BabyWhispererForums.com
SLEEP => General Sleep Issues => Topic started by: Seachelle1512 on February 27, 2016, 17:28:12 pm
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Hello! So for some background: LO is 9wks tomorrow, we have been loosely practicing EAS since 6wks, and now her sleep is so eradic and unpredictable, and her bedtime has creeped later and later into 2am territory. She is EBF, gaining weight perfectly, and capable of long sleep stretches (6hrs at 6wks, 7hrs at 7wks) but I can't get her long stretch to happen before midnight to save my life. My sample logs will make your head spin even though I'm doing the best I can to keep her on EAS. The house is brought and noisy during day and dark/quiet at night. She has bad gas and occasional reflux issues. When I can't get her to sleep within 20min I offer the breast and she'll usually latch. The 4-6hr cluster sessions are becoming a burden because they lead to nowhere. I go back to work in 3wks and need and earlier bedtime from her by then or I'll fall apart in the first week back. I realize she has major sleep associations to feeding/rocking but not sure if I should focus on that or on readjusting her circadian rhythm, then fixing those associations. Thank you for reading!
Thurs-
E/A 7:34-45
S 1hr
A 9:00-10:00 Dr appt
S 1.5hr
E 11:30
A 11:30-12:10
E 12-12:10 sleep attempts weren't working so I tried feeding again
S 2.5hr
E 2:56-3:10
A 2:56-4:20
E 4:05-20
S 15min
E 5:06-5:15
A 5:06-6:15
S 40min
E 7:03, 7:45, 8:39, 9:34 cluster feeds, nothing else soothed her
S 15min
E 10:54-11:02
S 45min
E12:17-24, Slept 5hr
Fri
E/A 5:14-32am
S 4hr
E 9:32-41
A 9:32-10:34
E 10:15-34
S 2hr
E 12:32
A 12:32-1:45
E 1:34-45
S 1hr
E 3:05-15
A 3:05-4:15
S 1hr
E 5:15-31
A 5:15-6:30
S 45min
E 8:00
A 7:30-8:30 with 15min catnap
E 8:50, 9:42, 10:35, 10:50-11:30
S 30min
E 12:44-1:10
S 6hr
Sat
E/A 12:44-1:10
S 6hr
E 7:10-20
A 7:10-8:35 she was wide awake after the first technical NF which has never happened before and is slightly terrifying.
E 8:23-35 R
S 8:35-11:10, 2.5hr
E 11:20-40
A 11:10-40
S 11:40-now (12:30) she fell asleep nursing after sleeping 2.5hrs and at this point I'm afraid to intervene at all for fear of messing things up- even though her sleep patterns can't get much worse.
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Hi, hugs to you! It is so hard when they don't sleep, especially if you know you're going back to work so soon.
Hopefully someone with more experience with using EASY at this age will also come along (I didn't implement it until later) but I just wanted to reassure you that this sounds totally normal at this age and is just a phase (my mantra since my lo arrived!) . It sounds like you're doing a great job! I don't think there is really much to 'fix' at this age but more encouraging her to learn day from night and when to sleep etc. 5-6 hour stretches are pretty good at this age for EBF babies but I remember how hard I found the late nights...and that was without the pressure of going back to work. Does she take a bottle of expressed milk? Just thinking about whether you and your oh could do shifts so you each get a block of sleep? You can then take it in turns to do the earlier part of the night/evening?
Personally I wouldn't worry about the sleep associations at the moment, it's good to be aware of them but I'd focus on helping her with establishing day/night. In regards to the gas, do you keep her upright after feeding? My HV said we just had to wait out the wind and kept telling me that at 16 weeks it would all improve! Not everything did but her wind did definitely settle at that time! Has she been checked for reflux?
The only other thing I can really offer is to start getting her up regularly at the time you want to be starting the day when you go back to work, regardless of how the night has gone.
