BabyWhispererForums.com
SLEEP => Sleeping For Toddlers => Topic started by: anna* on June 24, 2013, 19:17:59 pm
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Good luck with the bumpy transition, ladies.
Remember, please no posts m-a-r-k-i-n-g your spot, they'll be removed. Chat on!
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Thank you My Little Liam, we are very blessed to have a beautiful healthy little boy!
Siobhan I don't think I would dare even open his room door once he's down for the night, he's such a light sleeper. I know I need to just stick to the set naps and push through, I don't think the 2 naps are going to work for us now. Its just hard keeping him going the last hour or so and getting him to eat when he's so tired is sooo hard. I just hope we can get a good nap on Saturday before his 1st birthday party.
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I totally hear you. Liam is a deep sleeper thank goodness. Our house is so creaky and everything makes noise so I don't know what I'd do if he wasn't. I'm doing a semi-EBT today. Only a 4.5hr A since he woke early from his nap since they once again are working on our street. ARGH.. So we'll see what tonight brings. I just needed a break and he was exhausted so even if he wakes early at least it will be a longer night.
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I had some luck with pushing out her first nap yesterday. She's still EW me at around 5:30-6 so i'm going to keep extending her and hopefully she will sleep in the mornings so we can get to a 12pm nap.
Do set naps work with EWing babies?
She's doing about 10 to 10.5 hrs at night and 1h 40 nap during the day. I did do a cn yesterday and it resulted in a later bt so we had a long 5am to 8pm day
Also, I seem to be getting only 1h 25-30 min naps a lot. Is that Ut or OT?
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I'm guessing here but I think if the nap too early for them then they wake early and so you do Bt early and it becomes a vicious circle. 12 is my target the moment, but he was a huge grump master this morning and we only managed till 11.35 this was after a 5.20am WU. He then napped for only 1hr35, but is happier than when he went to sleep thankfully, so not sure what BT to do, do I stick to 7pm or bring it forward a little to 6.30pm?? WWYD?
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Well I tried to push her out to a 6pm bed time and she is way OT and fighting bt. Should I stick with pushing her out or try to cn her if she has a short nap?
This is tricky business!
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Logans mommy is she 2? If she is I would just go to set naps/set bt and get away from 2 naps all together. What is your current routine? Hayley sorry I didn't see this until now. What did you end up doing? Liam woke at 5:30 this morning didn't get him out of bed till 6, Nap at 11:30 Woke at 1, apop'd him till 1:30 and BT at 6:30. He's a little OT but I've just got to bite the bullet and start pushing that nap out to 12 BT at 7. :)
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Sorry, no she is 13 months. I haven't updated my ticker from my first daughter!
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Oh ok. :) Sorry since we are on a new thread haven't caught up on your other ones but are you doing short am long pm? one nap with eBT?
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A bit of both actually!
She was moving towards 1 nap at 12 months. Somedays she would give me a long 2+hr nap and that would be it for the day. Some days she would need a 15min cn a few hours before bed.
At 12 months she had surgery and needed to be in arm restraints and she was a thumb sucker so it all went to heck in a handbasket.
I'm just now starting to get longer than 20-30 min naps from her as she's slowly starting to self soothe a bit.
She's teething/and going through crawling/pulling up milestones at the same time and she's completely refusing the second nap. I tried her on a short am long pm, but she started refusing the pm nap too. So I decided to try to push her out a bit in her A time and see if we could get onto one nap that way. It seems to be working better but I have to AP a CN in the car if she doesn't nap long enough to make it to bed time.
Yesterday that resulted in a 5am to 8pm day as she wasn't interested in going to bed so today I did 1 nap and tried for EBT at 545, but she screamed till 645 so I'm not sure which route to take!
She's been EW around 5- 530 and doing 10hrs at night. Previous to surgery she would do a 2+hr nap and 12 hrs at night.
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Asbout 10-12 months we were doing a combo of ether long Am, short pm then Short Am to long PM. The first worked until he started to refuse the secon dnap. The second worked for 2 weeks but he just became an OT mess in the morning becuase he stopped being able to stay awake for long periods of time. So at 12 months we just went to one nap and that was that. He went through a GS where he was doign 11hr days and 13hr nights. But those days are long gone. We are dealing with 5:30 EW's. It doesn't seem to matter if he goes to bed at 6 or 6:45 he still wakes at 5:30. So at this point I'm just going to set nap 11:30 BT 6:30 until things even out then I'll start pushing to 11:45 then 12 over a period of a week. I'll let you know how it goes
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I think I'm going to try to do the same. See if I can get her on one nap and AP a cn if she's OT. Right now I'm pushing her out to 4h 40min A time and she's not quite giving me a good nap, but I hope she will after a bit of adjustment. Last night she went to bed at 5:45 and finally fell asleep at 6:45 had a 1h 30min night wake which is rare for her but then slept till 6:30 and that's her longest time in bed for a month.
I'm getting anywhere from 1h20m naps to 1h 40m naps. Hoping they stretch out soon. It's been a tough month after surgery!
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The only thing is if you are doing set naps you don't do a CN to catch up. The point of doing set naps/set BT is to get your lo used to that higher A time so if you go back to a CN then it defeats the purpose. I know some who jsut do A times i.e. 5-5.5hrs then if they start seeing OT set in they'll do one day of a CN to help catch up. I found that did me no good and he ended up still waking early the next day and becausde of the cn he went to bed later and had a shorter night. So we are sticking with Set nap/set bed time with one nap.
It's tough because on two naps 1hr20min is a UT nap, but on one nap considered an OT nap. Is 4hrs 40min the longest A she's done or did you dial it back a bit due to OT? A LO needs to be able to handle at least 4hrs 45min and take a good 2hr nap to be on one nap.
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Well last night wasn't great, I saw a post that my little Liam had written about her success with SEBT so thought I'd give it a whirl and he was asleep by 5.30pm
Woke screaming at 3.30am and I had to give milk with ibuprofen as I think it may be his teeth bothering him, tool till 4.45am to re-settle him then woke at 6.30am. Was pretty good this morning so we did 11.30am nap and he woke after 1hr10??? So is that OT, UT or just teeth? When we were on 2 naps 1hr10 would be UT, but if that's the case he's ready for more than 5 hrs awake time?? I'm stumped, but gonna try pain meds before nap and a nap at 11.45 tomorrow, see what we get. BT tonight hoping for 6.30.
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That's sounds like pain too me. Can you do Earlier bt than 6:30
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Well we had a 5:30 wake Up again. I put down at 11:30 for set nap. He also till 1:45 which is better them Yesterday. He's trying to resettle but can't.
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It ended up being just before 6.30, straight to sleep no problem. Do you think I should stick with 11.30 and just medicate the nap Siobhan? Pain meds at the ready for the NWs!
11.30-1.45 is a great nap, I'd take that!! We were getting 2.5 hrs at 11.30 until I went and did a 2 nap day and then it went wrong, I won't be doing that again!!
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Ha sorry no he did 1hr and 45 min my typo. Yeah same here thought I'd do a cn day 2 weeks ago and that was a big mistake.
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Ah, that makes total sense! Both of our days went pretty close to the same except we got an 1h 50m nap today but lots of bt resistance again.
She does a 4h 40m A time, but it takes her 10-15 to fall asleep so I haven't pushed her out more yet. I will give her one more day to adjust and then see if I can push her out again. She seems ready to be on 1 nap but just needs time to adjust. we are close to a routine but still suffering some bumps and bt resistance. I think some of that is related to the surgery to be honest. Previous to surgery I could put her to bed at any time and she would go to bed without a fuss.
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Yeah I can see how the surgery etc would cause some relapse on sleep training. What are you doing to help her SS agian for BT. Is she the same way for naps or just BT? What was her A time before surgery? Have you tried the capped AM nap and longer pm nap routine?
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Up until the last 2 days it has been the same for nap as bt. she would cry/sit up. I've been letting her fuss a bit to try to give her the opportunity to self soothe. I am doing PD/WO if she gets up which she is responding well too. If her cry escalates I will go in and pat her bum or if she is really upset I will pick her up and snuggle till she settles and back into bed. Seems to be working, but is taking some time.
Before surgery she was on a 4h 20m nap and I think she was getting close to needing an extension. she did 4h 20 in the am and 4h 30 in the pm usually with a 15m CN.
I did try capping the am nap and she started refusing the pm nap so I switched to extending her A time and have had a lot more success and less tears (on both our parts) with that. Just not quite there yet. Tonight she gave me a good fight for 30m but settled into sleep at 6:30. Better than last night's 1h fight!
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how did the night go? We had a much better night. yesterday was a wake up of 530 set nap of 1130 slept 1hr45 min but I apopd till 1:45 set bt of 6:30.:he slept till 6:30. He cried out at 4:45 but ss. Of course I was up from then on but oh well. Think we will do 11:45 today given the good night.
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We tried all of the combinations too Logansmommy2, and ended with capped am but refusal of the pm nap, so we're now on set naps... as i've had enough of trying to juggle A time and these early mornings they are vile, making an unhappy baby & mummy. I'm supposed to be studying at the moment but haven't for the last week as I am just so tired and i'm surviving on sugar and caffine at the moment!
So rubbish nap of 1hr10mins, finishing at 12.40 yesterday, BT at 6.30 we had a NW at 2.55 that I gave him meds and he slept till 5.55 out of the cot at 6.40. It seems we now have the other front tooth coming through so that's 4 at once... poor love :( did early lunch and gave meds after, was planning for 11.30 nap but he was so happy and playing that it ended up being 12.15 before he was asleep... eeek I know! But we'll see what happens! I'm at my parents now till Sunday so have plenty of hands to keep him entertained if he wakes in a grump and short naps. I'm beginning to wonder whether I am being too cautious and confusing teething pain with tiredness, maybe he is ready for the big jump. I'm going to stick to a short A to bedtime regardless of when he wakes, he's pretty good and will just roll around/play until he's tired enough.
Is there any point at which you should cap the nap ie 3 hours or is it just let them sleep as long as they like at this stage?
Siobhan, glad you guys had a better night & hope the 11.45 nap works for you, fx!
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We didn't make it to 11:45. I think his teeth were bothering him. He was just so cranky. Had no appetite etc. So I put him down at 11:30. At least I know he's not OT so we'll see whats' what
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Well we got a 1hr45 nap so probably need to pull it back to 12pm tomorrow, he's been cranky but I think the meds we're waring off but trying to keep him going till near BT, which planning on for 6.30 tonight.
Hope you got a 2hr nap from him!!
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not a great day yesterday EW at 6 down for set nap at 11 but only 1h 20m nap. Put her down for set bt at 6, asleep at 6:30 but was up at 4:50. Tried to ss till 5:30am.
So should I stick with set nap for try for a capped am nap?
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if you are going to do set nap you really need to stick with it. So it doesn't matter if they are early wake or not you do 15 minutes plus or minus for naptime and 30 minutes plus or minus for bedtime.it can take up to a week or two for them to settle in we are only on day 3 and I've had two bad night and one good night.
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So we had NW at 1.30 SS the. 3.30 when I gave meds, slept then till 6.30 after a 6.30 BT so an okay night.
He woke happy but was the niggley from 9am which I think was teeth lots of chewing, but no drool? And won't let me near his mouth, but only wants me, I got tired of all the carrying so did pd at 11.45 aiming for 12 nap and he was straight asleep, it's now 1.40 so I'm expecting a wake up anytime now.
Siobhans right if you decide to go to set naps you do need to stick with it, we are on day 8, although we did have one 2 nap day as I was doubting myself, that was a disaster and only confirmed that one nap was for us. If you really don't think she's ready stick with capped am, long pm for a little while longer. I think you do have to give it time for their bodies to catch up with the routine and OT is expected during the transition.
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Ok sounds good. I will stick with set nap. I just worry so much about OT causing even worse EW mornings! I'm sooo not a morning person and Logan (who is now 3) stays up till 8:30 so it's a long day :) Hoping it will settle in, in a few weeks.
That was a huge A time for her. We got a 30m nap. It is going to be a fun afternoon!!
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That was a huge A time for her. We got a 30m nap. It is going to be a fun afternoon!!
Sorry :( I would do a 30min earlier BT. She's definitely OT.
Liam woke at 5:30 this morning and no amount of APOP was getting him back to sleep. He was chatty cathy happy to lay in my arms but not sleeping at all. So at 6 we got up. I would have just left him in the crib but I went to put him back down and he had a meltdown on me and I just refuse to start my morning doing wiwo. He was whiny all morning so I think it's teething related. Went to put him down 15min early so 11:15 and he was so OT he had a meltdown. Not looking like it's going to be a good nap but we'll see.
i think this has turned into the Set nap forum. :) It's nice to have other mamas though to chat with and really just to know we aren't alone in our children's devious plans to take away our sanity. ;)
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I figured we would get an OT nap. She's never been awake that long.
I'm going to give an early bt a try. On the way to the cottage for the weekend.
How long does it usually take to get on a set nap?
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How is a everyone doing? Surviving the 2-1?? Well we're back to 2 naps as of yesterday, managed 10 days on one nap but he was so OT and grumpy it just wasn't working, going to try and get him caught up on some sleep then probably do a mix of 1 and 2 day naps. So yesterday we had a 5.40 WU with 40 minute nap at 9.50 APOP then 2nd nap 2-3.50 and he was still tired so asleep by 6.45, with a WU of 6.10 :) best night we've had in a long time. So today I shortened the capped nap to 30 mins as I wanted him to go down early than 2, so did 9.55-10.25, he finally went to sleep for his 2nd nap at 2.00 again?? Guess its because he's caught up on some sleep. I'll see what time WU is and BT before deciding whether I need to cut it to 20 mins, that's if the time the 2nd nap ends starts effecting BT.
I hope the set naps are going better for you!
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Set naps are much better thanks for asking. Sorry you had to bounce back to 2 but maybe once he gets caught up you can try again. I'm getting around 11-11.5hr nights mostly 11 and 2hr naps. We're doing set nap at 11:30 and set BT of 6:30 (6 if he did a bad nap). He is grumpier in the later afternoons before BT but he seems to be handling it ok otherwise. We do get the occasional Ew like 5/5:15 but with 11hr nights he's getting up at 5:30/5:45 and I don't get him up until 6/6:30 so it's sort of working. :)
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Good to hear things have improved for you.
We had pm nap refusal today after a 20 minute am CN. He woke this morning at 7, that was a 12hr15 night, with 2hr15 DTS that has not happened since he was about 7 months old! Then it took till 10.20 before he dropped off this morning and after much upset he went to sleep this afternoon at 2.25! I'm not sure whether he's caught up on sleep or its developmental as we are right under the big grey cloud of a WW week 53!
Well tomorrow he has a settling in morning with the childminder & I won't be picking him up until 11.30, so may aswell shoot for no am nap and then try my best to keep him awake in the car, it will take a miracle and into bed when we get home around 11.45 ish.
If it all goes wrong again at least I know how to get him caught up again, I hope!
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This whole 2-1 switch stinks! I went back to doing A times with her. She just wasn't doing well on set naps. 4h45m A time is going better for her, but naps are inconsistant at 1h20m or 1h45m. Still getting bt refusal most nights. What is a average second A time for a 13mth old?
