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EAT => Breast Feeding => Topic started by: twogirlsmommy on March 18, 2013, 04:05:27 am
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So I have no idea if this is where it belongs but please move as needed. So I gave birth to my daughter on Friday via c-section and I had wanted to try to breast feed even though I was not successful the first time. I thought things were going semi well and I had promised dh that I would not freak out about it like I did last time . So tonight at weigh in I was told that dd had almost lost 2lbs and was starting to look alitttle jaundice. The ped this morning had told us if she dropped more that I would have to supplement. I've started pumping as dd is not latching at all but the first point I got 10ml the next I barely got 5. I'm trying not to cry and just to realize that if this doesn't work then I am not a bad mommy but gosh that is easier said then done. :(
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Big hugs! I know exactly how you feel! While still in hospital I tried pumping after having dd and got nothing. She had dropped more than 10% of her birth weight, was dehydrated and now below 6 lbs. I have given her a total of 4 oz of formula in her life and she's now breast feeding successfully with no supplementation.
First, keep putting her on the breast. Try to correct her latch. Go see a lactation consultant to get help with her latch. Use lanolin on your nipples if they are sore. Although you can pump, the colostrum gets stuck inside of the tubing of the pump so you might want to try hand expression first into a medicine cup. Anything you express, you can feed your dd. I tried cup feeding her rather than a bottle.
My milk didn't come in until around day 4 or 5 so early on is when I gave small amounts of formula but kept putting her on my breast so she had at least 8 or 9 "feeds" a day. I didn't want to give formula but this is what I needed to do for her since it was taking my body a bit longer to make milk.
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Bug hugs! I also know how you feel :(
Like pp said, hand express in these early days to save every drop you get. I used a small sterile feeding cup to catch the drips of colostrum as I hand expressed and used a syringe to feed them to DS. I did have to use formula but I continued to express at every feed time, lots of skin to skin too, and every drop I got I gave to DS either with the syringe or if I got more and he was having formula I took the teat off the bottle and let him have the teat in his mouth and poured the breast milk directly into the teat for him to suck. It looks a bit like a funnel in his mouth but this way none of the breast milk was lost onto the surfaces of a bottle and he got every drop.
I can understand your hesitancy to use formula but wanted to say that in those first weeks I managed to increase the amount by expressing (by hand then after milk came in using an electric pump - a minimum of 20 mins each breast whether any was coming out or not) at every feed, including nights, and got up to the point where I was expressing enough for DS to have breast milk alone, no formula.
For me there were additional complications and I ended up moving to formula at 4.5 weeks but it might help you to know that you can still establish breast feeding even if you do need to supplement to begin with.
Probably all stuff you already know.
big hugs. You're doing your best and every drop counts even if you do supplement or move fully to formula.
xx
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Hugs xx
How often are you feeding? Is LO content after feeds?
Is your milk in yet? Don't panic. It's very early days.
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hugs hun, hang in there, and try not to freak out! My milk didn't come in til day 5, and by that time DD had latch issues, i needed a break i was so sore (nipples slammed in a car door kinda sore), so was pumping ALL the time, and getting basically nothing. Actually never was a good pumper... Anyway DD got jaundice, a 'helpful' nurse told me my baby 'needed formula' as she was 'starving' (!!!)and by the time we left hospital we still needed lactation consulant help and still pumped and supplemented for 7 weeks or so. Yes, we got there in the end, and dd still is still bfing at 16mths like a pro, and to see her feed during our disaster bfs as a newborn you'd never imagine it! Never took a bottle after that first 7 weeks.
So, it was hard work for 2 months or so. Comping isn't the end of the world imho, and it doesn't need to be permanent. Our wet nappies dropped, so was happy to have my dd fed enough to pee ok at that point! Be kind to yourself, those crazy hormones don't help us those first few days. Xx
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Hang in there, it will get better! I think you have had some fab advice from pps so won't add to that - but I am just wondering if breastfeeding after a section is naturally delayed since it wasn't your body going into labour, the timing was external.
Could your body just need to catch up a bit?
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Thanks ladies. We are still trying to latch but baby Aubrey is not cooperating and when I pump I'm barely getting 5 ml. As much as I would love to make this successful I have to remember that we did everything last time and it didnt work so all I can do is try.
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BM. Lots of hugs! It took me lots of effort to get milk in and i was exclusively expressing for 5.5mo. We supplemented the first 1-2 weeks because DS was a hungry baby. Dont give up just yet as expressing is lot of work. If i were to have another child, if BF didnt work, i would not go the express route at all. I wouldnt have time to do it.
FX that you will get help with the latch and drink more fluids. Xx
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It is not unusual to get nothing when pumping at this early stage. The aim is the stimulate the breasts to make more and expressing does the job even if you aren't getting anything.
Can you describe what is happening when you attempt to get her to latch?
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So many hugs. Both my LOs were complete pickles to start with. Both lost a lot of weight.
