white fish pieces, have you got any good fish recipes?

Eloise

[hrk]

The day went well; I need to iron out the amt for snack.  He didn't have a lot at lunch time after nap?  He was hungry at 4:30 and gave him a biter biscuit.  That held him to 5ish.  He did have a good amount for dinner. 

So, as far as milk: should I offer it at breakfast, bottle before nap, lunch after nap, dinner, top off at night.  Has two 7-8 oz amts before nap and bed.  The other times it is 3ish, more or less.  Although, he usually skips most of it at breakfast.

Ah, the sauce is like what we call a roux, but adding cheese!  Yummmmm!  I think I am going to try that for sure, in addition to the others.  Great suggestions!

Tonight, I made a 4 cheese macaroni that had tomatoes; I separated it in to two bowls and added carrots to Heath's instead.  I also make burritos, but like a quesadilla.  The shell is just folded over once.  I use black beans, avocado, and cheese.  Heath eats a lot of avocados and bananas. 

Natalie does cook fish, I think I remember correctly. Perhaps she will have a suggestion.  I haven't seen much at the market, so still deciding what fish to buy.

Eloise, the weather there sounds delightful.  Wish it was nicer here.

Thanks again!
Jean

[EloysH]

So you've been watching the world weather report! It was rather hot and sunny today we had a great time playing in the sandpit although it was too hot after 10am till 3pm to go the parks - most don't have shade    Where about are you in the states?? Was if Florida  I can't remember.

Great to hear the day went better and nap went better. Mmm, yum   burritos.     Oh I see, so you aren't giving heath any tomato at all.  Do you find it makes his reflux worse?  Can you tell me something, is apple good for reflux?   

About the milk, I have been told by the nutritionist briefly that it is fine for a one year old to have 3 cups of milk a day with breakfast lunch and dinner... I would guess that it's more about what they're used to as opposed to need. I think the idea is to reduce this by the time they are 18 months, but I am not sure on the quantities.   How much is 7-8 oz in ml??  1 cup is 250ml, to me it sounds alot to have three cups of day, I just can't imagine Jarrah drinking that much but again, it's what they are used to right?

[huntersmummyinoz]

hiya,

just lost my post, grrrrrr, will try again!

well i popped on to have a looksee, as your day/napping is similar to hunters. plus i just had to mark cos i love the recipe ideas you are coming up with, always looking for new things to cook here 

our day looks like this:

630/645 wake
700 bottle 5 oz (was going to switch this to milk in sippy with breaky but he seems to be dropping his night bottle at the moment)
800 breaky plus diluted juice
usually porridge plus cheerios or toast, plus fruit
sometimes hot breaky of sausage/bacon/hashbrown/egg/baked beans or pancakes

1030 snack: cheese plus cookies or crackers, plus water
*as he starts to nap closer to 1130/12ish will start to split lunch between here and after nap

11/11.15 nap, usually 2 hrs

1.30/2 lunch plus fruit plus 5oz milk in sippy (lunch is 15mins after waking)
lunch for us is usually bread based.
- bagel, spread with cream cheese, veg spread, etc
- toast fingers/triangles with veg spread or dip or baked beans, trying humous soon
- 1 slice of bread to make mini sandwich, filling cream cheese, plus ham, grated cheese, grated carrot, avocado, etc or veg spread, (i also use a cookie cutter sometimes to cut into stars, (makes it look different to the same sandwich yesterday IYKWIM)
- 1 slice of bread to make mini rolls: take off crust and flatten bread then spread with filling, cream cheese and tuna is a fav of hunters, or as per sandwich spread ideas
- pasta spirals, sometimes with veg sauce or plain but give other veg sticks
- rice cakes with different spreads
- 2 egg yolk omelette: add cut up ham, red pepper, tomato, cheese and spinach (hunter loves this!)
- potato or sweet potato chips always go down well too!
- mini pizzas are a fav too

4.00 snack: yoghurt plus fruit, plus water (if really hungry will give rice cake or something small, try to make it enuf to hold him out til dinner but not so much that spoils his appetite)

5.00 catnap (ROFL as this has happened once in the last week)

6.00 dinner plus 5oz milk in sippy(5.45 on one nap days)
usually same as me and DH or modified version. always protein, plus carbs, plus veg. then dessert (rice pudding, banana custard, fruity rice, etc)
hv always told me to fill him up as much as possible at dinner
7.15 top up bottle 3/4oz
7.30 BT   (7.00 on one nap days)

will be back to later with info on milk and a fish recipe 
kirry

[huntersmummyinoz]

jean, dont know if this is the right advice or not.....but if he isnt interested in milk at breaky then i wouldnt bother offering it then. sounds like naptime and bt milk is what heath wants most. the only prob you may see is that he isnt hungry at lunch time after nap because he is still full on milk, just watch and see how it goes and if he eats a decent lunch then i wouldnt worry. so personally i'd just offer before nap, with dinner and bedtime. after 12mths they only need 13 to 20oz milk and that includes other dairy in cheese, yoghurt, cheese sauce and other cooking. also does he have milk on his oatmeal cos that counts too. could maybe add a yoghurt after breaky or does that affect his reflux? yoghurt plays up with hunters reflux if he has it close to a sleep but is fine if its a few hours before.