I notice your A times are very varied so I hope someone with more experience in that can offer you some advice as well as the amount of daytime sleep she is having! I'm not sure what's too much or too little at this stage.
HTH, xx
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Thanks for responding- I know there's a lot going on here haha and I welcome any advice. I'm grateful that I don't have issues with getting long stretches from her, I just wish it started sometime in the PM. By 6wks she was doing 6 hrs, then 3, then 2 at 11:00 and that was glorious. Now it's like her 'night' isn't until 1am.
And Sarurday morning, she was wide awake after the first NF, which has never happened, so I figured what the hell, let's start the day and see what happens. Nothing happened. Nada. No improvement even by 15min. Rome wasn't built in a day, I know, but I don't know what to do to shift her 'night' that won't make her OT.
The ped said her Reflux isn't severe enough for Zantac. We tried a bottle of expressed milk Thursday night and I think it just worsened her gas issues for all day Friday.
Our Saturday is below... I keep track of gas drops and Gripe Water so I don't exceed dosages.
E/A 12:44-1:10
S 6hr
E 7:10-20
A 7:10-8:35 awake after 1st NF so I started our day, figured it couldn't make things worse
E 8:23-35
S 8:35-11:10, 2.5hr in crib
E/A 11:20-40 fell asleep nursing, was too afraid to intervene
S 11:40-12:40, 1hr on me
E 1:05-15
A 12:40-2:00, fought sleep hard for 15min but was yawning
S 2:00-4:00, 1.25hr (3-4:00 gassy-drops given, in & out of sleep)
E 4:12-21
A 4:00-5:00
S 5:00-6:00, 1hr in PNP (ssh/pat 15min)
A 6-6:30 (fussy, wouldn't latch- gas drops given)
S 6:30-45, 15min
E 6:45-52
A 6:45-7:40 (bath, bedtime routine, gas drops)
E 7:15-25 then fell asleep with ssh/pat
S 7:40-8:30 50min
E/A GW 8:35-9:05
S 9:05-11:15 2hr
E/A 11:15-1:00 fought sleep, nursed 3x, needed gas drops and GW
S 1:00-6:00 5hr
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Hugs, it's really hard doing this when you've got to go back to work. Where will she be whilst you're at work?
I would try and get your A times (count from when she wakes, including eating time) more consistent. At nine weeks we were still cluster feeding most of the evening but our days were getting more predictable and the cluster feeds started to shorten (relatively recently, my guy is 115 weeks).
I would try and get her to stay awake more in the middle of the day. Play with her, take her out into the fresh air if possible. We are out and about early (horses to see to) and I'm sure that helps.
If she's fighting day sleep then pop her in the pram, car or sling and see if that helps. I wouldn't worry about props right now, they can be phased out once you have a better routine going.
My guy has very very long A times but if it helps, we're on about 2.5hrs right now. I think really at her age 1.5hrs is a good place to start.
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Thank you! Yes it is nerve wracking. She'll be in daycare 3wks from tmrw and I have this crazy fear that she'll be treated differently because she's the erradic one and all the other babies will be on schedules.
I guess I'm still trying to figure out her A time, I still just look for clues but need to find a pattern of what works.
It's been to cold here for stroller walks. Car rides sometimes put her to sleep, sometimes don't.
How does cluster feeding work into the EAS routine? I swear my girl can start clustering at 4 or 7, always with the end result of a 1am bedtime.
Her bedtime is so late I struggle to get more than 9hrs of night sleep out of her even I used to get 10-12. Last night she slept 1am-6am, fed them Slept 6:15-9:00 but didn't go right back to sleep after that feeding probably because it was too light in her room. Is 8-9hrs of night sleep enough?
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It depends, is she acting tired? Tbh I always think that if he's dozing and feeding, then it counts as sleep.
I've got through this patch by putting baby in the sling and watching when he falls asleep. He's naturally fallen into a pattern that I've then followed as I've started to put him down for sleeps without me. I've found that it's a good way to work out his A times.
