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EAT => Food Allergies => Topic started by: huntersmummyinoz on August 04, 2010, 04:49:28 am
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have been starting slowly on solids on paed and dieticians advice. ds2 is MSPI plus wheat, and possible egg, peanut, tree nut, seafood.
rice, pear and swede all fine. potato - always spat up afterwards but no other reaction, will try this again later as wondering if it is a texture issue.
gave him pumpkin and he did 3 mucousy poos 3 days in a row, first one was 24hrs after he ate it. seriously can he really be intolerant to pumpkin?? anyone else have this??
am doing a new food every 3 to 4 days, and he also had choko earlier that week so stopped that and also put him on a thickener for his reflux which i stopped too for now, will reintroduce each of those independently.
i just want to cry, i knew we'd have some food dramas getting him on solids, but pumpkin! :'(
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Indeed, they resemble an allergic reaction. I suggest you consult your doctor and see if you can put in anything to lessen the severity of their symptoms, or may simply avoid squash ... and this includes food. You can get a very bad reaction to the ingestion of an allergen.
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DS gets a really red, raw bottom after eating carrots (as did his dad, when he was a baby!!) - carrots are in 99% of baby food jars so it is not common! Any food can cause an issue. DH outgrew the problem aged 2 so fingers crossed our LOs do too ...
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My DS also had a pumpkin reaction, and I was as taken back as u are! His poos were mucusy as well as explosive!! He didn't have that reaction to courgettes tho, so maybe it was the thickness of the pumpkin. I've avoided pumpkin since then, but it was mixed into one of this other babyfood jars when we were on holiday, and I didn't notice a reaction so maybe its really hard for their little starting tummies to digest the thickness of it plain. I would say to wait a while and try again in a few months. But youre def. not the only one out there :)
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wierd! We should ask Shannon, she has an allergy chart of something for every food, she was saying that carrots are a moderate allergy food... maybe she could look it up for you. xx how annoying!
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(((hugs)))). As pp said, you can have a reaction to anything. My DD2 couldn't tolerate RICE for a long time (among many many other foods). :o
I would ditch it from his foods and not try again for several months. It's not a huge staple and he'll most likely out grow it by 12 months. I noticed w/my DD2 around 9-10 months her gut started tolerating many more foods.
Hang in there!!
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We should ask Shannon, she has an allergy chart of something for every food, she was saying that carrots are a moderate allergy food... maybe she could look it up for you. xx how annoying!
It's not an exhaustive list but I would think babyfood would have been in contact with pumpkin SEEDs which it says are moderately allergenic. FWIW, I seem to be able to eat regular zucchini/courgette, but not the similar yellow summer squash (which is supposed to be low).
Maddening, isn't it!!
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thanks ladies :-*
this reaction was from half tablespoon of homemade pumpkin puree. so i'm wondering now if the reason i couldnt get to the bottom of his mucousy poops (pun intended ;) ) was because i have been eating pumpkin, never thought to exclude that from my diet :-\ and would prob eat it at least twice a week with roast dinners or in soups...
we have an appt next week with paed (who specialises in allergies and intolerances) and getting scratch tests done. is there such a thing as testing for pumpkin. anyone got experience with scratch tests and what's involved?
firsttimemummy, carrot reaction, wow! i'm certainly learning something new with food this time round. i thought reflux was enuf to deal with with ds1 but ds2's multiple food intolerances are certainly eye opening!
gogomama, not that i wish it on anyway but nice to know we're not the only ones :-*
scarlett's mom, rice wow so much for that being non allergenic!
shannon, are you able to scan that chart and pm it to me or is it too big?? i would love to compare it to the food charts for low, moderate, high natural chemicals (amines and salicylates) from the RPAH elimination diet as that's what i've been following to introduce his solids.
kirry :-*
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good luck with the tests, etc - we went to paeds but she didn't listen to what we were saying and some of the information she wrote in the letter to our doctor is the complete opposite to what we told her (ie we said his bm's were almost always sticky and she wrote that they were not sticky!!! ??? ). They are going to test for lactose intolerence butI think it is MPI actually! Going to see dr next week to see what he says. Seeing dietician next week so hope they will be of more use (if not, I have a friend who recently qualified as one!!)