If she has a tough night I try to do a 10min am, and then a "long" pm but with all the nap refusal it's a crap of a day.
Seeing the Dr tomorrow and hopefully I can put her back on a bottle and try a soother to see if that helps.
This poor kid is just dealing with a ton of OT
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I'll second that! The nap after the CM's was only 1hr35 and he woke happy but then within an hour was an absolute grump bag so I wasn't feeling brave enough to carry on with just one nap and did 20 min am nap then PM nap finishing at 4pm latest, he started taking longer to settle and started EW for the last 2 mornings so bit the bullet today and went for 1 nap! I know they say less than 2hr is an OT nap but when my LO wakes OT he screams blue murder, so I went for 12.30 nap and had to wake him at 3.30, im sure it's only a one off but was awesome today as I have a rotten cold so got some rest.
I'm really not sure on A times for 13 months as this is my first LO, hopefully one of mods will be able to advise!
How long did you do the set naps for?
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How are you ladies going? All on one nap now?
I was doing long AM then a short apop pm nap up until last week when DD suddenly refused to go down for her morning nap until its mid day (we went from 4 hr 15 A Time to now 5.30-6 hrs A). Is this OT or UT you think? When I try for a nap around the 5 hr mark she is just super hyper laughing bouncing walking in the cot etc. I give up and try every 15 minutes but Same thing. Then at the 6h mark she would snap out of it if I continuously put her down and be patted to sleep.
Then the nap length is usually short 1hr15-1hr20. Haven't had a nap over 1.5 hr! I haven't really tried for a pm CN as its usually fairly late so doing EBT instead which also takes ages for her to settle.
What do you reckon? Ot/ut? Her nights are 10.5-11 hrs....
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100% OT i think! Try putting her down 15 min later tgen normal A time. A junp that big in A time always backfires.
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Thanks! I think OT too but just don't know how to make her sleep any earlier!
I should clarify I did try 4h30 to start with but she was just full of energy and wouldn't sleep. I then startee at 4h45 every time but she just bounced around throwing her lovey etc. It drives me crazy :( I am losing my patience with he and feel so bad for it.
I pushed her out in the pram earlier last week to make her sleep but she woke 35 minutes later happy and ready to go!
Anyway today was slightly better she slept 1 h45 after 6 h A then BT was relatively easy after 5 h ( I put hrr down earlier she took 20 minutes to fall asleep). I will try going back to under 5h. Thanks its good to have people to talk this over with!
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Hi everyone
I'm hopping on here coz I think we might be going through 2:1 but I really don't know what is going on! Still at 13mo it'll be coming soon. BT is all over the place at the mo, but DD just doesn't seem ready for 1 nap ???
I thought it was a WW, and maybe because she'd just learnt to pull up to standing, or maybe the heat, but BTs and 2nd naps are so unpredictable at the moment. I didn't go through this with DS - he would quite happily swap between having 1 nap or 2 nap days, and still go to bed at 7-7.30pm. DDs BTs can be anything from 7.15pm on a really good day, to 9pm on a bad one ::)
About 6 weeks ago she started doing longer A times - about 4.5 hours, but then suddenly dropped back to 3.5 in the morning, falling asleep in the car on the way back from nursery. Now she seems to be in the habit of sleeping around 9.45am - I think because we're getting such short nights - only about 9 hours if she doesn't go to sleep till 9pm.
We let her sleep till 11.30am, then have to apop to get her to have a p/m Cat nap (it suits our family for her to have a long sleep in the a/m rather than p/m so we can take DS out in the p/m and DD sleeps in car or pram while out)
Some days DD will sleep from 15:30-16:00 and go to sleep by 19:15 ( a good day), other days (the majority) she'll have a 30min p/m nap and not settle till 9pm. I don't know what's going on!! I was thinking 2:1 and we've had a few days where she's had 11 hour night then 1 nap, but still won't settle at BT, or settles well but treats it like a 2nd nap, and wakes up after 30min wanting to play. ::)
Could be teething but 4 weeks in and still no teeth showing through... (she has none at all still!!)
Sorry if I'm rambling. Any suggestions / thoughts would be most welcome :)
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Tricky one!
We have made a mess of our 2-1 (DD was an overtired mess for last two weeks up at 430 every morning and refusing to nap until 1pm!!) So not much insight here. ... But do you notice any difference in your routines between your good days and long days? Do youthink maybe she is a bit OT overall cos that's what it usually is for under 10 hrs nights here...
But like I said we are not good at this at all! Hopefully more experienced mummies can give better advice :)
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Hi Songbird
Fingers crossed we've had 3 good days with 2 naps still and asleep by 8.15pm BT, but starting to get EWs now!! 05.30, but she's usually awake by 6.30 anyway, so it's really not too bad, but does mean she's only having 91/2 hour nights. I think we should definitely be aiming for 1 nap now...
how are you doing? Are you in the Uk? if so it maybe the heat making her hyper - it is definitely affecting Daisy!
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Just a question.
My dd is 19months and STILL transitioning.
I had a week of set naps at 12. Never got more that 1hr 25 min nap. OT set in. Back to one long one short nap. Never consistent results. Need to switch to 2 but seems so hard!
Is it normal for LOs to be tired every morning when transitioning? If we're in the car for more than 15 mins in the am she'll usually fall asleep and then we're all messed up. Is this normal or could it be that she's still not ready?
So confused.
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Hi Jessleigh
Sorry I don't have advice for you - just going through 2:1 with my 13 month old, and DS was on 1 nap around 12 months BUT he was pretty flexible, so when we went on holiday we put him back on 2 naps so we could have him up later in the evening. Just doing same thing with DD - we're pushing her to 1 nap coz she wasn't settling well at BT (UT) and starting to wake early. It hasn't helped the EWs - not too bad though, 5:45 and we're usually awake by 6.30am anyway these days!
Since 1 nap she's settling for bed at 18:30 though :) but, when we need a late night we just put her back on 2 naps and a later BT.
Sooo - does it matter if your DD is on 1 nap or 2? I guess it's whatever works for your family - is it affecting her night time sleep having 2 naps?
DS is on summer hols at the moment, but DD was always falling asleep in the car on the nursery run, even if she'd only been awake 2 1/2 hours so I'll probably have to cross that bridge again come September... ::)
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Hi ladies hope you don't mind me joining in, my DD will be 12 months on Wednesday. We have happily been crusing along with the 2-1 with a long am / capped 30min pm nap until yesterday. I casually mentioned to the CM that she will be moving to 1 nap in the near future and that day she kept her up to 12pm after a 6:30WU then she napped for 2hrs 15mins, to be honest she will do a long nap for me after a 4hr A time but i was terrifed she would be so OT. I was away at a "team building event" what fun, with work so DH picked her up and he said she was great they even went to teh swing park on the way home. We had 1 NW at 2:30 but i just fed her (she didn't eat any lunch so i thought she might actually be hungry) then she woke at 6:30 this morning.
So here is the thing, do i do the same and stick to a 12pm 1 nap day and hope she copes ok or do i keep the CN for home days?
I really dont know what to do we see to have jumper from 4 -4.25 A to 5.5 in the space of a day and i am worried it will come back to bite me on the bum :o
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Hi Eva's Mummy
I think you can try mix and match - I did with DS at 12 months - but DD has made a sudden leap at 13 months, so I guess my advice is just suck it and see! DD is now coping with 5.5 hour A time after her nap and some days even 6 hr A if she wakes early from her 1 nap.
Good luck. :)
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Thanks honey, i think thats just what i need to do i probably worry more about her sleep then anything else but i'm sure she can do more its just me thats thinks she cant.
Today was terrible it started ok, WU 6:40 then i put her down after 4hrs as we were going to visit my dad whoe lives an hour away so i thought she would sleep for 1.5hrs the lunch and out.
No she slept for 2.5hrs, refused her lunch so we headed over late. She then refused her dinner fell asleep in the car on the way home at 17:25-18:00 and now i can't get her to bed :o
On the plus side that was a great nap, on the downside it was too early and i really didn't want a second nap but i guess i will see what the night brings. I expect some crazyness tonight
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I still cannot get this 1 nap going!
DD is a week away from 15 months and she started refusing the second nap. I was doing a short am 20 mins and then long pm, till she started refusing the pm nap.
We switched to one nap but I can't figure out her a time. I've put her to bed any time between 4h 30m- 5h A time and I always get a 1 hr-1 h20 min nap. she then wants to do a 5hA time and then bed, but I would really like to get a decent nap out of her.
Anyone have suggestions on an average A time for a 15 month old.
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We've ended up settling on a fixed nap time as I got tired of guessing A times, we seem to have settled at pd at 12.45 and asleep by 1pm and get 2/2.5hr nap BT 7pm .
His WU is 7/7.15 and we are finally getting 12hr nights haven't had that since he was 3 months old :) I think he was ready for it weeks ago now looking back but I was just to chicken to push him!
FX this means we've made it through the transition but I will not be holding my breath, he starts nursery in 3 weeks so bound to all go to pot then!
Logansmummy if you're getting 1hr/1hr20 after 5 hrs I would start to push it out try 5hr15 for a few days see what so of nap you get, that's what we had to do we started at 12pm initially and he would nap well for a few days then they started getting shorter, but he was happy enough so I thought it wasn't OT so pushed it out each time we got less that 2hr naps. He will be 14 months on 29th aug.
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Hi hayley,
I see things are going well for you! How long have you been doing nap at 1?? What will you do if the nap gets short once again? Push even later?
We are still trying to figure things out... Teething molars and eye teeth is not helping things...
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For now Maya, I'm just enjoying it while it lasts! We had an awful time with sleep a week after his mmr jabs he kept waking every 30mins through the night, like having a new born, but things have improved since. we have molar movement too :( it's pants!! But no sign of them
Breaking through yet.
I'm going to stick to the 12.45 pd for aslong as it works (it will be a week tomorrow!) if he short naps and is OT he's a real grump bag within 2hrs of waking, so will pull it back by 15 mins initially I think. I won't push it out any further unless he's a happy chappy iykwim?
Are you still on set naps? How's it going?
I tend to find when he's getting tired that his co ordination goes and he becomes quite clumsy which has helped with getting timings.
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Morning ladies. First day of short am, long pm nap today so fingers crossed! And I'm sure you'll be hearing a lot more from me over the transition!
Hope you're all well and have happy sleeping babies :)
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This is so not easy, I have been trying to push to 1 nap as she seems to want to sleep in a big chunk but today she was so tired after 4hrs A time she was crying and clinging to my leg so i put her down for a nap at 10:30 and she is still sleeping now. She really likes her 2.5-3hr naps which are great but they are too early so we end up with EBT, she wont go down for a CN after such a long nap or even if i did it later it would be at at least 5:30 before she would take it making BT 9/9:30 and a 15hr day so i dont want to do that then she is losing out on night sleep the next day.
I know i need to push her first A time out but then she does a 30min OT nap and the second nap is either refused or 30mins as well.
Any suggestions do i just need to stick with EBT and hope we dont end up with a 6-6 routine x
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Can you cap that long nap and try to get a cat nap in the afternoon just to make it until bedtime?
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Gail, I couldn't agree more - it sure isn't easy this 2-1 business!
I think I agree with McSquirtle's suggestion. What if you cap her nap at 2 hrs and then try a CN? I think I'd be in the same boat as you with Aaron if I was doing a 4 hr A time but with the 5 hr A time I get an OT 30+45=1hr15 min nap which means he still takes the CN. If capping the nap at 2 hrs doesn't get you a CN then I think your only other option is to push that am A time to move towards 1 nap. What do you think? I'm also wondering if you move towards 4.5 hrs, do you think she could manage 4.5 hr A time, a long nap, and then 5.5 hrs to BT?
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Johnnyha65- Thank you! I was looking for someone to tell me it wasn't crazy to get more than a 5 hr A time. It worked like a charm today at a 5h 15m A time. A little fuss before falling asleep but a good nap!
Crossing my fingers it continues tomorrow. Thanks!
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I am a bit scared on capping the long nap incase i jinx her and she never long naps again, as i know thats the kind sof nap i am looking for just later in the day. (I know i probably cant jinx sleep but you never know ???) And i think i would need to cap it at 1.5hrs as she still refused a 2nd nap after a 2hr nap.
I think i will need to start pushing her first A time but maybe i need to do it slowly,after a good 2.5/3hr nap she can just make 5.5hrs to BT.
Tonight BT was 18:30 so not the worst which was 5hrs 15mins A and she went down like a dream, not a peep out of her. I just need her to go back to waking at 7/7:15 and then we would be on a 7-7 routine which would be nice.
I suppose i shouldn't complain we have kinds made it to 1 nap without much OT, and getting a nice long nap with it, its just at the wrong time of day. I'm probably asking too much x
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In that case if I were you I'd just bump the 1st A by 10 min for a few days and see what happens. That way, she shouldn't OT short nap and you may also be able to slowly push the day forward.
It's true, I am feeling a tad jealous...but in a good way ;). And congrats on the 1st steps today too!! :D
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Logansmommy2, so glad that 15minutes worked for you! We are all so scared of OT sometimes we just daren't make that little push! FX she continues to nap well for you!
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Well today we got a 1 hour nap :( She was for sure tired when I put her down but I think the train coming through just came by as she was resettling. Boo train!!
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What is it with grandparents or is it just me?? They were kind enough to mind R for 2 days whilst I did some work on our house in preparation for moving but decided to just do whatever they want with his nap and ignore our routine! Yesterday he slept a total of 20 mins am and 40 mins pm and then today after WU at 6am they finally got him to sleep at 1.30 ad he kept crying, is it any wonder the poor boy must be OT but no it's just me being too controlling and I need to go with the flow more he's been so happy and has eaten all His meals really well - apparently!!
Sorry for the rant its just so annoying, you'd think they knew my child better than me!
Rant over >:(
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I'm looking for some guidance to help get my DD fully rested before a major upheaval (24hr plane travel and -8hr time difference) in about two weeks :(
DD is 13 months and we started the 2-1 transition about two weeks ago. She was doing a 15 min capped nap in the am and then needing 3hrs+ A time to get a decent second nap. Day was getting too long so we decided to take the plunge.
We are having issues with EW and had a NW for the first time last night. I think she may be teething too. I know she is OT. Because I am never totally sure when she has woken for the day I was doing set nap at 1130 which gave me naps varying from 00:45 to 02:07. On one day she went down at noon and napped for 02:53! So I thought maybe 1200 was the way forward. Unfortunately that great nap was a one off and has not been repeated (most naps are 01:20/01:30). I have done the 15 min am catnap a couple of times recently (Tues, Fri) because she was tired. My issue with this though is that bedtime gets pushed back and she actually loses sleep.
I understand that I should be trying to keep to a 13 hour day if she naps well and 12.5 if she does not, but this is just not possible when she wakes at 0530! Our other prob is that she is not used to a long A before bedtime - 4 hours max. I thought this might have been part of our problem (although she wasn't fighting bedtime) so started trying to push this out. Think that was a mistake as too much all at once.
