BabyWhispererForums.com
SLEEP => Sleeping For Toddlers => Topic started by: sianie on February 08, 2011, 10:20:19 am
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Hi!
So DS is now 13 mo...we've been doing set nap times with him since he was around 8 mo & these have worked pretty well (bar illness/teething etc).
Our current routine is something like the below:
WU: Between 6am-7am (it had been around 6.30/6.45am but WU's are starting to get earlier...)
Nap: 10am - 11.30am (1.5hrs pretty consistently)
Nap: 2.45-3.45pm (1hr usually)
BT: Around 7pm
So I'm thinking that he's now maybe getting too much DT sleep (usually 2.5hrs total). He's still going down ok for naps but he's taking longer to settle at BT (babbles away) & his WU's are getting earlier (around 6am or a bit earlier). At the moment that's still between 10.45/11hr night which I know isn't a disaster but I want to stop it from becoming earlier & earlier to so avoid getting back into an UT/OT loop which always takes him ages to get out of :P! We haven't been hearing a peep out of him once he settles at BT until he wakes so I'm thinking he's UT.
I'm trying to get my head around cutting his nap &/or later BT. Maybe cut the PM nap back to 45mins but not sure what do do with BT?
Any new eyes would be appreciated! :)
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It sounds like he's ready for the 2 to 1 nap switch. Have you checked out this thread: http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=95670.0 ? You can also find help here: http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=173945.0
hth
michelle
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Yeah, thanks Michelle have read those links & am on the support thread!
He kind of started 2:1 at around 11 mo, but we cut his naps back a bit too much & ended up in a bit of an OT loop that was a nightmare to get out of.
We've been doing long AM/short PM but I think the PM nap might need to be made shorter still?
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I would cut the shorter nap back hun. Keeps your nice BT of 7pm for a bit longer :). You might have to stick that 15 mins (or whatever you cut off) somewhere else though? Wherever you think he can handle it best.
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Hmmm.....I think so too.
He's already thrown a bit of a spanner in the works as he only slept for an hour this AM, woke up crying which usually means OT for him (he was awake at 6.10am), so will have to do a longer PM nap to catch-up ::). Typical, this is what I was trying to avoid as when this happens it usually throws things for a few days :P!
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Oh dear :-[ Would you cut his next A time although you do set naps?
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Yep, will move it a bit earlier & FX he makes up a bit of sleep!
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Have you considered short AM (like 45 minutes) and longer PM nap? So if he woke at 6:30 do first nap from 10-10:45 and then PM nap 1:30-3, with bedtime then 6:45/7?
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Thanks Karen....yep have considered it but the thing that makes it tricky is that DD is at nursery 2 to 3 days a week & I have to pick her up at 2pm which would clash with DS's long PM nap. So ATM, long AM/short PM is the only option (that I know of, lol!).
Well he seems to have gone down ok for his PM nap (went down at 2.30pm) so we'll see how long he sleeps, 'tho it will effect BT as this is usually his short nap & I need him to sleep a bit longer to make up for the AM nap....
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Ah, I see (and totally understand - we had a similar issue for the first year of DS's life). Given that I might try to extend his morning nap a bit - maybe push it from 10 until 10:15/10:30. Then wake him after 1.5 hours if not up and aim for 30-45 minutes PM nap? So like nap 10:30-12, then nap 3:30-4, then bedtime 6:45/7?
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It is a PITA...!
I think that's what we need to work towards Karen....'tho until he's waking a bit later we're a bit stuck I think!
FW he does a longer night tonight (but who knows as his naps were a bit messed up!)
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Ugh, what an awful night!!
E took over 40 mins to settle at BT, so didn't go to sleep until around 8pm, was a bit unsettled during the evening then he woke at 4am and babbled away on & off until around 5am then went quiet for about half an hour, babbled, when quiet again so I have no idea whether he went back to sleep or not (I didn't!!) he was awake when I went in just before 7am & he was smiling away like he'd had a good nights sleep ???
He must have been OT after y'days naps but it's unusual for him to wake babbling in the night from OT as usually he cries out!
Hoping we'll have a better day today!
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Luckily he did a 1.5hr nap this morning (woke him at 11.30am), was worried we'd get a short OT nap that would throw things even more.
Just not sure what to do with his PM nap....do I keep it at an hour so he has caught up a bit from last night or cut back to 45 mins?? He usually goes down at 2.45pm (has been doing 1 hr) with BT around 7pm....any thoughts?
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I'd probably cut it to 45 minutes - so from 2:45-3:30 and still do bedtime at 7. Hope it all works out and you have a better night!
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Thanks Karen...do you think that 3.5hrs A after a 45 min nap is too much? 'Tho I don't want to do BT much early really & risk an early WU tomorrow which puts us back in the OT loop :P! I've always found that A before BT tricky to work out!
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Probably not but you may have to play by ear and get him in 6:30/6:45 if necessary...
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Sian - E is doing what J did a few weeks ago. Fighting BT eventho he took great naps. Some days his naps were shorter and I tried to maintain BT, but in the end you know what happened. I transitioned him too soon and we were in a big mess. Now it has only been two days for us, but our nights have drastically improved. And we are doing the short am/long pm. I think you are going to have to do two things. One - cut one of your naps AND increase A time. I found that J needed both to go down easily and not have EWs.