I think those long naps in the daytime aren't helping. Can you try to keep her going, even just a little?
I wouldn't worry too much about daycare. Babies vary so much at this age that I doubt they will bat an eyelid! It's very likely that they can help you with her routine, too, so if you talk to them now you might be able to make a plan between you.
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Her average nap is 45min-1.5hr is that too long? There are some 2.5s in there but that isn't the norm usually. She doesnt take long at all to nurse, 20min usually, so then 1-1.5hr A time depending on what works then 45min-1.5hr nap. That could at the shortest span put us at a 2hr routine. I'm just lost still at what's going to work for my baby. I actually said to my husband that maybe daycare can help with her routines. It's a real confidence drag to think a stranger may recognize your baby's tired cues and put her to sleep better than you. :/ ok pity party is over lol. Today has already been a trainwreck. I may have mistaken a tired cry for gas so her 2nd nap process was a disaster with 2 failed PD attempts.
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Try not to be so hard on yourself... You are being a great mum...it's just really hard sometimes to work out what they're needing. Trust me, you're definitely not alone in this (I feel like I've only just really worked out my lo's cries and she's 12mo...and even now she still has me at a loss sometimes!).
I totally get you wanting sleep in the pm, that was the hardest thing for me, I'm definitely not a night owl! I do think it's a little about just finding things that help keep you sane at the mo. I also found a sling really helpful, I used it more to extend naps if they were too short but it's an interesting tip mj&n made about learning about your lo's A time with it. It was also really helpful in getting my lo to sleep in the evening. Then eventually she moved to sleeping in her moses basket.
I think one of the main things about EASY routine is to not go over the 3hour time span, so if you have an A time of 1.5hours and then she happens to still be asleep after 1.5 hours, wake her up to start the new 3hour window rather than leaving her. 45mins-1.5hours is definitely not too long a nap. Personally if she wakes up early (so giving you a 2 hour routine) I'd only feed her if she was making hunger signs, otherwise I'd wait until it was 3hours from when she last began to feed (so potentially more of a s-a-e-a-s routine).
I read the baby whisperer book when I was pregnant and thought it would be so easy to implement a routine and understand cries etc...but it's a lot tougher in practice! Try to go easy on yourself and just do what you can to encourage the routine you're hoping for, it will come, it's just early days at the moment. The daycare might help with routine, try not to see that as a negative on your part though...It might be easier for others to settle your lo as she won't be able to smell milk.
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Thanks for the encouragement.
How did you handle cluster feedings? Mine can go on for 4+ hrs still, are cat naps in between detrimental to her night sleep at this stage?
She has fought me on sleep all day since her first nap so I'm now at loss for how to handle the rest of the night. Just forget routines and let her do her thing until tmrw when she'll be well rested and try again?
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Small update- things took a turn for the worse yesterday. Bad gas and fought sleep all day. 1st long sleep stretch wasn't until 3am. From 8pm on last night the house was dark, she would fall asleep after walking/rocking then not stay asleep more than 45min whether we held her or tried PD, with several failed PD attempts. Maybe she's just not ready for ssh/pat? I'm fighting an allergy attack with severe congestion and don't have the energy for bad naps and OT crying again today. And now her bedtime just got worse. I really want to enjoy these last few weeks with my LO but I honestly can't say I've enjoyed this last 2 wks at all with the sleep/nap/gas issues all making for a pretty unhappy LO.
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Big hugs, it sounds really tough for you at the moment. Do you have anyone nearby who could look after her at all for a few hours to give you a chance to rest in the day?
I handled the cluster feeds with boxsets and chocolate ;) That time feels like a blur now but I do remember finding it really hard. I remember trying to implement a night time routine around 6/7weeks and looking back I feel that we just created more stress for ourselves by trying to make J fit into what we thought she should be doing, when I just don't think she was ready for that yet. Sounds similar to your lo in how she was...ridiculously long cluster feeding sessions, upset and unable to settle in the evenings. But from all my nightime googling at the time I think it's a really normal thing for babies of this age.