My breasts are too big and heavy to facilitate easy feeding for them when they were tiny tiny babies. With DD I believe the MW wanted me to feed 30ish mls per feed (not bigger because she knew i wanted to breastfeed so not to stretch her tummy) so whatever I managed to pump plus a little bit of formula. After I fed her I woul put her down and pump both sides twice. Which would give me around 10mls. The next feed I'd use the pumped milk plus a wee bit of formula. I did that for about 4/5 feeds by which time I was able to pump a little more and the MW suggested I move onto nipple shields. So DD probably had 3 oz of formula.
It was an exhausting couple of days because I had to wake DD up to feed every 3 hours to keep her weight gain going.
Oh, I should add that DD had a terrible latch because she was putting her tongue to the roof of her mouth and sucking on that!! The nipple shields helped to stop her doing tht too.
We weaned off the nipple shields after a week or so.
Many many hugs. XXXXX
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I read this recently on Dr. Jack Newman's FB page:
"I posted this on % weight loss back in early December on my personal Facebook page, but I believe it bears repeating as there are so many new people on this community page.
So maybe now it's time to talk about % weight loss. In many, if not most postpartum areas in North America, someone has come up with the notion that 10% weight loss (7% in some places) means the baby is dehydrated and needs to be supplemented. This number (or these numbers) come out of nowhere with no evidence to back them up. And % weight loss actually means nothing at all. Why?
1. Most mothers in North America receive intravenous fluids during the labour and birth and often receive quite large volumes. Some of that fluid goes over to the baby and so babies are born "overhydrated" and "extra heavy". They start to pee out that fluid in the hours after birth and so "lose weight" which is not true weight loss. This is not taken into consideration when one talks about % weight loss. Two recent studies show this to be true.
2. Scales are not the word of God. First of all, when one weighs a baby on one scale and then on another, one cannot compare the two weights. Scales often differ considerably one from the other. I have personally seen one scale (the accurate one) weigh 400 grams (about 12 ounces) more than the other scale which was off. This is dramatic and probably does not happen often, but 80 grams (almost 3 ounces) is not rare and I have seen two scales, made by the same company, same model, sitting one beside the other weigh the same baby but with an 85 grams difference. Let's make the math easy: 90 grams for a baby born at 3000 grams (about 6lb 10oz) is 3%. So if a baby is weighed on the first scale and then on the second scale which weighs lighter, he automatically has lost 3% of his birth weight. Babies are often weighed on one scale in delivery and another in postpartum.
3. Furthermore, weights are often read wrong and written down incorrectly especially in busy maternity wards.
However, there is a concern. Women in labour who receive large amounts of fluids will often be quite swollen, not only their ankles and fingers, but also their nipples and areolas which makes it difficult for the baby to latch on and therefore the baby may not be getting milk well.
Unfortunately, the approach in most postpartum areas is to give formula, usually by bottle. This is completely the wrong approach. The mother and baby should be helped with breastfeeding. Again, the mother and baby should be helped with breastfeeding!"
Maybe it will help ease your mind. Get yourself a lactation consultant and don't let anyone bully you to stop BFing if BFing is what you really want.
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((((hugs)))) Have you seen the lactation consultant yet? I needed help getting the latch correct with both boys so keep calling them back if you still need help. They should be able to watch and see what needs to be changed. I found the football position easiest with a tiny baby. G had jaundice and we had to stay in the hospital all day the day I was supposed to discharged in the morning just so his jaundice number would be high enough for the insurance to pay for a light blanket. The best thing for jaundice (besides the light) is to feed feed feed so they potty a lot.
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We've seen the lactation consultant and she is shocked they are sending us home. Game plan for the next 24 hrs is to pump 30 minutes before feed. Try and latch her then give pumped and suppliment with formula.
Basically if she latches she sucks 3-4 times and falls asleep. Most times she's just refusing to latch.
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Have you tried all the tricks to keep her awake? Strip her down, skin to skin contact with you, wet cloth on her feet if absolutely necessary. If she's latched on asleep then blowing gently in her face or tickling under her chin can sometimes stimulate them to start sucking again. Audrey was the same but once we finally got her to START feeding, she would get more alert and take a better feed - it's a viscious cycle when they're too sleepy to feed.
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Yes we've done it all and to be honest NOTHING bothers this baby. They jabbed her for a blood test and she didnt wake up or even flinch or cry lol
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Hang in there. it will get better once your milk comes in.
Glad you saw a LC. I'm a bit surprised by the pumping before the feed. I was instructed to pump for 10 or ideally 15 min after the feed and use the expressed milk as a top up after the next feed. I wont lie, it was a lot of work but totally worth it in the end as i was able to bf my ds for 13 months. Both of my bubs were super sleepy. I ended up doing the diaper change part way through the feed as a way to wake them up.
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Super sleepy babies here too. Have tried breast compressions to keep the milk flowing? Does she wake to take a bottle? Glad you've seen the lactation consultant.
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Can't disagree with any of what Em posted from Jack Newman! Fluids so inflate weight and are rarely taken into consideration.
Often it does take a little longer for the change from colostrum to milk to take place after a c/s as mentioned before because you haven't pushed a baby out. If you're still producing colostrum, as others have said, rather than pumping switch to hand expressing. You will most likely get more out as there is skin to skin contact that a pump doesn't give (albeit your own skin!)
