BabyWhispererForums.com
SLEEP => Night Wakings => Topic started by: x95stocchier on May 09, 2006, 14:46:09 pm
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I'm sooo tired! DS is waking 5-6 times a nite. Since he's bf, I usually feed if it's been 3 hrs since last feed. I'm just afraid he's really hungry, and w/bf how do you know? He usually eats well when I feed, not just suck/pacify.
I added a df at 8:30 (cluster) trying to tank him up (before he was waking as early as 9:30) thinking his nw were hunger related. I'm afraid I am addicted to the paci, because he'll go right back to sleep if I give it (but sometimes wake up again in 40 min, or an hour, or 2 hrs). I'm afraid to let him fuss/cry too long because I'm afraid he'll get so worked up he'll never go back to sleep. naps aren't great...if I intervene he can usually sleep 1.5 hrs in AM and 2 in afternoon, but sometimes it's a lost cause. Sometimes skips catnap.
I feel hopeless. He's 5 mo for goodness sakes! I dream of 4 straight hours of sleep. That's sad. I'm afraid I need to wean paci, but we have a lot of long car trips ahead in the next few months (one of 5 hrs each way and one of 9 hrs each way) and I think we'll all need the paci then. As for pu/pd I have tried and he screamed so hard and so loud.....he didn't calm at all by the 5 min of holding. I just had to pd, and he screamed and on it went. It's a last resort, right? Any other ideas I can try???
How old is your child? 5 mo
What’s his/her daily routine? 4 hr EASY (currently stretching A time from 2 to 2:15/2:30)
6:30 -up for the day & eat (may or may not have been awake for up to an hour before)
7-A
8:30-S
10:30 -E
11-A
12:30~1-S
2:30-E
3-A
4:30-catnap
5:10-A
5:30-E
6-bedtime routine (massage, last tank up bf, song, quiet time)
7-crib, usually out w/in 10 min
(I also just started a df at 8:30 to tank him up)
What’s nap routine? 2+ catnap, with 15 min winddown-book, song, etc
How long are naps? 35 min wakes up, but usually goes back down for total of 1.5 to 2 hrs
Do you bottle or breastfed?? bf
How much? or how long? 5-7 min per side...sometimes 1 side, sometimes both
If breastfed.. one side or both?? (at each feed) both if he'll take them
How many wakes per night? 5-6
What’s your LO like when waking at night? How long is he/she up? I usually feed if it's been 3 hrs since last feed, and re diaper too, since he's eating, and surely peeing. when I don't feed, he fusses till he mantas till he cries for help. I paci, p/s
When you go to him/her is she fussing or crying? Or is it a mantra cry? I try to wait for the all out cry
What have you tried to settle?? paci, p/s (I have tried pu/pd but like a bad mommy didn't follow through. he screams louder and harder than I have ever heard)
What do you do for A time and how long is it? 2:15~2:30 or so of awake time, in morning: bath, exersaucer, songs, dancing, etc. In afternoon/evening more low key, books, songs, dancing, mirror play, blocks, joining us for dinner, etc.
Are there developmental issues such as teething or milestones? teething maybe??? but this waking has been going on for quite a while
Have you introduced cereal? Why, how much, and how many times a day? (for LO’s under 6 months) no
Do they have a prop? If so what is it? paci
Do they have a lovie? recently introduced a bear
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Hi,
I think you and Zoey should talk, it seems you are having similar issues. My dd did this around 5 months too. She just needed the soother to go back to sleep. I just kept playing find the soother and put it in your mouth until she was able to do it herself. We had great nights and really aweful nights! Your ds may be coming to the 6 month growth spurt too. We had to decide if we could wait until she could put the soother back in herself or if we wanted to wean her of it. We chose the former and around 7 months she started sleeping through without our help. Now she only wakes if she is really hungry. I hope that helps.
Tracey
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how r things going now?
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Boy am I glad you asked....unfortunatley, not so well. I weaned the paci, started pu/pd and assumed I was on my way to happy sleep land. Well, I was...for about 2 or 3 days....it's been back to the same old same old, ever since. :(
Last night he woke 7 times! :o :o He's waking for all his naps at 30~50 min, and sometimes I can get him back to sleep and sometimes not. A good day is now when I can get him back to sleep from early nap wake, and "only" 4 nw! This is no good! I asked these questions to the pu/pd board, but perhaps you have some insight too......I'd appreciate any feedback!
I am still night feeding (he's exclusively bf) , want to change one to a df, but wakes are inconsistent (and early) so it's hard to get one in. I usually feed around 10 (if he wakes earlier, I put him back to sleep....then he sometimes goes as late as 11 or 11:30 before the first night feed) Then I feed again later in the night (around 2 or 3). Is this possibly confusing him? Sometimes he gets fed (10 or 2), and sometimes not (9:30, 1, 4, etc)? if only these 2 nw, I wouldn't be concerned...but when he wakes several more times and doesn't get fed...
early wakes...he's still waking anytime from 4 to 5 and sometimes self settles, but usually only for 30 min or so. I have been doing pu/pd to get him back down, but over and over, I only get 15 to 30 min out of him, then back in. We start the day at 6:30, do you think I should consider an earlier start to the day, or earlier bedtime? (currently bedtime is 7)
I know bad naps usually mean bad nights, and bad nights usually mean bad naps, and so how on earth do you get out of this cycle? I feel so helpless!
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Sorry no advice but {{{{{hugs}}}} i too would be interested in any replies...your ds and my (8month ::)) dd sound very very alike. If it is any consolation my good nights are 2 feeds aswell, and daytime naps are a disaster :(
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maybe you need to extend A time a little so lo will be more tired to sleep through the night?!
how long have these type of night wakings been going on now? could it be a sensitivity to something in your diet? have you tried eliminating anything to see if it made any difference?? specifically - how exactly are the wakings - if you go in does lo stop crying? must you feed?? what happens if you were to leave the room with him - is he happy then?
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evelyn - if you could kindly post your routine i could take a look for you...and also if you could tell me exactly how these wakings are when your lo gets up - it would be appreciated.
have you tried weaning the night feeds at all? or are you comfortable with the feedings as they are?
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Hi Tawnya,
Thanks for the reply. he is so spent by nap time...rubbing his eyes like crazy, and hardly makes it through the naptime story/song routine. Do you still think I should try to extend? 2:15 total awake time, maybe? I am never sure what time to do AM nap. he gets up at 6:30, but is really awake at 5 or 5:30, I've read both to pull up AM nap to when he shows sleepy signs to prevent overtired and I've also read that if you pull up the nap, then it will reinforce the early wake.