Yesterday
0530 awake
0700 get up/BF
0840 breakfast
0937-0952 nap in car
1210 lunch
1240 BF
1324-1515 asleep (in bed 1300)
1700 dinner
1830 bath
1845 BF
1923 asleep (in bed 1910)
2230 BF
2300 in bed
0320-0420 NW
Today
0610 awake (woke earlier but went back to sleep)
0700 get up/BF
0745 breakfast
1045 lunch
1100 BF
1145-1320 asleep (in bed 1130)
1345 snack
1630 dinner
1705 bath
1720 BF
1755 asleep (in bed 1742)
Where to from here??
[sorry this is so long]
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Been on here so many times! Haha! Kept thinking she was ready but kept going back to 1 nap plus CN just to get through the day.
Now DD is 20months! Still so hard to keep her up til 11:30.
It's been 4 days of set 11:30 naps. Best nap was 1.5 hrs. I resettled her after one hour. Other naps have been as short as 40 to 1hr 15. How long does it take for them to extend?
Making it it BT is rough. I feel so bad.
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Believe it or not but my best friend's son was still taking 2 naps at 2.5 and slept 12 hrs at night! Some LOs just transition later I guess!
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Hi all
Looking to get some advice.
Our lohas just turned one and for last 2 months we've been stuck in the 2-1 transition.
When ds started refusing pm nap repeatedly we tried long am and short pm but didnt work. We then tried capped am and long pm which seemed to be better. We then got ew so was advised to cap morn nap to 30mins which we did. Thats when it all went wrong. We had grumpy boy between naps and ew so we bit the bullet and changed to one nap. Before he started the transition he was able to stay awake until 11am so i set nap at 11.15 which has worked a treat. He has a good 3hr nap and can manage until 7pm bt. Our days are really good. He goes to bed fine but has been ew and not going back to sleep. It started at 5.30 and has got earlier and earlier. Yesterday he was awake at 3.30 am and this morning it was 2.30. He doesnt cry. He just lays chatting and wriggling around until 6/6.30. He shows no signs of ot and only gets sleepy about 11am ish even with ew. We've managed to cancel out teething, being to cold and hunger. Was told that if he was ot he would be waking before midnight.
Am really at my wits end. When he wakes i cant get back to sleep either so am very tired mummy and still having to go to work.
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pinkladyangel, if I were you I would push that nap onward past noon and cap it at 2-2.5 hours. You don't want to get stuck an 11 am nap as this is what is probably encouraging the EWU. I wish my DD would nap for 3 hours!
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Thanks for replying.
My aim was to push nap forward but the ew were making it difficult. Yesterday i bit the bullet and just did it by 15 mins so he was asleep by 12. We got a 2 hr nap and did 7.15 bt. The only thing is todays nap was only 1hr 40. He woke up happy but do i need to do early bt or stick to set bt which is 7/7.15?
Forgot to say he woke at 5 this morning but eent back off at 6 then woke at 6.50.
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If it was me I'd be quite pleased with a 1 hr 40 min nap and I'd stick with regular BT but that's only because my DS is a terrible napper. Honestly, 1 hr 40 min is not a horrible nap, although I'm sure it seems like it since he's been doing such huge naps for you. Just my 2 cents though!
Also, hugs to you about the lost sleep. I'm also very poor at going back to sleep when my DS wakes up at night and it just wears on you. I hope the NWs sort out for you soon.
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Just joining this board now... O is 13.5 months old and I've been slowly transitioning him to 1 nap a day. I've been capping his AM nap at 30 mins, and for the past two days since he's slept til 7am, I jumped in and started 1 nap a day. A few problems:
1) He wakes up just after an hour, and I've nursed him after this wake up to get him to sleep another 45ish minutes
2) He has only been getting 2 hours or just under for naps, which makes him super tired and he's in bed by 6:15 both nights - and with the time change, this will make things even worse.
Our EASY looks like this (past 2 days anyways)
7am wake up (nursed him around 5am and 6am - need to work on moving those to wake up but I'm just too tired to fight this right now!)
8am breakfast
11am lunch
12-2pm nap
2pm milk and snack
5pm dinner
6:15 bed time
How do I go about this with the time change approaching? He's already going to bed 45 minutes earlier than normal because of the lost day time sleep :(
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How you going MB? What's your Los first A ATM
We we're do ing so we'll on 1 nap but the last week has been rubbish! We're getting lots of mid nap waking, shorter naps and problems settling. SA and teeth aren't helping
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Sara - sorry to hear LO isn't napping as well. We are all over the map right now with naps. Because of the time change, I ended up just going back to two naps a day, each one is usually just over an hour, but sometimes he wakes up after 30-45 minutes for his morning one. Anyways, today we were out and he had a 40 minute nap in the car from 9:30-10:10 (7am wake up). Then I put him down at 12:30, he slept til 2, I then nursed him and he went back down for another hour!
So I really don't know what to do. There are days where his am nap is short just because we are out or at someone else's house, and but many times his pm nap will be broken if it's long.
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Today I kind of did what you did today with his arvo nap (but ethos was for ts one nap) I pd at 11 and he woke at 12.25 ::) and I got him back to sleep with a touch of APOP and he slept till 2 :o
BT was then a battle though and I can't work out if it's SA or he was UT .. I tried from 7 and he didn't settle till 7.30 and I had to shh a little and put my hand on his back. Have you had any SA?
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I haven't had any SA. He slept fine when I put him down at 7 last night, but then woke up at 6am and was exhausted this morning.
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Do you think teeth are making him tired? Or has he just started walking? We had sttn (phew) up at 7.10 so I was going to go for 4.5-4hrs45 A and hope for 1.5+ nap!
When you do. 1 nap what is your A to BT?
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Well, today he slept for 15 minutes in the car at 11:30. Normally after a quick cat nap he's good to go for a little while but he was really unhappy. So I put him straight to bed, he woke up every half hour and by 1pm he was up. I put him down at 6 this evening and he woke up at 6:45 just screaming. I gave him advil and nursed him again (he hardly nursed before bed time as he was so tired). We'll see what tonight brings!
I'm thinking it's teeth. When I do one nap he's usually up by 2 and in bed by 6:30, so 4.5 hours
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Ugh sounds like teeth ::) hug so n there ugh day.
So when you do 1 nap howling is he first A? We were doing something like this
WU 6.30
A 4.5
Nap 11 for 1.5-3 hrs
A 5
BT 6-7 depending on nap
But he's fighting me like mad at BT. Not sure if its developmental (sa) or he needs an increase somewhere. He did do 5 nap 5 but seemed to get OT and I pulled it back which stopped the mid nap wakings. But now he's just not tired :-\
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It's been weeks since I've done one nap, but I think then he was doing 5 hours A
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So did you just drop back to 2 because OT hit?
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Mostly because I was tired of him being so tired. And when he's tired he doesn't eat. And it was so hard to keep him up, anytime we went anywhere, stroller or car, he'd fall asleep. And right now I'm getting about an hour break in the morning where I'm able to have some 1:1 time with my daughter, and then in the afternoon he'll usually do 45 minutes, wake, nurse, and then go for another 45. Sometimes he doesn't wake but just goes 1-1.25 hours in the afternoon. I figure with the holidays coming up, it may be easier to just keep him on 2 naps a day that way I know that if we go anywhere in the pm, at least he's had some sleep in the am.
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That sounds great that he takes two decent naps. I assume nights are good too? Our nights are terrible when T is UT so I struggle to find a balance for him. Z was so much easier to read!
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Nights arent great but they never have been :(
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Hi just poping in to say hi. My dd turn one today!!! Has been on one nap for 2weeks STTN. But my question is how do I lengthen the nap. She started of with 2 hr n now is 1.5 hr sometimes worse 1 hr.
Wu 0550-0620 ( happily lie in bed till 0645 until I pick her up)
Nap started with 11 now pushed to 1130. 1130-1300/1320
Bedtime 1830/1840
STTN (11.15-11.5 hr)
Tried early bedtime but she just lie in bed sucking her cloth not sleeping.
She is teething now n just learnt how to walk pushing with the walker.
So not sure what to do to lengthen nap. Any ideas?
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She may be self regulating as 13 hrs is pretty avge in 24 for a LSN kid on 1 nap.
I would hold for now and see how things go..given she is STTN and napping solidly most the time I don't think she would be too OT.
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Hello! Has anyone on here been through / going through 2-1 with a very young LO? We've been capping naps for a while but we're getting so many EWs that I'm seriously contemplating pushing on with one nap but most of my reluctance is that J is so young to do it. The only time 2 naps has worked for us lately is when he's been ill - then he's done 2 naps and a 13 hour night. Otherwise we only get 10 hour nights on 2 nap days and after 2x2 nap days, bedtime resistance sets in and we end up with 14 hour days and him fighting every nap. The only thing that gets us back on track is a one nap day. After a couple of those he's tired enough that he'll do 2 naps again.
Anyway, if he was older I'd be pushing the one nap days a bit more I think, mainly cos I can't find the magic time to get a decent nap out of him on one nap days. Ideally I'd do a set nap at 12 and an EBT and see if his nap lengthened at all but all this flipping between one and two nap days is meaning I'm getting different length naps on the same A time all the time.
Anyway, has anyone done this at such a young age? I would love to hear from those that have!
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Hey lovely. Both my boys we're on 1 nap at least most days by 10 months. If the nap was a bust or day too long I did a pm CN ;)
What does his EaS look like ATM?
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Glad we're not the only ones! It's really clouding my judgement cos I keep thinking he must be chronically OT rather than ready for one nap at his age! But then his sleeping behaviour suggests UT most of the time. I think I'm pretty good at spotting it when he is OT as well.
Two nap days look like this:
WU: 5.30
A: Usually about 4 hours. Could probably pd earlier if he's tired but after 1-2 x 2 nap days he starts fighting his morning nap.
S: Set at 9.30 for 30 minutes.
A. 3hrs 30
S: 1.30 - 2.45/50 usually.
A: 4hrs 10/15ish
S: Bedtime at 7 but if he's UT he'll often fight it til 7.30.
He then does a 10 - 10.5 hour night. Normally nearer 10 if he's fought bedtime or naps during the day.
One nap days are just random. I can't for the life of me get a good nap out of him. I've tried everything from 4 to 6 hours A time before his nap. He usually needs a resettle. If his A time on a one nap day is around 5 hours or less I have to resettle at around 40 minutes, he fights it and then just does another 35 minutes or so. If he does nearer 6 hours he resettles more easily or sleeps 1hr 20, but is grumpy in the afternoon. He never does more than 1.5 hours total though. He does do an 11 - 11.5 hour night if we do EBT. Still gives us a 5.30am-ish wake up though!
At the moment I do one nap if he fights his morning nap - we often end up with about half and half one and two nap days. Eventually I'd like to set a nap at 11.30 / 12 or something and do EBT til he gets used to it all but am clinging onto two naps for now! I'm sick of the early starts though :(
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Mmm that am nap is likely the problem I think.
Do you cap it at 30 or does he only do 30? I your capping I would push it to 4hrs15 and don't cap. Then resettle if you can (if he pulls a nap less than 1 hr 20) if you can get a good one then shoot for EBT.
When you do a 1 nap day how long is he sleeping and when do you usually offer it A wise?
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Thanks Sara. If I leave him for that morning nap he usually sleeps 35 minutes, which is usually UT for him. Or he handles OT very well! In the past, an A time push has gotten us past 35 minute naps though. I'm starting to think I need to make proper efforts at finding the A which will give a decent nap, whether that gives us long AM, short PM, or one nap day, whatever. I'm certainly up for trying 4hrs 15. In the past it's given us an UT nap but with him swapping 2 and 1 nap days and trying different A times I haven't done anything very consistently.
If he does one nap I generally do A times somewhere between 4hrs 45 and 6 hours once when I just watched for cues. Today we did 5hrs 25 and he cried out once at 34/35 minutes, then woke properly at 1hr 10. I couldn't resettle him, though my daughter did interrupt us half way through so not necessarily indicative of anything. He was very happy and chilled afterwards though, put up with guests arriving, playing by himself and loud play from my daughter which wouldn't go down well if he was tired. Tomorrow if he refuses his morning nap I'll try the same A time I think and see what happens. Typically he increases his nap and night sleep on his second one nap day unless we miss EBT and he gets OT.
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That nap after 5hrs25 sounds OT. I'd certainly give 1 nap a crack though if you can, and resettle (if it's short) if he will let you. Maybe base it on WU, ie if WU is 7.30 try a nap 4.5 hrs later 12-2 and EBT 6.30-7pm. Then if your next WU is 6 go for a 2 nap day (10-10.30) and then (1-2.30) BT 6.30/7?
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Thanks. Basing it on wake up was the plan, but cos he always does a short night after a 2 nap day, we never seem to get close to a 6am wakeup even. Past 6.30 is unheard of! So we end up in a 2 nap / EW vicious circle until either he starts refusing his morning nap or by fluke or late night he sleeps close to 6 and then I do a one nap day and EBT. It's not helping me find an A time for one nap day which works though :(
That said, he's been ill over Christmas so I've reduced his A times right down and we had a few rotten nights but yesterday he seemed much less tired again. He did this yesterday and last night slept for almost 11.5 hours! :)
WU: 6.20 (but 1hr nw at 3)
A: 3hrs 20
S: 1hr, 9.40 - 10.40 (uncapped. Wouldn't resettle)
A: 3hrs 35 (but pd at 3hrs 20ish)
S: 30 minutes, 2.15 - 2.45 (uncapped, but I'm positive was UT cos he wouldn't resettle, just lay there babbling and was happier after this nap than he has been in days! I know 30 minutes is usually OT but I'm sure it was UT in this case. Plus I'd reduced A times yesterday by 15 minutes on the previous day and he'd slept less as a result)
A: 4 hrs 15. Would have pd earlier but he was so chilled and happy and no tired signs til close to normal bedtime I thought he could handle a longer A ok.
S: 7 - 6.20 :)
So I think I'm going to try and slowly increase that first A while he's still getting over this cold (rather than jump up A times for a one nap day) so I have a better handle on that first A time and stop capping it for now. He rarely sleeps longer than 1hr 20 anyway! Then I'll have to have a cut off in the afternoon for a cn cos any sleep past 3 seems to affect his nights. In fact even a big nap ending at 3 was causing EWs before.
What do you think?
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Don't want to curse anything but the day after my previous post I tried putting him down after 3hrs 45. He fought it so after a while I got him up, gave a quick lunch, nappy change, bottle and pd again at around 4hrs 45 and he went down without a fuss and slept over 2 hours! That's the longest nap we've had in weeks! Yesterday I tried 4hrs 40 and he needed resettling at 50 minutes but he went on to sleep 1hr 45 in total before I had to wake him to go out. We've been getting 11.5 hour nights :) Today he seems more tired but I've pushed him to 4hrs 45 again as he didn't seem especially tired by the time of his morning nap if we were going to do 2 naps. We'll see how he does. Today may have been too much but we'll see.
Anyway, i *may* have hit upon something A time wise... Possibly not for every day but maybe he needs 2 x1 nap days then 1x 2 nap days as a pattern?
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So that didn't last either. Can I just lay my head down here and cry?! :'(
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It's okie I know it's hard. * hug*
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Hi Ladies,
I'd like to join in... My DD is 13 months. Bumpy last few months of early wakes, night wakes, and hard to get down. Mostly related to me missing cues due to stress, sickness, and vacation. So routine is as follows
645 wake/nurse
10 nap cut off at 1 hour
230 nap cut off at 1 hour/nurse
730nurse/ 8 asleep
She woke last night though so I will be giving her an extra 1/2 hour on the second nap if she wants it.