For what it's worth, to have got out 10ml of colostrum is AMAZING! I managed 2ml after my c/s with DS and was mortified until I found out that was actually plenty for him.
Another tip for feeding a sleepy baby is stroking their cheek upwards from the corner of their mouth towards the cheekbone. This actually stimulates the suck reflex, so will get them sucking again even if they're asleep.
Also presuming (perhaps inaccurately) that you meant 2oz lost rather than 2lb :-\
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Thanks for all the advice ladies! And no I means almost 2lbs. She was born weighing 9lbs 1.6 oz and on leaving the hospital she was in the very high 7s.
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That's not actually too bad for weight loss because its actually over just over 1lb weight loss given she was just 9lb and was just less than 8lb on leaving hospital. Breastfed babies can be expected to lose up to 10% of their birth weight so at over 9lbs you'd be expecting in and around 14-15 oz of weight loss which is nearly 1lb.
So don't panic too soon. I'd persevere with waking for feeds around the clock and using all the tricks the ladies have posted. If supplementing I'd probably syringe it rather than bottle feed as it will work against the BFing if she is a sleepy feeder because the milk will just drip into her mouth rather than her having to actively suck which makes BFing even harder.
Did she why you pump before feeding? I'd always thought you fed first then pumped otherwise baby is sucking on empty and won't be motivated to suck?
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What I didn't say before is that you CAN definitely do this. If your milk still hasn't come in, definitely hand express and as Shiv said, if you do need to supplement, syringe, cup or finger feeding are the most conducive ways for maintaining BF longer term and if you can express or get donor milk to supplement with, all the better x
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Just adding in some (((hugs))) and encouragement! Jaundice made dd2 super sleepy, she was hard to feed those first few days. It's good your latch has been looked at -- if that's working right, you should get there. Lots of skin to skin contact like the other ladies have said will make your milk come in faster.
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Breastfed babies can be expected to lose up to 10% of their birth weight so at over 9lbs you'd be expecting in and around 14-15 oz of weight loss which is nearly 1lb.
And I agree with this -- I don't remember what dd1's numbers were, but both dd2 and ds were right at that 10% mark when we left the hospital and had both surpassed their birth weight at their 2 week checks.
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Thanks ladies. Our biggest concern is she is peeing crystals so she is dehydrated which is not helping the sleepiness. I'm pumping 5ml of breast milk ever 3 hours so she is getting that but she still is also gettin an ounce if formula at each feed b/c she now is not latching. We go to the ped tomorrow for a weight check and a jaundice check. I will then have a week and a half to get this established before dh goes back to work.
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DS peed crystals too in the beginning. (((hugs)))
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I remember ds1 was an excellent feeder, but ds2 struggle a bit at the beginning because he could not latch properly. He made clicking sound and the milk was all over his face. I gave birth on a monday and milk arrived saturday or sunday. It was not quick like the first time.
I have also read its very common for babies to lose up to 10% of their body weight...
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5ml isnt bad!!! Keep at it! Vibes that she will get more hydrated and feeding! Lots of prayers and hugs!
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I think the worst part of this is we are waking her to eat and she never wakes up lol. I got close to 10ml last pump but she is just such a sleepy baby that even w/ a bottle of ebm it takes her 30 min to eat.
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Hang in there. I had to pump and feed for a few days when Stan had jaundice. It is hard work for sure but soon enough she will wake up a little.
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(((hugs))) glad you have DH there for a bit while you get somewhat settled.
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Oh man, that sound just like DD! She slept through the first 2 weeks! In fact she slept through most of the first 2 months. BF was hell to start off with. It took both DH and I tickling her/stripping her/stroking her to wake her and BF took about 1.5h-2h at a time with me crying the whole time trying to keep her awake. It passed when the jaundice passed at about the 2 week mark.
Holding your hand! Hang in there!
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I'm sure you're doing loads of reading around in between the busyness of having a new LO, but there might be some more helpful info in this FAQ and the associated thread - Making breastfeeding work - delays in milk production
This might sound daft, but I just took DD into bed with me when I was in the hospital and let her latch on and feed as she wanted while I had a bit of a doze. That skin to skin and sucking are so vital right now. If she's still sleepy, what about doing a DF during the day?
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We tried latching at the 1130 feed and she just got extremely ed off lol so everytime she yelled I tried to express alitttle into her mouth. The good news is she is peeing wet diapers which was the main goal so hopefully she won't have to go for more blood work. I'm giving it my best shot and as dh say during one of my more emotional stages that its all I can do and that my girls will know I love them no matter whether I can breast feed or not.
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yay for wet diapers!!! you are a great mom no matter what!!! :)
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You're doing great! Honestly the 30 minute sleepy feeds sound pretty much like ds at the beginning, just make sure you've got some water and a book/tv show to keep you entertained. :)
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So update from ped. Dd gained 6 ounces and doesn't look as jaundice so no more blood work and we just keep doing what we are doing till we see him next week which is basically feeding and pumping every 3 hours. Bad news it seems the only person who likes my boobs in our house is dh lol
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LOL! Sometimes people find getting in a warm bath with LO on their tummy/chest and just letting them find their way helps, but probably not so easy in the early days after a c/s (I could get up when I got into the bath the day after mine!)
