BabyWhispererForums.com
SLEEP => Night Wakings => Topic started by: Mama2boys on February 24, 2011, 21:39:06 pm
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Ladies,
Its been 12 nights, and I have been AP'ing DS2 back to bed instead of feeding him but he still wakes up and it still takes 45min-1 hr to get him back....
what am I doing wrong??
so ready to just nurse and go back to bed instead.....
help??
TIA
Mukta
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Oh no mukta!! (((hugs)))
Is it discomfort do you think? If you haven't been feeding him then he shouldn't be waking for feeds still. Maybe a routine issue?
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so he is teething sort off and sleeping rubbish naps but he wakes by the clock..maybe he is just bloody stubborn!
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Am so with you on this one. We are on day five of no nfs and he's still waking too! Taking 1.5-2hrs here to resettle and I am concerned we are pretty much APing instead. I try so hard not to to begin with but always end up jigging him on my knee!
Hopeless.
So I have no ideas except pain from teething which is what I put ours down to. Although we are also at the tail end of a perforated ear drum too! Probably not the best time to wean the nf!!!!!
So hugs from me. Maybe we can do this together?!?!?
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It's no practical help Mukta but it might help - I've never done anything except feed Caleb if he wakes during the night and he woke at least once every night until he was a year old then he just started sleeping through and has done ever since. I've not been at all 'strict' with him (just not possible with number 3!) but I tried to instill fairly good habits from the start - not feeding to sleep if it can be helped and so on. I knew he didn't have any particular vices - feeding to sleep/dummy/rocking etc. so (happily!) just went with the flow. I do believe that we can't fix everything, despite me trying to do so for my first two boys!
Kelly x
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Good feedback Kelly and I have tried to but now its hurting my ability to function as a wife, mother and employee!!! Also I know he doe snot need that feed now as he is drinking more during the day but the habit is not changing....He was waking up 3 times a night and I was getting no more than 2 hrs sleep at a stretch....so I do wnat to give this a fair shot! once a night I can manage....
Leanne: Please join in. I would love nothing more than a partner :)
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Mutka - Is he teething? I know Martina asked, but that would account for so many wakings. Have you tried Ibuprofin before bed?
How about your routine? How is it?
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but he wakes by the clock
It always seems this way though because of sleep cycles. Sleep cycles themselves are predictable, and it is during periods of light sleep that babies are often woken by discomfort. I can't remember exactly, but it goes something like the first few hours of sleep are spent in deep sleep, then the rest of the night they cycles through periods of light sleep. A sleep cycle is about 1.5hrs I think, so at the end of each one they enter into light sleep which is when they're likely to wake. Make sense?
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Makes sense Martina.
Kara: yes he is teething just restarting....and as he was MPI doc won't let us give Ibuprofen so its ordinary tylenol....and that marginally improves his sleep but he still wakes up at 3ish....
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Why no ibuprofen with MPI, is there dairy? ???
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Good luck then sweetie x
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How did last night go? Any improvement?
DH got up with DS for the first NW - he got him back down in less than 5 mins ::)
However I got up for the 2nd at 5am and also got him back down in less than 5 mins!
Never happened like that before - doubt it will again! The only thing I did differently was that he was unbearable at 5pm so gave him paracetamol. I'd have thought it would have well worn off by the middle of the night though
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Both of my kids are MPI and can have Ibuprofin. There isn't anything in it that they can't have. I did have to be careful because of reflux, to only give it with food. But they can have it. I would talk to your doc about that.
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oh Mukta and Leanne noooooo I don't want to hear that the litte mites are still waking after 10 days!!! Rest assured I will be following this thread closely though ::)
I have recently started the slow trudge to get Kai off night feeds. We are back down to one night feeds again, but I haven't been brave enough to get rid of it! I was working myself up to do it the other night and then the poor bugger woke at midnight and VOMITED everywhere..... the next morning it was apparant that he was really quite unwell.
We have had weeks upon weeks of long NW's every 2nd or 3rd day or so... at first teething but then they persisted later on, ugh!
So now just waiting from him to get better and then see when I can take the plunge.......
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cmon Eloise join us :)
So no Ibuprofen, not because its bad etc, but its hard on the tummy and as I am slolwy introducing milk into DS's diet I need to be careful...its not impossible to give but doc said stay away so will talk to her.
yesterday was an odd day, he had 3 short naps, but the night was better.
Took a DF at about 11:30 (i broke the no feed after 1 rule as he slept at 730 instead of 6:30 due to the third nap) and then he woke up only just before 5when I did BF him ( I am trying the nothing betwen 11-5 rule) so I guess the night was better in a warped sort of way..I nee dto do this gradually for myself and for him.
So lets see how tonight goes....and if it stays well next week say Friday onwards will avoid the 5am as well and move that to 6 or later. I don't mind the DF as I never sleep before 11, but not sure he truly needed it, but for me that will be the last to go.
Thanks for all your support..am going to change the title a bit ;)
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I am glad you had a better night. Definitely do this in a manner that you can handle. :)
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I agree, you have to take an approach that works for you. :)
Seems like there a lot of us in this same boat. :P We can cheer eachother on. ;)
Eloise, sorry to hear that K is now sick, just when you think you're moving forward.... ::)
Same thing here, made some progress then got hit with this bloody ear infection and will have to start over. So will be asking for more support next week too I'm sure.
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how are things the past few days Mukta?
We have taken the plunge two nights ago an got one night no feed till 5am.. yay! Last night I fed at 2am and that's it. Tonight we are trying no feeds till 5am and see where it gets us. I think I am ready and he is ready for this. We have to stop the ngiht feeding as I NEED to wean him ASAP.
Will let you know any good news.
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Hey Eloise,
That great progress already...
well so we are managing no feed between 11 and 5 BUT he still wakes up so its kind of useless but now my supply in the night is low so cant really go back and no point really.
DS2 now has an eye infection so lats night I broke down and gave an extra feed as he was inconsoable between medication eye drops and all that eeky stuff at 1:30!
hopegully tonight will be better..his sleeps - naps have become worse...all around life is a bit rubbish :(
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well there's not much you can do for times of sickness except hold the fort right?