These nw (anywhere from 4 nw to more like 7 or 8) have been going on for quite a while.....I'd say more than a month. I weaned the paci this month, and it helped a little (ie, he used to wake at 1, 1:15, 1:45, now just wakes once around that time then goes back down). When he wakes, I'll feed if after 10 and after 2 (that's 4 hr stretches) but other times I do pu/pd. He'll usually calms pretty easy (except for the 5 am-ish wake, that is usually a lost cause. I let him mantra for about 20 min this AM, then I did pu/pd, and he cried and fussed and almost settled, then cried and fussed and so on, until wake up time. never did go back to sleep from 5:15 to 6:30.)
I've never tried leaving the room for a nw.
I spent a month on a very bland diet and it didn't seem to make a difference, good thought though. He's happy as a clam during the day, (except in evening when he's tired).
Recently I've been pulling bedtime from 7 to 6:30 because he's SO tired. (naps aren't exactly great either, but we're working on that).
I think the hardest thing is that nw are all over the place....last night first one was 8:40! I can't seem to get in with any w2s, because he's not consistent.
Thanks again for your reply. Hopefully this additional info helps you help us! :)
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I am absolutely NO expert
But when my LO was much younger (actually he still is alittle this way) I found that if he was overtired when he went to bed that he would have MANY night wakes.
From what you are saying with how tired he is at nap time I would consider putting him down earlier with the hope that he will sleep better during his naps and then be rested enough to sleep somewhat better over night (esp. once he learns the independant sleeping with the help of pu/pd)
I also understand how you said that early nap reinforces early wakes and this may be true but I think if you could deal with the naps and then the night wakes and then if need be the early morning wakes.
Just a thought but it may be worth a go
Goodluck
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Oh! I am having the exact same problem with my son, who is a month younger than yours. (If it makes you feel any better, after going to sleep at 8, mine was up last night at 10, ,12:10, 1:30, 2, and 4:45, and woke for the day at 6:45.) I too go through that to feed or not to feed dilemma. Sorry, I don't have advice (If I knew what to do I'd be doing it! :)) Just wanted you to know you are not alone!
Jen
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Yikes....i will try write our routine, Our am wake up and pm bedtime are at those times as i work 3 long days per week.
6.30...awake and bf
7.30....breakfast
8.30-9 sleep, usually only 45-60mins
10.30 breastfeed
11.30-12pm...dinner
12.30-1...sleep usually 45-60 mins
2.30 bf
3pm some fruit
5pm bf, may have catnap here
6. bathtime
6.30 supper 7.30-8pm bf and struggle to get her to sleep for 8.30
wakes usually around 10pm, 12.30(feed) 2.30, 4.30(feed), its not uncommon for her to wake for day before 5am.
She was doing well before i went back to work 7 weeks ago, she even was down to 1 wake up and feed for 2 nights(sigh), but she has found it hard to settle at her childminders. Naps are even poorer there and she has to wait for me to come home at 8pm for her night time feed. My childmindedr does her best to stick to her routine but this can go very astray as it lily is very slow with bottles and only takes 4oz ebm at a pop, also pu/pd does not work for her when she is there, sorry i have to dash! Any advice welcome!
Ps.....dont mind the nightfeeds really!! Do mind all the wakings and would love a proper break during the day!!!
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Tracefo - how long did it take for you lo to learn to put the paci back in herself? I'd love to know your trick!!!
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evelyn - at 8 months i def don't think your lo needs this catnap at all. i really think you could stand to stretch out the A time as it would then push the day later and lo wouldn't be overtired before bed kwim? i think you would get better napping out of lo if you did this as she would be more tired before naps..if she 'seems' tired at the usual nap time i suggest only slowly increasing it every day a little at a time as she is 'used' to her routine - and make sure you keep the A time (extra A time before sleeping) very low key - whether it's reading a book or haviing a little chat...low key! i think this should help you and your lo greatly as i believe that she is getting too much daysleep and not getting tired enough overall to be getting good rest all the way around. good luck and keep us posted!!
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btw - for those of you struggling with whether or not to feed at night - try settling lo in the crib first - if lo sleeps past an hr than assume the waking wasn't from hunger. if lo wakes before an hr assume hunger and feed.
don't know how old everyone's lo's are - but i did slowly start weaning dd off night feeds at about 6 months..
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Hi teezee, thanks for your reply! Makes a lot of sense! I posted earlier today out of shear desparation, so please dont think i was wasting your time!!! :)
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sarah - i would def try to extend for a few days and see how it goes - you can always go back to what you were doing before. he may just 'seem' tired or 'think' he is tired b/c you have him on a good consistant routine and that's what he is used to. just keep the extra A time very low key and not stimulating and it should go well - just be sure he doesn't get overtired and if needed just extend by 5 or ten min at a time...the morning A time 'should' be the shortest A time of the day, getting longer throughout the rest of the day...but i do think that your lo can do with an extra 15 min A time - possibly up to a half hr - but it will have to be a slow process to get him there. also, do keep in mind that the 6 month growth spurt is coming up and pay attention to signs for that.
as far as the early wake up - kind of compromise between both of what you have heard esp lo being so young still kwim? just try extending how i described but just don't let him get overtired - you know your lo best..
from what you describe it does sounds like lo isn't tired enough to stay asleepwhen the early am waking occurs.
i do def think that extending the A time will help with naps as lo will be more tired to stay asleep longer, and in turn will not get overtired by not getting enough quality rest during the day. if you do put your lo down too early in the am b/c he is tired - beware that he isn't just tired b/c he woke up early and 'making up for lost sleep' with that am nap - i may advise that you want to limit that nap for a bit til things get back on track - so that he is rested but not just catching up...good luck hun!
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Hi!!!
Hope you are hanging in there.Not sure if this will help you but my Ds is 5 months old,but I changed him over to the bottle about 6weeks ago as he wasn't getting enough milk of me.
But when I was Bf him I would feed every hour from 5-7pm then one more at 9pm and he would sleep all night.I did this from 7weeks and he has slept thru the whole night since then.
Day time sleeps he isn't too good at,he has 3 one hour sleeps a day,but I am not too worried about that now,as he sleeps the whole night and goes down early.
I just watch his signs now and when he starts to get cranky rubbing his eyes i put him down to sleep.
Hope this might give you some ideas,my Ds is actually born 3 days after yours....
Must be dec babies,I no alot of people that have had trouble with them sleeping and all born in dec...