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Yay for the 6 ounces!! What a fabulous job you're doing, I know it's not easy!
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Just adding to the hugs.
We had the crystals and jaundice and weight loss after the c sec with Cadan and it was very worrying. Just keep doing what you are doing Hun.
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Yay for the 6 ounces!! What a fabulous job you're doing, I know it's not easy!
^^^agreed! more (((hugs)))
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Sounds like you are on the right track. :)
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You're doing a great job!!! (((Hugs))))
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Yay!!!! Well done you xx
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Great to hear positive updates!! Hugs xx
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Thanks ladies! I am pumping 20ml every 3 hrs but she still has no interest in latching. She either screams her little heart out or she puts boob in mouth and falls asleep and nothing will wake her. So to be honest I'm doing all I can but I'm also trying to deal with the emotions if this just doesn't work as we are on day 5 and still no real signs of milk, there are changes but no like gushes of milk or engorgement. Oh the guilt and peer pressure that is going around here b/c in the area I live in breast feeding is considered the only way. The lactation consultant actually told me to starve the baby and she would latch eventually. I was like really? How us that beneficial to any one? Thank you for the support ladies and thank you for not judging its nice to know there is someplace to come and be supported and not judged.
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Wow that was very unhelpful of her. I think what she meant to say was using a bottle makes things very difficult if you want to BF a sleepy sleepy baby. So by latching first and trying to get her to feed then syringing in the top up you will help things along. My friends BFing was cut short because the MW told her to bottle fed the top ups and it was only months after she realised had she could have syringe or cup fed then the bottle preference wouldn't have had a chance to develop.
Hugs xx. You are doing so well xx
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she could have syringe or cup fed then the bottle preference wouldn't have had a chance to develop.
This.
I presume the LC has checked for any anatomical issue that might be preventing a good latch? The one you're seeing right now doesn't sound all that helpful (or supportive!) to be honest. Is there someone else you could see instead? :-\
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Wow, that is a really nasty comment for the LC to make. Just wondering if your dd was checked for a tongue tie? Also, I wouldn't worry too much about not being engorged. I didn't get engorged with my DS but bf him for 13 months. Hugs.
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Just wondering if your dd was checked for a tongue tie?
That's partly what I was driving at when I asked about anatomical issues. That and lip ties.
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Also, I wouldn't worry too much about not being engorged.
Same here, first time around I had balloon boobs within a few days, the second time around it didn't happen. My milk just slowly changed colour from yellow, gradually going whiter and whiter.
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No tongue tie or anything like that. No other support at the moment v/c I can barely move. Just doing the best we can.
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*hugs* Keep up those pain meds :-*
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So to be honest I'm doing all I can but I'm also trying to deal with the emotions if this just doesn't work as we are on day 5 and still no real signs of milk, there are changes but no like gushes of milk or engorgement.
Hugs sweety. Emotions will always play tricks before, during and after pregnancy. But can I just say that with ds1 my milk supply was very high, my boobs were so engorged, the milk came out like a rocket sometimes :-\ but I did not experience any of these with ds2 and I was able to BF both my kids for more than a year. I remember with ds1 I was able to pump more milk at a time.
So don't worry you are doing a great job!
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more (((hugs))))
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(((hugs))) Have you tried visualizing the milk flowing when your LO is latched and when you pump? I know it's a little "out there" but my LC has said a lot of women have had success with visualization - she said the key is to imagine LOTS of milk (like an entire river or something similar). She said part of the reason it works is that by focusing on the image it can help your body relax and do what it needs to do. I have some recorded breastfeeding affirmations I can send you if you'd like - PM me if you want them.
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Many hugs and speedy section recovery vibes XXX
Have you tried nipple shields? I know with DD they definitely encouraged her. Yes, they needed to be weaned but they definitely helped her to feed in the early days.
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Just sending you some (((hugs))) today. Remember to enjoy those newborn snuggles while feeding no matter how she's fed.
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Couldn't read and not send hugs. Vibes for a slightly more awake baby too. You're doing really so well.
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Have you tried nipple shields? I know with DD they definitely encouraged her. Yes, they needed to be weaned but they definitely helped her to feed in the early days.
yeah forgot about those! We used them at the start too, and then again after 2mo when Dd went on a nursing strike and I just didn't bother to wean them again. We BFed for 11.5mo and they never caused any problems.
There was an article sb posted here about the new nipple shields not being as "bad" as they thought.
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No no nipple sheilds. I just keep trying to latch and if she doesn't then we move on. I'm pumping about 20/25ml every 3 hrs at the moment. Not much else I can do but try and remember to try to enjoy this time as I really didnt with dd1.
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Keep trying. She might just do it one day soon xx
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So update. She is still not latching and I am only able to pump about an ounce every 3 hrs. My incision is causing us issues at the moment and today is a crying day. I'm very lucky as she is a very calm baby so far. Trying not feel quilty and just focus on the fact that if she eats 8 times a day she is at least getting 8 ounces of breast milk a day. Also trying not to feel the guilt from people who think I am not trying hard enough.