Not sure when to start cutting the first nap back to 45minutes. I was thinking of waiting until more sttn but it doesn't seem to be happening. I got a few days last week of sttn and 2 days in a row this week then gas/temp last night threw her off. ugh :(
I look forward to reading about all of yours and glad to have a place to talk about it. Wishing good luck all around! hugs
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So my LO has another tooth showing and I think that is what is effecting her sleep this week. My mother in law could not get her down for her first nap today. So totally unplanned first day of only one nap. 130-330pm :-\ ???
I'm not sure what I am in for tonight. She fell asleep at 745pm so that was good. as for the rest of the night we shall see....
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Woke last night 1130-1230 not too bad. Had morning nap just fine today 1 hour. Then second nap woke after 40 minutes screaming. Not sure if she was dreaming of teething or both. My husband tends to talk in his sleep and I caught lo talking a couple times too. ugh So still not sure when to reduce first nap to 45 minutes. I will see how tonight goes.
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Hi ladies! Id like to jump on board! I'm in the middle of this crazy time and i would love to give you an idea of my day but sat here thinking about it and its all gone to complete pot!!
DD has just turned 12 months, she has always been on the high end A times, sleeps independently for naps,BF before BT but always put down awake although lately Ive been AP'ing one of her naps, usually afternoon CN. (Shes also just getting over illness)
I'm completely lost on her A times, some days she will very easily stay awake until 12h/12h30 and other days she cant last past 11h. Today she feel asleep in the buggy at 10h30 for 30 mins and i could only get her to nap again at 16h !!!
WU is usually around 06h30
Before i was trying long AM short PM, AP 2nd nap but now both naps are getting harder to get her down for!!
On 1 nap days i try BT at 06h30, sometimes earlier but she seems to always WU earlier in the morning then she gets a really long day or we get into a vicious circle!!
I was thinking of trying short AM long PM but I'm worried about EW and I'm just not sure she will go down! Should i try implementing 1 nap and give a CN if i see her getting OT??
WRT nap lengths, on 1 nap what are the usual OT/UT nap lengths?
Its such an amazing time,watching LO grow into a toddler but its extremely confusing and tiring!!
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Confusing and tiring...so true! I'm finding 2 hour total nap time for the day when she sttn. If she wakes I usually add 20 minutes to 1/2 hour to offset the OT. But I am still on two naps.
Georgena what time did she wake in the morning? Does she always wake on her own for naps?
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Hi. Just jumping on here as S is going through the 2-1 Nap transition and I am interested in hearing what tactics other people are using as I am not too sure where to go from here!
Now S does a short capped half hour morning nap after 3hrs 45 A time and a 1.5hr nap in the afternoon after another 3 hrs 15 A time. Then it is about 3 hrs 15 A time until BT.
Nursery seem to have most babies napping from 12.30 for a couple of hours and am wondering whether we should try to align her naps so that she naps longer as now her afternoon nap is getting interrupted by other babies waking up and playing.
I just don't know what to do next in terms of changing her nap times / lengths and I just can't imagine how it can work without her getting OT!! What have you all done and what have your experiences been?
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Mommybear, usually she wakes between 06h15 and 06h45
Yesterday went like this
NW 21h only settled @ 11h30, (had EBT)
WU 06h30
Nap (in buggy) 10h30 untill 11h10
Nap 16h10 untill 16h45
BT 19h30
STTN
WU 06h45
So all in all not a bad day or night!
Although the first nap was not planned to be at that time but think she was tired from a long NW!
And today she just went down now at 13h15!! She has been swimming and is usually screaming for a nap straight away but not today!!
As for waking her, 90% of the time i have to wake her from her CN and started waking her from her AM nap after 1hr10 mins to keep 2nd nap in tact, if i left her for that 1st nap she would usually wake herself after 1hr30 but thats short for a 1 nap day no???
Im leaving her to sleep now, hopefully she will nap for 2hrs and that would be perfect, if she wakes before 1hr30 i will resettle.
Every day is different at the moment which is why im so lost on A times, and it doesnt vary by half an hour or so, its soooo different each day!! I tried 1 nap days a few weeks back and i just got an OT grump on my hands with EW!! Could it be that just a few weeks could make a difference??
BeeAnn, how old is your LO? Welcome to the club!!
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Hi. My LO is 13 months old.
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Hi all - my lo is nearly 15-months old & sleeps independently but takes a while to settle for naps (often 45 mins/1 hr but can be more).
She's having 2-naps of 1 hr each & I just don't know how to move to 1 nap which would make the day so much easier.
I can shift her am nap say 30 mins later to 10:30 but she still just sleeps 1 hr which obviously isn't enough & we have terrible NW if she misses her pm nap.
Obviously if the am nap is shifted later & later it makes the pm nap so much more difficult - Tracy doesn't say how to deal with this problem & when to drop the pm nap?
Should I start capping the am nap? I thought I should be trying to make the am nap later & longer & then dropping the pm nap but from reading this board this doesn't seem to be the way most people do it?
I can't do EBT because of dd1's regular afterschool sport / dance - any advice greatfully received x
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Which nap is she resisting and on what A times? If it's the pm nap she's struggling with I'd cap the am one, yes. We did 30 minutes in the morning and 1.5 hours in the afternoon with my oldest for a long time. Jack passed through that stage quite quickly and then i started concentrating on getting a long late morning nap and then letting him sleep in the mid-late afternoon only if he needed it. But by the time we did that he could handle one nap ok so it didn't matter so much if he refused a pm nap.
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Thanks I might try that - it just feels a bit cruel waking her up @ 30 mins when she's got herself so snuggly & settled :)
It's generally the pm nap that she resists, but it varies & she can be completely unpredictable, I'm keeping a log to try & find a natural sleep pattern for her at at the mo she's just a random kid!
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I know what you mean! I used to do that nap in the car or buggy quite often - meant I could go out for most of a day. Freedom! Was easier to wake them up that way, too.
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Can I ask what you did after the half hour capped morning nap. We are doing half an hour in the am and then 1.5 hours pm. But don't really know where to go from here!!
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When we couldn't fit in a short am and long pm any more we switched to long am, and AP'd a cat nap on the days we needed 2 naps. We alternated 1 & 2 nap days for a long time, just doing one nap when he refused his am nap. Then we did 2 x 1 nap days and 1 x 2 nap days, then 3 x 1 nap days etc. I mostly followed cues and WU time though. It wasn't scientific ;). If WU time was early, we did 2 naps. If it was later, we did 1 nap. Once my LOs could nap well on 5hrs A time I switched to one nap as the standard. I'm kind of at that point now with Jack (I know he's very young!), so not through it yet. But only cos 2 nap days just mean 14 hr days and 10hr nights and lots of nap / BT refusal. If short am / long pm is working for you I'd stick with it for as long as you can.
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Hi I haven't posted in a while. It's been a rough week. Nw multiple times I think it's been a little over a week since I had two sttn in a row. Teething is the main problem. I tried motrin the last two nights. She woke at 5 am one night and last night she woke at 1240am for over an hour. I'm having a hard time focusing from the lack of sleep. I'm probably just missing something. One tooth broke but a second is still just a bump. I had cut her first nap to 45 minutes and she is sleeping her second nap just fine 1-1/2 hours usually. But her nights are a mess. I also went down from 4 to 3 nursings. So maybe its the food. I am trying cow's milk but she doesn't seem to like it in the sippy. I will try bottle today. Maybe I'm just making to many changes at once. I have my niece again next week for 3 days a week. I was trying to make some adjustments before reintroducing her cousin into the routine. ugh I don't know. ???
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Hello everyone. I'm new here and thought maybe this is a good place for some support. I feel like we are just goung back and fourth on this 2-1 nap change. Just when I think we've got it down, we dont. I have twin boys. They are 13 months old. Lately all I can get is 1 nap. It's usually been about 2-2.5 hours. And its from about 10:30-12:30. Bedtime is at 7 and they won't take a 2nd nap. I know I could just put them down to bed early, but then they won't get to see their dad when he gets off work. That is important to us. Maybe putting them to bed earlier will solve my probs.....I dont know. All I know is that I would love to know what we are doing with these naps....1 or 2. LOL
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Hi 4lamps,
How's the night sleep going?
My update is this...my lo is now 14 months, the teething was a huge issue. Two teeth one after another came in. I also adjusted her milk intake and now she seems to be doing better. I have my niece three days a week again. So a 14month and about to be 3yr old. Naps are for the most part going well. 45 minute first nap, 1hr 15min second nap. Although today she woke 1/2hr in... I think I was making too much noise with 3 yr old. She sttn two days this week and last night only woke for 1/2 hour at 3am. I'm not sure when I should cut back to 1/2 hour first nap but I'm going to hold off for now. I want to get the night sleep a little more regular.
Oh she is walking now too. Wish us luck tonight. : )
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Hi 4lamps, What time does your LO's wake in the morning before their 10:30 nap?
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Hello its been a while since i posted but its been an awful month of 2-1 transition:( Alex is 16mo and is going back and forth between 2 nap days and 1 nap days. Our problem here is that she likes to take a long am nap going down around 10:30/11 for about 90min, but then wont take a 2nd nap. So by the third day of this she is so OT that she wakes up screaming in the night. BT is pretty early here usually between 6-630. i have tried pushing am nap till later but then she wakes up OT between 30-45min. I know 45min is supposed to be UT but from what i have noticed over the year is that 45min is her OT. Any advise is welcome.
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I had to do a short am/long pm nap for both mine as they would never go down in the pm after anything like a decent am nap. I would think if she can get to 11/11.30am and manage a decent nap she 'should' be able to cope with one nap but if not then I would shorten the am nap to more like 30 mins and see how that works for a pm nap x
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Hello! I'm having a rough time figuring out what to do with my DS (13.5 months) for naps, so I thought I'd join you guys here.
DS was doing great with two naps, but around 11 months we started having trouble and he started refusing his morning nap. (Thankfully, his night sleep is still good.) About a month ago, I asked for help on the boards and we decided that he was transitioning to one nap. Since then, I've had some great days and some terrible ones. Sometimes he'll take two naps, but generally he doesn't. On a good day, it might be something like this:
WU 6:30
S 12:30 - 3 (put him down, walk away, he fusses for a few min. and goes to sleep)
S 8:30
On a bad day, it might be something like this:
WU 7
S 4:15-5 (wake up from nap crying, then try to sleep when nursed)
S 7
WU 9:15 pm but easily soothed back to sleep
The latter was how today went. The strange thing is that LO often seems tired early in the day. When we go out before his 1st nap, he tends to fall asleep in the car (regardless of what time it is - he's done it as early as 10 am).
Today, I started offering naps around 10 am (he was rubbing his eyes and seemed tired). Offered again after lunch at around 12:15, 1:30, 2:30, 3:15. When I even brought him into his darkened room he started wailing. To finally get him to sleep, I resorted to holding him until he stopped crying and then putting him down, and he fell asleep almost instantly. Poor kid seemed exhausted - I don't think that method would have gotten him to sleep earlier, he was just so tired by 4:15 that he zonked out as soon as he stopped crying. I seem to have a really hard time identifying when LO wants to sleep - he's basically stopped giving reliable sleep cues.
I haven't been recording things lately. I'm going to start logging his sleep like crazy again and posting here. Hopefully I can get him back on track!
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Hi beth33,
Did you check his mouth? I've been having a heck of a time with sleep the last 3 1/2 months. On and off its been the teeth. My lo is 14 months now. Oh those back teeth... :( She also has gas too at the moment. My flow got messed up after trying to use a hand pump for a day/night out without her. And then the activity of walking doesn't always help. I'm finding sometimes she needs longer wind downs.
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Hi mommybear,
Thanks for your thoughts. You know, it *could* be teeth, but I don't see/feel anything. That doesn't mean there's nothing going on, as LO really hates opening his mouth for you, so you don't get much time to look or feel around, especially in the back.
He's not really walkling yet, though he's started to cruise a little tiny bit in his crib and pnp.
Pumping is really tough, especially at this point, huh? I feel like I only get half the amount that I used to. (The good(?) news is LO is VERY resistant to taking any kind of milk from a straw cup, so he's still generally on BM "from the tap," so I don't really have any reason to pump.) I hope that things normalize for you soon!
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Thanks, It's been a few weeks and we seem to be doing better. I stopped pumping except for one day a week for work. So my flow seems back to normal. I've made some other changes too and came up with a plan. So far so good. Keeping my fingers crossed. I think I held on to the 45 minute first nap too long and too much night sleep. It's been so long and so many issues that I was confused where she should be for sleep. Then I realized she has always been less. The most she has ever slept at night was 11 hours and two 1 1/2 hour naps during the day. So we are trying 4 days of adjusting her schedule by small increments.
Starting with the following for 4 days
640 wake
1015-1045 nap
230-4nap
8 bed
Today started with
630 wake
1030-11 nap
230-345 nap
8 bed
So far we got a sttn with EW the day before last
and last night sttn woke at 630.
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Hello all! I am new here.
We have nap/bedtime struggle ups and downs for a month now. My LO just turned one last week. He used to sleep 1.5 hours each for both naps. There were one week that he slept for 2~2.5 hours during the morning nap and somethings skipped the afternoon nap. This didn't repeat since then. Last week he was very difficult during the morning nap, and seems to back to a little bit more normal this week. Afternoon nap is still a struggle.
May anyone has any suggestion on if I should start long AM/short PM CN or vice versa?
Yesterday
WU 5:30
S 10:00-11:25 (Woke once at 10:40, smoothed back to sleep)
S 4:30-5:15 (Naptime routine started at 3:30)
S 8:00
WU 11:25 (Back to sleep at 11:40)
Today
WU 5:35
S 9:40-10:20 (I went in to smooth, back to sleep in 5 minutes, but woke again at 10:40)
S 4:00-4:35 (Naptime routine started at 3:00)
S 8:00
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You need to either cap the morning nap at 45 mins (maybe less) so that he is more tired for a pm nap. OR pushing the am nap later and then offering a pm CN (30-40 mins) and shorter A to BT
Which would you prefer? Have you seen the stickys on the 2-1?
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Yes, I read that sticky and makes me wonder if I should do a short morning/long pm nap. He has always been longer am nap and shorter or equal pm nap, so I have never try the vice visa. After last week, I just feel silly to spend an hour to put him down and wake him after 30 minutes ;p I will try the 45 min morning nap tomorrow. Wish me good luck!
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I'm desperate for some help please. I knew the transition is going to be a tough one but I was still not prepared.
My 17 month old son can have a good A time until 11:30 but then will only sleep for 45 min before waking up hysterical. He clearly wants to continue sleeping but nothing can calm him down at that point. This only happens on 1 nap days and he's never been like this before. I tried to revert to 2 naps and he'll sleep for an hour in the morning and then refuse the afternoon nap so his A time lasts from 11:30 until bed which is way too long or he ends up having a late catnap at 4:30. This constant changing from day to day is also causing NW and EW. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!
