6 mo sleeping 10 min during the day

[Ninou]

Dear all,
I had a great help here before with working on naps for my older daughter and now I am back for advise.
My younger daughter is 6 mo now. Up till 4 mo there was no major issue with routine and naps and since than we were often sick, older child at home, guests, etc and my youngest routine is completely unexisting by now. She is eating each 3 - 4 hours (breastfeeding), starting each time different time during the day. There are quite some night wakings as well, but my major issue now are her naps. She might have 30 - 40 min nap in the morning (approx 3 hours after waking up) and afterwards that would be naps of 10 - 20 minutes. Even if she is in a sling, or in the baby wagon, or in a car. A small bump on a road or some noise - she has eyes wide open and impossible to get back t sleep. In the night she usually sleeps from 18.30 to 06.30 (with multiple night wakings). So I am really concerned about her naps as I am a strong believer that nap is very important for child developpment. Any tips where to begin?

Many many thanks in advance

Nina

[Kellyjs]

Hi would you mind posting your easy for me so I can take a peek? 3hrs A seems about right for a 6mo, but a few days log might help me get a better understanding as to what's going on.

Is she an independent sleeper? Does she put herself to sleep ok? You imply she's out and about a lot for naps? Not a problem, it'll just help with a plan if we know what your usual day is like.

For us, those short naps were UT or discomfort related.

[Ninou]

Dear Kelly,

Thanks a lot for replying! I have started to make and EASY today already to post it here. So I will come back here again in three days to show what the general pattern is.

She sleeps in her cot, goes to sleep without rocking or feeding (usual routine is: diaper change, couple of songs on hands and shh patting in her cot). We were on a good routine (WU 7.00 E 8.00 S 9.00 A 11.00 E 12.00 S 13.00 A 15.00 Bed time routine as from 18.00 ) up till 4 mo and than we all got really sick here and for two months her routine was completely screwed up. So now these are like 3 naps of 10 - 20 minutes during the whole day and 11 - 12h night sleep with multiple waking ups in the night.

Anyway, I will come back here in couple of days to post the routine during these days.

Many thanks in advance and wishing a Happy New Year for everybody!

Nina

[Kellyjs]

Look forward to hearing from you nina, and happy new year to you too! 

I'm thinking we might have to start all over again from scratch as the illness may have ruined all your hard work beforehand x

[Ninou]

Dear Kelly,

Here is the routine for last three days.
Day 1.
WU 5.00 in the morning
S 6.00
WU/E 7.40
A till 9.35, than started to put her to bed
S 10.00
Awake 10.20, tried to shhpat her and rock her for 20 min - no success. Awake with eyes wide open
E 11.50 - porridge
13.00 we went outside
S 13.45 in the baby wagon
Awake 14.10
E 14.30
As from 16.30 she was already hanging, did not want to do anything by herself
S 17.30 in baby carrier
A 18.00: shower, eat, etc
S 18.45
Night: multiple wake ups during the night, especially in the first part of the night.

Day 2
WU 6.15
E 8.00
S 9.07 (in her bed)
Awake 9.40
E 11.00
S 12.10 (10 minuted in the cot, than awake, than my husband rocked her and she slept on his chest 30-35 min, he put her in the cot and than in 10 minutes she was awake again)
A 13.20
E 15.00
S 16.30
Awake 16.55
Since than was on hands
E 18.00, shower, etc
S 18.15

That was a new year night and as usual she woke up couple of times in the beginning of the evening and than from 24.00 - 01.30 she was awake because of fireworks and finally felt alseep on my chest.

Day 3
WU 6.45
E 8.00
S  10.00, awake in 10 minutes, we tried to put her back to bed, took 15 - 20 min to my husband to rock her and after that she slept 15 min more in her cot. Was not really happy once she was awake, but I was not able to settle her back to bed)
A 11.00
E 12 - vegetable pure and milk
We went ouside for a walk, was getting sleepy there, so once home we tried to put her to bed but she screamed a lot
S 14.00 - slept 15 min in a cot, after my husband rocked her back to sleep and she slept at least 1 hour more on her chest.
A 15.15
E 16.00
E 18.00, than massage and to bed
S 18.30

Since than she already was awaken like 4  - 5 times. Screaming in her sleep, but if we do nothing she just gets more upset and does not settle down. Usually really easy to settle down with couple of shhpats..

So that is the story. I try to understand why she wakes up so fast during naps,but really can not get it. Usually she just had eyes wide open and smiling. In some cases she wakes up upset and than even if i try to ressetle her she just gets more awake..

Hope you can advice something, I have no idea where to start ...
many many many thanks!

S

[Kellyjs]

Bless you, it is a tricky one isn't it?

I do think those naps are causing OT by the end of the day. Probably why she's hanging off you and having those NW's in the early part of the night.

On day one, I think she had an UT nap there as technically that was only 2hrs 20mins A. Could be why she's waking at the 20mins perhaps? Whereas the next day, A time looks good but the nap was only 30mins. The only time you managed to get her back to sleep it seems was after a very long A after a short nap when your DH managed to get her to sleep on him.

If we look at sleep cycles, around 20mims is when a LO actually falls into a deep sleep. She could be jolting herself awake, but really i would have expected she'd be used to that by now. It's more like newborn behaviour.

Can I ask if there's any teeth coming through that you can see? You said the routine went out of the window at 4mo, but these short naps... Are they recent behaviour? Waking up at this time I would often assume discomfort. How's weaning going? Do you think something might not be agreeing with her there?

[Ninou]

Well, she just had her two teeth through (that is when it all became a chaos ), right now I do not think something is disturbing her, I think she just got used to a very short naps, is it possible?

At the same time, today was somehow betterr in a way that  during the whole first nap I was sitting near her and caught her at her 10 min wake up - sshhpatted her back, again she was awake in 10-15 min, I caught her again and shhh patted back, afterwards she slept something like 1h10 min in total. For the second nap I managed to catch her at her first 10 min awake - shhpatted back, but in 10 min she opened her eyes again and here I lost a battle. ended up by rocking her into sleep (took 20 min) and she slept like 1 h on my chest. Finally she slept 20 min in the pram when we had a walk in the evening, from 17.20 - 17.40.

So maybe I should focus on trying to sit with her during her sleep and try to extend those naps?

From those diairies, do you think I better have her on 2.30 or 3h acitivity stratch?  And if she is clearly showing tiredness signes after 2h, should I put her to bed or should i try to extend A time?

Many many thanks!

[Kellyjs]

Amazing news, go you! I think that might be the key for a little while to convince her to get back to sleep. We can look at a plan to wean that later on if needs be.

It's going to take a bit of time to find the right A for her I think. 2hrs 20 is too little we do know that. Unfortunately tired cues start to become a little unreliable around this age, but can still be taken into consideration. For us, I never appreciated that actually it was easier for us to resettle an OT nap than an UT one. I was so paranoid that she'd get OT and won't go to sleep at all! How about you try something in the middle like 2hrs 45mins with a view to extending to 3hrs if needs be? I do think you'll have better luck resettling those early WU's from naps if she's tired enough to go to sleep. Maybe try a longer stretch first thing to try and get a decent nap in in the morning, then you can judge it by how's she's doing following that nap (if it's long or short), you may have to reduce it a little if the nap is short but only by 10 mins or so. Wdyt?