Nap Refusal - Any advice for today if poss

[Truly Blessed]

Gosh, I wish I could give you a straight answer Hun It is unfortunate that moving to a bed has coincided with the 1-0, it is a tricky situation for sure. There are 3 approaches that I know of.

Return her to bed silently every time she gets out. I have tried this, and I tell you with no hesitation it is hard, and IMHO not the best way to go if you can avoid it. Firstly, it means she is getting attention, so it can quickly become 'a game' in her eyes. Secondly she may just find it upsetting and get cry a lot. Thirdly it is a battle of wills, and can take a long time.

The other way isn't easy either, sorry, but I think it is better. Just let her walk around the room and do her thing. Use your sleepy phrase, plus ask her to get back into bed in as few words as possible. Don't enter into any play or extra activities with her, just sit. Eventually most LO's will lie themselves down when tired enough. This may not even be in the bed, it may be beside you on the floor or wherever. But, the next night she will know what is going to happen if she gets out of bed and that it is not interesting or fun, and the hope is she won't bother in the end.

Thirdly, you could take her mattress out of the cot if you have room and let her sleep on it on the floor for a while. For whatever reason, it helps with some LO's, it's like flopping down on a mattress on the floor is less like getting back in, strange but true.

I'd try the earlier nap tomorrow and if it doesn't help I'd seriously think of alternating no nap days with EBT and an early nap day with later BT.

x.

[Hayleys]

Hi!

Thank you all of that info is really helpful! I think I'll try the second option but if we get to a place where it's not working then I may have to try the first. Ugh! Such bad timing with the 1-0 and her needing the cotbed coinciding!!

So last night on the way home she fell asleep very quickly in the car, she was absolutely shattered! This was her EASY yesterday:

WU 6:30
S 11:35-12:05
BT 7:50 (fell asleep in the car)
WU 6:20

So she had a 10 hr 30 min sleep which is good but she is still very tired. I'll try an earlier nap today then and see if that helps withbedtime tonight!

Thanks again! Really appreciate your help!! xx

[Truly Blessed]

That's the way I would go too Hun, you're so welcome, my pleasure, sending more 'sleepy vibes' your way.x.

[Hayleys]

Hi

So I managed to get the earlier nap in yesterday. This was her EASY:

WU: 6:20
S 10:20-11:50
BT 8:15 (asleep by 9:10)
WU 6:30

Bedtime was later than usual as she was refusing to get in the bath. She was very tired and also had pooed and I hadn't realised so was getting grumpy about going in the bathroom. Looking back, I should have just skipped the bath as I think she was just wanting to go to bed. Just before she did get in bed she even asked me if she could skip a TV show and go upstairs. She was very tired.

She did get out of the bed though and I laid on the floor. I found it really hard but she fell asleep next to me in the end and I then transferred her. My gut feeling is it took her time to fall asleep because it was a new way to learn to fall asleep as opposed to not being tired enough or perhaps OT didn't help either, what do you think?

 I'm thinking to keep with the earlier nap today but as wake up time is getting earlier to perhaps try an earlier bedtime as her day is getting longer. Do you think this also may help her get a longer night, she is so tired this morning. I was hoping to keep her wake up from 7-7:30 but guessing that may go out of the window now. Ugh!

xx

[Truly Blessed]

Morning,

Yes, I'd go early nap again, and think about switching her BT routine around with bath earlier possibly  Or like you say go for a wash and skip if you think she is already sleepy.

I think an early night is worth trying for, no guarantee she'll take it, but worth a try. In the light of her sleeping on the floor, is it worth going with the mattress on the floor plan while she goes through this transition to take the bed situation out of the picture  I have a feeling she may like it.x.

[Hayleys]

Hi

So I managed to get her to sleep in the car from 10 -10:30 am. Just wondering if she looks like she may be more receptive to an earlier bedtime what time would you suggested - 7:30?

Today is far, after a 9 hr 20 min sleep, has been:

WU 6:30
S 10-10:30
BT ?

I agree that if the mattresses had been on the floor last night then I think she would have fallen asleep on it  as opposed to the rug on the floor. The problem is that now she absolutely loves the fact that she has a bed which she can climb in and out of. I think that even though she won't fall asleep on it right now, she would feel really upset about the mattresses being on the floor instead of the bed frame and this could cause a lot of problems. If we had started it from the beginning when we took the sides down then I think she would have been fine with it but not sure this is the way forward from here.