I can't even post a routine since it's been all over the place. He now wakes up around 6 (used to be 7 :( ) and although I think of bedtime as 7, I've been putting him down a little earlier since he's not sleeping well during the day...
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Hi RitaBobcat,
I don't really have any advice but just wanted to offer my support I posted this in 'Sleeping for Toddlers'
NW with almost 1year old
It sounds similar to what you're going through (although our LO isn't one for a few days) and we're struggling a bit with the NW and PM nap refusal.
Sorry I couldn't be more help. Tonight was awesome.....ly hideous. He had no PM Nap so I put him down at 6pm instead of 7pm and he went down fine but he woke at 2:30am and it took us 1.5hr to settle him.
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Thanks for your support HPM1. Since I posted, he's been all over the place. Cat naps, short AM/long PM, long AM/short PM, no PM nap, etc. I don't know what the pattern is now and how to correct it. I'm kind of hoping part of it is an early 18 month regression (which obviously isn't your problem yet) and it'll correct itself eventually.
But if anyone has any advice, I'd love to hear it :)
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Need to join this thread for some support too...
RitaBobcat- my son is a bit younger than yours (13.5mo) but we're in a similar situation...waking early from his nap,totally miserable with it & then getting OT later. On those days I APOP a cn (15-30mjns depending on length of 1st nap) in buggy which helps him get to BT but we're now getting very EW (5am) which I think is either due to sleeping late afternoon; OT from having 1hr daytime sleep or less (he needs 1.5-2hrs in day) or due to starting 1st nap too early, which we sometimes have to do to compensate for EW.
I thought we were doing well with the 2-1 but I now feel like I've messed up & fallen at the last hurdle. Until a couple of weeks ago DS's day looked like this:
Wu: around 6am (this is fine as DH & I both have to get up then for work)
Nap: 11am for 1.5-2hrs
4pm- walk in buggy- if he slept cn capped at 15min
BT: 7pm if had 2naps; 6.30 if only 1.
I think it went wrong when DS stopped falling asleep for the 4pm cn. At first he would sleep 11.15-12 hrs on 1 nap days but then he started only sleeping 11hrs & waking at 5.30... I started trying to push his bedtime back to 7 but at same time my mum & his nursery (who he's with 2 days each now I'm back at work) started putting him down for his nap at 10.30. I think this has caused OT to build up to point we're getting short naps & EW. So far I've tried:
trying to persuade him to go back to sleep at 5- no luck at all
setting bedtime at 7- he just wakes up earlier & earlier
AP-ing a 9.30 morning cn - he just totally refuses pm nap then only sleeps for 30-40 mins
AP-ing a late afternoon cn- we just get EW
Setting nap at 11am- very short OT nap (35mins) & waking screaming
The last 3 days he's had less than an hr daytime sleep & only 10hrs at night & he & DH & I are exhausted. I think he is teething too as he's dribbling lots although I can't see any teeth. I think there's also a WW approaching too.
Today I'm trying a nap after 5hrs A time (started at 10.10) having given him Calpol & really hoping he has a long one & can start catching up on some much needed sleep. If so we'll then start pushing it later again.
Sorry for long post- just needed to offload!
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Complete disaster of a day:
Wu 5.10am
S: 10.10-11.10 -wouldn't re-settle
Only ate half of lunch before started crying, screaming inconsolably from tiredness by 12.30
S: 12.45-13.15 in buggy (taken out to try to calm him down & he just fell asleep)
Starting to fall asleep again at 4pm, I decided to try to keep him awake and do EBT to try to combat EW. Big mistake. Huge.
Screaming with tiredness by 4.30, wouldn't eat his meal
In bed at 5pm
Fully expecting him wide awake & hungry in about an hour then refusing sleep until late evening. Either that or awake and ready for the day at 4am tomorrow :-(
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Update on my end. We finally switched our almost 16 months old to 1 nap over the weekend. Result is encouraging!
He refused to nap on Sat morning, so I made up my mind and let him stay awake til noon. Napped over 2 hours, then stay up til bedtime no problem. Unfortunately he was awake on and off from 3:30-7am. We were both dying on Sunday and he only napped 1.5 hours that afternoon, so we had put him to bed around 7:30 and the AMAZING, LEGENDARY 11-12 hours night sleep HAPPENED! He slept til 7:15am next day! Woohoo!
Saturday
Woke at 6:40 am, napped at 12:15, woke at 2:30, bedtime asleep around 8pm (Multiple wakings from 3:30-7am)
Sunday
woke at 7:00 am, napped at 12:00, woke at 1:30, bedtime asleep at 7:30
Monday
woke at 7:15 am, napped at 12:35, woke once around 1 hour mark, then rocked back to sleep til 3pm (had to wake him), bedtime asleep before 8pm (Spent 30 min to settle to sleep)
Tuesday
woke at 6:30am, napped at 12:10, sleep til 2:30 (had to wake him again), will try to bedtime at 7:30pm
Now I have a question, should I wake him from nap if he slept pass 3pm? It seems to be more difficult for him to settle for bedtime if he slept pass a certain time.
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Hey. I'm new to posting in here. I see a lot of similar issues happening to others...make me feel a bit better. My DD is 15 months. Switched to one nap at 11-12 months. Was up to a 5h20 min A time in AM and a 4.5A after nap. She'd sleep 1.5-2 hours. Now all of a sudden since we started her at her dayhome she was only napping 1h15 mins. She was sick but I bumped her A time up...made a difference some days but then others it did not. She's up to a 6h A now and back to 1h05 min naps. So I don't even know how to tackle this? Go back to 5h20 A time (in hopes it's just the sickness and/or transition...push a bit to 5h30 A or stay at the 6h A and hope she transitions? Ugh. This is never ending! :(
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Hi, I'm new to posting to this topic but could use some help since I just started the 2-1 transition with my son.
Today is day 2 of transitioning my nearly 16month DS to one nap. I just can't figure out the timing to get him to take a good nap. Yesterday looked like this.....
woke: 7:45
Nap: 12:30
up at:1:30, I tried rocking him back to sleep and get him to sleep from 2-2:20 but as soon as I put him in his crib he woke.
Bed:7:00, fell asleep right away, no night wakes.
Today...
woke:6:40
nap: 12:30
up: 1:35, stirred around but slept until 1:50. I tried to rock him again and he was not having it, did not want to go back to sleep.
Is it possible that he needs more than 6 hours between the time he wakes up and his one nap of the day? It boggles me because it seems like a long time between right off the bat. His EASY prior to switching looked like this....
woke up:6:30/7
nap:10:30 for 30-40 min (I would wake him after no more than 40 min, sometimes he would fight the am nap and I would end up rocking him to sleep).
nap: 3:30-4:30or 5pm
Bed: 7:30/8pm
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Hi there
The last few days my nearly 13mo little girl has been only having short morning and afternoon sleeps (yesterday wouldn't go down for her afternoon nap at all).
Her BT and WU are the same... but this is her EASY:
6/6.30 WU and milk drink
7.30/8 am breakfast
9.30 am morning snack
10 am sleep
Used to wake at 11.30 but now it is 11 am!
12 pm lunch
2.30 pm snack
3 pm sleep
Last few days has slept for 30 minutes... usually has been an hour or so
5 pm dinner
6.15 pm milk drink, bath, teeth, story
Bed at 6.35/6.40pm
I have read the thread about 2 to 1 sleep transition and I'm not quite sure where this fits in or if I am misreading the signs. She definitely has tired signs, yawning, eyes rubbing etc before her nap so IS tired, but should I be pushing her morning sleep out? It has always been her morning sleep that has been the longest one since we have been on two naps a day.
Any advice/thoughts/help? I have read all the pages relating to this just want to be sure what to do. :( Thanks in advance.
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Ladymugg, our schedules are almost identical except for our BT has been closer to 7:15/7:30 as my DS has been taking his pm nap a little later around 3:30 and needs at least a 3-3.5 A before bed. Our naps have usually been short 30-50 min until recently when they started being around 1hr10min.
From some others' chatter here going through 2-1, you'll probably want to start moving your am nap by 10-15 min every 3 days or so. Some try 30 min every 3 days... I guess it depends on your baby. My DS is 12m7d, and we started this transition about 2 months ago, then returned to 2 naps this past week. Now he's resisting the pm nap quite insistently again. I'm starting a thread here about the 2-1 for a 12 mo... feel free to jump in as like I said, our schedules are almost identical.
As for us, I'm inclined to jump by 30 min every few days. I kept thinking lately though that I might need to make his am shorter and bring up pm. I'm just not sure, either, as I've also read the 2-1 help threads. DS has been OT for so long that it's muddled things a bit. Only recently, like last 2 nights, has he slept decently at night.
Sorry this isn't as helpful...
Hope to see you on the thread. :)
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Hi there
I meant to come up and update my post days ago (woops) and also I thought I set up notify on this thread, looks like that didn't work!
Anyway I had concluded that we were getting early WU of around 5.30 am (I never get her up before 6am, unless she is very upset) as that had been going on (off and on) for a few days. So Monday I started pushing that nap out to 10.15 and today (Thursday) am now up to 10.30. Will continue on until we get a 12.30/1pm lunch as her sleeps have increased to well over 2 hours doing this.
Amazing!
Anyway question - yesterday I got a 2.5hr sleep in the morning and then she was back in bed 3.15 pm ish until 4.45. Considered waking her, maybe I should have as she still was waking at 5.30 am this morning. 4 hours total sleep seems like a lot, although she went to bed last night with no problems and slept 11 hours still.
I'm just about to put her down for her afternoon sleep now, should I keep that to a 45 minute cat nap since this mornings nap was also 2+ hours?
Thanks
Nic
PS: Ginger your info was helpful - thanks - I guess I had already drawn my own conclusion in the interim... I guess great minds think alike eh? ;)
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Also should I keep BT at 6.40pm, she seems to be tired and wants it then, no problems going to sleep either. (?)
Maybe if I shorten that afternoon nap that might help that 5.30 am waking? Ideally looking for 6-6.30am once again.
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I agree, I bet the long daytime sleep is shortening her nighttime sleep. So yes, I would cap her pm nap but it's all trial and error, isn't it? Hope it works for you!!
About BT, same concept... since she's sleeping more in the day, her total wake time has decreased leading to UT? That's what I"m thinking so maybe concurrently push BT to 6:55ish or so and also cap pm nap? But that could be too much. Sorry, I'm new to all this so I"m not the most reliable source tbh! :P
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Thanks! I was going to cap that nap but she woke up anyway l but I'll wake her in future if it keep going.
Still 5.35am wake up today :(
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5:10 here, but in/out since 4:00. :-\
Ds is ill though and teething, so it could've been discomfort.
We're back to 2 naps with only 3.3 A times. Again, probably due to illness and broken/unsettled nights, although he hasn't needed me.
We're also back to 6:30 BT, as he's waking early and therefore taking naps earlier. He doesn't seem to tack on sleep with a EBT. Darn! Haha.
Are you still at the 10:30 nap even with an EW?
Oh and remember it takes a couple of days to adjust. So maybe tomorrow or day after she'll be up
Later.
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Yay and she was :D
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Don't know where else to post but here I guess.
Ugh...I've Been up since 3:45. DS up since 4:45 or earlier and will not settle. Only a 10ish hr night.
I don't know how we're going to make it to the 10:30 nap.
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Ouch :( Keep going it will get better. FX
And go get another coffee ;)
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I know all these transition trial and errors take time, but another 4:30am WU this morning was brutal. :-[
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What time of the day should I be aiming for, for that single nap? I know it "depends on the individual child" but was trying to do some maths and be practical too...
Approx
6.30 am WU
6.30 pm BT
You'd think 12.30 would be the appropriate time but what an annoying time for baby to have her nap (amiright?). I guess I had 1.30 in my head but if she slept 2 hours would a 3.30 pm wake up be detrimental to successful BT?
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Hi lady!
I was told that 12 and 12:30 is ideal for this age. But yes, depends on the baby! I bet your LO can handle whatever ends up being consistent. My thought is that the closer to 7 or 7:30 their WU is, the more a 1 or 1:30 pm nap is ideal. That will however probably push BT to 7:30/8:00.
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Great - thanks ginger. I hope those 4.30a, WUs stop for you soon
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It's almost 3 and I'm up because I accidentally woke DS during a dream med and apparently I have insomnia. :-\
Forgot to mention that I'm shooting for awake times of 6 in morning and 4-5 before bed. So a 6 WU, 12ish nap, etc...
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Ah right... makes sense. I've recovered throughout the day today on the thought of a 12/12.30 pm nap. I just had to get over myself a little bit ;)
Tomorrow starts 3 days of 11.15 am naps... so only 9 days until we are at 12 pm.
When do I drop the afternoon nap - when we get to 12 pm or before then? At the moment she is sleeping til 1pm(ish) so I pushed out afternoon nap to 3.30pm BT (so I guess 3.45 sleep, then 45 min, WU 4.30pm), I wouldn't want it any later than that given 6.30 pm BT.
Maybe dropping it at the 11.30 mark makes sense.
I feel like a doofus asking these questions, but the book gets kinda vague about that bit.
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Hi ladies, would like to join in. I've posed an individual post, got lots of good advice and now will be going down this bumpy road ;) Hope reading your experiences will help a lot!
My DD is 9,5 months. 2 weeks ago she started refusing nap 2, a week ago refused EBT. Our A times are very long.
Sometimes our night is quiet after an hour nap during the day, another night she is up at 1-2am after a good nap. Most nights no OT awakenings after A time 5-6 hrs before bed!
Also 2 weeks ago she stopped falling asleep easily. It looks like our easy going independent sleeper turned into a newborn, but a bit differently. She crawls, stands/walks in her crib for over an hour, sometimes 2 hours before she falls asleep. Most of the times I have to keep putting her down many times before bedtime... Several times had to leave her to cry because lost my patience and just left the room! she was asleep in 2 min. then! Now I am afraid of every nap time or bedtime because it is so frustrating!
She is very LSN and a very light sleeper. :-[
Anyways for now I am trying to figure out the best time for her fixed nap and BT.
Looking forward to your posts!
Thank you
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Hi there, without knowing your circumstances or your previous post, I just wonder a couple of things:
- Do you think teething might be the reason for the disrupted sleep?
- What kind of sleep props or routine do you use for getting her to sleep?
I am not an expert at all on the 2-1 nap transition, but I just wonder (this is me not knowing, so asking a question) - is 9.5 months a little early for the 2-1 transition? I don't know, just it seems that way. I know they say signs of this can start as early as 10 months...
Have you been keeping a bit of a log just to see if there are any patterns?
Anyway to answer a couple of the questions you actually asked (sorry for my nosiness) - what time is she napping now? At around that age my daughter (now 13 mo) was at fixed nap times of around 10 am and 3 pm, this was with a 6am WU and 6.30pm BT.
Form those times I have been working towards the 2-1 transition using the "15 minutes later for 3 days", today we are at 11.30 - and a 4pm catnap if that happens. I think we will stop at 12.30.
The reason I asked earlier about the teething is my LO is a bit of a late teether (she got 2 teeth in 2 days this weekend, making her grand total of 5), and the other week she was a bit all over the show with her naps and then a tooth popped out. I think the shorter naps were definitely because of pain. It passed within a few days. Just wondering is all! (I'm pretty oblivious when it comes to teething though I will admit, I think sometimes it is easy to blame things on teething so then I go the opposite end of the spectrum and almost ignore the signs... oops).