It takes your toll,but hang in there... ;D ;D
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imho - if you are bfing and want to continue - i wouldn't suggest giving lo formula - even to supplement - supply =demand and if lo isn't sucking/nursing then the milk won;t be produced and your supply will diminish. if your supply seems low - pump and hr after you feed lo. i am still bfing at almost a yr and there were times when it seemed it was getting hopeless as my supply would drastically drop but after observation it happened right before i got my period as hormones are all wacky ;) if your supply is well established it should be ok with a little work on your part if needed..you could also just let lo nurse more often for a couple days - this should work also :)
andrea - if you are still having troubles with your lo sleeping it could have to do with your lo needing his routine tweaked some..if you would like to start your own thread and post lo's routine we could take a look for you :) if not, keep up the great work!!
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Hi All! Thanks for your replies! I have made some small successes these past few days.
I have been able to extend naps, though w2s is still failing. I am now applying pressure for the jolts. I've been getting 1.5 hrs in Am and 2 hrs in PM nap. Yeah! However, I'm wondering if I am going to be applying pressure until he turns 10! ::) Anyone know how you wean this? I know w2s you do 4 days, then let them try, then do again 4 days, etc.
I also applied pressure to help him get back to sleep this morning when he woke at 5.....but I did it again 30 min later (good thing, because he did slightly wake) and so on. But I got him to his 6:30 wake up time without a real awakening, though it probably wasn't the best quality of sleep. So, at least he didn't start his day early.
I've also been extending A time to 2:15, however, contrary to what you said, he seems to deal better in the morning. ??? (and he's supposedly a textbook baby!) Anyway, I get 2:15 easily in the morning, then with a little struggle in the afternoon. Between PM nap and catnap, though, he's giving me sleepy signs at 1.5! I stretch to 2, but not sure I can do more. He also gives sleepy signs 1 hr after waking from catnap, before I start bedtime routine.
Here's our improved routine:
6:30 wake and E & A
8:45 S
10:15 E&A
12:30 S
2:30 E&A
4:30 catnap
5:10~5:20 E (cluster)
6:15 E
6:30 massage, song, bed at 7
So, he's less overtired by having that late catnap, but waking only 90 min before bedtime.
few Questions:
1. In BW-SAYP, Tracy suggests a 4 hr EASY that has a catnap between 5 and 6, with bedtime at 7:30, so could be waking 90 min before bedtime. DS is doing the same thing in this schedule. Do you think that's too close to bedtime? Also, at what age does catnap go away usually?
2. Why does he seem more tired later in the day rather than earlier? (maybe this is due to our chronic sleep problems and bad naps accumulating?)
3. What to so about that darn cluster feed....I'd like to do E at 2:30, 4:30 and 6:10, but 4:30 is catnap time, so as a result, he eats 1 hr apart, I doubt both are full feeds. Since he's still waking 2X to eat at night, maybe he doesn't need it for now?
4. I heard before to make the PM nap the long one, rather then Am, do you agree?
Thanks for all your help!
Sarah
PS thanks for the heads up on the gs. I will keep an eye out!
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it will pass - just need to do it for some time. could lo be somehow getting overtred/ overstimulated?
sometimes sleep cues change or become harder to identify. my lo would yawn all day long and for the longest time i assumed she was ready for bed and didn't understand why things weren't falling into place.then i started keeping her up for longer periods of time and her sleep got better and she didn't always 'seem' sleepy. if they are used to getting more sleep and less A time than their bodies are on a routine to show tiredness at that time..kwim? am i making any sense?? just make sure you keep that extra A time as low key as possible..look out a window or something..
i wouldn't say the time between the catnap and bedtime is as much to worry about as whether your lo can handle having a later catnap? that prob doesn't make any sense - if it is too late in the evening (and every lo is different as with everything..) than sometimes it will affect night sleep...
it could be accumulated overtiredness in which case i would try putting lo down to bed earlier for a few nights to try and let him 'catch up' and not do the catching up during nap times though.
have you tried a df as opposed to a cluster feed??
i agree that with 'most' lo's the am nap should be the shortest as then you will be sure lo isn't getting too much morning sleep and it won't affect night sleep. look at the am nap as an extension of night sleep...kind of like a topper - it doesn't need to be as long as in the pm as lo should be very rested from a good night's sleep kwim..although my dd is the exact opposite and i let her nap that way b/c it isn't affecting her nights any...it's all a balancing act and finding what works for you - 10 or 15 min could change everything when it comes to a lo's routine.
good luck and keep us posted! it sounds like you have a great start - just keep moving forward and things should start falling into place!!
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So, if he's having bad naps, I should put him to bed early that day?
For example today he slept 30 min in AM, cried for 20 min, slept 35 more min. In PM he slept 1 hr 20 min. He;s going to be ready for a catnap by 4, probably sleep 35 min, so he's going to be SO exhausted by the time 7 rolls around. usually 45 min after catanp he's already rubbing his eyes and fussing like crazy (around 6 pm)
I want to do a df, but he's waking so early.....like 8:30~9:30 for first wake. I put him back to sleep, then feed the next time he wakes 10~11 ish. Does that early 8:30~9:30 wake mean something? The time is not consistant, so can't do w2s.
Up until yesterday I didn't think overstimulation was a problem,. but yesterday he figured out how to roll, and now he can't stop rolling.....I think that's affecting him today. Anyhow, does overstimulation cause more jolts?
Somedays I feel like I'm taking 2 steps forward and 1.75 steps back....some days 2.5 steps back!
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that's what i would do - put him to bed early if naps are bad - esp if he seems tired, like he's on his way to overtired - with my dd i would be able to tell at night her sleep cues better than the rest of the day as she would rub her eyes (not always a sleep cue for her) and start to get hyper - that was the first clue that i had to get her to bed NOW! and at that age, it really does differ from day to day imo, just keep a close watch - but i def think even a little earlier woudl help. with today, i would put him down for 6pm if that's when he is tired b/c being overtired will just make his sleep more disrupted.
that early waking after bedtime most times signifies overtiredness - which i am pretty sure your lo is..that's why i think the early bedtime will help get everything sorted out. even if he starts napping well you don't want him to make up for ALL the sleep during the day or he will start getting days/nights mixed up..a whole other problem ;) but the early bedtime will instill that night time is for sleeping, keep him from being overtired and let him 'make up' any lost sleep.
developmental things can most definately add to wakings/early wakings - but i think that it is something more here although it could be making it worse ultimately. overstimulation - if other kids are around and excited, sometimes tv, getting lo riled up in the last A time can cause more jolts definately.
there is def regression when you change or do new things so don't let that discourage you - you are here and asking for advice and that is wonderful in itself that you are willing to try something new :) you are doing a great job!!
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HI Tawnya,
Thanks again for all your help. I love your DD's new picture! So cute!
So, on again with 2 steps forward 1 step back....but I am trying to find one or 2 positive things in every day so i don't get discouraged! (This morning he woke at 5:45, then mantra'd for 10 min and back to sleep till 6:30, his wake up time! YEAH! And I found him 180 degree turn, and on his tummy when I went to get him up!)