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well there's not much you can do for times of sickness except hold the fort right?
yup baby is now called fort ;)
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(((hugs))) mukta, holding the fort here too! ;) :P
How are we ever expected to make progress when there is always something or another going on? ::)
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well eventually you will get a window, and will have to take the chance again while you can ;)
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well eventually you will get a window, and will have to take the chance again while you can
DS1 was the month he turned 3 :(
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Hugs Mutka. It sure is hard....
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any luck anyone? we are still stuck at those wretched 3am wakeups :(
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Same here mukta, 1 NF around 2:30 give or take a bit....
I keep saying "when he's well I'll wean it again" but when is that going to be? ::) I'm fairly certain if I just bite the bullet and do it now he'd start sttn or at least close. I did it before, why not again?
*sigh*
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well i have stayed with not feeding in the night so between 11 and 5 no feedings, but the NW is worse IYKWIM
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Hi Mukta
Just a thought, are you still doing a DF and if so have you tried missing it? It could be that waking (or even partly waking) him is disturbing his night rather than helping. Even if this isn't the case, it could be that doing something different is enough to get out of the pattern he's been following lately. I would make sure he gets a good carb based dinner, forget the DF then feed him when he next wakes and try and settle him without a feed after that one. The one time I would always feed straight away is at 5am or later - I find that the sooner you can get in there and get them resettled the less likely it is they'll think it's morning (especially now it's getting light!).
Kelly x
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Hi
Still sticking to no nf here! Somehow!!!
Been a good three weeks with no nf from 7pm to 7am! But before we get too excited, he still doesn't sttn! We've had a couple of good nights of sttn, a couple of easy settles but the rest have been 1-2nd NWs!!!! Eugh!
So no pearls of wisdom from me I'm afraid. Just stick to your guns and hopefully one day they will get the message!
Agree there is never a good time to go for it though. We started during teething! Oops!
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Hugs Leanne, these monkeys have got us up against a wall!
Thanks kelly and although we do a DF its only when he wakes up for it, I do not wake him up...so basically if he wakes up before 11 i offer him milk else i do not...do you think that still could be the issue?
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Thanks kelly and although we do a DF its only when he wakes up for it, I do not wake him up...so basically if he wakes up before 11 i offer him milk else i do not...do you think that still could be the issue?
I think you should try not to feed him at this time. I used to feed F when he woke up early and he just kept waking, but once I starting pushing him to go longer he started sleeping longer and longer stretches. Worth a shot, no?
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I don't know how I missed this thread...but can I join too..... :( Beore I came on here I had just read this update from Baby centre and thought I would share it as it made me feel better about NF.
Baby sleep: Seven tips
Seven great tips from parents and experts for getting your baby to sleep.Beginning at about 6 weeks, you can reinforce your child's biological rhythms by establishing a regular bedtime routine. At about the same time every night, for instance, give him a warm bath, read him a book, and then feed him before putting him to bed. (For more ideas, see our article on bedtime routines.) Try to get your baby up at around the same time every morning and put him down for naps at the same point in the day.
At this stage, consider your routine and your baby's sleep schedule as a work in progress: During the first three months of life, your baby will gradually sleep more at night and less during the day. You'll need to keep adjusting the schedule as your baby matures and develops.
3 to 6 months and beyond
Typically, by age 3 months or so, babies have started to develop more of a regular sleep/wake pattern and have dropped most of their night feedings. And somewhere between 3 and 6 months, experts say, most babies are ready for sleep training and are capable of sleeping through the night. They're not talking about eight hours, though — they generally mean a stretch of five or six hours.
Of course, every baby is different: Some may be ready earlier, others later. And some will sleep seven hours or longer at an early age while others won't do so until they're much older.
Before starting sleep training, make sure your baby doesn't have any medical conditions that affect his sleep. Then be flexible about how you apply your chosen program and carefully observe how your baby reacts. If he's very resistant or you see a change for the worse in his overall mood and behavior, stop and wait a few weeks before trying again.
If you're not sure whether your baby's ready for sleep training, ask your doctor.
How do I know if my baby's ready?
If your baby's at least 4 to 6 months old, you can probably begin taking steps to wean him from feeding during the night. Of course, even if your baby doesn't need to eat in the middle of the night, he may still wake up wanting to. Babies who are used to eating several times a night tend to wake up out of habit, and it can take time to change this routine.
It's important to maintain your health and well-being, and you won't be able to if you're chronically sleep deprived. So whether to put an end to your baby's night feeding depends in part on how it's affecting you.
If you enjoy nursing or giving a bottle to your baby at night, there's no reason to stop — he'll eventually quit on his own. On the other hand, if you find yourself feeling grumpy and exhausted — and your baby's physically ready for the change — maybe it's time.
Practical tips for night-weaning your baby
•Approach the weaning process slowly and gradually. Start by giving your baby less time on each breast or a smaller amount of milk in his bottle at each feeding. Try to prolong the intervals between feedings by patting and comforting your baby and gently urging him to go back to sleep.
•Make sure your baby gets plenty to eat throughout the day. As your baby grows and becomes more active, he may not want to stop to nurse or take a bottle during the day, and he may try to make up for it at night. To make sure he gets enough to eat, take scheduled breaks during the day for a quiet bottle or nursing session in a place with no distractions.
•Offer your child extra feedings in the evening so he won't be hungry in the middle of the night. You may even want to wake him for a final feeding before you go to bed yourself.
•If your baby's bottlefed and at least 6 months old, you can gradually dilute the nighttime bottles with water. Start by substituting water for one quarter of the milk. Gradually use more water over subsequent nights until, eventually, the bottle contains only water. Your baby may be less inclined to wake up for a bottle of water.
•Don't try to night wean your baby during a time of transition — for example, if you're just about to return to work or take a family vacation. If you've recently become less available during the day, make sure to give your baby extra cuddle time when you're together, so he'll feel more connected and be less likely to seek comfort in the middle of the night.
•Have your partner comfort your baby when he cries during the night. If you're the one caring for him at night, the smell of you or your breast milk is likely to make your baby want to feed. If you're sleep sharing, try having your partner sleep between you and your baby.
•Gradually eliminate feedings, one at a time. Gently soothe and comfort your baby when he wakes to feed, and explain that it's sleepy time, not feeding time. Tell him he can nurse or have his bottle in the morning, and now's the time for sleep. Speak firmly and gently while patting his back or tummy. Even though he's too young to understand your words, he'll gradually understand the meaning, and your presence will soothe him. In many cases, babies cry only a little for a night or two before adapting to the new system.