Anyway hope that helps? (It probably doesn't - but hi anyway :) )
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Hi Ladies - just popping in with some support as just went through 2:1.
Couple of questions I found in your previous posts
- I think optimal is not earlier than 12 but many will start being on one nap with having it at 11:30am
- what's the best time for a noon nap depends on you and your child; firstly its a good moment to start setting a BT at specific hour; best schedule for 12noon nap is 7/7; if lo will start to shorten the nap significantly (less than 1:20-1:30), will refuse 12 noon nap or will be waking earlier and earlier it's a good moment to push the nap; but it's worth mentioning that many kiddos will stay with a nap at 12/12:30 until they drop the nap completely and some will need a nap at 1:30/2:00 just after starting on one nap; hear to your LO and choose th best
- I wouldn't push dropping the catnap no matter what time noon nap is but offer it not later than X:X so to preserve bedtime; sometimes LO won't need a catnap after 1:30 noon nap and sometimes they will need it even after 2:00 noon nap. I kept offering a nap around 4/4:30 the latest, usually in a pram or car seat and capped it at 10-15min; it really helped us to keep OT at bay during this transition.
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Hi Martii, thanks for support and a good structured information !
So, if you did a CN at 4:30, what was your A time before BT?
If CN was refused what was your BT then?
We ve just went through a cold, So will see what will happen after that. She had two days with two naps, one in the car. Before that no matter what we did, she wouldn't sleep in the afternoon.
The nights are getting shorter now, But I did not wake her up from her naps due to a cold. Today she had 2h20 min total. Woke up from nap 2 at 17:00. And didn't fall asleep until 20:15. Probably wasn't tired enough.
Ladymugg, no problem for asking, at all!!!
My DD's actual age 42 weeks, so it is almost 10, 5 months.
But I see now that almost all these months I gave her too short of an A time which almost constantly caused her to have short naps. only when I increased A times significantly, she started napping more than an hour. Now it is very often 1hr20. Which is a lot in comparison to almost always 35-45 min naps.
I don't think she is teething very actively. It is on and off it seems like.
Her only prop at BT is me, sitting near her crib. If I leave she is not calming down. At a night feed DH puts her down and leaves and she is fine.
I gUess for this one I will start GW. But how to do it if she stands up constantly before BT...?! It takes up to an hour or more to keep preventing her from 'climbing up'. She has lots of time for that during the day, but it seems she can't stop being active.
Her nights are better now. Only up around 4-5 am.
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Ladymugg, thanks for suggestions! Teething, oh, I really blame everything very often on teething . I think I posted two weeks ago that she was teething, and am waiting for teeth to come out, but nothing ( she has two at the moment). Even was thinking this cold is just a teething development, but we got it too. Also, I was giving her teething meds, which didn't help her naps/nights.
It looked like she was or is in her WW, but also looks like 2/1 transition also.
Anyways, will keep offering nap 2 and see what happens.
:-)
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Before transition we had a schedule of 11:45-13:15 nap (I woke but in nursery he was waking by himself at 1:30h mark). Then catnap at 4:00. Very short second A but as I was pushing this first A very much, he was really ready to go for a second nap at 2:30. Catnap lasted not longer than 30min as I was waking. 4:00pm was quite strict for a catnap as that was the moment I came back home and could do the pick up from the nursery. When he was tired he went staight to sleep and was doing 25-30min till 4:30. When less tired he could have anything like 10min and he was also fine with that. If he fall asleep at 4:20/4:30, I let him sleep 10-15min. BT was set at 7pm always. Never any refusals. But his second nap was always very short. I think I started capping to max 20min when he was not refusing but seemed full of energy at bath:).
Than first nap became shorter, he started waking after 1:15. So I kept second nap at 3:30 and still let 20-30min (it was Xmass so I could plan it somehow without nursery:)! And in January when he was 10.5 we started pushing nap to 11:45/12:00, I stopped capping so his naps started to be some days 1:45-2:00. And I started to offer catnap in a pram. It was a hit and miss as he could do it after 2:00 first nap and refuse it after 1:30 nap but I think it was the element of self regulation for him. So ask walk in a pram 4:00-4:30. If he fall asleep - 10min, if not get him out up in the pram and just act as he is not tired:).HTH
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Mariella - if your issue is inconsistency around sleep I would move to "set" nap times if you haven't already eg: 10.30 and 3 pm or something like that. Then if your baby still isn't sleeping very long I would start tinkering with moving those naps later by 15 minutes every 3 days.
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Thanks, today we had again one nap. She is feeling better and refuses to sleep second time. Our walk in a stroller made her mad, she was crying all the time on the way home when I was sure she will be asleep ;)
Will keep trying. I might try set times naps, but for now need to figure out what A time she is on. Looks like 4h30 min is too little already.;)
Thanks for help!
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That is awesome! I nearly apologised because I hadn't been keeping up on your posts that well for the past few days and there was a lot of info going back and forth! So pleased for you.
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Oh, no problem at all! I have been on this thread only a few days anyways ;) I had other posts on different boards ;)
Thanks
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Hi Mariellamom... Nice to see you here. How is Mariella? Is she feeing better at all? I think all your questions were answered so if there are any updates, would love to hear.
We finally had a 5:00 wu here today. Can't believe I'm excited about at 5am WU. Anything is better than 4!!! I'm hoping as DS stabilizes his sleep, it will become 6:00/6:30 soon and 6:30/7:00 eventually. Can't wait!
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OK that is so good ginger! :) We had a 4.30 am wake up here but I am pretty sure that was teething-related. She eventually went back to sleep 6-7am.
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Martii, I think I missed your reply. Thanks for all the details. Nice to see other options!
Ginger, oh my! That's the worst for me to wake up THAT early. At least 30 min in the morning were so helpful. If not, then the whole day I am trying impossible- to stay patient!
I hope your DS will be better at that soon.
my DD wakes up at times very early ready to play. I can't stand those times and very happy when DH can help someho .
We had a very strange day today with two short naps. Will see what tomorrow brings.
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Ladymugg, did the teeth come out?
I am thinking today could be teething also. She sucks on her finger which doesnt happen often. Also eats poorly.
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Not yet - I think they've just been moving around. Had a rough day. My little one suffers from time to time from involuntary breath holding spells (we think - we finally have our pediatrician appointment on Monday) and had a black out this morning, and then when we were out shopping she fell and hurt herself again. :(
Just wondering when that longer midday sleep usually kicks in. We are at 12 pm now and I think we will stay there, the afternoon nap dropped off by itself, but lately have had naps of 1-1.5hrs (previously was around 2hrs). Would like this 2-2.5 that people are talking of! Do I just need to be more patient?
Thanks so much for all your help!
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Oh my, Ladymugg... I hope the doctor's can determine what's going on and that there's a way to treat it permanently. What a scare that is each time! Is she okay from the fall?? How are you?
WRT midday nap length, of course it depends, but I'm assuming it takes a few weeks for their little bodies to adjust and consolidate sleep. A friend's DD lengthened to 2 hours after almost 5 months, starting the transition around 14mo.
My DS FINALLY lengthened his nap starting last couple of weeks.
So, 4 months after the transition started... refusing naps and BT battles.
2 months after doing late pm CN.
1 month of firm 1 naps, with occasional late CN and 1 week of 2 naps due to illness.
2 weeks of pushing to 12noon nap with 15 min morning CN. Within this period he's had 4 naps longer than 1.30 including today's.
Mind you we've been sleep training simultaneously. It's been difficult but rewarding! My sweet baby (toddler) seems so well rested and in such a better mood overall.
We're starting to get buckets of drool again also, but I don't see redness in the gums which for us is a sure sign. Hmmm...
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Ladymugg....that might be so hard to deal with those breathing issues! I hope God gives you strength to go through this! Hope the doctors will know what the solution is.
Ginger, oh my gosh! Really, 4 months???? I know they go fast, but it is good to know ahead of time- the road is loooong. It is not easy to deal with very often OT baby during this time.
DD is holding on pretty much very well, if she is OT. But not when something unexpected comes up. We had to wash her after an 'diaper leak accident', oh boy she was screaming...:))
It sounds so strange that basically in transition they sleep less, than after it?.... I mean if now one nap can be 1h10 , CN 15-20 min. But later that one sweet long nap is up to 2 hrs!
Or later they probably reduce night sleep..?
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Thanks Mariellamom.
The paediatrician visit went well - she is all normal (12kg and 81cm at 13.5 months); he confirmed she has involuntary breath holding spells, which are basically in a time of stress or pain she will hold her breath, kind of like crying so hard she doesn't breathe. Thankfully she isn't much of a crier and has only had a few of these spells. The best part of this confirmed diagnosis is she will grow out of it in time, and they aren't harming her.
Back to the sleep talk, the midday nap is about 1.5 hrs the last couple of days. I just put her down now, wish me luck for a long one! :D
Ginger - wow that looks like it took a long time :( I guess we transitioned a little more quickly than that so will be interesting to see how long it takes here. We have been on one nap now for about two weeks. That late afternoon CN just doesn't happen so gave up! :D
I'm so pleased your LO is so happy and well rested too. Love it!
I would say I am starting to enjoy the benefits of this one nap per day, including being able to take her to morning play groups and such. Most of these things start at 10 or 10.30 am here and it really wasn't worth it while she was on 2x naps a day. But to be fair I'm not sure should would have enjoyed them 2-3 months ago as she does now. All perfect timing!
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Hi ladies I'm joining in to support/grumble/commiserate. DS is just shy of 12 months, been mainly on one nap for the last month but can't really manage it properly yet. Nap is short and he's OT but can't get two naps to work unless the first one is a teeny CN. Some early mornings, thankfully only some short early NWs. Hanging in there for him to get a bit older!
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Yes, wish they were older to handle the 1 nap! But alas, growing pains for mamas and babes. ;)
Lady, yes, he is much MORE well-rested but I guess still struggling to handle the long A's with 1 nap. But I can see the difference even a month has made in him being able to handle it better. I'm so impatient with his nap getting longer... why can't it have come like 3 months ago when he needed it! Haha.
Hope everyone's having a lovely day! :-*
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Hi Jessmom, welcome!
Ladies, what are your A times now before and after that one nap? If nap 2 is not happening ?
Just was wondering.
We are 5 hrs before and 4:30 after.
Ladybugs good news about your LO! Hope she will outgrow it soon!
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Hmmm, our A times have kind of gone out the window with set times. Lately it's been around 7, then around 4.5/5. =O Only because our wake ups are so darn early and naps too short!
Ideally it'll be 5-6/5-5.5 with this EAS:
WU 6-7
S 12-2
BT 7-7:30
Currently it's something like:
WU 5-5:40
S 12-1:50 (usually ends earlier)
BT 6-6:30
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Thanks Ginger,
Oh,,,, those EWs! It might be so hard!
We had a couple WUs around 5am but I pushed her to sleep in our bed and she fell asleep in an hour or more until 9am. I was exhausted and didn't open my eyes before 9. That long sleep made my day, but DD was cranky all day. Not sure if that was the reason.
We didn't do set times yet because any nap before 5 a time was short. But last two days after 5 hrs, her nap was short. I probably need to increase A time again.
I just renembered one lady here was helping me. Her DD had EWs also and to avoid OT she did a CN in the car for 15 min around 9 am. then a regular nap at 12. Maybe this info will help.
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Our awake times are like this
6/6.30am WU
Nap 11.30/12pm
WU 2pm (hopefully, sometimes earlier)
BT 6.45pm
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Some afternoons my daughter is yawning away so I try for a CN at around 4pm but she never sleeps. She goes quiet for about 15 minutes but I think she is just chilling out.
It makes sense though, she is only up for about 2-2.5hrs by then. I see she is pretty tired by BT but I not OT (I hope), she doesn't take long to get to sleep at BT anyway.
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Thanks Ladymugg!
Does she wake up so early on her own?
so funny, in the last couple of days I forgot that nap 2 exists actually :))
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Sorry Mariellamom - don't understand your question? I'm happy with a 6/6.30 am wakeup, not sure if that is what you asked.
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We are aiming for a set nap at 11.30/45 to fit in with nursery routine (DS starts next week). If he wakes really early (pre-6am) then I'm offering a CN around 9.30am. We had a fab day on Thursday with WU 5.30, nap 9.30-45 and then 11.45-2.15!! BT is 6/6.15, he doesn't seem to cope any later right now x
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Thanks Jessmum. It is helpful to read others routines. Very helpful to me when our day is upside down and I don't know what to do :)
Ladymugg, I was asking if you yourself wake her in the morning or she is just an early riser. I am ' extremely not a morning person' :)))) That's why early wake ups scare me so much :))
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Haha I dont consider 6 am to be early hehe. I used to wake before I was a SAHM at 5.30 to get to my job that was out of town. And my husband and I usually get up early for running or training. But yeah I guess it is early ;) And I don't wake her.
Cheers!
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Yes 6 is pretty acceptable in my book too ;). 6.30 is nicer but as long as it hasn't got a 5 (or 4!) in it I'm generally happy!
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Oh ladies, I can't even think about 6am as about something nice :)))
I feed DD around 4-5 am and love to watch breautiful Sunsets as long as I know after that DD will be sleeping soundly :))
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Argh, 5:10 WU today. BT is probably to blame.
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Hugs ginger, hang in there. It will come right eventually. Our routine is being destroyed by teeth, poor little thing only turned one this week and is cutting one of his upper canines, with the other about to cut along with his 4th molar! Not a good night and had to resettle 35 mins into nap too :( we are living on pain meds right now...
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Ack! Hugs for you, Katherine! Seriously, sweet poor B and all those chompers! Hang in there as well as hopefully once you're past all the teething, it will be glorious! And to think... he'll have his major pearly whites by 2! Crazy!
How long did he do after the resettle? Hopefully it ended being a long one so he was rested.
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1h50 total so pretty ok really. Grouchy afternoon but hard to know if tired or pain right now. Nursery tomorrow...bracing myself for a 30 minute nap!
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Did he already sleep in nursery Katherine?
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No first time for a nap today! Eek....at least he got up at a reasonable time this morning so the day won't be long even if nap a mess x
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Hope it went fine:)!
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Still averaging approx 1.5 hours for that middle of day nap.. It's been able 3 weeks since we transitioned to 11.30am/12pm nap time. Hope it increases soon! Night sleep going well still.
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Ladymugg, whats your wake up and bedtime?
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Marta he managed 55 mins, and I got a 15 mins catnap to get us to BT so we survived! Mega tired and grumpy today though despite a very good night (I guess he crashed) so hoping the nap goes ok x
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Ahh! That's a great nap for the first day in the nursery:)! More then one sleep cycle yuhuuu:)! We had I guess 30min instead of normal 1.5-2h:). Great that you managed to squeeze a catnap there!
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Wake up is anywhere around 6/6.30 and BT is about 6.45
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Is that put down at 6:45 or asleep by then?
We had a good nap today... But a crying break in between. 1.11, then another 54min, asleep at 11:45 and woke almost at 2.