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Also trying not to feel the guilt from people who think I am not trying hard enough
I'm saddened to hear that people would think/say that. To me it seems that you are trying very hard and 8 oz of hard-won breast milk a day is far better than none. (((hugs)))
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Big hugs. The early days are so hard and it sounds like you're doing an absolutely amazing job for your little girl. Anyone who says you're not trying hard enough needs a good kick up the bottom, frankly! >:(
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Quote from: Brennasmommy on Today at 16:46:09
Also trying not to feel the guilt from people who think I am not trying hard enough
I'm saddened to hear that people would think/say that. To me it seems that you are trying very hard and 8 oz of hard-won breast milk a day is far better than none. (((hugs)))
^^^^ this. Those people have no idea how hard it is. You're doing a great job in very difficult circumstances. (((()))))
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Hugs. You can only do your best hun.
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Just dropping off some hugs Caroline...
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((((hugs))))
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big (((hugs)))
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Hugs xxx
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hugs!! you are doing your best!! xx
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Thank you ladies. Today was the first day I had to feed pump and get out of the house to pick dd up from preschool and it was stressful to say the least. Some feeds I am able to get almost 2 ounces others I only get a 1/2 an ounce. Eventually I will have to move over to the bottle feeding board but I truly thank you for all the support. I didn't have you guys when I had dd1 and I was a mess and it was a very hard time for both dh and myself. This time I feel like dh and I are more grounded in our focus and having your extra support helps me to remember what is important in the grand scheme of things.
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Still no joy with getting her latched on? :(
Any further help available from the LC?
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BM,
(((Hugs))) - I had a really hard time bfing DS1 and stopped after 6 weeks. I was miserable because it just wasn't working for us. I gave it my best, but sometimes that is not good enough for some people! I had a terrible time having to explain why to other people and felt very judged. My neighbors were the worst and it's really hard when people don't think you tried hard enough and you feel bad enough about it to begin with. First of all, it's no one else's business how you end up feeding your child! I don't get why people think that they should have a say in a mother's choice of feeding method for their LO. You are doing everything right and trying so hard. No matter what ends up happening with bfing, you are giving it your all and that shows what a good and loving mommy you are.
PS - I hear you on the stress of bfing, pumping, and having to get out of the house. DS1 starts preschool on April 1 and we have to leave the house at 8:15. I've been trying to get into this schedule this week as practice. DS2 seems to want to nurse around 7/7:30 most mornings this week and he takes close to an hour sometimes (with the stopping and starting/falling asleep). 7:30 is when DS1 has to eat breakfast and then get dressed. Yikes! I think I might just pump a little earlier and give DS2 a bottle with EBM to speed up the process. I think it's hard now because our LOs are too little to be in a routine right now so that makes everything unpredictable.
You're doing a great job!!!!
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I hear you on the stress of bfing, pumping, and having to get out of the house.
it gets easier! ((hugs)) bm
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Well done for everything you've done so far! It was hard enough to do with one child, let alone with an elder one to worry about as well - so I really admire you for persisting so far.
At the end of the day, with two to think about, maybe bottle feeding gives you more independence and ability to have time with DD1 while DH has the baby once in a while? Hopefully you can find enough positives in whatever choice you make to help reinforce that it is indeed your choice - and one you have made for your whole family.
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Have you had a doc check that you are able to produce enough BM hun? There are a small number of women who are just not able - and there are some external indicators relating to breast shape...
SO many hugs.
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So an update as we were at the ped's for a weight check on Thursday. In 9 days since he last saw her she gained 9 ounces which is an ounce a day and he was extremely pleased with that. He seemed alittle concerned that she was taking almost 3 ounces ever 3 hours but I really didn't know what to tell him.....any less and she is fussy any more and she spits so that seems to be our magic number right now. I am pumping at every feed round the clock and I can get anywhere between an ounce to 2 ounces depending so she gets the expressed milk first and then we add whatever formula to equal as close to 3 ounces or till she's satisfied. She is completely refusing the breast and to be honest with round the clock feeding/pumping and dd1 to look after I kind of have given up the trying. My goal now is to be able to pump until dd2 is at least 2 months old b/c that is how long I made it with dd1 but today is my first day alone with both girls and to be honest its extremely hard to do it all and I still haven't added in the school run or any of the activities dd1 does during the week. Thank you again for the support :)
@ Kara I think I may just be one of those women who just doesn't produce and I need to come to terms with that. I don't know what doc would check that but when I asked my gyno he did not seem to concerned about it.
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my first day alone with both girls and to be honest its extremely hard to do it all
I'm not in the least surprised. It sounds almost impossible to me, I never even started pumping with LO2 as there just weren't enough hours in the day. You're done superbly well to get this far. (())
I'm sure you've been asked this before but have you seen a lactation consultant? A good, sympathetic one? There seems to be depressingly little knowledge/research into bfing in medicine. I wish I had a magic wand and could send Dr Jack Newman to see you! More hugs.