Naps went haywire again today....The holding for jolts isn't always working. Not sure what to do on short naps anymore. :-\
So, I came up with a list of more questions:
Today he slept 38 min in PM nap, and then pu/pd for the rest of the nap period. NOW, what time do I put him down for catnap? 2:15 after he woke, or 2:15 after getting him out of the crib? I went on sleepy signs (he's an eye rubber) thought it may have been premature, since he's still giving me sleepy signs early.
How long do you think I should keep putting him down early?
If he is sleeping past morning wake time, do you think I should wake him and start our EASY on time every day, or let him sleep to help catch up on all this lost sleep and adjust EASY based on Wake up time? (this hasn't been a problem yet, but I'm just hoping!) Same question on naps....I presume it's best to wake him at E time? Regardless of how much sleep he actually got?
How long should I try to push a nap? ie if he naps 1 hr 20 min in the morning, good enough? Or push for 1:30 or more? And finally, how much daytime sleep do you think I should aim for? (he'll be 6 mo in 10 days) I looked at the thread that shows average sleep, but it didn't make sense....less daytime sleep for a 6 mo old than older kids..... ??? I'm thinking 1:30 in AM 2 in PM and 30 min catanp, if I can get all that. Do you think that sounds good?
Oh, on overstimulation....I'm really stumped. I have no other children, I never turn the TV on when he's awake, and I only do exersaucer and that type of stuff in the morning. The only thing could be DH coming home from work, usually after catnap and they play between then and bedtime. But, that doesn't really explain the naps hard jolts.... ???
Thanks for your encouragement. :-*
It's so frustrating, and to think it will never be sorted out...always need tweaking because of age, development, etc. Agg! I just want to get to a place I can deal with....and with more than 6 hrs or broken sleep a night!
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thx for the compliment on the pic ;D although i have gone and changed it again ;)
congrats on the reg wake up time today! that is a great achievement!!
i had huge problems with jolts when dd was his age and i would still have to swaddle - don't know if you do - but she fought and fought with a regular swaddle but wasn't at all resistant to an aussie swaddle and i actually used it until she was i think about 8 months and even on days she was excited by something and 'hyper' i would still use it after that til about 9 months!! :o that should help with the jolts if you aren't already using a swaddle if you need a link to the aussie swaddle let me know ;)
i think that you should put him down early for at least a few days - til you think he is caught up and on a more reg routine..which may be longer - i guess you will have to judge that and if you put him to bed at a later time and things get worse than you will know - it is so much trial and error really...i know i wish i had a 'magic' answer to help solve this but i can only help guide you in hopefully the right direction...
i def think you should be consistant with the wake up time as he will then learn when that time is kwim? and your routine will hopefully start falling into place more regularly..with the extra sleep from early bedtime he should be rested enough..if you don't wake him once he is caught up - he will let you know with early wakings once again kwim? he will get used to sleeping in late in the am and wake up for a 'sleep break' early am as he will be able to 'catch up' in the morning and you don't want that!! :)
i think 1 hr 20 mins is fairly good - at that age i think that is about what i got out of my lo for at least one of her naps on the odd occasion i would get 2hrs for both but most times one long, one shorter, and a catnap.
as far as how much sleep? all lo's are soo different and 15 min can honestly make or break night time sleep - to me it is such a fragile thing this balancing act of sleep. ok well, keep in mind that in the next few weeks your lo may/will (usually between 6-8 months) be ready to drop that catnap. and then you will need to have two longer naps although the time of the two he is having should be enough - but then you will def need to do an earlier bedtime insted of the catnap until the A time is extended enough (of course it is a slow process..) so that he can make it through to the bedtime. again, this is IF your lo is ready for it at that point - don't try doing it too early - if he starts sleeping to a reg waking up time and in the next couple wks he starts waking in the early am again, i think it would be time. also at 6 months, don't forget about that growth spurt! you may want to start adding a bit more to bottles or if bfing pumping some to increase your supply so you don't start any new night feedings as a result - just to be a little proactive here ;)
honey - you will never stop tweaking so don't get too hopeful there ;) but seriously - as soon as things start working he will go and change on you! tried and true - happens to me all the time ;) these lo's like keeping us on our toes ya know??!!
anyway, if swaddling - maybe the aussie swaddle will be helpful..it was a complete godsend for me..how many times did he wake last night? also, he's about the age that i would feel comfortable (after the growth spurt that is..) saying that maybe you want to try weaning the night feeds...and do remember there is soo much going on developmentally, teething, growth spurts..etc if you are consistant and continue being proactive he may just surprise you one night ;) will keep my fingers crossed..i do remember feeling like you must, thinking my dd would NEVER sleep through or even until her night feedings without awaking - but it is possible - i was hopeless and desperate when i posted on the sleep boards and much more frantic than you sound - if i could do it - you can too!!!
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HI Tawnya!
Well, it's better I didn't reply yesterday after 10 night wakings! :o He kept rolling over and wanting me to put him back. Yesterday for naps and night sleep, I decided to let him go, and sooth on his tummy, if that's where he was. WOW! I love tummy sleeping! I'm so glad he learned to roll!
AM nap I was holding him for jolts, but he woke anyway, and got back to sleep, total 1:20, afternoon nap he rolled to his tummy, slept 1:30 (he did wake a few times, buts elf settled....this is a new skill on naps!)
Then, last night he rolled to his tummy, and though I heard peeps, not a cry till 11 when I fed him (usually closer to 10) and 3 (I usually feed around 2). I woke up a couple times hearing him fussing, but never had to intervene! I feel so refreshed after...like....6 hours of sleep! ;D
As for the swaddle....I wish I never stopped when he was little (I wasn't doing bw then) but he's so move-y when he settles, and uses his hands a lot to move around/get comfortable, I think he's get so mad.
Oh, another question....when I start nap or bedtime routine, lately he's fussing up a storm...squirming in my lap for the book or song, rubbing his eyes like crazy, so I've tried, but then moved to the crib. I know consistant routine is important. WWYD?
Thanks for the reminder on the gs. I started pumping yesterday. Hope it helps! Also thrown into the mix, we're going to ILs this month, probably for a week! So that will throw us off for sure, but if we make some ground before then, I know we can get back to it no matter what gets messed up!
Thanks again for your help!