•If you try to eliminate feedings and your baby cries inconsolably for several nights in a row, go back to your normal routine and try again in a week or two
If you're not sure whether your baby's ready, talk to your doctor.
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Join in Kim, misery seeks friends and shoulders for sure!!
We have technically given up the NF but not the NW...wierd i thought one would lead to the others!
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So did I mukta!!!! We stopped DDs df one night at around 6months (we fell asleep on the sofa and missed it lol) and she never woke for a nf again! So dropped both feeds in the same night! Not quite so easy with DS!
Although he has sttn last night! Went down around 7:15 and I think I can just hear him stirring now at 6:45!
I would also stop feeding altogether personally. Regardless of what time it is. Otherwise it is confusing messages. It's not like he can look at a clock or know how long he'd been asleep and think "oh it's ok, it's before 11, I just made it, I will get some milk!" or "damn it, it's middnight, I am not going to get a feed, I will just have to scream in protest instead!". Kwim?
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I would also stop feeding altogether personally. Regardless of what time it is. Otherwise it is confusing messages. It's not like he can look at a clock or know how long he'd been asleep and think "oh it's ok, it's before 11, I just made it, I will get some milk!" or "damn it, it's middnight, I am not going to get a feed, I will just have to scream in protest instead!". Kwim?
you cracke me up, but I totally get your point. Will do that tonight onwards and see how it goes...
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So how should I drop the NFeedings ??? I can't do cold turky I'm not strong enough :-[ Nothing worked with my daughter so I'm kinda scared to try with Logan !! I need a plan!! Help meeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Kimm your LO takes a bottle right? that easier then to do a gradual weaning. I did that with DS1.
If you are giving formula, you basically start diluting or reducing the amount of formula, diluting worked for us and you dilute it furtehr every 3 nights so if he was taking say 6 scoops in 6 oz of water drop it to 5 scoops in 6 oz of water and every three nights drop a scoop.
If he is taking BM in a bottle I would dilute pretty much the same way.
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I guess it depends what you think is reasonable. Caleb usually sleeps through the night but if he wakes once then I don't have an issue with feeding him and I think it's reasonable if he's teething or has had a busy day at the childminder's for him to want that - even if he doesn't 'need' it to fill his tummy. I do think a lot can be achieved by looking at tweaking routine and whether baby might be hungry but it doesn't account for these other issues.
I think I agree with Martina and would try not to do a feed at 10/11pm. What time does he tend to wake if he doesn't wake at that time - does he go a lot longer or just a bit?
Kelly x
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good point kelly but its the norm for him to wake up and demand a feed not an exception and hence I know it a habit...
Never trie dnot feeding at 10/11 when he wakes up, I just do as I am awake...so think its ok, but maybe its not and once he sleeps for th night I shuld just let him sleep or put him bcak to sleep without a feed...
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He wakes at different times ....He goes down at 7:00 then wakes around 10:00, 1:00 and then around 4:30-5:30 am. I would be happy with one night feeding. He eats really well during the day so I would expect him to be able to do longer stretches, he is a big boy already 22 lbs. He has four bottles a day and three meals of solids. I do think he is going through a growth sput right know as I can't keep up with him.
If I start diluting his feeds do you think he will wake up more??
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Kim, if he is waking up at those 3 'fixed' time sits habitual and diluting the feed will just slowly get him used to eating more during the day to mainatin the energy he needs and hopefully sleep through the night. do you feed him everytime he wakes up?
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Mutka~ yes :-[ I feed him each time he wakes...he takes a full bottle each time.
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hmmm not sure if you should start diluting all bottles or 1 at a time, I would do all bottles...as I am learning partial change is not good enough with these little ones!
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I think I'm going to dilute all bottles...the little stinker won't know what hit him ;D ;)
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go for it! I am going to drop the 10-11 feed tonight as well! Power to the mama's
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Mukta, I would definitely work on not feeding for a set amount of time after he's gone down for the night (decide what you think - but maybe 6 hours if he usually goes 4 during the day). Feeding at 10/11pm is continuing a daytime feeding pattern which might not be setting him up for a night of sleeping! A waking before midnight is also quite possibly due to overtiredness. What time does he go to bed and could it be brought forward a little, even 15 minutes can make a difference. Does he crash out when he goes down at the start of the night?
Kelly x
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Ooh good luck ladies. I am a cold turkey lover I'm afraid. No diluting here. Just stop and bear the consequences! Horrible nights but hopefully worth it in the end!!!
Mukta. Glad I made you smile. Remember it when you are dealing with a nw!!!!
Kim. Go for it. Be strong lady!!!!
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Thanks Leanne! I dont have the heart for cold turkey, bbut thats what I am trying now.
Kelly, so DS right now gets a feed at about 6/6:30 and then in bed but wont sleep till past 7 so even pulling it up eralie rby 15 min wont work, he will just fuss more sometimes it take shim an hr to go to sleep :(
Anyways he feeds at 6:30 then 10:30 but then 5am, so I guess his night is 10:30-5 so that abt 6hrs...so am I expecting too much for him to go the whole night without a feed??
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so am I expecting too much for him to go the whole night without a feed??
I wonder this too sometimes, but then I remember that T was going all night without a feed at this age and lots of babies do it, so it's not too much to ask!
I need to go for it. I keep procrastinating but TBH things aren't that bad and I'm not that bothered by getting up once for a feed, if it's only once. Lately it has been only once. But I do want to be done with NFs. So I'm thinking Saturday night I'll start.....
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hugs Mukta, I think the way to start is not to feed on that first waking and follow through for 1.5 hours or whatever it takes ... that's what we do... BUT...................I am STILL feeding at night, never got past one feed... the last tooth threw me off..!
Just discussing tonight when we will put him through it again. :-\ :-\..........
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last night SUCKED!!!
and maybe i understood all of this wrong....so did not do this right, so guidance would be appreciated.