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Lots of hugs BM! It was extremely difficult to exclusively expressing. Just for your own well being, once the milk is established, dont pump around the clock or you will burn yourself out. I was because no one told me that night pumping was not necessary, and i was doing it till after 3 mo, after i discovered BW! I salute you for keeping it up! Hugs. Hw are you recovering?
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Thanks for that advice Koe but I have no idea if milk is established so I fear if I don't pump then there will be no milk for her.
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At the moment, your body is still producing milk based on hormones. At around 3-4 months, milk production is no longer driven by hormones, but by supply/demand. The body naturally produces more milk at this stage during the night simply because that is when prolactin (milk producing hormone) levels are at their peak.
You're doing so well. Are you using a good quality double electric pump when you're pumping? Some women find that they need a different sized flange to get a better yield of pumped milk. The milk collection set I had had three different sized ones.
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Are you using a good quality double electric pump when you're pumping?
I was wondering the same hun... are you able to rent hospital grade pumps over there?
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I do have a good quality pump its equal to the hospital one.
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Might be worth trying a different flange and/or speed/pressure.
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Hey, just stopping by to give hugs and cheers. You are doing amazingly! Seriously I have no idea how you are managing to pump around the clock and deal with two kids. :-*
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The only way I'm surviving right now is that dh has been home since dd2 was born. He goes back to work Tuesday and its the night shift so I am concerned as to how I'm going to manage b/c at night it takes an hour between pumping feeding and resettling every 3 hours at night which means not a lot of sleep for me and dd1 doesn't even nap anymore. Starting to panic alittle to be honest.
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Yeah the only way I managed to get to 4 weeks was because DP was here and got up at every single night feed with me so we could tackle the whole thing together. I remember it taking an hour...and I didn't have another LO to care for.
I'm cheering you on, but also want to say, only do what you can do. There is no shame in stopping if it gets too much x
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Thank you. I actually looked at dh tonight and asked him honestly if he would think less of me if I stopped. He looked at me like I was crazy lol. We are going to see how next week goes and go from there. My goal is to make it till are 1 month check up which is in 2 weeks.
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Oh hugs!
It's a horrible position to be in, the decision is awful, even with DH's support.
:-*
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It is a hard decision but its funny dh looked at me and was like if you said you wanted to stop and we had a freezer full of breast milk and dd was latching and everything was going well I'd honestly think you were crazy but thats not our situation. You as a mom or busting your butt to do everything you can and thats all I can ask. He can be such a good man and a PITA at the same time lol. Last night I pumped before I went to bed and then pumped at 2am and this morning when I got up. I did not pump when dh fed dd @ 11pm I slept lol. To be honest I am kind of burnt out from pumping.....My pump is not my best friend anymore but I will perservere at least until our 1 month check up b/c that will put dh back at work for 2 weeks and on 2 different shifts so that we can at least see how things will work. I really do wish she had latched and that my milk had come in more though :(
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vibes and esp vibes for the coming 2 weeks then if that's your first goal. I'm really not surprised you are fed up of the pump. For me (at 4 wks) it was seeing that DS was more aware, eyes open, looking around etc and I was spending every feed time pumping and straight after pumping doing nappy change and helping him to sleep so I never got to be with him awake and gaze or smile at each other. There just came a point where I felt his bonding, interaction and one to one attention was more important than where his milk came from - but it was still devastating to stop.
So many hugs for you xx
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((((hugs)))) honey. I don't know if it's a route you want to go through, and I know traditional wisdom has it that once a baby is feeding from bottles you can't get them back to the boob, but there are things you can do to encourage her to latch now that she's that little bit older (just as there are ways to get a breastfed baby to take a bottle if it's necessary). There is equipment that can help if she is used to the faster/easier flow of a bottle, like a pouch of milk with a teeny tube that comes down to your nipple to supplement while you're breastfeeding.
I'm not trying to say that this is what you SHOULD do, only that if you do still want to breastfeed, you don't have to give up on that yet. I hope this is all coming out the right way I am not making much sense today.
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You are a great mom no matter what!! Please don't put more pressure on yourself and THAT, too, can affect the flow! Think positive!! Stay positive!! think of freshly baked bread, or your favourite music, anything that wakes up your every single cell!! Lots of hugs for this week!! Thinking of you all! x
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I just wish you were getting some better IRL help. There must be someone near to you who would be willing to spend the time trying to figure out why she's not wanting to latch and helping find a solution rather than just leaving you to it :-\
And the SNS (supplemental nursing system) Anna mentioned is great - gives you some stimulation and LO gets the automatic reward of milk at the same time.
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I could call the hospital back again but to be honest they were really not helpful and to get a private lactation consultant which we did with dd1 cost money that unfortunetly we don't have at the moment so we are just doing the best we can and to be honest we knew this going into this pregnancy and the birth that we were just going to try and do the best we can and try not to sweat it if it doesn't work (easier said then done lol)
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*hugs* Would there be someone else at the hospital you could see for a second opinion? I really feel like you're being fobbed off and that makes me sad :(
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Just some more ((((hugs))))) sweetie.