Just wondering, I know you mentioned that you had experience of putting your little one back in the bed every time he got out, did you ever try the approach I'm currently doing or know of anyone who has had success? Obviously each toddler is different but do you know roughly how long it would take? What I found hard last night is there was one point where she was asking me to hug her. I told her that it was sleepy time and she need to get back to bed, but gosh that was so hard!!! I was just thinking that if I had hugged her then there isn't really any purpose in what I was trying to achieve as she would want to get out of bed each night for that to happen, am I right in my thinking? Gosh, I really hate it when sleep issues arise. I always find these times so difficult!! 

xx

[Truly Blessed]

I'm sorry I couldn't get back to you yesterday Hun, DH laptop crashed and he was using mine to lesson plan . It would have been more than my life's worth to approach

The problem is that now she absolutely loves the fact that she has a bed which she can climb in and out of. I think that even though she won't fall asleep on it right now, she would feel really upset about the mattresses being on the floor instead of the bed frame and this could cause a lot of problems.

Agreed, it would only work if she wasn't keen on her bed, but that's good news.

Just wondering, I know you mentioned that you had experience of putting your little one back in the bed every time he got out,

Yes, it became a game and it went on for 50 minutes the first night, my back was killing me and I was almost in tears. By the 2nd night I left him to it, so I've done both. By night 3, Sam got bored and got back into bed himself with what you're doing now.

What I found hard last night is there was one point where she was asking me to hug her. I told her that it was sleepy time and she need to get back to bed, but gosh that was so hard!!!

Yes, it is hard, and that is a very good question Hun. If she comes over to you for a (HUG) maybe at this point you could simply say "Into bed Sweetheart and Mammy will give you a hug" I'm thinking if getting into bed is teamed with a hug, she may do it. Then tuck her in and give her a big squeeze then stay on your chair, not holding her the whole time. Any chance that kind of approach may work  I completely see where you're coming from. Also I would talk talk talk to her in the day time, praising her for being in her bed, and saying how well she is doing etc.

Lots of ((HUGS)) Hun, it really is stressful, I hope last night was better.x.

[Hayleys]

Good Morning

Thank you for you response!

So yesterday was a mixed bag really. She was extremely tired to the point where she fell over at 4 pm and as my DH was cuddling her she nearly fell asleep on him. We went for the earlier bedtime of 7:30. She only stayed in her bed for 2 minutes and refused to get in for her stories which we usually read. I tried many different approaches to get her in the bed. I then I told her that she needed to get in the bed and I went to lay on the floor. She then got in what I would describe as a panic, grabbing my face and asking me to wake up  . So I told her that we could sit on the bed together which she was happy with. She was such an OT mess. We then read her stories and I told her that she needed to stay in the bed, she asked me to sit on the edge of the bed and I did. At one point she went to get out of the bed and I told her that she needed to stay in. She started to ignore me so I said that if she stayed in the bed then I would stay in the bed too. (Not sure if this was the best thing to say as obviously at some point I do want to get off the bed with her staying in but in the moment I was unprepared on how to handle things). So she wanted to settle very quickly after this. I tried to get her to lay down on her pillow but she wouldn't. She ended up falling asleep within minutes on my lap. So glad she fell asleep quickly but not in the ideal way!

The good news is she then had a 10 hr 50 min sleep. She is still tired this morning but hopefully we are heading in the right direction with lengthening her night sleep. This was her EASY yesterday:

WU 6:30
S 10-10:30
BT 7:30 (asleep at 7:50)
WU 6:40
 
She is so tired right now I think I just need to take a very gradual approach with bedtime, like you were suggesting in your last post. It's hard from my perspective as it feels like we have made a massive backwards step, but I have done a lot of APOP in the past and made adjustments but when the time has been right we have always been able  to get back on track - this is what I keep telling myself anyway!!

It would be a lot better if she had fallen asleep on the pillow instead of me, I could just keep trying with this, perhaps she will. Or do you think I should keep trying to get on the floor perhaps. Gosh so hard to know what to do, any ideas really appreciated! xx

[Truly Blessed]

Hello Hun,

You know it's good to have a plan, but so important to remember that she has been an independent sleeper so she will be again. Bless her, I can just see her grabbing your face. Take my advise if it's any good to you Hun, but you are her Mammy and you know her like no other, so go with your gut when you 'feel' what she needs. Keep in mind getting as much sleep into her is number 1, anything else can follow. When Sam was 2 I spent almost 3 months lying with him until he went to sleep, because anything else left him so upset. A wise and lovely BW reminded me that one day he will be grown and I will long to cuddle up with him while he goes to sleep So try not to worry about going backwards, I have done far too much of that too.

It looks like the really early nap may help for now, keeping everything crossed that's the case.

(((HUGS)))

x.

[Hayleys]

Hi!

Yes thank you for your advice, I think she is struggling right now and I just need to do what feels right - thank you you have helped to reassure me to just follow my instinct and not to worry about it all for now. As you said, right now helping her to sleep is the number one priority!!

Yesterday afternoon we spent a long time playing with her teddy bears and putting them to bed. She actually initiated it by putting lots of pillows on the floor and covering them up in her pyjamas. She wanted me to sing to them the songs which I sing to her before bed. I took it as an opportunity to speak about bedtime and emphasis the point that they needed to stay in their beds after the song, there were books in there which they could look at if they wanted until they were ready to sleep, but they must stay in the bed. She loved doing this and I was hoping it may help teach her what to do at bedtime.