I think it's doing whatever you can to encourage night time habits whilst balancing that with doing whatever helps get you through this stage (because she won't always only go to sleep at 1am, I promise!). Here's what I would probably do:
- try to get a consistent A time in the day to help prevent OT like mj&n recommended. But take each day as it comes, it might take a while to work out what works best for your lo.
- Use a wrap/sling for naps and evening times when baby won't settle...it was magical at that age for my lo. Don't worry too much about sleep associations at the moment - it's more important for baby (and you!) for her to sleep at the moment!
- Try to find ways that will help you cope with the late nights. E.g. friends or family taking your lo out for a couple of hours in the day for you to nap...you and your oh taking it in turns to do the settling in the evening. Sometimes just accepting something for what it is can be freeing...your lo will learn to sleep earlier but it might take some time for her to be ready for it. If you're going to be up until 1am, you may as well be getting to watch some movies or catch up on a book :)
- Do bedtime routines and keep things quiet and lights dimmed after that (within reason, you don't want to sit in a dark room for 6 hours! we watched telly but just had it on quietly) to help her learn when her night time is supposed to begin.
- Try to start the day around the same time each day.
With regards to the catnaps during the clusterfeeds, I would probably be wanting to encourage them if it's after the time you'd consider her bedtime.
I really hope I haven't just talked at you! It must be really hard for you knowing you'll be having to go to work in a couple of weeks, I really hope your lo starts to enjoy her sleep soon.
Some one else might have more advice re: EASY and cluster feeding at this age but I hope what I've said helps.
x
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Thank you, I enjoy reading other's experiences. My LO is definitely the Cluster Feed queen. And I wouldn't mind them if the end result was a PM bedtime ;)
I think I may just have to accept it for what it is while trying for a consistent WU and bedtime routine time each day. My husband works more of a 2nd shift, so I'm left flying solo. My mom will be staying with me all week next week so she'll be doing daytime feedings also to get LO more acclimated to bottle feeding.
The last 2 days it seems she can only go 45 minutes max before becoming OT. I feel that's kinda short for her age but I could be wrong.
And rewatching the entire Scrubs series that I own has helped me get through maternity leave :)
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Our lo's sound so alike! J could also only go 45 minutes for a while... I guess just go with what you're seeing from your lo, so if that's 45 minutes then that's fine! It's so tough having to do it by yourself - my husband was in the middle of exams and deadlines when our dd was small so I often ended up doing the nights, it's really hard :(
Really hope you get a chance to rest when your mum comes to stay!
x
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Can you feed lying down? That's a definite lifesaver. I've been going to bed when baby does for a while now, and just dozing while he feeds. Yoga ball in the corner of the room for when he needs bouncing off to sleep, white noise on constant and off we go. It's not conducive to getting anything at all done in the evenings but I am mostly rested.
Look up safe co-sleeping guidelines if you want to doze with her, also you can get hubby to check on you and bring drinks and snacks.
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I feel like my attempts to make her 1am bedtime earlier have backfired. Last two nights her long sleep stretch didn't come til 3am :-[ Two weeks of stress and crying for it to only get worse is starting to take its toll. I don't understand how her bedtime of 11pm at 6 weeks turned into 1am at 8 weeks then 3am at 9 weeks despite me trying to implement routines and watch for tired cues. Feel like my days are spent worrying not enjoying... Now after two failed ssh/pat attempts for her first daytime nap (yep her first daytime nap is 2pm) I'm holding her so she doesn't become OT. I've tried waking her slightly earlier and super early and nothing has worked, just makes it worse I think. I may just have to wait for her melatonin levels to kick in and just hope for a miracle in the meantime.