DS slept at 7:45, late but he had slept wa too much during the day, anyways woke up at 10:15 expecting a feed, I did not and all hell broke loose anywaya stuck with it and did not feed. AP to sleep, Then he woke up at 12:30 same AP to sleep then at 2:30 AP to sleep then at 3:30 when i broke donw and fed him but then took him a wretched 45 min to sleep and then he slept from 4:15-6am and up for the day
so now he is OT and the day will suck as well :(
what should I have done? fed at 12:30? but thats almost worse right as because currently I feed at 10ish then NW at 2ish but next fee dis only at about 4:30/5 and then he sleeps till 6:30?
or was it only because its the first day of not getting the 10ish feed??
to top it all I have an ear infection and was in pain and DH had been working past 2 am and had to be up at 6 so he could not help. I just want to cry :(
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Oh my goodness Mukta I think you did BRILLIANTLY! That's only one feed! They will wake repeatedly for a few nights looking for the feed. If he keeps waking night after night I would start looking at teething/reflux, but its normal for them to keep waking in the beginning.
Feel confident about dropping the 10:30pm feed, really at this age none of our bubs need them, they need to slepe longer and get a better stretch of sleep in....
We are starting out again tonight going to work to not feed till 4am for a few nignts then go cold turkey. We are in lull between a pair of teeth so decided to go for it as he has started trying to sream for a feed at 10:30pm whilst teething and now thinks that's part of his new night time pattern now that he's not in pain ::)
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Thanks Eloise, I felt awful....thought it went super bad
And yesterday broke down and gave him a feed at 10:30 and then did not feed till 5:45 but i guess that did not stop the NW at 3:45!!! but I got to bed at 10:30 so a bit better today and will start tomorrow ernestly no feed as long as i can avoid it once he goes tobed. I know now that he can go say about 6 hrs without a feed so will see how tonight goes.
I have totally had it and am crumbling physically and mentally, this kid needs to 'grow up' ;)
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I hear you Mukta!!!
Logan is waking every 3-4 hours to eat.....I don't have the strength to even attempt anything at the moment.....I tried wake to sleep the other night and got an extra hour out of him. he woke at 11 instead of 10pm ::)
I think I might sell him on ebay ;)
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I think I might sell him on ebay
I am close to giving him away for free!! and the older one can go as well...lucky for them, they are super cute and cuddly hahaha just kidding, despite all the tiredness they make my day.
did you try diluting the bottles?
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mukta, I think you did wonderful as well. I think that kind of night is to be expected when you're changing something and they don't like it. Good for you for keeping up until 3:30!
Sorry about the ear infection though. :(
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I am determined now, its a weekend and I am going to pull all the stops and just try hard and get rid of these wretched NW and NF
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Muhkta - good job! I am going to work on dropping the late evening (10 to 11ish) feed tonight as well, so will be up with you! (Am in MI, so probably will be up with you, truly.) I do not have the gumption yet to try all the night feeds, so my plan is to hold out til midnight. My LO is just a bit younger than yours. Good luck! Hope you feel better today.
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yup same time zone, so when we are up won;t feel so lonely after all :)
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I'm going to start with the 10-11 pm feed too.....I'll be up for the party as well!!
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Good things come in threes so perhaps this will be a good night for all of us?! I am nervous but getting things ready -- have a blanket in LOs room so I can camp out and going to put my pump in our guest room (where I sleep at night so as not to wake DH when LO cries for me) so I can be more comfortable if/when he skips that first feeding.
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Good luck ladies! :)
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good luck ladies - how did you get on last night?
We decided to take the plunge and go for it and it was a success, but traumatic too :-\ Kai woke at 11:30pm and DH resettled for 1.5 hours! He cried angrily for most of that time and worked himself into quite a state, he bascially did not calm, down for a whole hour of DH holding him and walking in and out... it was awful, We are astonished at his resolve! Eventually he fell asleep exhausted very suddenly at the 1.5 hour marke, he went from screaming to just sleep!
THe good part is that he woke at 5:45am...so get fed then!
Tonight no feeds till 5:30am or else he will be sold on ebay ;)
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ha, I see all of us are online together to help motivate each other!
well so be it. Good luck lovely ladies and stubborn babies, wtach out for the mamas ;)
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ok I'm going to try wake to sleep to try to get past the 10-11pm feed. Ugh not looking forward to tonight...I just hope there isn't to much crying from either L or myself :-\
Good luck ladies!!
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did not think of W2S....let us know how it goes..
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Sticking my nose in here. My DS keeps getting ear infections, so I keep getting "poor baby syndrome" and just letting him feed at night. Might need a little inspiration. :)
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Good morning! How did it go for everyone? We had decent luck here, I think (time will tell). LO helped a lot by sleeping until 11:30 pm, rather rare as of late (has been waking at 10ish). So I went in and picked him up (he was sitting up) and he cried. A lot. Pretty much without stopping as I stood by his crib, patted and shhhed with some PUs. As midnight struck, he was still crying without many pauses. So I decided to keep going, as it didn't make much sense to just stop then to feed. He did have some pauses but they were pretty short. Around 12:30 he started crawling to the edge of the crib, sitting up and reaching for me. I tried holding him but he didn't fall asleep. I decided to feed him at 1, since that would be seven hours since his last feeding and quite honestly, it seemed he might cry for hours more. I was hoping that he would just fall asleep suddenly, but no such luck. At 1:05, I gave him a bottle of milk and he took 1 1/2 oz then nursed for six minutes and started falling asleep. Fell asleep on my shoulder as I was carrying him to the crib, at 1:15.
He was then up at 4:45 for another feeding. No problems falling asleep after it. (Well, other than he was still falling asleep at the end of it.) Slept til 6:55 and woke up chatting.
So I hope I have not confused him totally. Going to try again to hold out til at least midnight. If we can at least drop the first feeding, then over time I am hoping/planning to drop the next one.
EloysH, thanks for sharing your story with Kai -- it definitely helped as I read it just before bedtime last night and it gave me courage to keep going!!
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I think you did well to hold out that long. Even if you were confusing him still his body has learned to wait later for that feed. We started off with many nights like that... this is probably the 5th time that we are weaning the nights feed since 9 months old- the teething kept putting us back as he us a very rough teether. So these days I have a steely resolve and besides he turned 1 yesr old two days ago, so enough is enough!
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Good morning
Well the wake to sleep only got me half hour more, He woke at 11:30. I was already sleeping in his room, he has double bed in there so I camped out. I picked him up and just brought him to bed with me :-[ He then slept till 3:00 I gave him a feed at that time as it had been 8.5 hrs.I went back to my own bed as I thought he would last till at least 7am. He woke at 6:30 and dh feed him and tried to get him back to sleep. It didn't work so I just got him up to start our day at 7:30.