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huntersmummy - yes, you can do a scratch test for just about anything. Usually pumpkin is not one of the regular ones (at least not here) so maybe call a day or so before to request that be part of the test. The only thing is for GI issues, skin prick/scratch testing isn't very reliable since those are usually used for reactions like hives. We never did scratch testing, but did skin PATCH testing where it stays on the skin for 24 hours, then you note the results at 24/48 and 72 hours. They were almost 100% correct with us (she reacted to about 90% of the 33 or so patched on her back!). So keep that in mind if they do scratch testing and nothing comes of it.
Good luck. :-*
good luck with the tests, etc - we went to paeds but she didn't listen to what we were saying and some of the information she wrote in the letter to our doctor is the complete opposite to what we told her (ie we said his bm's were almost always sticky and she wrote that they were not sticky!!! ??? ).
::) >:( So annoying!!!
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Where does pumpkin sit on the sals & amines list? Wondering if its those groups he has the problem with or a build up of foods from those groups?
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shannon, are you able to scan that chart and pm it to me or is it too big?? i would love to compare it to the food charts for low, moderate, high natural chemicals (amines and salicylates) from the RPAH elimination diet as that's what i've been following to introduce his solids.
Having scanner woes but will def. get you and Elo a copy.
Sorry for OT, but Kirry, I think you mentioned to me elsewhere at one point that you had supply troubles while on the ED diet. I think this might be happening to me. What should I do? Can I reverse the trend? DS2 is suddenly polishing off both sides in less than 15min and is harder to settle.
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Shannon, dietician said not to get hungry, and to eat protein with every meal and keep snacking.
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Pumpkin was actually the second food I gave DS1 & he threw up. I didnt' give it to him again for 6 weeks & the same thing happend... he is 7 & only about 6mo ago tried it & he nearly gagged on it.
OH & i used to work with someone who was potato allergic, so even though they say they are low... still a chance with anything eg I am a pretty sure I am allergic to lamb or at least intolerant as I've only eaten it 3 times in 16 years & all 3 times i have been sick & got a rash afterwards... & it was only a mouthful until I realised hey this is Lamb.
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Kate, I think sweet potato might be a problem for us, at least the orange variety, not sure about yellow - and those are supposed to be ultra-low. Weird, weird. Did pp have these issues with babes a 100 years ago?
Tari, thanks for mentioning *patch* testing, I think that sounds very promising and we may go that route. At what age can we do that?
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Tari, thanks for mentioning *patch* testing, I think that sounds very promising and we may go that route. At what age can we do that?
I believe they will test from 6 months up. We had our DD2 tested through patch testing at 9 months.
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Kate, I think sweet potato might be a problem for us, at least the orange variety, not sure about yellow - and those are supposed to be ultra-low. Weird, weird. Did pp have these issues with babes a 100 years ago?
I am pretty sure my DS1 can't tolerate any orange Veg, every time I've tried to give it to him (& he is 7) we've had issues & ironically I tried him again on kumura (orange sweet potato) the other day & he had a wheezy cough in less than an hour... he doesn't normally get them without a cold!
One of the people I worked with (I worked in immunology research) had some ideas about allergy some are published, - hygiene Hypothis, also eating unseasonal food, too much variety, children of 40's to & 70's having cows milk from as early as birth etc & passing that problem to their children & grandchildren . Also years ago babies were just "colicy" or difficult and some may well have died quite simply because of failure to thrive.
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I wondered for a while about orange food too! DS can't take orange juice and sometimes orange foods upset his bottom - not think it's the fructose levels in some of them ...
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now think, not "not" think!
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To Hunters mommy - just because a test comes back negative doesn't necessarily mean it is. The test are designed to pick up only one allergy indicator and there are a bunch but the other antibodies aren't easily tested for. http://www.labtestsonline.org/understanding/analytes/allergy/test.html I did scratch tests myself for years due to terrible seasonal allergies, they prick you a bunch of times which as a teenager doesn't hurt but it likely would for a baby and then you wait while it feels like a bunch of mosquito bites are raging. I took shots once my allergy was diagnosed and it helped for that but now I'm 30 and developing food allergies (walnuts and pecans for now). This article might be helpful also http://www.betterhealthusa.com/public/282.cfm. Good luck.