I'm too scared to co sleep. Her problem isn't waking up frequently, it's just that her internal clock thinks bedtime is 3am where she'll then do 5hrs, followed by 3hrs then 2. Before I started actively trying to change things I was getting 6.5-7.5 hr stretches from her and a 12-1am bedtime, so I just feel like I've made things worse for everyone, worrying over what her bedtime was.
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What scares you about cosleeping?
I've read that it takes them the first three months to set their diurnal rhythms. So she's fine, really. You didn't mess her up. You could try getting her outside first thing though, to help her body clock along a bit.
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I'll have to tell myself that all day. I didn't mess her rhythm, I didn't mess her rhythm... Kinda makes me feel better :) With my mom here next week I'll be more apt to get up and outside with LO. I've had plenty of errands I've wanted to run but never wanted to solo so we could try to get out more.
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Good plan :). Do you have a sling at all? Even going for a walk with baby in the sling will benefit you both. I found our naps much, much easier to come by when we started to go out at roughly the same time every day, and the fresh air does both of us good. We have two horses so we are generally out the door by 8am to go see to them, and my little guy takes his first nap in the sling.
Make sure you rest, too. Cluster feeding is baby trying to increase your supply, and you need rest for that.
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It's not a sling but I do have a baby carrier. If her 3am bedtime stints continue while my mom's here maybe I'll strive for a 11am wake with noon walk and see what happens. 1am sounds so much better now than it did before lol. It's supposed to be much warmer starting tmrw-Tuesday like 60-70°F but rainy so hopefully we can still get out, even if we have to become one of those mall-walkers ;D
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We have a lillebaby and I'm addicted! I love it!
I wouldn't worry about the weather. It's snowed here today, right in our faces but we were still out in it. Fresh air and weather is good for the spirit, and as long as you're wrapped up then it won't do baby any harm.
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That's true- I'll just bundle her up and take her out as long as it's not raining hard. She does have a cute furry footed/mitten onesie she finally grew into ;D
Saw the pedi today for her 2mo checkup and she suggested I start getting LO up at 7am each day, deal with any fussiness for a few days and after about a week we should see results. 7:00 is about when I would need her up for daycare. I was afraid to switch her cold turkey like that but the pedi said to just do it. Going to stick to EAS as best I can and might just nurture her naps this week so she doesn't get OT then get back into Ssh/pat once her schedule has flipped.
It tried snowing here this morning but the flurries only latsted an hour.
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Good thinking!
Now you come to mention it, the time we had to flip DS1's body clock for our trip to Canada a couple of years ago was way easier than just moving an hour or so when the clocks change. So go for it! It can only go wrong, and you'll have learned something from it even then.
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After 3 days LO seems to be responding pretty well to the daytime routine, despite not wanting to wake from her naps lol, but we only had one good night so far. She goes down at 7pm well and wakes herself around 10:30, but the last two nights what is supposed to be her 10:00 'dream feed' isn't going well. The first bad night she would not settle, only took 15min catnaps then not back to sleep till 2am. Tonight it took an hour to settle her only for her to wake an hour later. She isn't consolable back to sleep with ssh/pat so I end up PU and sometimes nursing again. Trying to stay positive and not get discouraged but it seems she still thinks 2am is bedtime.
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It sounds like you've made a lot of progress!! Well done!
I would just feed when she wakes at night, for now, and focus on getting a daytime routine and good feeding schedule. The nights will improve naturally if you can sort the days.
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I feed at the nighttime, no resettling attempts, but she doesn't go back to sleep right away at first NF. She was up 10:30-12:00, slept an hour, woke up again at 1:00 so I fed her and after she didn't go right back to sleep after 20m I just laid her in her crib at 1:40 (partly out of frustration and so I could go rest for a bit) and she put herself to sleep. Yay for that. But she is now up at 5:45am, so I nurse her then wake her up in an hour (assuming she goes straight to sleep) to start our day. I really hope it gets better at night
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Here's our last 3 days. I make note of her behaviors to try and track patterns. A failed PD means she cried so I PU and retry.