SO we didn't do to bad with NF but now I'm APing ::) ::) oh well one thing at a time :P
Oh and I think he would have slept longer but one of his legs go stuck up in his sleeper ::) ::)
I hope you all had good nights.
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That is a really good stretch without feeding! Is that the longest he's gone?
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Yep that's the longest he has ever gone...will see what happen's tonight.
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Good luck! That is a great night for you.
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hi ladies, sorry been MIA but the whole NF weaning is taking its toll...
anyways Fri night we went from 6:30 - 4:45 without a feed (NW were plenty) and then sat night was awesome, we went form 7 pm to 6am BUT had a 1 hr NW :( instead of frequent ones, so lets see how tonight goes...
all the best to you all for tonight!
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That is great, Mukta! We made it past midnight last night, but just barely. I hear you about the toll of the night wakings/weanings... so tired but cannot seem to sleep during the day. Good luck tonight!
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that's progress Mukta :)
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Well done mukta.
I'd like to give you motivation to continue as we were dealing with 1-2nd NWs but he did start mostly sttn for a week but last two nights he's woken again. He's got a cold - any little thing seems to affect him. But do stick with it. I am SURE they will work it out everually. Be strong. We haven't fed him in about three weeks now so that's immense progress.
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great news Leannne!
Well we had a shocker last night. He woke at 2:10am and we PD/WO and held him and whatever we could till 3:45am! Eventually I gave in and fed him as he was too distressed and not settlign still. He fell asleep numerous times and woke up numerous times. He was very clingy today and I have decided he's teething again. So I am thinking of holding off till the tooth pops, is that what you guys woudl do? He has no trouble with independent sleep, but when he is teething he tends to do long NW's routinely like 1.5 hours a night on average.
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Hi all. thanks for the support, I am more determined than ever.
Eloise I would continue if you are medicating for pain....
DS2 is a half half sometimes its independent sleep but sometimes its AP depending who is with him.
Anyways we are staying away from NF but we still have NW but i think we will get better soon ;) hope hope and some more hope....
ccg01: it sure is rough but worth it
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We are going to stick with it -- I know that we have to cut even these last two feedings at some point soon but it feels right to start this way. You give me encouragement that it can be done! Hope your NWings turn into sleep-filled nights soon!
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Good to hear from you Mutka I was wondering if you had jumped ship ;D
We are doing good last night he woke at 11:30 and dh went in and gave him his soother. He then woke at 2:20 and had a party till about 3:30 I had to go in and rock him to sleep...he was then up at 4:30 and I gave him a bottle. He slept till 7:45 so over all not a bad night.
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Glad to hear you all so positive ladies! :)
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amazing what a 3-4hrs of straight sleep can do for me ;) hahaha how sad are we...my neighbours daugter 2 weeks yonger than DS2 has been sleeping though the night since she was 6 weeks.....bwah!
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Argh. We had a rough night last night. LO was most likely OT as he skipped afternoon nap (had good morning nap, was almost asleep for afternoon one per DH and then pooped... no chance of sleeping after that) and was up about 6 hrs by the time I got him to sleep at 6:45. (The good thing there is that he fell asleep in my arms, rather than nursing, which has been a big prop we are still working on...).
Then he woke at 10. :-( I held him and thought he was almost asleep several times, but he gradually got more and more worked up. Tried the crib, sitting next to him, he crawled up to me and cried hysterically. Tried Pu/Pd but it just works him up terribly. Had to leave the room for a few minutes around 11:15 as I was getting worked up (had been quite calm til about 11, then I started to get really tired and frustrated). He got more worked up and even holding him didn't calm him (he was fighting me, hitting me, etc.). I was trying to get to midnight but crumbled and fed him at 11:30. He slept from 11:45 to 5:05. So the long stretch is good but the earlier part was horrid. I am worried now that I've caved in he will start waking up early each evening. Starting to dread bedtime. (mine)
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hugs for a rough nigh cc, but honetsly 1 night wont break the bank...seriously if only it were that simple right!
as for us we had a rubbish night as well and depsite decnt naps and maybe he was OT at bed time, we had a 1 hr 10 min NW...CRAP for sure.
BUt I did get away with not feeding between 7 and 5 but he still woke up every 3 hrs for a NW! miserable :( But I am so damn determined its almost a power struggle for me now ...how childish is this ;)
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Thanks and hugs back to you Mukta! You had even a worse night, it sounds like! :-(
DH said he thinks that LO is teething again, so that might also explain why he couldn't quite settle. Who knows?!? He had a fantastic nap today, 2 hrs. 15 minutes.
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keep it up Mukta :)
I am resigned to the power of the tooth. He wakes after meds have worn off at night, thenI can;t back him down under 1.5 hours without a BF. THis is so disheartening. We had a 2.5 hour NW the other night (without meds) and last night he woke at 10:30pm - BF gave meds then woke T 4:45am for the day.... ugh!
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Hugs Eloise, we are very close to some teeth breaking skin so I am worried too!!
Teeth are such a PITA!
wish me lukc for tonight, hoping we can break the cycle before teething hits us
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ok, so we went 12 hrs without a feed..now no need to get super excited because he still woke up every 3 bloodyhours but I was super exhausted (1 of those was a 45 min NW) so at about 4 when he woke up I send DH in and send wtf see if he will sleep if not I'll feed but i need the bloody sleep...DH got the hint and so did DS2, ..he slept though till 7 after the 4:15am wake-up
yes to the fact that he can go 12 hrs without a feed and sob sob he still wakes up.
I tried giving him a water bottle and all hell broke loose!
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Oh Muhkta! I hope that he adjusts his wake cycles very soon -- I take it he has trouble getting back to sleep on his own?
Here, we've had one really nice night where he cried out but resettled himself all the way from 7:10 to 1:40 (a record for him). I fed him then and he slept til 4:50. But last night he was up at 11:15 and was frantic for lack of a better word, fighting me, trying like mad to eat. We think the sitter was not very successful at getting him to eat enough yesterday (and he's teething, of course), so I only waited 20 min and fed him. Then he was up again 3.5 hrs later. Then slept til almost 7. So definitely progress since last Friday when we started, but SSTN meaning the whole night still seems far off in the distance...
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Mukta, I am wondering whether you think something else might be at play here like teething pain waking him or else the reflux
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Hell Ladies, the weekend just go worse!!