stock, not sure if this is available to you but in uk there is a heinz baby stock, also boots does baby stock cubes (so really really low salt content)

fish recipe, unfortunately i cant take credit for it, its an Annabel Karmel recipe. hunter loves this so much that he actually lets me feed him off a spoon (he usually refuses a spoon unless it has yoghurt or dessert on it )

Fish Pie
Topping:
500g potatoes, peeled and diced
4 tbl spoons milk
3 oz butter

Filling:
1 small onion diced
2 tomatoes diced (i'm sure would be fine without jean)
1 1/2 tbs flour
7oz milk
250g cod fillets, skinned cut into cubes
250g salmon fillets, skinned cut into cubes
1 tbs chopped parsley
1 bay leaf
2 oz grated cheese

topping, make as per mashed potato
filling: melt butter, saute onion 3 mins, add tomato saute 3 mins. stir in flour, cook 1 min. add milk, bring to boil, cook for 1 min. stir in fish, parsley, bayleaf and simmer 3 to 4 mins. remove bay leaf, stir in cheese until melted.
preheat oven 180'C/350'F, put fish in oven dish, top with mash potato. bake for 15-20mins.

i use mini ramekin dishes. so hunter gets his own cute little pie. DH just eats two. i also double the recipe, cover remainder with clingfilm and freeze (no need to bake in oven if freezing)

another good idea with fish is make your own fish fingers. cut into strips and roll in flour, egg, milk and then crushed cornflakes. shallow fry.
fish cakes are good too.

HTH
kirry

[hrk]

LOL, everyone seems to be able to drop bottles but us. 

Heath was very restless 30 min in to nap; then woke screaming at the 2 hr mark.  Nothing would calm him.  Tried to give solids, refused, gave bottle and he sucked down 7 oz again to the 7 oz he had before nap.  No he is eating a bunch of the left over pasta from last night and drinking a bit of water and a half banana.

So, today I gave him the snack at 9:40, and he didn't eat a lot.  So, this likely didn't help.  :-(  I think I must work on it being later to get in more solids.  I fed early b/c we neede to run an errand.

Kirry, your day looks good, too!  How do you do a split lunch?  The fish pie looks great!  I have some little cups that would be great. 

Thanks again everyone!

[hrk]

Eloise, I read your post earlier, and meant to reply also.  We live in Wisconsin.  It is so cold.  Natalie is getting the cold, too.  Tomatoes are really bad for him; he wakes screaming from reflux.  I love tomatoes; it is no understatement either.  As a kid I used to dunk everything in ketchup, even cake.  Not anymore of course!  But I still love tomatoes on/in everything. 

From his sippy it looks like about 200 ml is 7 oz.  He doesn't always take much with meals, so it ends up mostly covering nap and bedtime.  Although he often has 23ish oz of milk/(8ish of it formula) per day.  He actually cries if he hasn't had enough sometimes.  The night bottle is formula, as he was having a lot of waking.  Per Paula's suggestion, I added the formula back, and he stopped waking.  I am going to see the pedi on Wed, so I will talk to her about his milk intake.  He just doesn't seem to be reducing, and then at what point do we need to do it.

Kirry, I think I will take your suggestion and just offer at nap, dinner, and bedtime.  Offer more solids a later than 9:40 as I did today!  Heath is thinking "sheesh mom!"  I haven't put milk in his oatmeal, as he gets plenty from the rest of the day.  I agree with the yogurt being bad for the reflux.  I think James didn't do well with it either when he was refluxing.  I would love to have Heath eat it for the probiotics.  He loves it, too, but it results in spitting up through his nose :-(

[~Natalie~]

Hi all, I have been reading along but am struggling to keep up

We do fish and James loves it, our favorite is a Tilapia Piccada
Dedge the tilapia in flour with salt/pepper
heat T olive oil in pan
Cook tilapia, about 2min per side (just watch for doneness)
Add white wine, lemon juice and capers
Cook alcohol off
remove fish
finish sauce with butter, pour over fish
we usually eat it with brown rice

(I eye ball the liquids because it really depends on how many fish you are making)

Yes very cold here too, yesterday was nice and we were outside, but the temp dropped again.  If it is going to be this cold then it better snow soon!! 

Yogurt really messes with James' reflux too.  Tomatoes are bad but I have been giving him small one every now and again.  We had pasta with meat sauce yesterday and then again for lunch and he has been refluxing really bad and puked on his coat    I think two days in a row was just too much