Wed A 7:50, S 7:18
A 7:50-9:20 1.5hr (Dr appt)
E 7:50-8:00
S 9:20-10:50 1.5hr car seat
A 10:50-11:50 1hr, yawn 11:35, didn't fight but had to burp/fart first
E 11:00-25
S 11:50-1:00 1hr10 in arms
A 1:00-2:10 1hr10 Fought w/o crying 10m
E 1:15
S 2:10-3:10 1hr PD
A 3:10-4:15 Fuss 3:50, bounce 10m, no cry
E 3:20
S 4:15-5:40. 1.5hr. PD 4:14 failed
A 5:49-7:15 BT routine
E 5:45
E 6:49 GD, Failed PD 7:05, burped then PD
S 7:15-11:00 3.75hr
E 11:10-36
S 11:36-5:15 5.75hr
E 5:15
S 5:15-7:35
Thurs A 7:30, S 7:35
A 7:35-8:20 Fuss 8:10. Fought 10m no cry
E 7:42
S 8:20-10:30 2 hr, PD
A 10:30-11:40. No fuss, in carseat 11:30
E 10:40
S 11:40-1:40 2hr, car/errands
A 1:40-2:40. No fuss, started rocking 2:30
E 1:44
S 2:40-4:25 1.5hr PD
A 4:25-5:20 No fuss, fell asleep fast
E 4:36
S 5:20-5:48 PD cry, PU, back to sleep fast
S 5:50-6:30 45min in arms
☆Reflux meds wore off? Wouldn't lie flat☆
A 6:30-7:35
E 6:36-52
S 8:00-9:50, failed PD 7:39, PD 7:56
EA 9:50-10:05, struggle to fall back asleep
S 10:20-11:50 (grunty, fidgety sleep)
A 11:52-2:00 (minus a catnap)
E 11:52-12:16 hiccups then fought sleep
E 12:36-45 fought sleep, catnap, awake
E 1:23-30
S 2:00-6:45 4.75h. She woke herself up.
Fri
A 6:45-8:00 Failed PD 7:45
E 6:45
S 8-10 2hr
A 10-11:10 bounced for 10m
E 10:11
S 11:10-12:30 1.25hr
A 12:30-1:45 Failed PD 1:39 arching/in pain
E 12:35
S 1:45-3:20 1.5hr
A 3:20-5:05 Failed PDs 4:32, 4:48-5:53, crying- reflux meds wore off?
E 3:28
S 5:05-6:15 fidgety at first
A 6:15- BT routine 7:15 PD failed
E 6:20, 6:56
S 7:20-10:20
A 10:20-12:00
E 10:20, 10:50
S 12-12:45 after 2 PD attempts
E 12:48
E 5:45
She seems to have went straight back to sleep but now I dread getting her up at 7 to start our day. She used to do 6-7.5hr stretches of sleep. I hope she gets back to that eventually...
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She will, just maybe not yet. One step backwards for every two forwards, this is not a straight line kinda thing!
Your nights look alright to me, tbh. There's so much info on your days that I can't pick out the routine very easily but if you compare to the sample routines, how do you think it looks? I'm not great at typical routines as both of mine have had very long A times for their age and I tend to regard that as normal!
Here's our day at 18 weeks, if that helps:
A - 2.5hrs
S - 45 mins to 1.5hrs
A - 2.5 hrs
S - 45 mins to 1.5hrs
A - 2.5hrs
Catnap, 20-40 mins
Bed about an hour after he wakes, which is a bit of a rush
This is a good day for us and routine goes wonky more times than it goes like this, but this is what I'm aiming for.
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She's been following the 3hr EAS cycle well with 50min-1hr10min awake time, depending on how long she takes to fall asleep. I've been waking her to eat so she is awake more during the day. So the daytime routine goes well. Is it normal for them to not just go back to sleep at NFs once they've done EAS throughout the day? Do they start to think they're never supposed to just go back to sleep after eating?