We had 1 hr NW on Fri and Sat and 2 hrs on Sunday!! finally tylenol and breast and he slept off.
Eloise: good point and it might be teething, could be reflux but he outgrew that apparently at about 8 months and last 4 months we have had his poop checked and no blood in the poop and he is eating yoghurt and some milk in cereal etc so doc thought he has outgrown the MPI as well!!! I know his gums are a bit raw so might be teething tonight I will typleno him at bedtime and see if it helps...but so far despite tylenol he does wake up. The only improvement is that sometimes he manges to put himself back to sleep, like lats night at about 10 he ooh and aahed but went back to sleep till 11:15...so he is getting there.
Another day another week, 1 yr almost gone another 2 to go!
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Well if he is teething I would nsay he is doing rather well!
I am weaning a day feed first now.. getting rid of middle of the day feed we are on 3 x a day and 1 x night still! Friday night will start night feed again we are going cold turkey and NEVER feeding at night again! we are prepared to be up all night all weekend!
But I need to wean him ASAP as I am on a strict ED and need to eat more foods again (12 monyhs is too long)....and he will be 13 months by the time we wean (one feed a week), so there you have it ::)
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we are going backwards - 3 nights of 1 hr NW, tylenol helped but i had to nurse at 4am :(
hopefully this is only teething....i will wean the 10:30am feed as soon as he turns..what are you replacing it with??
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Hey ladies. . . can I join in? Feeling super ambivalent about weaning NF and could really use some support!
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the more the merrier, must admit none of us is having amazing luck!
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I am still following along quietly too, since I'm STILL procrastinating at dropping the NF again. ::) Thing is, F is only waking the one time at the moment, otherwise he is sleeping well. And since it only takes 10mins to feed him and he sleeps the rest of the night, I'm just going with it because I'm so tired. But I know he doesn't need the feed, and I know that as long as he gets it he'll keep waking. :P So maybe this weekend.... (as I've said for a few weeks now ;))
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Hi Ladies,
We are still bumping along and things seem to be getting better. L is only waking once a night and is starting to refuse a bottle, he is teething so we have been useing pain meds.
I think the thing that has helped us the most is W2S he was always waking at the same time 11;00,1;00 and 3;00am. We started with the first nw and he then stopped waking at 11. We did W2S for the 1am waking last night and he made it till 2;30 I tried to feed him as I thought he would be hungry but he only had a couple oz. I think he just wanted a snuggle ::)
Will do the samething tonight and see what happens!
Hugs
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yayyy Kim, good news. Our NW are not as consistent so w2s might not work...but I will track for a few days and see
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yes sounds like everyone is still going forward.. Martina, you know you will get the job done when you put your mind to it.
well K has settled on day 3 with after dropping the midday feed. We are set to drop the night feed for GOOD on Friday night and not expecting to get ANY sleep for the weekend. We have such a fighter on our hands, he is teething a bit too, and also we have trained him to scream for 1.5 hours for any NW'ing then we cave. So we are thinkng all the NWs will be 1.5 at the least and will be quite a few of them ::)
Mukta, K is only drinking sips of goat milk and only a teaspoon of buffalo yoghurt at a time so the feeds are being replaced with snacks at the moment. He will drink more if we clap in praise everytime, but that's a bit cumbersome! Hope that tooth comes quickly for you!
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We have made progress! (I can really see that in looking back on logs from a few weeks ago.) Knock wood! Have had several time he's slept til 1 (from about 7 pm). Has cried out earlier but gone back to sleep on his own. (That seems to be days he is probably OT or gassy.) Is taking a full feeding at the wakings, though. Getting a second wakeup about 3 1/2 hrs after the 1 am one... trying to figure out strategy for what to do next. Not sure whether to try to move the 1 am feeding out a half hour or so, or whether to just hold him off at the 4:45ish one. (Neither gets me much sleep, but given that I'm getting a lot more than I have, I need to push through it... have to travel away from LO at the end of April and would love to have him down to one nightfeed by then, so DH only has to deal with one waking/bottle.)
Thoughts?
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Well my advice is to go cold turkey at night.... a complete turn around ::) After months of resettling the first feed, then feeding again, or using a cut of ftime in teh ngihts for feeds as if to push him later...he has never gone more than a few days without sleeping through the night. I do think it sent a confusing message.
4 nights ago I decided never to feed again at night. And I haven't so far. Except, he has been fighting it like the ens and it has taken over an hour or two to get him back to sleep once per night. On night 5 I think we have had a break through he has woken once briefly.. and went back to sleep till morning.
Will keep you updated! So we are on 2 x breastfeeds per day now, morning and night.
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oh Eloise, I need to do that. I have broken down and fed between 4-5 but i need to go the wgole hog. i have 6 nights before i travel...so might give this a shot after discussing with DH....
but we are still getting those NW anything from 10min to 1 hr :(
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Definitely agree with the cold turkey approach. Glad you've seen some progress Eloise!
We had a surprise sttn two nights ago so that has motivated me to drop feeds since I know he can do it. Last night however he woke and screamed the house down, pretty sure those teeth are coming. :P But I didn't feed him until 5am, so that's not too bad.
Eloise, when you say not feeding at night, do you mean right until he gets up? Or do you feed after 5am? That is still a grey area for me, not sure what to do there as we have enough troubles with EWs as it is. :-\
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exactly, If I feed him at 5 he goes back to sleept till 6:45/and todya 7:15 which is SO AMAZING!
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I have been waiting to post this but I'm sooooooooooo happy tha I can't wait anymore. Logan STTN!!! Friday night I was away and he was up from 1130-130 then slept till 7:30. Sat he slept till 5;30 had a bottle and back down till 7:30. Sunday he slept through till 6:30 had a bottle then back down till 7:30. Last night he slept till 7:30!!!!!!!!!!
We really love him today!!!! ;D
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I have been waiting to post this but I'm sooooooooooo happy tha I can't wait anymore. Logan STTN!!! Friday night I was away and he was up from 1130-130 then slept till 7:30. Sat he slept till 5;30 had a bottle and back down till 7:30. Sunday he slept through till 6:30 had a bottle then back down till 7:30. Last night he slept till 7:30!!!!!!!!!!
We really love him today!!!!
Kim...please tell him to convey this to my LO....please please.
So happy for you!!!!