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so are you swaddling again? regular or aussie swaddle?
sometimes you may need to adjust the routine slightly if something doesn't seem to 'work' anymore. it is best to keep it as consistant as possible but i know from when my lo was 4 or 5 months til now dd doesn't have half as much in her routine...it is relatively quick now as over the months we have 'dropped' some steps...
it can be so difficult with regards to the routine and going away - have done it a few times a dreaded it each time - but was never as bad as i thought it would be..after a night or so at least ;) just for bedtime, bring as many things as you possibly can to make lo feel like he's 'at home' kwim? i went as far as detaching the music box that's attached to the mobile (so ididn't have to bring the whole thing) as that is apart of the bedtime routine. bring familiar blankets, etc. and things should go well :)
hth.
you are doing such a great job - such encouraging steps towards your goal!! way to go!! :D :D
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btw i keep forgetting to mention that my mom's bday is the same as daniel's! sagitarius's are awesome!!
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Thanks again for all the encouragement!
I think the fact that he's not as overtired (thanks to early bedtimes) and the longer A time, he's getting there. Then the tummy sleep was the topper. I think it must be more easy for him to self settle on his tummy. And now that I know he can, I am surely slow to move to his rescue. (a part of accidental parenting that I struggle with most!)
I am not swaddling now. It's also really not here....many nights he sleeps in just a onsie, so I think I am going to try to hold off andnot do it if I can get away with it. BUT, the next baby will definitely be swaddled for a mush longer time! ;)
Yeah, I'm thinking skip the book, go to the song, and if he resists, put him right down. he is starting to fuss when we enter the nursery sometimes ??? Not sure why... Anyway, I'll watch and document. Those may be times he was a little more stimulated before nap time. Night is not a problem, as we feed then do a massage, both of which he loves!
So what are the signs he needs 2:30 A time? How about signs I need to watch for to drop catnap?
Thanks for the tips on travel. My mom always says that it doesn't take as long to get BACK to where you were than to get there to begin with, so hopefully with some consistency and a little pu/pd if needed, we can hop back into things when we get back. At least this visit will be pretty easy for us to stay on EASY. DH is helping IL with farm work for the week, so they will all be gone most of the day (and part of the night!) so that will leave DS and I to set our own schedule. :)
Oh, and on pumping, do you do it 1 hr after each feed?
I'm a sag too! Daniel was born 2 days before my bday! What a gift! ;D
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don't feel too bad - i was a classic 'rescuer' too ;)
if you start noticing night wakings again or early wakings then it's probably that he is getting too much day sleep and time to soon drop the catnap - first try adjusting things a bit like you are now - with A times and nap times and if it doesn't seem to help at all - start dropping the nap and just go with an earlier bedtime and it should level itself off within time when he is able to stay up for longer periods kwim?
as far as 2.5hr A time - just extend the A time slowly and if it seems to help but still not great then do it a bit more just play around with it til you find the happy medium.
you could do the pumping right after a feed - but always find the best results about an hr after. if you get a 'dry pump' don't worry about it too much just relax and keep pumping - this will send the signal that more milk needs to be made also :)
i am a capricorn...but most of my fam is sag!!
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So is the idea that you build up supply by pumping, then when he hits gs, he can just eat more each time, and not need to add additional feedings?
How do you go about getting rid of a night feed? w2s for the time he usually wakes? or do I need to slowly wean the feed, ie only one breast for a while, etc.?
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exactly - with taking less frequent feedings he will be taking more in at each feeding which in turn will help his belly sustain him for longer periods of time.
slowly wean the feed in fact i will give you a link :) i didn't start with dd til she was just over 6 months as at that time i figured it was time..although she completely had her night and day feedings backwards by that point and it took a LONG time for me to get it straightened out...you think you have felt hopeless - i thought she would NEVER eat during the day! here is the link:
https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=46907.0
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Thanks! Thats a great link. I have 2 feeds right now at night....the first one has moved to 11:30/12 (used to be more like 10) the other 3~4 (used to be 2) Last night it was at 4:30, so I only fed one side, afraid he wouldn't be hungry at 6:30 if I fed both.
I want to change the early one to a df, and eliminate the second. Which would you work on first? My thought is eliminate the late one, and then slowly pull up the other with a df. That way at first he won't be going such a long stretch (if he eats at midnight, then not again till 6:30, vs, a df at 10, then not again till 6:30) After I eliminate the late feed, pull up the early one by 15/30 min increments to something more reasonable like 10/10:30. Does that make sense? What do you think?
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BTW- after the first good night, DH said to me, Daniel wants a sister. :o lol, okay things are better, but not quite THAT good! I told him we'll talk in a few more months!
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it really is whatever way you feel comfortable with kwim? i did both night feedings at once using this weaning method as that is what suited me best and it worked - again - whatever you feel most comfortable with! :)
your dh is crazy! after the first they seem so baby crazy huh?!..i know my dh is too:)
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Well, why is it that when I have improvement, it always only lasts a couple of days?? I know the los keep changing it up on us, but really....ds gives me 2 or 3 good days/nights, and then back to old habits. :(
he's been waking for naps again.....often I can only get 50~55 min out of one of his naps, the other he wakes 2 or more times. At night, he's taken to waking a few extra times again, and also the early mornings....they never really went away, but he started self soothing, and the past few days has needed me to come in do pu/pd to get him calmed back down between 5 and wake up at 6:30.
aaaaaaa....I know you say I just need to be consistant, and these things will blow by, but seriously, we have never had a solid week of good sleep (day or night). I'm trying to get to a place I'm comfortable leaving with dh for a movie and feeling confident he won't wake between bedtime and 10 pm, or leave him with a sitter or dh for a nap time and feel confident he'll sleep though a good hour and a half, but no luck!
I've been working on moving A time closer to 2:30....we're at 2:25 now. Could this be too much for him? Maybe I need to drop catnap? Oh, he's sooo tired in afternoons, I'm not sure he'll survive from PM nap till bedtime. When you do that, do they eventually lengthen their other 2 naps to make up for the lost catnap?
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there is always some regression when you make changes - that is totally normal :) don't let it discourage you just keep up the good work you are doing and it too shall pass ;D
yes they do eventually lengthen those other two naps so they are rested enough - usually doesn't take too long.
and i too know the feeling of not being able to leave your lo with anyone..i didn't for the longest time - felt like forever...hold tight and try to enjoy this age - it really doesn't last forever..soon enough you will be where i am wishing your lo was 6 months again :-\
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What could he be regressing on? tummy sleeping? i don't think I changed anything else recently.
So does that mean I shouldn't change anything just yet, and let this settle first? (ie A time, catnap, etc)?
I am having trouble figuring out the schedule w/ longer A time...seems no room left for a catnap. If I have 2:25~2:30 A time, naps can only be 1.5 hrs or run into feeds. Then after PM nap, there is 4.5 hrs left to the day, but if I wait 2.5 hr before catnap, he's waking from catnap 1~1.5 hrs before night sleep. Am I making sense? Seems with 2.5 hr A time, the catnap doesn't fit ???
have I said lately how much I appreciate your help?!