My extra notes are to help me figure A times that work and what works putting her to sleep. Princely could have just posted the times so it didn't look confusing.
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I took your advice also and have taken her outside every time she's awake today. I think I'm noticing her tired cues better and she hasn't been hysterically OT in several days, but the A times sometimes vary still based on her lead.
I just worry (shocker, I know) about the nights because I'm definitely getting less sleep at a time. I even laid down last night at 9pm hoping she'd sleep til 11 again, but didn't fall asleep til 10, just for her to wake up at 10:30 go figure ;) She used to never struggle during NFs. Her day/night radar is definitely still off cause she does NOT want to wake at 7 and 10am but wants to stay awake after her 10pm feeding lol. Like the pedi said, she's keeping 'college party girl' hours- wants to be up till 3am and sleep till noon :-X
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Slowly slowly, one improvement at a time. Noticing her cues more easily is a big step!
At this age it's about surviving the lack of sleep. It sounds bonkers but I am in bed around 8.30at present and find it really does the trick. My days are super busy and I have very little chance to rest during naps, so I either read or sleep depending on how I feel. I'm in bed before my eight year old! He's up with daddy.
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Hopefully slow and steady wins the race then!
Yesterday was not great at all. Lots of short naps, no extending them and she wouldn't settle for more than an hour until 3am even though "BT" was 7:40. She's self-soothing to sleep more, and that wasn't even a battle I was trying to win. Sigh...
Sat
A 7:05-8:30, E 7:15, self soothed to sleep for 15min
S 8:30-10:15 1hr45m
A 10:05-11:15, E 10:15, self soothed to sleep for 15min
S 11:15-12:15 1hr
A 12:15-1:30, E 12:25, Ssh/Pat 15min to sleep
S 1:30-2:30 1hr, no resettling tried 20min
A 2:30-3:30, E 2:55
S 3:30-5:00 1.5hr, I held her for an hour then PD
A 5:00-5:45, E 5:15
S 5:45-6:00 15min. I let her sleep after short A time because she seemed OT
A 6:00-7:40 BT routine, E 6:30
S 7:40-8:50 1hr
A 8:50-9:45, E 9:00
S 9:45-10:00, woke up had to diaper change, S 10:20-11:10 holding her and she woke up as soon as I put her down
A 11:15-12:20, E 12:00
S 12:20-1:30 1hr
A 1:30-2:20, E 1:35
S 1:40-2:20
A 2:20-3:00, E 2:20, self soothed to sleep for 15min
S 3:00-7:00
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Today's nap routine went almost on par with the sample schedule. And it looks like her usual anti-night sleep antics are starting. I feel so terrible waking her up during the day, especially when it's doing nothing to improve her night sleep. Day 5 in the books, trying to stay positive but it's not easy. If she is up till 3am again should I still wake her at 7? I feel like I'm hindering her restorative night sleep by interrupting it every morning. Can I be doing more harm than good with this?
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Argh, I feel your pain. Do you wake her from all the naps? What about concentrating on getting that first A long enough and then not worrying about the rest too much? I'm just thinking that first one needs to be long enough that she doesn't treat the first nap as an extension of her night.
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After waking her for the day I know I wake her after the first nap. So she probably is just treating that like night sleep. The others I can't remember really. Except last night I woke her from her last nap, after much contemplation of whether I should or not- the nap started at 4:55 and she was sound asleep at 6:30. My plan was to just shift BT back a bit, also giving a later BT a try. My husband got her to sleep at 1:45am and I thought "Hallelujah, an improvement " until she woke up crying at 3:15am. We went outside today during every A time amd she soothed herself to sleep for a couple naps. I've gotten 1hr of sleep since waking up yesterday.
Her first A time is an hour like most the other ones. Should it be longer?