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yay Kim! Well done :)
Martina, Mukta, I am feeding at 5:30am, but letting him play as long as possible before feeding. I haven't been confronted with 5am yet. If it were 5am I would let him cry/whinge for as long as possible to try and drag out the feed time then go feed. I think that works eventually, it wuld get later and later each day. K is the type of kid who wakes for the day at that time unstead of going back to sleep when offered a feed.
You uys can do it Mukta, cmon!
Well K woke from 3am to 4am several times each time resettled quickly, it was the darn teeth. We are just so glad there wasn't a long screaming session!
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Kim, that is great! Did that come from just doing WTS?
We are muddling along here, DS has gone as late as 2 or 3 without waking to eat, then usually 3 1/2 hrs after that is up again. But I took him to my parents' place last weekend for two nights -- his first overnight. He had his crib sheet, bunny, sound machine but was still awake at 10:15 the first night. Then two more times. Argh. Up at 12:15 the first time the second night, then twice more if I remember right. Hoping he will straighten out here at home, last night was our first night back and he was up at 11 and it took me almost til 12:30 to get him fully back to sleep. But I know he was overtired from skipping his second nap... just would really like to get him STTN!
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I'm not really sure what made him finally sleep through... we threatened him and said we were going to sell him on ebay??? ;D Maybe he took us seriously.. :P
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lol! I doubt my LO would believe me, but maybe I should try telling him that... ;-)
Last night he was up at 11 again. I waited almost 30 min to go in (probably too long, but there were a few times I thought he was settling). Then held off until about 11:50 before feeding him. He slept til 4:20 after that (my ODS was up two other times, so I am exhausted, but that is another story). So clearly, something is not working yet here!
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have your boys been talking to mine!!
plus i ha dthe added disadvantage of a miserable migraine...stress is killing me, if I dropped dead one day now one in BW would even know :(
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Oh Mukta! A migraine to add to it all? :'( Not fair! Hang in there... any progress at all with your LO?
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Hang in there... any progress at all with your LO?
None and we might be teething again!
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(((hugs))) mukta, I am getting frustrated as well. Teething and 2-1 are leading to mega OT and SA here. Feel like we will never catch a break.... :(
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hugs Martina and Mukta. Hope the migrane cleared today. Martina, I hope that your 2 to 1 is swift, ours sure was!
I can see the white for K's tooth now. So I am pretty confident that he would be sttn consistently if it weren't for the tooth. Last night he did 7pm - 5am. Pretty good. I got up and gave him breakfast at 6am, then a bf after that. I am pretty happy with that.
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I thought we were headed to a pretty quick and painless 2-1, but we seem to have been hit by OT bigtime. :P Overall I think it will be an ok transition, but at the moment things are a mess. I'm thinking teeth have something to do with it.
I also think if F weren't teething he'd be sleeping pretty decently by now. 3 nights ago he sttn, now he has these long unsettled NWings. :(
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Hang in there ove, we will hold your hand through thuis tooth, then your little prince will be sttn for sure. If you can just manage to resettle without feeding, I think you'll have it cracked. Whether that be before or after the tooth comes it WILL happen. You know he responds really well to the no feeding when you put your mind to it. It's all in the timing 8)
I have not fed K at night for 6 nights now, it's a record! He's really trying to get back to sleep himself and not crying for the boob anymore. In two days I drop the morning feed, I am really looknig forward to it... as each day passes it brings me closer to the wonderful life of food I once had 12 months ago.
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Thanks. :-* I've been doing pretty good at settling without feeding. 3 nights ago was the sttn, 2 nights ago we made it until 5am, and last night it was 4am. He was up from 1-2 and I just kept resettling without feeding him. At 4 I was a zombie so I gave in, but he did sleep until 7. Luckily we never regressed to the point of feeding more than once, or feeding early in the night. So I'm not too worried about not feeding, but I'm also not looking forward to things being really bad with the teeth. At least knowing he really doesn't need to be fed does make it a little easier. I think I'm just really struggling at the moment because I'm so tired, and both boys are being a bit difficult during the day so I'm really feeling like I don't get a break, ever. :( Hanging in there though, because I do know it is a phase.
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i dont know how we will ever make the transition, DS's am A time is only 2.5 hrs then a 45min nap, then another 3.25hr A time, then a 1.25 hr nap and then a 45/4.75 hrs A time....
do you think our problme is our EASY?
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Yeah Martina a phase, how exhausting for you though. I am finding that paracetemol before bed and as soon as he wakes at night is going a long way... we have not had any more long NW's since!
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mukta I think it's worth a look at your EASY with those A times. I think you could push him a bit more.
Eloise I have been giving ibuprofen before bed and when he wakes if it's time for more and it has been helping.
Last night he slept better, not a peep before 3:45 compared to the two previous nights where he woke between 12-1 for an hour. But I was weak and fed him. :-[ *sigh* During the day I feel ok about not feeding but at night I'm a zombie. I keep saying that when I get myself out of OT I can tackle it, but let's face it I've been in a chronic state of OT for almost a year now! ::)
I think that good stretch got him out of the OT hole though because he is much happier today.
Just out of curiosity, Eloise what does your routine look like on one nap?
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yes please, lets ahve some succesful routines 1 and 2 naps please.
I will push am nap by about 15 minutes and see....wish me luck!
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Sorry some of you are still have long NW's it is soo hard when you are tired. Logan has been sleeping through for almost a week(knock on wood) and I feel like a new person. His day sleep is still off but I will take it, the last couple of days all he wants to do is sleep yesterday he slept for 2 hours in the afternoon then was only up for an hour and had to have a 45 min nap.He then went to bed at 6:30 and slept through till 7:15 :o
I don't know if he isn't feeling well r what?? And it seems like today is going to be the same he has only been up for an hour and he is already getting crank and rubbing his eyes.....it's going to be a long day!!
Hugs!!
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Our routine is roughtly 5 hours A time. Wake 6:30am, nap 11:30am - 1:00pm, bed 7pm.
Drats we had the roughest of rough nights last night.... 3 hours awake and sleeping with 10 min little naps here and there, he ekpt waking up. I stupidly put him on a major new food intridcutino 48 hours ago and I am betting it's that. Or else the teeth, but this was pretty bad.
Sigh, we still have not had more than one sttn in a row!
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Hmmm, so you have K do a longer pm A....that is opposite what we have been doing but I have been wondering if I need to do a shorter am A and a longer pm one with the one nap business.