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Hugs for today. One day at a time, one feed/pump at a time.
xx
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I really do wish she had latched and that my milk had come in more though :(
I can't imagine how completely frustrating it is for you. I would be going nuts. You sound so sane about it.
~~~~~~~vibes for getting where to want to with it, physically and mentally. You're doing a brilliant job.
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Hugs Hun... it is a very hard decision to make... for some reason, the majority of us women feel that BFing is something that we should be able to do... it's the natural thing to do... and it is far from the most natural thing more often than not.
Like creations, I pumped and supplemented too.. it was exhausting.. DH was only home for a week after DD was born.. I made it to 10 days... and then had thoughts of relactation around 7 weeks and again at 12 weeks... ultimately, the fear of failing again was too much to attempt it for me...
You are doing so great!
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Only just seeing this now. So many hugs.
Holding your hand - whatever you decide to do. :-*
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Lots of hugs and vibes!!
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So I am am day 4 of being by myself and as much as I love dh he doesn't wake when baby cries or when toddler needs him so I am pretty much solo right now and really feeling the effects of that. I'm not pumping as much b/c there is literally no time and at night I sometimes got for sleep unless I'm uncomfortable. Hello post partum crabby mommy :(
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I should also say that at a 6 hour stretch I am only getting 4 ounces and that dd seems to spit the breast milk up more then the formula and she does not seem to like the breast milk as much as she likes formula (totally different eating style with each bottle) Blah we see the ped on monday so I just have to get thru next week to make it to 1 month. Some reason my appointment is Monday but she's not 4 weeks till Friday.
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I was lucky that DS didn't bat an eye given formula or breast milk, he just accepted either. How about mixing the two so the flavour is similar to formula?
My memory is a little hazy on amounts but honestly 4oz sounds like LOTS to me.
more hugs x
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4oz is a great amount to be getting out at each pump, but if your sessions are 6h apart, your body will naturally be producing less milk because it thinks LO isn't so hungry. :-\ I know it's really hard finding the time to pump and you have done amazingly well so far.
As for the EBM/formula - my DS had to have EBM at just the right temperature otherwise he wouldn't take it.
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-cry if you need to-
I totally understand.
I haven't read all the responses and I'm not sure how it is going with you right now, but just to comfort you... I had a very (VERY!) painfull start with BF. Just after the birth it went great - you know the first time they put your baby on your chest... what a magic moment :) and you think "oh, so it's that easy!", but actually it's just suking, as the baby has to learn the BF too.
but afterwards! OMG!! still in the hospital the nurses were trying to help, were squeezing my nipples to help the LO latch on; pumping was horrible, pure nightmare, a torture, as if my nipples were pulled and cut with an unsharp knife and they told me to do it every two hours :O; I thought I would die, giving birth without the epidural was a piece of cake comparing to BF; I cried, I cried a lot! every feeding took us 45min of struggle (every 2h!); my LO got extra formula out of a beker, I couldn't pump anything at that moment (only a valuable drop!) and was so jealous seeing my roommate pumping 100ml, I don't know but a full bottle at a time for her premature born baby like 6x a day; it took me I think at least two weeks to acheive the more or less normal state of BF. I don't remember exactly from which moment it went on without me thinking "what the h*** is wong with me?!" (sorry for the emotions). I managed only once to pump 100ml and it was 5 weeks after the birth. Once! I was so proud. It went worse from then on.
I was told from the beginning it was going to be very difficult, but it will pay off. and it's true. My LO is 4m old and the BF moments are the best moments of the day. However from the beginning I had to fill up with a bottle of formula. No big problems there, as long as she's satisfied.
I hope you're not crying any more and doing well with you LO.
:)
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Well I'm not crying anymore but I'm still sad it didn't work. WE went to see the ped for a 3 week weight check up (and that was considered our 1 month check up b/c we were 3 weeks and 4 days) She gained another 10 ounces in 2 weeks with me expressing and the formula. The dr. was very happy with that. She is getting half her bottles with breast milk and the other half are formula so half her day is at least the good stuff lol. I am still pumping obviously but its once in the morning, once in the middle of the day, once before their bedtime and then once at the 2am feed. If dh is home I try and pump more but being as its just me and I'm out numbered its hard to do and dh seems to be the one having post partum issues this time around. Thank you all for you support it means the world and its nice to know I'm not the only one who struggles.
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Big hugs :-*
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lots of hugs BM!! pumping 4 times while alone with 2 and recovering!! That is a huge amount of work!!! thinking of you!! xx
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pumping 4 times while alone with 2 and recovering!!
Amazing!
many hugs x
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Yeah well I don't know what kind of reward I get as I started bleeding again so obviously I might be doing a little too much but there is no help for it. I need to get back to routine or else dd1 and I end up at each others throats and dh is already back at work and he is struggling so someone has to pick up the slack.
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(((hugs)))
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Hugs (((((((((((())))))))))))))
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Hugs and support vibes.