A 7:15-8:15, E 7:25 (S/P 15min)
S 8:15-10:15 2hr
A 10:15-11:15, E 10:25
S 11:15-12:40 1hr (self soothed til 11:45)
A 12:40-1:40, E 12:50 (rocked to sleep 5min)
S 1:40-2:20, 2:30-40, 2:45-3:45. 1.5hr total (I held her to extend this nap)
A 3:45-4:55, E 3:50
S 4:55-6:30, 1.5hr, woke her up
A 6:30-7:50, E 6:35, 7:30
S 7:50-8:10, needed to burp, 8:30-9:00
A 9:00-10:30, E 9:15, fought sleep
S 10:30-11:15
A 11:15-12:15, E 11:20, fought sleep hard
S 12:15-30
A 12:30-1:45 E 1:00.
S 1:45-3:15
A 3:15- E 3:25
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I'd see if you can push at least that first A time out, an hour seems very short to me. How old is she now?
If you look at her total amount of sleep and awake time, it looks like she's trying to take it in the day still. Try pushing her to 1hr15 and go from there.
My guy is 17 weeks today and is on a 2.5hr A, for comparison. He's a long A baby though.
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She's 10 weeks today. I'll give 1hr 15min a shot. Can't get any worse- I'm getting less sleep now then I ever was before and I thought I'd be enjoying my last 2 weeks at home but I'm not and that makes me feel terrible.
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10wks as pf yesterday. I don't even know what day it is.
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Well this sleep training thing has been a long journey and I thank anyone who has contributed their time to help me.
Progress was made while my mom was in town all this week. Several nights in a row of successful BT routines and wakefulness during the day.
One more question since LO threw me for a loop yesterday. Friday night she slept 12hrs straight, no NFs. The longest she has ever went was 8hrs. Then today it was like a whole other baby woke up. She was cranky all day. Sometimes going to sleep easily, sometimes fighting it, mostly 15-30min naps. The only 2hr nap I got was by holding her. We kept to our 2.5-3hr eating schedule. Then the 7pm bedtime attempt failed. It's now 9pm and I think this bedtime attempt may fail too cause I still hear her trying to self Soothe.
Could the 12hrs straight sleep done more harm than good? Or could it just have thrown her off for a day? I know BTs and STTN won't be consistent from the start, just hoping all the hard work maintaining a daytime schedule isn't ruined lol :-\
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Well done you!!! I'm guessing she's fighting sleep because she's had such a good day. Maybe stretch her A times when she's slept well and see where that takes you.
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When I say fighting sleep I mean she's shown tired signs but won't settle.
How long should I maintain the strict 'eat every 3hrs' rule that I had to follow when I was trying to switch her days and nights? I think I messed up today in waking her to eat at 10:00. Should I now just monitor her awake times for tired cues then not let her sleep more than an a certain anount?
A 7:10-8:30, 1hr20. E 7:15, yawn at 8:10 then hiccups for 10min. Settled easily to sleep.
S 8:30-10:05 1hr30
A 10:05-11:20, 1hr15. E 10:15, didn't show great interest in eating and was fussy by 10:50, wouldn't settle to sleep.
S 11:20-12:20. I held her since she was so hard to settle. She was sleeping very fidgety.
A 12:20 Woke up crying, wouldn't settle or stop crying so decided to feed at 12:30 and start a new EASY cycle.
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How are you doing now?
You can probably relax a little on the eating - I don't sweat half an hour either way really.
Tired signs get less reliable as they get older, and often going by the clock is easier. They're used to sleeping at a certain time and their bodies get used to it, but often they need to stretch out their A times a little. I find that if we have a good long nap he will add half an hour or so onto his next A time.
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Just wanted to say sorry for suddenly disappearing -i managed to log myself out on my mobile and couldn't remember my password. I only made it onto my laptop to reset my log-in a couple of days ago! Sounds like you're doing really well though! I hope things have improved further still :)