3rd time it's been over 2 hrs in a week. Also had a couple short ones around 1hr.
We were out in the morning and were late getting back in time for 11:00 nap which was good in a way because it pushed Our nap back to the 11:45/12:00 range. He seemed to handle today's wake time ok even though it was an early start at 5:00am. Grandma was with us so i guess it was enough of a good distraction to push him through tiredness. He was yawning a lot on the way home though around 11:00. Put him down for bed at 6:30 but he cried (for like the 5th night in a row) then self settled and took 27 min to fall asleep at almost 7! Long day but hipefully the nap will carry him through to a good wake up time.
Hang in there Lady... Hopefully it'll hit the 2 hr+ Soon. Is DD handling the days ok?
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It is lights out about 6.35/6.40, asleep by 6.45/6.50 - it doesn't take her long that time of the day.
How many weeks did it take for the longer sleeps to kick in for you ginger?
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About 4 weeks if you count from the real push to 1 nap toward 12noon.
We had the first after 6am wake up in over a month!!! 6:20. Woohoo! Did wake at 3, 4, 5:40 but ss until wakeup. So happy. Nap was only 1.21 total but i'll take it!
Cried again at BT. :/ but only for a few mins. Then out at 6:50. Fx for another after 6 wu.
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Hmmm there are some molars pushing through at the moment, I'm sure that isn't helping. She was away at my mums house over the weekend and the routine got a little out of whack so today am putting it back in place. But it has been about 3 weeks since she landed at that 12 pm, we were transitioning about 3 weeks before that. Is that what you mean, since it got to 12 pm?
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Oh no... hope the molars pop soon and it doesn't cause much more discomfort.
Yes, that is what I meant, so for us it was 4 weeks since I moved to 1 nap permanently and starting moving it toward 12noon, and you're going on 6. Mind you though that we've been transitioning for a few months with some back and forth from 1 to 2 naps. So I suppose not quite the same. So perhaps you have a couple more months to go? =/ But who knows... she might extend it all of a sudden or maybe not. I heard 1.5 hours is also common for 1 nap especially with 12 hour nights.
Today for us, WU was 5:30 with screaming/crying at 11pm, then another wake at 4:15. Don't know how long it took for him to fall asleep. Going to stick to 11:45/12 nap and 6:30 put down time. Curious how the next few days will go. We'll see!
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Ah ok .... hmmm... I will keep being patient. To be honest she isn't massively tired on the 1.5hr sleep days but I think she could do better with 30-60 minutes more. She sometimes yawns mid morning but then after a snack perks up again.
Thanks ginger! :D
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Hey ladies, we are recovering from a long cold, or maybe she is teething. She has only two lower teeth, it looks like all 4 upper ones are coming out..... it takes forever it seems.
We've been on one nap for over a month I think. But she wakes up after 8 am, and BT works well around 7. Her nap is stable 1h30. I will be trying to extend her A time again to get a longer nap once she is better.
Ginger, sorry WU are still so early. What might cause it? Oh, who knows.
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Hi Mariellamom, welcome back but sorry to hear about the illness and all those teeth popping in!
DD seems to be sleeping really well and hopefully she will extend that nap soon.
Right, who knows what's causing the EW but today was a good day, thank goodness. I just hope it's not a one off. He woke at 6:35 after a 30 min wake at 5:20. At least he self settled and I got to stay in bed, although awake, until AFTER sunrise. Haha. I wonder if keeping him in bed longer in the morning helped with it... I kept him in there until 6:30am and today until 6:45. It felt like sleep training, but I had tried everything else. Also yesterday, I took a quick stroll with him right before dinner time to get him some sun exposure. Apparently that can help set or reset their bio clock (remember that from the infant days?). Today was the first day in a little while I could put him down for a nap without him being super OT. He actually acted a little UT... XF he sleeps well! I would love to firmly establish that 2 hr nap he's been giving me once in a while, but "firmly establish" or "consistent" for that matter probably doesn't exist when speaking of LOs. ;)
Ladymugg, yes, I've found snacks to be a lifesaver these days. I have had to strategically pick them to give him enough energy to last as long as he's had to. Any signs of extending the nap?
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Some days yes - others no. Teething is happening full on (on and off) for the past few weeks) so I think that probably isn't helping at all.
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Hugs to all. We now have chickenpox to contend with on top of teeth, starting nursery and a cold. This 2-1 may take a while! Currently sitting in car on driveway while B has a quick CN before hopefully a nap at lunchtime. Keeping my fingers crossed!
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Katherine, sorry to hear! Hopefully at least the cold will subside or teeth come out!
Ginger, thanks! You are so right about 'consistency' at this age:-)
I've extended DD's A time, But the nap is still 1h20 min. Will keep it for a few days and hope for a long one!
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Oh my. Last night DD was up 5 times! Not sure what's causing it. She had only 1h20 min nap. And a shorter A time to BT, but it is not different from other days like this.
It looks like our ' normal ' day is 11 hrs with 13 hrs night. It helped to reduce OT from not long enough one nap.
Today was messed up because of a hard night. But good we had two naps!
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Hi ladies thought I'd jump into this thread as we are 5 days into transitioning to 1 nap with our 14mo daughter. I have another post going about ss which has gone out the window since illness but thought I'd join here too.
Think my lo may have been ready for this for a few weeks but I persevered despite the 2 naps shortening and having a bit of a struggle at bt. Following a couple of days with less that 10 minutes sleep all day (at daycare) we decided to bite the bullet and see what would happen. My lo has actually been quite lovely. I probably haven't given her enough credit for what she can actually handle! Our only struggles at the moment are when I'm trying to make her nap!! ;D
For the last 2 days I have given a cn, yesterday because she was a bit accident prone and today because I could not keep her awake during her morning feed. My plan was to start aiming for an 11am nap and gradually over the next couple of months push to a time that suits the length of nap she will hopefully settle into. Anyway, with the cn both days the nap hasn't eventuated until 12:30 which is a massive 7.5 a time??? Am I setting her up for a big sleep dept in the coming weeks? We are usually 11.5 hours overnight give or take depending on nw, which we have had quite a bit of over the last 3-4 weeks following illness. With her only having just over an hour during the day at the moment I'm getting a bit worried. Bedtime has always been 6pm (asleep).
Would you suggest any tweaks to the basic layout of our day? Any suggestions on cn and nap times. As we get minimal tired signs my lo has always been on scheduled naps so feeling a bit all over the place at the mo!!
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Hi there
I gather your LO wakes at around 6 am based on what you said? That is the same as my 15mo DD. We tend to do 11.30am in bed (12 pm if we have something on like playgroup and just haven't gotten home in time for lunch etc etc, which I always serve before her nap).
I wondered about 12.30 as a nap time when we were transitioning too but the lovely ladies on this page suggested 11.30 and to be honest that has worked out really well. It means if she sleeps for 2 hours that is 1.30 pm/2.00 pm > 6.30 pm BT, giving us about 5hrs A time before nap and about 5 hrs before BT.
I would say if you end up with a nap time of around 11.30 that might work best, how does that sound to you? Some days if the sleep is very short, a CN in the afternoon around 4pm works (but very rarely, unless the kid is super shattered).
Hope that helps!
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Thanks Ladymugg!
We were pretty consistent with a 6ish wake up but to be honest with the illness and nw it is pretty much 5am now. If we have a bad night with a long awake period (2 hours) then its around 6am, and same if we have a 4am wu and I am able to resettle.
I like the idea of 11:30 and am going to give it a go, think I am going to try (at all costs) to avoid a cn in the morning. I am always worried that she will throw me a curve ball of a huge nap and I'll never get her down in the evening!! The next 2 days she is at daycare so I will also ask them to also try for the same time.
Does you lo ss?
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Argh sorry, I'm getting there with these abbreviations but not 100% on what you mean by "ss".
If you mean "single sleep" then yeah she does one nap per day... if you mean "self settle" then yes, she has been pretty good since about 6 mo with self settling. Took a while there with some PU/PD in the night but generally has been good (apart from the odd noise in the night, which if we don't respond to goes away after 30ish seconds).
Don't worry about your 5 am wake up - I am sure it will take a few days to get back on track but she will get back to 6 am with some persistence. I would just make sure that the room is dark and warm and that you leave her unless she is upset. The rule in my house (it might seem cruel) is no getting up before 6 am. So sometimes that involves a bit of reassurance or just leaving her. It doesn't always work but I'm deathly afraid of encouraging an earlier up time!
The only thing I would consider if I was you would be pushing out the BT to 6.30 pm and see if that helps?
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lol yip I'm the same with the abbreviations!! Only just figured out what STTN meant about an hour ago :)
Yes I did mean self settle. She was such a good settler, both naps and night time. The night time one went when day-care started and she started falling asleep when having her evening feed. And the day naps have gone to pot with illness. She's still not 100% and we get quite a bit of coughing overnight but hope it comes back?!? We are nearly 3 weeks of not ss for naps and nearly 2 months of falling asleep feeding at night.
The day nap I'm happy to tackle once the fog clears a bit on this transition but the bt one concerns me.
I start feeding about 5:40 at the moment and she is down by 6. To be honest sometimes I have to jiggle from the moment I start feeding to keep her awake??
Any suggestions ?
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Up until my LO dropped her BT bottle a couple of weeks ago I was doing bottle before bath. That way I could get teeth brushed and not worry about that again. Not sure if that helps?
I didn't breastfeed so maybe it's different with that whole snuggle thing....(?) but I was previously giving my daughter her bottle on her own little mini sofa so it was more of an independent thing rather than a just before bed thing... Maybe 30 minutes before? Sorry I'm not the expert but that's what I did :)
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Hello.... I am new to this thread and hope for some support in tgis juggling act we have going. . My missy moo is 13 months and is refusing morning sleeps. Once asleep she only sleeps for half and hour and is awake for 4 hours til her next sleep which creeps into the late afternoon say 4.30. This means she can only have a half hour sleep otherwise her bed time ends up being 9.30-10pm.
Way to late. So I have decided to give her one nap only.
Her nap is a between 12.30-1.30 and she wakes up after 1/2 hr I rock her back and she will sleep for another 1 or 1 1/2 hours.. tje problem is night wakings.. she is waking bewteen 2-3 times, screaming.. she doesnt take a night bottle anymore and if offered refuses it anyway.. if this common when transitioning? Can anyone tell me there story and if it impacted night sleeping? I have been reading your thread and its nice to read all the support and love being spread.. sometimes it can be lonely when people around u have angel sleepers. I hope everyone is well.
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Hi there Frankiefrankiefrankie
What time are your daughter's BT and WU times usually? That makes a difference to that nap and also catnap.
I would personally limit the CN to 45 minutes max. In our routine (6 am WU, 11.30am nap (2hrs ish), 6.45pm BT) a catnap if it ever happens usually is around 4 pm or 20 minutes either side of that. Any later and it is far too close to BT. I would cap it at 30-45 minutes max otherwise you are going to get to that late BT problem you are finding, for sure.
I didn't really have issues with night sleeping when transitioning, so not sure if I can help you there. If I were you though I would probably be thinking about trying to avoid or wean off that rocking her back to sleep. :( Have you tried any self-settling techniques? I am not sure what they are for a toddler of that age (sorry, they are probably in the book or someone nice on this forum may know) but I used to use PU/PD way back when my daughter was around 6 months old ish. I think that the babies are probably too old for this now. Maybe just some reassuring shhhhh and "night night" - set a timer for 10-15 minutes or so and see if she can settle (obviously don't leave her if she is distressed). Hmmmm not sure what else to suggest? If she can self-settle well you can probably avoid that daytime rocking and then she might be able to get back to sleep easier by herself for night wake ups.
My little girl "sleeps through the night" I guess as well as any person - she wakes and stirs a little but only for a few seconds and then back to sleep. It is rare I think for any baby to be completely dead silent and out to it for the full 10-12 hours or so I think!!
If your little one is refusing her night time bottle then I would say it is probably because she has decided she doesn't need it or doesn't want it. My little girl has just gone through this - so I offer her a little bit of cow milk with dinner and she enjoys that a lot more. At this age milk tends to be thought of more as a drink rather than a food so as long as she has had enough dinner I would say don't stress too much about that later bottle.
Anyway back to your first question, if I knew your WU and BT for your little girl it might be helpful - the other mums here might be able to chime in (I'm not an expert but am starting to try to contribute back to all the lovely people who have answered my questions time and time again by answering some myself). Perhaps her first nap is too late and she is overtired, which contributes to the shorter sleep?
Some ideas for you :)
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Thanks lady mugg
Her routine is as following
7.30 awake
B/w 12.30-1pm asleep (try to get her to have a 2 hour nap)
8pm bed
Unfortunately missy moo only sleeps 11 hours at night so going to bed any early will lead to a 6.30 and sometimes 6 am awake time..
I have to rock her back to sleep during naps because she will not go back to sleep... it is something I have been working on for months and months... at night time its more of a reassurance then anything else. I usually pick her up for a sec and poo her back down but lately it has been hard for her to get back to sleep. She is drooling heaps, it could be teething but to be honest with her other 8 teeth it wasnt this bad.. her first molars are to come out next..
On the topic of cat naps I have e limited them because it usually would happen at 4.30 and she is refusing them as she takes ages to sleep and then I have to wake her up( bc its 5 pm) and she is grumpy and cries. Transitioning is tricky. I have given her some homopathic medicine for teething tonight so hopefully it reliefs some pain. Thanks again ladymugg..
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Welcome frankie and first mum!
Here's a link to the basic info about the transition if you haven't already seen it:
From 2 to 1 nap transition (10-12m and older)
Ladymugg and I were in a similar situation until my DS started NW and EW. It may be due to a few things... teething, physical and language development, emotional dev't= separation anxiety, etc...
Our routine at the moment is still forming, but I will say that many times during the transition, we did a routine listed below because DS just could not handle more than 4.5/5 hours until recently actually. It did have to do with poor nights and EWs, so take that into consideration. Also, my DS often refused late pm naps, CN included so we did them in the morning. Well, at the very early stages of the transition, we did do very late CNs around 4 or 5 and bed 2-3 hours later, but once BT gets pushed so late, you have to just go for the 1 nap.
if...
WU 5 o'clock hour or earlier =X
CN 9:00/9:30, 15-20 mins. in the car
N 11:30 (or 2 hours later on the dot)
BT 6:00
if...
WU 6:00
N started transition at 10:30, pushed to 12:00 slowly (15-20 min a day, finished in 10 days or so)
BT 6:00 at the beginning, 6:30 towards the end for a good 1-2 months
For only a couple days now we've been on this routine, but it does include many NWs and early morning resettles.
WU 6:15-6:30
N 11:30/12:00 (usually 1hr30min = 1.30)
BT 7:00-7:30 (because DS seems to sleep avg 10.5 hours lately)
DS does seem OT, but I honestly don't know what else I can do without getting a 6:30-4:30/5 schedule or the likes. He seems to enjoy his evening lately so I'll be on this for a few more days. It does take 5-7 days for new routines to stick so I'm hoping our 5am WU and resettle will go away.
Hope there's been progress on your ends... hugs and best wishes.
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In case you need them...here are links to some methods for help with baby sleeping independently, NWs, lengthening naps, etc......