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well you can still tweak a bit here and there but no drastic changes imo.
i wouldn't worry so much about time - if your lo is healthy and thriving you imo don't have a need to wake him for a feeding at this age - when he is hungry he will wake. i know my lo would from the age of about 7-8 months go up to 5hr+ without a feed..so if lo is going 4.5 don't sweat it. be liberal with easy and if it's gotta be aeasy or something like that don't sweat it!! as long as you have a 'routine' time doesn't matter so much kwim? follow your lo's cues and let him lead the way - with your guidance of course ;)
just make sure with stretching this A time that your lo isn't getting overtired - you may have to move slower if you are wanting to extend - even like 15 min for a wk or two if that's what lo can handle...if he's ok with it than go forward. have you tried w2s for the short naps that you would like to extend?
if you want to cut out that catnap and give an earlier bedtime for now i think you should try it. if after a wk or so it isn't working you can always go back to what you were doing before kwim? no harm done.
i am glad i am appreciated :) just wish i was able to help you more/quicker :-\ :-\
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As you've said, stick with it, and things do get better. ;)
We skipped catnap last night (not by choice...I had a dr appt and DH has a short tolerance for that kind of thing.) Daniel usually fights catnap hardest...lately 15 min or so. DH gave up at 10, and so we put him down at 6.....he did really good! Woke once at 9:30 ( I think he was expecting a feed, since I usually feed between 10:30~11:30--I didn't want to feed early for fear his whole night...and morning, would be 1 hr early) He then woke for 2 feeds as usual, and best of all..NO EARLY WAKINGS! Woke up happy and playing at 6:30 on the dot! ;D
So not sure if it was the dropped catnap, but may try without for a while. How long should I keep the super-early bedtime? Just follow his cues for bedtime? It's difficult with a long bedtime routine (massage, etc) I never know when to start, so sometimes I just expedite the whole thing if he starts getting restless.
It may be hard to judge results for a while, as we are headed out of town for 4 days. :-\ That always happens when we're starting to make progress! Oh, well, Grandparents have to see the lo too! I'll continue to skip catnap while there if he's getting good day sleep, which, BTW, he's been doing great on his 2 naps these past few days...sleeping well, and no early wakes. YIPPIE!
We're sitting pretty on a 2:25 A time right now and think we'll stay with it for a while. Seems all this combined may be helping w/ early wakes too.
Thanks for the reminders about flexibility. I'm a type A personality (can you tell!?) I expect there must always be one correct answer! Too bad babies aren't that way!
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along with early wakings, when a lo start fighting that catnap it usually means it is about time to drop it and go with an earlier bedtime when needed :D so good job to you!!
i would keep the earlier bedtime til you think he will be able to make it longer. i would go with a couple wks to start and then slowly extend it by 15 every few days and see how it goes - as long as lo doesn't get overtired you are good as gold! ;)
you are absolutely right - it is all relative of each other - just keep the balance - that's the secret ;)
with going away it may/may not affect things..and when you get back chances are he will be a bit off - but just keep consistant with what you have been doing and he will catch on again!
i'm the same way btw - i LIKE structure!! i had a hard time adapting to my lo at first this way but it does get easier as the months go by.
continue what you are doing b/c it is working!! way to go and congrats!!
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Hi Tawnya!
I thought I owe you an update! A lot has gone on. While we were out of town, DS was a trooper...he took 2 GREAT naps every day! ;D Night sleep was a little rough, but I was happy about the naps. Most days at home are good naps now too....much better than before. We are at about 2:30 A time now.
On the NW, he's self soothing more, and in fact, one night around the time I usually feed him (around 2:30) he self soothed before I got in there, so I let it go, he woke off and on for an hour or so and kept fussing, but not crying...eventually fell back asleep and woke at 6! I was shocked! He didn't need that other feed! So, then I started to let him do that several nights, and haven't been feeding him that second feed anymore. I can't believe he cut it himself! He hasn't been taking a lot, though anyway. He does still usually wake up between 2 and 4 and fuss back to sleep every night.
I do have a new question....he's doing the early morning wake thing again (Still??) so I'm not sure what to do now. He's probably hungry. I've seen some feed and put them back down. I tried that a few times, and he never went back to sleep. But this AM he got REALLY upset when I tried pu/pd with him. He must have been really hungry. Not sure what to do now. ??? Should I feed or not? And if I do, won't that screw up the EASY for the whole day, since he won't eat well at 6:30? Maybe the early wakes are not due to hunger, but to the bedtime? We're working on moving that back toward 7 since cutting the catnap. he's been good letting me extend slowly from 6, and we are at about 6:15 now. RE: early wakings, perhaps I need to expedite the process, get it back to 7 quicker? or the other way around? He's up 3:45~4 after PM nap till bedtime (depending on when he wakes from PM nap) I've also thought if I can extend A times more, he may push that PM nap later, and therefore decrease that last long A ? What do you recommend? That early wake is annoying, because it throws off our whole day...he's overtired from the get-go.
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that's amazing!! congrats!! it's amazing how capable of self soothing they become kwim?!
the early waking is usually caused by one of two things...
overtiredness or too much day sleep. how much total hrs of sleep is lo getting these days? and def if you are able to extend that A time to push the nap later go for it as this would def solve lo being overtired before bed if that has become an issue. biggest thing with these early morning wakes - keep lo up for a 'normal' amt of A time as if you put them down early for a nice long nap it will only reinforce this habit...they will just be using that nap as the rest of their night sleep - so if it still persists (if you have solved the too much sleep/not enough A time no overtiredness) you may want to try and see if limiting the morning nap to say half of what lo is getting now will help the situation. good luck with it all - will be thinking about you :)
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Thanks Tawnya-
His day naps total no more than 3 hrs right now. On a perfect day 1:20 in AM, 1:40 in PM, (though often AM is only 50 min!) Should I try to be extending? I think these are about right for a 6 mo old, right? I will try to slowly increase A time again....both morning and afternoon, to push the naps later. It's tough to get him over the hump from PM nap till bedtime. Last night I put him to bed at 6 again (we'd been going for 6:15) I think at 6 mo he can go anywhere from 2.5~3 hrs A time, right?
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ok i am no expert on amt of A times as i was sooo totally off when my dd was 6 months :-[ :-[
that does sound about right though - maybe 2.5 hrs for the first A time and progressively getting a bit longer throughout the day..even better than taking my 'guessing' check out the faq for the easy board as they have sample routines for lo's of all ages. i think that would help you get a better idea :)
it def is a hard time for adjustment with cutting out that nap...remember everything you are doing as you will need all of your skills again as later you drop from two to one...the fun really does continue ;)
i think you are truly on the right track - it is just a matter of him NOT getting overtired in that last A time :-\ i know of ppl who have put their lo's to bed for the night as early as 5:30pm - never done it myself but could be an option for the time being??!!