I found having a routine was a life-saver with two. Take it easy on yourself - don't stand up if you can sit, don't sit if you can lie down - lots of fluids and snacks. xx
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Hi Ladies! Here is an update. Today dd is officially 1 month old (AHHHHH) and I am still pumping! I am only pumping 4 times a day and I usually get anywhere between 2-3 ounces at 1 pumping session which was working great as she was eating 3 ounces so she was getting a good amount of breast milk. Right now I think we are in a growth spurt or she has just decided she is hungrier as she is downing 4 ounces every 3 hours (sometimes 2 1/2 if the 4 ounces was breast milk) I will continue to pump until I get to a point where what I produce versus what she eats is ridiculous. For dd1 that was around 2 months but we shall see.
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That is awesome, BM! Good work! I'm so proud of you! :)
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Thanks Nicole! How's Max doing?
I should also add that we saw the ped and she gained another 10 ounces so is above her birth weight and he is very pleased. On another not I was sitting with dd2 on the couch talking to her and dd1 was watching jake and the never land pirates and it hit my how much both my babies have changed in a month. Sigh.....
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Wow! Brilliant! You're doing so well. I still have no idea how you are managing to do it with 2 LOs, you must be super woman.
xx
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Well done hun. Your LOs are lucky to have you working so hard for them.
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Great work!
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You're doing so well :-*
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Your inspiring honey. :-* your just doing amazing!
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You're doing so well!!
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You really are super mom! So glad about her growth!! Hw is your recovery? Dont forget to take care of yourself first so that you can care for your dd's. Hugs and :-*
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So update. Last night for the first time I did not pump after her night feedings b/c she was pretty much up ALLL night with gas and after the 1 feed where I should have pumped she put herself back to sleep so I just crawled into bed. We are 5 weeks today and I'm hoping to make it to 8 weeks but I don't know if I'll make it do to sleep deprivation and the fact that I hadn't pumped in 12 hours and yes I was engorged but I still only got about 3-4 ounces. So still plugging away but still so awfully tired. On a funny not dd1 now pretends to pump milk for her babies when I pump for her sister b/c according to her that's what mommy's to do :)
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Oh, bless her - and you for trying so hard.
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dd1 now pretends to pump milk for her babies
So cute!
You are doing so well.
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Oh, bless her - and you for trying so hard.
^^^^this
((((hugs))))
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*hugs* They all said what I was going to ^^ :)
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So we are at week 6 and we have hit the growth spurt where we are eating every 2 hours and the only way we sleep during the day is to be held, I have a love hate relationship with my pump more hate then love at the moment. I am only pumping 3 times a day and I am slowly watching the supply dwindle and to be honest I'm just plain tired. I get angry every time I pump b/c I wanted so bad to breast feed and its not working. I think this is the end for me. Going to go down to 2 times a day and then see what happens. Thank you for your support and information.
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You've done so well to get this far! I'd be asking (if that's ok?) whether it would be worth just stopping?
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Big hugs. You're trying so hard and are giving your new LO the absolute best start. Every drop is great x
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You've done SO brilliantly!
When I stopped I'd kind of hoped (with consultant advice and support) that I could keep 2 pumps per day going, but I think that only lasted a couple of days before my milk dropped so dramatically that I was faced with the decision to go really full-on to get the supply back up or just stop. I was annoyed with the whole thing and felt awful. What you need to remember if/when you stop for good, no matter how sad or angry you feel about it, is that you have done SO well, and that you will have more time and energy to give a different sort of attention to your LOs.
Big hugs, it's hard. Big big hugs xx
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(((hugs))))
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So here is my last update. I made it to 2 months as dd is 2 months today and the last bit of breast milk she had was for breakfast this morning. I am not longer producing anything so I have stopped pumping and will be going to formula full time. I did the best I could and hopefully that will be enough to give her a good start. Thank you for your support and advice and just being here for me when I need you guys. I will say that I cannot wait to clean and pack away that stupid breast pump as I have a love hate relationship with it. I love it b/c it allowed me to give both my girls at least some breast milk but I hate it for the fact that everytime I sat at it I felt more and more inadequate.
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A wonderful achievement to have kept going for 2 months. You are a star mummy and your girls are lucky to have someone so committed. :-*
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Oh honey, you are doing everything you can for your girls and if pumping is just that little bit that is too much, then please don't beat yourself up about it. Celebrate as you pack it away and allow yourself to relax for a bit - you deserve it :-*
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you have done a great job!! every drop of liquid gold you have managed to feed to your precious LO does all the good for her :) Hugs!!
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A big well done and a round of applause for continuing through adversity! You've given your LO such a good start and I have nothing but respect for you carrying on pumping for so long.
I know it's been a hard road and a tough choice in the end, but be gentle with yourself. If you find yourself feeling a bit blue, it's totally normal when BF ceases, so grab a nice bar of chocolate (or something!) and give yourself a bit pat on the back. :-*
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You've done so well. I would've chucked it in ages ago. Seriously, be proud of yourself and give yourself a treat - from all of us, cos we'd like to if we were there IRL.
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I think 2 months of pumping is absolutely amazing! I think a very big treat is in order for such a dedicated, loving mommy!
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Amazing job!
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You've done an amazing job, BM. So proud of you :-*
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Well done