Closer to bedtime she seemed much more awake than the previous days and bath time wasn't an issue like it has been. When we went upstairs she did get in her bed but during the songs she wanted to get out. I reminded her that when the songs were finished she could look at her books but she must remain in her bed. She was receptive to this and did stay in the bed. She kept laying down on the pillow too and covering herself with the covers but just could not sleep. I was sitting on the edge of the bed as she didn't want me on the floor. It took a long time for her to fall asleep but when she did she actually chose to lay on her pillow and cover herself with the duvet instead of laying on my lap which I thought was great!! She had also spent a good hour remaining in her bed without trying to get out so again I was really pleased with this!

This was her EASY yesterday:

WU 6:40
S 10:15-10:45
BT 7:45 (asleep at 9:10 pm )

However she did wake in gone night at 12 pm and took roughly an hr and a half to fall back to sleep! I also heard her cry out twice at various different times after that. She then woke up at 7:20 am. When she woke in night she wanted me to cuddle her on her bed which I did.

Not sure what to make of her taking so long to go to sleep at bedtime and also the night wakes, do you think this could be a sign that she is heading towards a no nap day. Just before Christmas she got her first two year molar, but surprisingly slept really well while this was going on (we've had a lot of problems with teeth and sleep in the past). I can't see any more cutting but I'm aware that they may soon so this could start to affect things too.  My sister has her today and I've told her to stick yo the 30 min earlier nap. Do you think this is the way forward? xx

[Truly Blessed]

Nice role play, that's great Hun I'm a big fan. For now I think I would stick with the routine, and it sounds to me like she wants to be able to see you, which I'm presuming she can't so well when you're lying on the floor, maybe she needs visual re-assurance 

Is there room to put a chair next to her bed  I think if it were me (IIWM) I would try that tonight, and maybe even put a hand on her, so she is comfortable in the fact you are still there if she closes her eyes. See if this results in her falling asleep faster.

Also I have been advised that lavender is super for helping LO's relax at BT, I have heard you can put it in the bath and a couple of drops on the pillow, behind the ears or on the feet  I have been meaning to try that myself for Sam, and plan on getting some. I also like the idea of diffusing it in a room, maybe at wind down. This could be worth a try too.

My thoughts are that it is really hard to tell whether it's time for a no nap day or two at the moment until she is completely settled and comfortable with her new sleeping arrangements, so I do think for a few more days it might be wise to hang fire with the current routine.

Thoughts   

x.

[Hayleys]

Oh thank you! I think you might be right about her needing to see me - that's a really good point!! I think I'll do more role play with her this afternoon and maybe try to introduce the chair so it isn't too much of a shock for her for tonight. I think that did help to prepare her last night. I might leave the chair until tomorrow but I'll see! Feeling like I need to take things very slowly right now. Think when I try it I'll put it really close to the bed so I still feel very near to her. Then if that works perhaps I can eventually work on
the chair getting further away!! Going go give that lots of time though.

Thanks!! Lavendar is a good tip too, may try to get some of that!!  xx

[Truly Blessed]

Think when I try it I'll put it really close to the bed so I still feel very near to her.

Absolutely Hun, right next to the bed so you can also put a hand on her if she needs it Maybe when you do the role play, you can suggest it and put it further away from her bed then ask her "Would it be good here?" at which point she is likely to direct you to put it right next to the bed, this means to her she has made the decision where it is good for Mammy to be, which will hopefully result in her being happy with it, are you with me 

Good Luck 

x.

[Hayleys]

With you! That sounds like a great idea!!!! x

[Hayleys]

Hi!

She had been very grumpy yesterday and when I looked in her mouth, I could see that she did have a tooth starting to cut. I think this explains the night wake yesterday too. We have her meds at bedtime and feel asleep in 45 min, stayed asleep all night and had a 10 hr 25 min sleep so that's good! Here was her EASY for yesterday:
 
WU 7:30
S 10:30-11 pm
BT 8 pm (asleep at 8:45)
WU 7:10

I think the earlier 30 min nap is working well for now so going to stick with it. Yesterday afternoon she initiated making a bed on the floor with cushions. I introduced the chair and she was fine with this. At bedtime she seemed ok with the chair too, but then started to climb on my lap when I was in the chair. As she is teething I just sat on her bed an moved the chair away. Do you think I should try again tonight? Any ideas what to say if she try's to sit on my lap again, perhaps I could lean over to hug her while she is still in the bed? I think it would be good to try to get her used to a chair being in the picture instead of me just sitting on the end of the bed. She was trying to interact with me a lot. I did cuddle her and also ask her if she would like to lay down and try to sleep which she kept trying to do and eventually did fall asleep on the bed. She also remained in her bed which was fantastic and I've been giving her lots of praise about it. She is very proud of herself and I am of her!!!

Thanks for your help!! xx