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Things are still going "okay" and hopefully getting better soon, but we can't seem to get bedtime any later than 6...still! I tried going 6:10 for a couple days and it did not work! (woke up at 8:30/9 every night) Should it be taking this long? I think we are on 3 weeks at 6 pm. ???
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You don't like 6pm? Is he waking early because of it. There are many nights that lil Owen finds bed at 6-615pm lol. Daniel is getting SO BIG! I love that picture, he is so handsome!
Big hugs, and support coming your way!
Zoey
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are you able to stretch any of the A times anymore without lo getting overtired? if not, until lo can handle more - i would leave it there.
how many wakings are you at now? what are the nature of the wakings?? how are you responding?? are you weaning the night feed?
congrats on the steps you have taken and achieved thus far...fingers crossed for you.
i will be away after tomorrow afternoon for a week. but when i get back i hope to hear wonderful strides with your lo!! :)
in the meantime, as i said i will be here til tomorrow so if you need anything pls let me know :)
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Now that you mention it Zoey, it is rather nice to have so much of the evening :) But poor DH hardly sees DS. I think I'd rather be at the 7 pm bedtime. 6 just seems unreasonable.
Tawnya-We're at 2:40 A time right now, and going for 2:45....some days he's ok with it, other days are tough. (especially the days he wakes early and I leave him in crib till wake up time, he obviously has trouble making the A time)
His nw are sort of all over the map....some days just 2 (for feeds--around 10:30 & 2:30....had been skipping the 2:30, and waiting till 5 ish for a while) then last night: 8:45, 9:30, 11:20 (feed), 4:20 (feed) then early wake at 5:50...never went back to sleep till we got him up at 6:30. Some days he's sleeping right up to 6:30, no early wakes (though still nw). Most days doesn't wake for the first time before 10 or 10:30, but then sometimes, like last night, he does. ??? I don't see any real difference in the good days and bad days...ie overstimulation, poor napping, etc.
When he wakes, I let him go as long as possible without responding. I make sure it's a real "need you" cry. I also tried w2s 2 nights for the 2~3 ish wake up, but it has not worked so far. When I do go in, I do pu/pd, but never takes more than a few minutes.
I've been "intending" to wean the night feed, but he's been going through his 6 mo gs (hopefully that's not the only reason he slept well a few of those days!) so I've been hesitant to cut the feeds just yet. That should be over now, though still seemed extra hungry this AM. By tomorrow I should know better. But second feed I'm only giving 1 breast now.
I don't mind keeping the early bedtime for a while...espec when he was down to just 2 wakes, and sleeping till morning wake up time most days....but when he wakes lots (for unknown reasons), it's frustrating! I figure by 7 mo (in a few weeks) we should be able to go for the 3 hr A time (based on what I found on EASY board), so that will hopefully help even out that end of day A time to get back closer to 7 PM. Still not sure what to do about the nw since they are so sporadic.
Thanks for your reply!
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it very well could be in combo with 'habit' wakings - developmental. there is a lot of stuff going in lo's head right now - trying to accomplish new things...just keep doing what you are doing..i know i keep saying that but it is soo true. that's great it only takes a few min for pu/pd during the night wakings - have you tried just patting or shhing or just putting a hand on lo? try settling in the crib first...
i would absolutely wait til the growth spurt is done also. just keep trying to in the meantime to up the daytime intake as that will help as well.
w2s won't work unless the wakings are at the same time every night - it's always good to try things but that is generally how it goes - as you are supposed to do it one hr before the habitual waking.
i really hope things start working a little faster for you but you have made progress and any progress is good progress :)
if lo is waking a lot maybe try some pain reliever or orajel and see if that will help?!
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Yeah, that's a good point. I don't see any bumps on gums yet, ut it is about that time.
Actually, when I say I do pu/pd, I do a modified...meaning I just place my hands on him and apply pressure (p/s and true pu/pd overstimulated him, he never calmed, just got more riled up). So in reality, it's 2-3 min of my hands on him saying soothing words to get him to calm.
Okay, I will keep plugging along.
Hope your trip is vacation. If so, have fun! Hope to have lots of good news when you get back!
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no not a vacation :P just a visit to my dad's..
sounds like you are doing everything right with settling :) good for you!!
um btw your avator is gorgeous!! :D
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Are you back yet Tawnya? Hope it was a good trip! Hi Zoey,
I wanted to update you both on our status:
We have been trying and trying to get his bedtime later, somedays 6:15, most days 6. :( I started to realize he's doing 11.5-12 hrs at night, but since putting him to bed so early, he's waking early.
DS now has 2 routines for night:
Scenario 1:
wake 9 ish, either self settle, but usually requires some assistance from me (hands on him, saying it's okay, just sleep, etc)
wake 11:30~1:30 eat
may wake 3~4 but usually self settles
wake 5~5:30 and never really gets back to sleep.. usually doesn't demand being picked up till closer to 6.
Scenario 2:
wake 10:30 ish eat
wake again 2:30~3:30 eat (I've been slowly reducing min on this one, but then some nights he follows scenario 1....)
wake 6 ish, usually doesn't demand being picked up till around 6:30
The past few days I tried something new, though it may be a bad idea. He's followed scenario 1, only eaten once. Around 5 I go in to whether he is awake or not, and bf (sort of like a df, though he's mostly awake) and put him back down. he gets one More sleep cycle, so it gets him till 6:30 or later. I don't think this is a good habit to form (teaching him to have a feed at 5 AM) but his early wakings screw up his day so much and I can't seem to kick them.
Any other ideas?
His A time is still at 2:45, except at day end is usually 3-3:30, depending on his naps. both naps are usually 1:30, but sometimes shorter. His total day sleep is often slightly less than 3 hrs. I know you've said before early wakings are a result of too much day sleep or overtired at bedtime. How do you get to bedtime without being overtired?
Still frustrated with early wakes. I think he's back to chronically overtired. He wakes about 12 hrs after we put him down (6-6) but it's not good sleep, several wakes and 2 feeds. Then 3 hrs or less day sleep. How do I break it? Do I need to start putting him down BEFORE 6? It seems ridiculous to expect him to sleep past 5:30 AM if I'm putting him down at 5:30 PM, KWIM? :'( To make matters worse, I cannot stop stressing out about this. So when he wakes and self settles at 4, I lay there wondering how long till the next wake...etc.
Also, what's the deal with that 9 pm wake? It's not every night, but about every other or so. How can I get rid of it? Can I do w2s even though it's not every night? He's going to be 7 mo next week. I really didn't think I'd still be working on all of this (how nieve of me!) Seriously, am I doing something wrong, or is he just a poor sleeper?