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My sister in law is allergic to watermelon, actually, any melon. Not exactly the same as pumpkin but sort of equally odd. Makes her lips swell up and I'm not sure what else.
Just offering hugs!!
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Hi Kirry; I have this site I use all the time. Now I should confer with the book I received. :-) If we follow this list things go well for H. And I noticed changes in H with giving H pumpkin puree after a week. It was more behavioral (so he probably wasn't feeling well after having it for lunch every day with sunflower butter, apple butter and pumkin puree or tucking it other additional foods). I am tending to see (as also suggested in Fed Up) that a variety works better for H. He cannot handle consuming the same veg/fruits day after day unless they are on the low/very low part of the chart. Obviously, in trialing foods, you want them to consume quite a bit and see how they react. And I think go longer than the normal suggested trials; with H's resistance to foods back then, I don't think he consumed enough to really tell (and then add that the meds were acting as a buffer for the foods). XXXXXXXXXXXXXX Go slow and be as sure as you can.
http://salicylatesensitivity.com/about/food-guide/vegetables/
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Kirry, some pumpkin ins on the high sals list in the booklet.. :(
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wow Kirry.
And this.... is why I'm so scared to start solids :)
We've only really done carrots and rice cereal so far.
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thanks everyone, sorry it has taken me so long to reply, crazy household atm!
appt is tomorrow so will see how we go. seeing dietician again tomorrow too. went back to the three safe foods for a week and all good then gave him choko again yesterday which i thought was fine and mucousy poo during the night! and he is refluxing over and over and i've just had to resettle for the 5th time into his nap (tho he is sick with a cold too so it could be that or all of the above ::) )
elo, it was butternut pumpkin so on the moderate sals.
sherry, yeah i totally feel like he is going to live on rice pears and swede atm :'( sucks cos he LOVES food so much and really enjoyed the pumpkin, it just didnt love him! i'm worried by not giving enuf variety soon in solids that he will become a fussy eater too :-\ i was going with 2 new foods a week but one reaction sets us back a bit.
jean and masonsmum, thanks, off to check out those links :-*
tari, so is patch testing aimed at identifying intolerances or is it just a non invasive way of testing for allergies??
shannon, sorry for late response but as elo said, dont get hungry, eat eat and eat! lots of protein and carbs and allowed fats. if you on the sears diet rather than the RPAH one elo and i were on then cutting avocado could be a problem for you as you arent having enuf other foods and also avocado is nutrient dense if you arent having much other variety. with the RPAH onen there are many many more allowed foods for you to eat so cutting avocado was less of an issue.
kate, thanks for sharing. wow still reacting at 7!
gvackm, watermelon, wow! so i'm starting to think it is possible to be sensitive to anything at all.
thanks again everyone :-*
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sherry, yeah i totally feel like he is going to live on rice pears and swede atm :'( sucks cos he LOVES food so much and really enjoyed the pumpkin, it just didnt love him! i'm worried by not giving enuf variety soon in solids that he will become a fussy eater too :-\ i was going with 2 new foods a week but one reaction sets us back a bit.
I actually don't think variety as a baby has any link to fussy later, my DS2 who at 5 is far "fussier" than DS1 was at 5 (& DS1 didn't eat heaps) but as a 6-15mo DS2 would eat anything & everything no worries, not now. I think it is more to do with the development of taste buds (strongest sense of taste from 2-5yo) than variety of food as a baby.
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2 new foods a week but one reaction sets us back a bit
I really wish I had gone slower with H, and I did about a food a week. It gets too hard to tell if you are getting delayed reactions. H's bottom is always a day or two later. I think the fussy eating was due to food sensitivities, as on the high dose of prevacid he started eating more. Food sensitivities can cause fussy eating, too. I received an article from our occupational therapist about that, as I was looking for a link between tactile defensiveness (sensitive to food texture/etc) and allergies/sensitivities.
XXXXX for a good apt.
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Kate - DS1 was the same way. He ate EVERYTHING until about 18 months. He was such a good eater. Not anymore. Maybe because of some missed allergy or something. Who knows.