My issue is I desperately want the boys to nap at almost the same time so I tend to push F to do a longer am A time. Will have to play with that a bit.
Sorry about the rough night. :( Wish things would just get and stay consistent!
T was consistently sttn by 10mos. F is nowhere close! ::)
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sometimes we 5.5 in the morning If I am late at getting back whatever, but he is pretty darn tired though, yawning away and red circles around his eyes. Of course if you can get the kids to nap together that's probably more important.
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Hey everyone
I'm thinking of weaning my lo off her NF as I've had enough after 7 1/2 months of getting up in the night and by this age she should be sttn! She has a bottle before bed at around 6.30pm and I currently do a df at 10pm (formula) and she wakes at around 2-2.30 for a feed (breastfeed) and again at 5 but we don't feed her and she goes back to sleep until 6.30am.
I'm not sure whether to drop the df to encourage her to go longer without a feed but then she'll wake earlier and probably more often. Or to continue with the df and reduce the amount she has at 2-2.30 to try and stop the waking at that time?? Any ideas would be really appreciated. I was going to try going cold turkey but we've had such bad nights for the last few weeks that I just don't think I can handle it!
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hugs ELoise on the terrible night.
I had it a bit rough and broke down and fed him at midnight and then he slept till 5, and he had a decent feed
Nots ure what to do, our days are 12.5 hrs and nights are 11.5 obviously with NW...
I might try and push the am nap out but right now the am A time is super short!
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Mukta~ I noticed a huge difference when I uped Logans am A time. He was only doing an hour am A time but I bumped it up to 2.5 hours.
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mukta, I think you can safely up his A time. I find a lot of times we get stuck thinking they can't handle more but they can. They're 'programmed' to feel tired after a short A but after a few days they catch up. F wasn't doing very long A's and now he is doing them ok. I think they just need to adjust.
I fed F at 4:30 last night. He wakes at 5:45 every morning out of habit, and I usually leave him and he'll be ok until 6:15/6:30. Well this morning I was so tired I just kinda phased his fussing out, and he went back to sleep until 7:30 when I woke him! So I think I need to just leave him be longer. He was so much happier today with that extra sleep.
Going to try and make it until after 5 for the feedings this weekend.
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good luck Martina :)
Yes I agree Mukta, push that first A time out more.
Well I have not fed Kai at night for 8 nights now. We gave other pain meds last ngiht and he sttn from 7pm till 5am. But woke at 5am grumpy and teething and would not return to sleep.
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and it gets worse. Tetehing or something is killing me..DS was up every 2 hrs last night...
we pushed out his am nap and it works except I ahve to AP him insteda of just patting him while he falls asleep..not sure which is the lesser evil!
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(((hugs))) mukta. I was thinking about this thread when I was up for almost 1.5hrs last night with F who refused to settle! :P
I don't know how we're ever going to drop this last NF. I ended up giving in and feeding him at 4:45 because I was just tired of getting up and down with him. I have NO idea why he was awake. He wasn't crying really, but when left he wouldn't settle either. Meds didn't help. I just don't know.
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same here, meds did not help
its been a month now that DS doe snot get fed between 7am and 4:45.5am..but he still wakes up, its really not acceptable now :(
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Sigh. It seemed we were making such good progress, LO was not waking until 2 or 3 for a feeding then sleeping til his normal wake time around 6:45. During the last week, though, there have only been two times he's done that, and he's done a 12:50 wake once. He's been waking crying and not settling without a feeding as early as 10:30. Last night he cried so hard and solidly (almost without pause) that I gave up and fed him just before 11. :( Then he was up at 2:35. I waited as he sounded several times like he was crying a mantra cry, but it went on until 3:15 so I went in then.
We suspected teething so last night he had Ibuprofen before bed, guess it did not help. I have to be away two nights at the end of the month and am panicking as DH does not ever go in at night and I was so hoping LO would be STTN by then. Argh.
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Discomfort must be at play whether it be teeth or else food issues. Is he happy to independelty fall asleep at bedtime? Just check that there is no night time association.
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I was thinking about discomfort as well. He is starting to eat a lot more solids and also has the teething signs. Also wondering about a growth spurt/hunger as he really ate a lot yesterday and then again today. He can fall asleep on his own (did tonight - I wasn't even in the room, he just chatted himself off to sleep) but has been trying to get back to his nurse to sleep habit over the last several days (but I caught on and have not let him the last few).
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Knocking wood -- has done better the last few nights -- waking after 2 (bedtime is still around 7, meaning he's asleep then). Wondering what to do next -- wait longer til I go in at that waking? He is always sitting up when I go in then, crying and looking for me. :(
He has figured out how to climb the stairs, so lots going on in his little head, but I know that will always be the case. Is also pulling up to stand. He is trying to keep us very much on our toes!
How is everyone else getting on?
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Its hell he:(
He cries and howls when we put him in bed and PUPD is impossible...and ofcourse hw is waking up every 3-4 hrs :(
when will he learn sleep???
btw he turned 1 :) and he is super soft and cute and cuddly and smells awesome!
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(((hugs))) mukta and Happy Birthday Aadi. :) Ahhhhh, toddlers!!
I started my own NWing post because we have been getting ridiculous long NWings still. But last night was better. Still, I'm feeling like we're NEVER going to be able to get rid of this last NF! :P
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I hear you Martina, last night he wa sup from 2-3:20, slept at 8 and happy and coihen he woke up at 6:15
WTF???
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Those long night wakings are no fun! :-( What does he do when you go in to him?
Congrats to both of you on his first birthday!!
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i wait till he is crying.....and then he willhold on tight and just hugs us and wont let me put him down... not even want to be in his room....
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Awww. Does sound a bit like separation anxiety... not sure what the BW techniques for that are, though. Hoping you get relief soon!
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and/or teething....
agghh i need a break...well we all do!
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I hear you!! But have been lucky (knock wood) that DS usually goes back to sleep after the feeding.
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that DS usually goes back to sleep after the feeding.
so would DS but I am trying to avoid feeding!
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So I totally jinxed myself as we are once again dealing with NW >:( He is waking around 2:00 and is up for at least an hour!! the other night he had an almost 2 hr NW >:( >:(
I think he is teething again so hoping this won't last to long.
GGGGGGGGGGGGRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!