PS either of you know what's up with the site lately? Seems to be down a lot. ???
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Hi girl - been wondering about you! The site has PMS and we are looking into some Midol for it. ::)
The 6p-6a could just be his bio-rhythum, if so there is little you can do to change it.
Wakings can also be from hunger - is he getting all he can be during the daytime hours?
I'm sorry you are still tweaking!
Hth some
Zoey
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Hi Zoey-lol about mydol!
I thought the same about biorythems, but he used to sleep 7-6:30/7 just since we moved up bedtime for the catnap it changed...
I think he's getting enough to eat. so hard to tell with bf. But sometimes wakings are 2-3 hrs after he last ate...doesn't make sense that he'd be hungry again.
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He is just do cute I wanna bite him! He has cheeks like Owen, don't you just nibble them all day?!? ;D
Have you tried wake to sleep for the wakings? The one where you go in an hour before he usually wakes and stir him and then sneak out using your stealth abilities, and pray to the Sleep Gods? Do it for 3-4 days then see how he does. I find when I use these wake to sleep methods, when you stir, you duck out of sight for a few mins after, THEN leave - I find if I try to leave right away, my leaving wakes him even more then he is up and mad. Maybe that could help?
What happens if you extend the bedtime by 5 mins every 3 nights til you get to where you want it? Does he get his bath at night? If he loves his tubby liek Owen, try leaving him in there longer lol. The whole world could come crashin down around us and if Owen is in the tub, he doesn't notice lol.
Also, what happens when you don't feed him when he wakes? Is he waking cause he is wet from pee? What was the end result with pupd? Could you do that or patting when he wakes? Are you using the soother?
Perhaps bring back the catnap? Have you tried that?
Do I ask too many questions? Lol :P
Zoey
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Not too many questions! I appreciate the help!
his night wakes are not at the same time, so i haven't been able to do w2s. The 9 pm one is w/i 20 min, but not every day. I tried last night anyway, and he woke at 9:30 for 40 min! ::) Usually when he wakes, it takes max 15 min to get him back to sleep, so this was different for us.
Was trying to extend bedtime by 5 min at a time, but then he'd have a bad nap day or be particularly overtired and we'd have to scrap it and move up bedtime again that day and then ended up starting all over.
On a non-feed nw, sometimes he self settles (1-10 min) and if I have to help him, like I said, usually takes 1-15 min) I doubt he's waking from wet, because whenever I feed him, I also change him, but I guess you never know. don't use a soother, and as for pu/pd per advice of Stacy, we just do more of a pressure (hands on his chest/back and legs) and soothing words actual pu never calmed him a bit. This works, though he still gets madder before he calms.
FUnny you should mention catnap...I've been on naps board these past few days talking about that. I brought it back yesterday since he's SO tired at bedtime. They said if he can't do 3 hrs A time yet (which he can't) still needs catnap. Problem is he fignts it. It took 20 min to knock off yesterday, with some help from me. All that seems liek a lot for a 38 min sleep! But I think it helped. he slept till 6:30 this AM.
I'm still wondering what's causeing those frequent 9 pm wakes..... grrrr...
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Not too many questions! I appreciate the help!
his night wakes are not at the same time, so i haven't been able to do w2s. The 9 pm one is w/i 20 min, but not every day. I tried last night anyway, and he woke at 9:30 for 40 min! ::) Usually when he wakes, it takes max 15 min to get him back to sleep, so this was different for us.
Was trying to extend bedtime by 5 min at a time, but then he'd have a bad nap day or be particularly overtired and we'd have to scrap it and move up bedtime again that day and then ended up starting all over.
On a non-feed nw, sometimes he self settles (1-10 min) and if I have to help him, like I said, usually takes 1-15 min) I doubt he's waking from wet, because whenever I feed him, I also change him, but I guess you never know. don't use a soother, and as for pu/pd per advice of Stacy, we just do more of a pressure (hands on his chest/back and legs) and soothing words actual pu never calmed him a bit. This works, though he still gets madder before he calms.
FUnny you should mention catnap...I've been on naps board these past few days talking about that. I brought it back yesterday since he's SO tired at bedtime. They said if he can't do 3 hrs A time yet (which he can't) still needs catnap. Problem is he fignts it. It took 20 min to knock off yesterday, with some help from me. All that seems liek a lot for a 38 min sleep! But I think it helped. he slept till 6:30 this AM.
I'm still wondering what's causeing those frequent 9 pm wakes..... grrrr...
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hey sorry been gone so long...
but yes i am back - it sounds like you have gotten good advice from zoey and on the naps board. 12hrs is a wonderful amt of night sleep - my lo only does 11hrs and ALWAYS has..
the 9pm wake usually means lo's are overtired..i know my lo has been doing this since we got home from my dad's ::) and it is NOT fun...and last night she was up from 11:30pm til 1:30am...so unfortunately we NEVER stop working on these things. :-\
as for the site i think they are doing some work on it to try to improve with the glitches and everything...hopefully will be done now :)
if he isn't able to make it to bedtime without that catnap then for now give it - or give it sometimes if he seems to be having a good nap day and seems that he will be ok til bedtime...
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Thanks for your reply. He's woken at 9 for the past 4 nights. Even if it is from overtired, would w2s maybe work? he was less overtired last night (I think) but still woke at 9. Do you think w2s would work? I guess it's worth a try. I've never done w2s at night....do you still touch them so the just barely stir like with naps? I read somewhere one person flips her lo over to do w2s...seems like a lot more than "just barely stirs". When I go in, should he be in a deep sleep? (ie if he's aready stirring, should I skip it?) Then, how many days do you w2s?
update: did a short AM nap yesterday, normal Pm nap, then catnap, and he slept till almost 6:30 this AM! (though he did have a few nw...plus night feeds...) I'm so glad he slept in the morning though! ;D
Thanks!
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ok i am no expert on - i repeat NO EXPERT on w2s..but here is what i can offer..maybe zoey can help you some more :)
at night w2s - go in 1 hr before lo usually stirs
if lo isn't in a deep sleep then i suppose your options are - 1. put your hand on lo to help settle
2. don't go in and see if lo settle himself
i would barely stir lo...anymore and i would think it would actually wake lo and defeat the purpose kwim?
i have heard w2s can continue anywhere for 2 or 3 days up to a week or two.
happy month birthday to daniel!!!! and so glad to hear he slept better. glad the nap tweaking has helped :)
don't know if i have mentioned this to you - have been weaning the night feed? is the 9 pm waking the only wakings at night now?..besides that early wakings (which has hopefully been overcome :) )?