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scratch tests all negative so at least he isnt allergic to anything i guess.
with the pumpkin, paed and dietician think he has a salicylate sensitivity so are getting me to challenge amines next (meats, and then banana). then will work on a few more low to moderate chemical veggies. then will work on finding out just what level of salicylates (and amines if he fails that) he can tolerate in his diet. (start by adding a small amount into his diet 1/4 tsp daily then 1/2 tsp, 1 tsp, 2 tsp, 1 tbs, 2tbs, etc - if there are no adverse reactions on a particular amount after 2 weeks then you go onto the next amount for 2 weeks and so on. if you get a minor reaction, you stay on that level as symptoms may settle with time. if you get a definite reaction you go back to the previous level for a few more weeks and then try increasing the intake again)
going to be a long road!
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Kirry I've been trying to call but my mobile is stuck permanantly in Kais room with the white noise on, I keep forgetting to get your no. out if it before I put him to bed! Doh! If you are on tonight can you call the home ph later? I am so keen to know about all this stuff, I have had to put Kai on solids yesterday! Yet to speak to the paed dietician about the food order and amounts, (next week) also haven't got my my appt with the paed for scratch tests and food stuff till 9th Sept.
The dietician thinks that Kai is sensitive to amines and sals too :( That explains why me being on the RPAH elimination diet moderate version instead of "low"is not settling his symptoms completely >:(
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hey Kirry, the fac tthat he was negative to all scratch tests - does that mean you can eat anything new?
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Hi gals! I wish something would have shown up for you Kirry; that would have been nice to at least have a direction to trial (and possibly make it easier). The allergist did say that requiring such a high dose of meds to control symptoms indicated a food sensitivity (but two blood tests for IgE did not show anything). And I think it just means no "allergy" but does not rule out intollerances, right?
I will post a quick update, as I did leave a message with the phone nurse for our gi regarding next steps. I mentioned that the allergist was suggesting that we should scope for EE as a next step. I also mentioned that the allergist knew nothing about salicylates. I asked about a second opinion with the other dr he suggested (and if he knows about salicylates); his respnse was to do the second opinion with the other allergist (but he didn't mention the salicylate part). So, I will ask about it when I make the apt.
The new book's list is more limited than the one I use online. I do think since going even more preservative free, that he is even better. He had a bunch of corn, a few grapes, melon all in the same sitting. NO red bottom and no nwings. Every time I think I figure it out (like it has to be corn), then no reaction on the bottom. Can nearly drive you crazy!
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sorry wasnt clear, yes no allergies but intolerances instead. paed and dietician (they work together) have said stay clear of dairy and soy til 12mths and have to challenge both again around then anyway to keep getting prescription formula. continue to keep wheat, gluten, egg, peanuts, tree nuts and seafood out of my diet but will try him on wheat/gluten/egg in small amounts later on to see if and how much he can tolerate.
jean, no i'm actually glad there's no allergies as he's more likely to outgrow intolerances than an allergy. just darn frustrating working out the specifics as you know! i was also wondering if you'd be able to work with my dietician thru email consults?? she is SOOOO knowledgeable on all this stuff and it's very much about the level of tolerance for particular food chemicals rather than specific foods. apparently particular foods always get the blame as they just happen to be what was eaten when the reaction occurred and tolerance level was reached, so you really need to look at the chemical involved and work out how much of that he can tolerate (eg. corn is on the higher end of salicylates but small amounts of corn may actually be okay, he could be coasting along near his threshold for salicylates, then eats corn and gets a reaction. other times he may be below his threshold for sals, eats corn, so no problem shows as it doesnt tip him over his threshold. hope that makes sense???) is this anything new or do you know this stuff already?
elo, it's crazy trying to catch each other isnt it!! i've been trying to call you back all week. i didnt store your home phone so have been trying your mobile. can you pm me your home number :-*
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Jean I was going to mention the same re the corn
so you really need to look at the chemical involved and work out how much of that he can tolerate (eg. corn is on the higher end of salicylates but small amounts of corn may actually be okay, he could be coasting along near his threshold for salicylates, then eats corn and gets a reaction. other times he may be below his threshold for sals, eats corn, so no problem shows as it doesnt tip him over his threshold.