On a 45min nap, J can do 4hrs and I witnessed this on Monday when I decided to give him two naps after a week of 1nap days. I even tried 3.5hrs and he fought, so I let it go and just spent more quiet time with him and in the end he fell asleep after 4hrs. Again, you know E better, but I know our lo's are similar. You could try just the 45min pm nap and see if he'll go down after 3.5hrs and if not, you'll know tomorrow that it should be 4hrs. I know it isn't ideal. Hope I have given you some insight.
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Yep Karen that makes sense!
Thanks Oanh :-*! J & E have always been so similar, lol!
Yep agree that the PM nap needs to be cut.....it's always the A time before BT that I struggle with so maybe 3.5hrs is a good place to start & we'll see what happens.
His PM nap was a bit weird this PM as he woke after about 10/15 mins & babbled for 5/10mins then went back to sleep so I woke him just before 3.45pm so in total he had around 45mins.
So aim for BT at 7.15pm?
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Hi Sian
Looking at your day, I think maybe it is too much day sleep that could be the problem. Ialso do a 1.5 hour morning nap and do a 30 min PM nap. Our day typically goes like this, in case it might help:
WU: 7.30
Nap 1: 11.00 - 12.30 (A time = 3.5 hours)
Nap 2: 4.30 - 5.00 (A time = 4 hours)
BT: 7.30 (A time = 2.5 hours)
Sometimes the PM nap is 10 mins later as she seems much more able to have a longer middle A time. I think 3.5 hours A time might be a tad long after a 45 minute nap. I'd say 2:50 to 3 hours but I guess it does depend on the LO and the kind of nap/As that have gone so far in the day.
Hope you have a better night tonight.
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I think 7:15pm is a great place to start and then you can go from there - either do less if E doesn't fight BT and has NW after going to bed (sign of OT) OR add 15min if E does fight BT. All this the next night of course.
Hope you have a good night - FX'd.
BTW, had another good night with J. 1NW at 4am, very brief and woke at 7am today!!! So far so good with the reflux meds and change in routine. Thanks so much!! :-*
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Thanks for your routine Sophie it does help!
E was down by 7.15pm but didn't settle 'til 7.30pm (but better than last night!).....we'll see how the night goes!
Thanks for all your thoughts & ideas ladies they've all been a big help! :-*
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Well we did end up with a better night.....E was a bit unsettled during the early evening & he did a brief cry out at 4.45am & just before 6am but he resettled & woke at 6.45am, so that's around 11hrs 15mins of NT sleep!
Have tried to push his AM nap out a little this AM (want to get it to 10.15am then eventually a bit later) & try another 45min nap at 3pm this PM (all this in theory of course, E usually has different plans! ::))
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Good night! Fingers crossed that it goes well today.
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I knew I'd jinx it ;)
E did a 1hr 10/15 min nap this AM & an hour this PM....took a while to settle for both of them which is unlike him. Possibly UT then OT I'm thinking....oh well!
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Back for some more thoughts....
Didn't have a great night last night, didn't settle 'til gone 7.45pm (down at 7.15pm), woke crying at 5.20am but luckily re-settled then woke for the day at just after 6.30am, so only around a 10/10.5hr night in total.
Put him down at 10am for his nap & he woke after 1hr 10mins (this can be OT or UT for him, but more likely OT after y'day naps & last night).
I'm trying to avoid getting into a OT loop which appears to be happening :P!
Not sure what to do about his PM nap, it'll need to be longer due to the shorter AM nap so trying to figure out what time & how long? (although I do have to pick DD up from nursery at 2pm so won't be home until 2.15pm) What do you think?
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Got him down for 2.30pm in the end 'tho he took 5/10 mins to settle. Woke at 3.20pm....ugh!! :P
Going to have to be an early BT tonight....
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I'm with you on the messed up naps today. DD woke crying after 45 mins this morning. She's down now and I'm going to have to wake her after an hour to preserve BT, although I have no clue on what A time to do after an hour pm sleep.
Hope he goes down for bed well tonight and gets over any OT. What A time do you think you'll go for in the morning if he 3.5 hours gave you a 1hr 10 nap. Or will you stick with it to give it a go.
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Well as it turned out when I went into get him up he was still asleep ??? Bizarre as it definitely sounded like he was awake! So he ended up having just under an hour & I'm thinking down around 7/7.15pm (I woke him around 3.35pm). What time will you wake Lola Sophie?
I think it depends on the night we have (typical we are going out for dinner for a friends b'day tonight & SIL is babysitting). I'm half thinking of just going for the new AM set nap time (10.15/30am) & just ride out the OT for a few days...he's already OT so maybe just bite the bullet (or maybe that's a little bit too gung-ho! ;))
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Oh it's so hard to know. Had a bit of a nightmare here. Lola woke after 40 minutes, so further OT. She woke at 4.10, so not sure what time to do BT. I've put her down for both naps today and really don't want to do the same again. I hate it when you don't know how long they need from a untypical nap. Her tired signs aren't great.
Hope you have a good meal out and there's no OT wakings for your SIL to deal with.
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I would probably go for BT around 7.pm!