I kept blaming pork for Kais reactions now looking back I was eating alot of amines - bannanas every day, lamb shanks slow cooked in a pot two nights in a row, BBQ'd and charred meats every second day, then pork - bam! green mucus poos and bad reflux for 5 days.
I am usig the same dietician as Kirry and booked for scratch tests with the same paed in a few weeks. I am quite quite Pis**ed that after talking to the dietician she suggested that I go more strict on my diet as Kai is quite sensitive and NO to any food challenges - I was hoping for the opposite ::)
Kiry off to bed will try to call tomorrow
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Yes, over the past year I have blamed food pairings and meds for the different/inconsistent reactions (pairing with lower foods it was fine, and with tomatoes that is why it showed up with the popcorn eating). We have been doing low sal for a year now; and successfully off meds, so a huge improvement from last year. But not only is corn high, but so are grapes, melon I think moderate from the list. And he had a burger from McDonalds (high sals probably with the processed meat) and preservatives in the bun. No reaction. I was thinking something would show up, and it was a week ago. Personally, I would LOVE to have something show up on a scratch test and KNOW what to avoid. I am sooooo tired of this cat and mouse game regarding the food sensitivity. :-(
Glad you are doing the scratch tests, Eloys. You never know, although it sounds like we are 0 for 2 between Kingston (scratch test) and Heath (two blood tests).
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Jean - do you dare to hope that maybe his sensitivity is getting a little better?
I am going to start a new thread I think about a low chemical diet :)
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I've been out of town for more than a week for work. No BW. :-[
I have been eating a very small number of foods the whole time in order to try to keep the base line while on the road. It was going pretty well (although shopping and cooking on the go is brutal). Poor little guy now is having a bit of a reaction as I ate 3! servings of rice that had unknowingly been cooked with a pat of butter.
quote author=huntersmummyinoz link=topic=176024.msg1988125#msg1988125 date=1280965089]shannon, are you able to scan that chart and pm it to me or is it too big?? i would love to compare it to the food charts for low, moderate, high natural chemicals (amines and salicylates) from the RPAH elimination diet as that's what i've been following to introduce his solids.[/quote]
I just emailed this to Elo, but now I realize I've got such a low-res copy that it will probably work to post it here and then anyone else can have a look too. Note that watermelon is the very top of the page (ie, a top offender!).
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Jean the dieticians do give a method to determine your tolerance threshold in terms of serves/cups of sals per day. I will ask at next appointment!
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Thanks Eloys! I am trying to remember what the book suggests, but my memory is failing. Plus your specialist has some good ideas based on experience.
Sher, perhaps his sensitivity is lessening. :-) (It did cross my mind, but you know what will happen when I say it, lol.) I have wondered about amines and glutamates in addition to preservatives. I need to get a better handle on those categories.
On the list I used previously, there were five categories for foods, and yes, mellon is in the high category just below the very high. There was plenty of no-no foods there to cause a reaction and build up over a couple of days (based on previous experience). My cousin wanted to stop at McD's after being out last weekend. Back in May we ate at BK (but that is "flame broiled"), and his but was bright red for three days. :-( I wonder if that could be a hint towards the amines.
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Jean - I was wondering if you were worried about the amines. There is so much to wrap your head around. Man, it's so hard to even think about it all, let alone try to follow it all.
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And of course, as I mentioned it...last night his bottom started to get red. Sigh, eye roll...
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Oh man!!!
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BUT the little red bumps that were there last night (probably about 4-5) starting have faded today by nap time when I checked ??? Maybe a minor reaction...
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How does the chart above match what you have ladies?
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Hmmm, to me it looks a bit different than low salicylate.
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I don't think its inline with sals or amines, I wish they said how it was calculated/derived.
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maybe because its based on allergy only?
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And a side note, we actually have ripe pumkins in our garden. I made one tonight (although H took less than one bite), and it was delicous. BTW, I have never had pumpkins ripe in mid August??? I guess I am going to can or freeze them and save them for a rainy day (when H can perhaps eat them or handle them routinely smeared on his sandwiches).