PU/PD
How to PU/PD (inc age adaptations)
GW and WIWO for toddlers
Toddlers: Walk In/Walk Out vs. The Gradual Withdrawal Method (HOW TO CHOOSE)
Wake to sleep for naps
How do I address habitual wakings? (wake-to-sleep and other methods)
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Thanks ginger413 appreciate the links. I don't have much control on Wed and Thurs as my little one is at daycare :( I just have to roll with it.
Yesterday she fell asleep at the lunch table at 11:30 and they transferred her to the sleep room, she woke but they were able to shush her back to sleep, but unfortunately only for 10 minutes. They attempted again around 1:30 but no luck.
Apparently she had a lovely afternoon and did seem in good spirits when I picked her up. After bath getting into jammies was a bit hard, lots of crying unless she was wrapped around my neck which made it hard for dad to do up buttons. Story time was good but her bedtime feed was a bit rubbish. Really hard to keep her awake. Sound asleep by 5:50.
We had a blip at 7:50 and the cry wasn't her normal I can do this on my own cry so I went in and shushed and rubbed her back. Took about 10 minutes but we didn't hear from her again until 5:40.
We shall see what today brings!
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Every day is a new day :). Be kind to yourselves mamas, you're all doing great jobs!
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Pretty good day today! Woke at 6 so I was all set to try for 11:30. That was a bit premature as when I popped her in the highchair for morning tea (which turned into lunch) I started to get some really good tired signs.
So 10:45 we went down. Couple of bum strokes and we were asleep. In total we had 1h40 with resettling after 30-60 and 80 minutes. Feeling very proud of my lo.
Afternoon was a bit long as you can imagine but she did really well. Stayed awake during bedtime feed so able to pop her down awake at 6 but it didn't go well :-[ I couldn't settle her and neither could my hubby. So I picked her up and gave her cuddles. She was squeezing me so tight :-[ Cuddled in the chair for a bit then stood cuddling her beside the cot. Popped her in and she gave a little grizzle. One shush from me and asleep.
How long do you cuddle/relax with your lo's after finishing bedtime boob? I'm wondering if I rushed her and that caused the meltdown. That and being awake 5.5 hours!
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Sounds great First Mum :)
Are you in New Zealand too?
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Hey ladymugg we sure are :) we are in the Hawkes Bay. Where are you?
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Rotovegas... ;)
I got the idea we were on the same timezone haha!
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lol! I'm new to this forum thingy so had no idea how to update my profile?!? I have now found my location :-)
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Oh cool! I tend to find a lot of people from here are in the UK so get replies at the other end of the day ;)
I am a bit of a newbie around here too, I tend to ask more questions than I answer but trying to reverse that. Gee it is hard with a little one to try to give back to things like this! I just forget, I guess.
I think you sound like you're doing fine. Did you consider a quick catnap this afternoon? Or will it just not happen? My little girl just doesn't want to catnap anymore so I hear you on that one!
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I thought as much! Feel like I don't know anything so not sure I'd have anything to offer!!
Will def consider if the nap is early tomorrow. I've had no experience of a later bedtime so a bit worried about that? What time do you suggest I do the cn and would you move her bedtime from 6pm. My hubby and I often talk about how good a later bedtime would be but with so much going on for her at the moment I'm reluctant to start messing with something else.
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I don't know tbh, I just wing what I do. Our routine is a bit like this:
6 am WU
6.30 am sip of milk
8 am breakfast
11.15 am lunch
11.30/12 pm sleep
1.30 pm wake up
3 pm snack
5.15 pm dinner and last cup of milk
6.45 lights out
So.... I like that later bedtime because it allows hubby to have some time with her when he gets home from work. I suspect it will get later over time and we have an earlier dinner together and then bed. But if 6 pm works for you then that's fine. But I think if my LO went to bed at 6 she would definitely wake at 5 or 5.30 (I mean she does sometimes now, but not consistently).
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It amazes me how all the babies can be so different!! :D
How old is your LO?
The middle of our day is a bit all over the show at the moment with sorting this nap but her wake up is pretty consistent 6-6:15. We've had a couple of ew over the last couple of weeks with illness but our day starts at 6. Sometimes that meant resettling or if we were tired the earliest we would bring her into our is 5:30. Breakfast at 6:30am dinner is at 4:30-4:45 Dad does bath and stories and I usually start feeding 5:40 down at 6pm.
When talking with my mum its interesting what she wrote in my plunket book about me and my sleeping habits. She often tells me I was "up at 6 down at 6" apparently until I was about 4 :o
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Ah well I'd just roll with it then! Although sometimes you must be like "I wish it was 7-7!!"
My LO is 15 months, born 8/4/14. What about yours?
Me personally, I try not to bring her in with us if she wakes up early as they say that can encourage the earlier wake ups. Something to think about? (Although I haven't had experience with that, I'm just deathly afraid of pre-6am becoming the norm!!).
:)
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Ah yes 7-7 would be ideal!! I love the snuggles :P its definitely a last resort and its been a few weeks since its happened :-[
My LO is 14 months born 13/5/14
Did you notice a big change with how you LO improved with handling awake times, did it happen suddenly?
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Hi ladies, been off for a while from this thread but we are struggling a bit. Pretty much just having one nap but just can't get out of horrible early mornings :( :( DS is also (still) teething canines - two to go! - and has a cough which doesn't help but I would love some thoughts/advice if anyone has them.
WU has been around 5.30am give or take, BT at 6/6.30pm for ages. Not technically EW I know, but just too ridiculously early! So I've started trying to push BT closer to 7. So far all that's done is make DS take longer naps ::) great you would think but he's been pulling off some 3h naps, even at daycare :o and then doing a 10/10.5h night. Total sleep all good at around 13.5h but OT from long morning A (set nap at 11.45ish) and short nights. I think I need to cap his nap, right? Seems ridiculous at this age but I want him to sleep in the morning, not the day! What would you do?
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I can only dream of 3 hr naps but I know B has quite a lot to catch up on. We are getting10-10.5 hr nights with 1-1.5 hr naps.
Hmmm, you're more knowledgeable than me on this K, but capping the nap definitely seems to be worth a try. I'd say wake at 2:00 for a 7:00 pm BT. It might take a little bit to change his clock. I don't rememeber if nursery can push to 12 nap. If he ever wakes between 5:30-6 i'd say to do that.
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Ha well he did it on his own today and slept 1h45 :). Will go for 6.30BT as that's about 5h A after the nap and hope tomorrow isn't so horribly early. Am doing my best to keep him in natural daylight until as close to BT as possible and then dark until 6am earliest. Read a few things that say it's the light exposure more than anything which helps reset the circadian rhythm so here's hoping!
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Haha, we're doing the same! Out and about even if it's just right outside our apartment for a quick stroll right before bed. And same, bright lights at 6:15, 6:30. Not sure it's working, but we'll keep trying.
5 A before bed sounds great, K. And with a shorter nap, he may give you his 12 hr night again! Here's to hoping!!!
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Ha ha I'd be happy with 11h the way things are right now ::)
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Hello all :) Katherine sorry if I said this before but I do remember DS needing his nap capped a little soon after he dropped the morning one. Then he was slightly more tired for BT and did a longer night.
Just joining in here as we're at the morning nap capping stage but everything's a mess at the moment with severe OT, so frequent NWs, EWs, OT 30min am nap (fixed time due to preschool drop off), OT 1-1.5h pm nap (fixed time due to preschool collection) and utterly miserable all day :( And now ill too ::) :( She did at least do a 'better' night last night due to illness, I'm kind of hoping the illness will somehow break the cycle. Preschool finishes on Monday so can be more flexible after that. Other things - she's recently (last couple of weeks or so) started crawling around in her cot like crazy and sitting up, then tries to go back to sleep by laying her head down in front of her with her legs still out in front (little contortionist!), she now cries every time she goes to sleep and every time she wakes - how I miss those weeks of settling happily to sleep and waking up chatting softly! I also wonder about introducing a lovey - since going into sleeping bags around 6mo she's used the end of the bag as a lovey, but perhaps this is more uncomfortable/frustrating now she's longer... She did take to a particular bunny for a couple of weeks but is less interested in it now, I did give it to her one night when she was especially unsettled but it didn't seem to make much difference and I haven't done it again since, maybe I should try it again, maybe she'll find it's a less frustrating comfort item than her sleeping bag which obviously moves every time she does :P Any thoughts? But mostly I just need to somehow find a way of helping her to catch up on this major OT, just waiting for a nice long pm nap...
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Sorry for the late reply trimble...
What is your eventual goal? Is it like a 1 x 11.30 am nap? If it is, that way not only would you get hopefully a longer sleep, but then it moves out towards the middle of the day and then would also have a nice side affect of not interfering with your pre-school drop-off too. The nap time a lot of us are on around here is 11.30am (or thereabouts).
My LO has a cuski toy as her lovey. She absolutely loves it! But she has had it almost from birth. I think if your daughter takes to one then thats great as it is a good, portable sleep association that can go to daycare, to grandmother's house etc. BUT if its not your daughter's bag then it won't achieve anything I guess?!
The sleeping bag thing.... my LO is in them and the longer they are the better. I usually go next size up not only to make it a big cheaper so we can get more wear out of them, but also so that there is plenty of room and she doesn't get so tangled.
Now your daughter is crawling and moving around in her cot, don't worry this doesn't last long IMO - maybe a couple of weeks. If she isn't going to sleep I would just go in there, place her back in her sleeping position, tuck her in tightly if you use blankets with your sleeping bag (and if not, maybe just a larger sheet sideways to tuck her in tight), lots of shhshhhhsssshhh and night night, sleep time etc etc.
Honestly though if your LO has been sick I would just focus on trying to get her back to the old normal and then go from there. Don't stress too much about what has happened in the previous weeks, hey what happens happens, that is life eh!
Hope the above helps! All the best :)
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Read a few things that say it's the light exposure more than anything which helps reset the circadian rhythm so here's hoping!
What a coincidence that you mentioned this. You remember me saying this??? I actually felt that our EWs started because the sun was rising so early. Even though her room is pitch black, the sun was rising at 5.30 and it was affecting her body clock. Well, the past 3 days, it has been raining like crazy and it's dull and cloudy and we have been getting 7.30 WUs. Seems like there could be something to this, right????
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Wow Fleur that sounds lovely :) Shame about being stuck in though :( Our room is pitch black too so can't get my head around how the sun could be affecting her?
Thanks ladymugg, tbh I'm not quite sure what we're aiming for atm, as you say the illness is throwing everything off anyway so will just have to ride that out for now... I don't think 11.30am would work so well, we really need at least 12.00 but preferably 12.30 before we can go for one nap, since the CM goes out to groups in the morning, which don't start until 10 or something. Would also be nice to get to church, the earliest we could feasibly do nap after that is 12.30. With DS, he held onto his morning nap for quite some time, until he started refusing it. Atm we have WU at 6.30 to give us 3h before nap at 9.30, which will work for when DS starts school (CM also doing his drop offs) before morning groups/church, but when we go to one nap I reckon the latest we could practically move WU would be 7.15 - that just about worked with DS. So anyway, I'm really hoping we can do something similar with DD, but not sure how hopeful I am that it will work! I think our ideal atm would be something like:
6.30 Up
9.30-10 Nap 1
1-3 Nap 2 (will have to end by 3pm for school collection from September)
6.30/7 BT (based on her ideal TS before all this mess of 14.5h, but I suspect this is reducing now so 14h probably ok, once the illness/OT is done... From the last few weeks I know that 13h is way too little for her!)
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Yeah I'd just get her re-sorted after illness and then worry about it again in a week or so when things are back to normal.
Not sure what you'll do about moving to one sleep given you have a few restrictions around timing due to your busy lives! (I hear you mama). Personally (and I mean this in the nicest, most suggestive way - I hate it how you can't convey tone that well in writing) I think you could get away with 12 or maybe even 12.30... but no later at this age because with that 6.30 am WU time you are looking at 6hrs A time before nap and then say if its a 3 hour sleep to 2.30, its only 4 hours A time before BT.
Anyway whatever sleep time you move to I guess you'll be doing it gradually ie: moving nap time out by 15 minutes every 3 days or so? And then when you eventually get to your end goal, I'm sure it will only be for a few months anyway until the sleep gets a little later in the afternoon as their sleep needs drop off and bedtime gets a little later.
It is easy for me to say this as I don't have other children at the moment and no school schedules etc. When we have activities on eg: playgroup goes to 12 pm for us - but I leave before then so we can have some lunch in her before bed. I know its not ideal, especially with church (maybe there is an evening service or one another time you could go to?) but I'm sure as you know once you miss that sleep window and your LO gets OT, there may not be any sleep at all, or not for very long :( Hard when its just one nap too I have learnt, as that 1-2 hours during the day is my "rush around and get EVERYTHING done" window! ARGH!! I'm talking about my own stuff as much as yours here, don't worry I'm not trying to tell you stuff you already will know!! :P
Hope that helps - sorry just jotting down some thoughts in the hope they'll help.
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Our room is pitch black too so can't get my head around how the sun could be affecting her?
Ours too. Her room is like a cave. But I think the body just knows sometimes. Is it bright there? Here the sun was bright and shining at 5 am!
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How did ya'll hang the blackout liners? Ours blocks out 98% of the light... there's a small line on the top of the ceiling. Perhaps I should adjust it for the morning.
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DH has taped it down, put another layer on the pelmet and clipped the curtains together with clothes pegs :D
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Haha... hold down the fort! (old saying in the US) Then, how do you open the blinds in the morning to let light in?
Katherine, not sure if your "plan" entailed light therapy of sorts, but I'm desperate and am willing to try some things based on some info I found...
-Exposure to 30 min. of sunlight (even overcast is effective) between 6:30-8:00am (I usually take him out at 8:30/9:00 but apparently it's not as effective)
-Dimming lights in about 20min increments to mimic sundown 1-2 hours before bedtime (I was taking him out for a walk 40-60 mins before bed, woops)
-Exposure to as much light as possible when awake, especially blue light which is best in sunlight
-And today I fixed our curtains to make it 100% blackout
We'll see if it makes a difference during teething and SA!
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I'm down in NZ so had that summer light coming in about 6 months ago like you ladies... I can only say all you have to do is keep that room dark like you already said, and keep that white noise on to avoid all the other outside activity going on when light (neighbors going to work, delivery vehicles, pets waking up etc).
Thankfully we live in a quiet cul de sac but not everyone does!
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Then, how do you open the blinds in the morning to let light in?
I don't. Lol. We have full length windows covering an entire wall and it was so bright. We had mat blinds with 2 layers of curtains but still too much. So now we've also put dark film on the window. I open a small portion of it to make the room dim while nursing and then we put on the lights/go out into the rest of the house which is super bright.
Hope some of your ideas work out, ginger. How would you expose him to blue light? As in normal light?
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F, I see. We have huge windows, though not full length. Yes, blue light is in natural light and most electronics. I read it is not in house lights... those are mainly white and yellow. But I don't know exactly what that means.
go out into the rest of the house which is super bright.
This made me realize that we've been getting less light in the rest of our apartment... the full trees in the summer block the sun. I loved it in the winter when the tree was bare because all the sunlight would flood our living room. I wonder if this has affected his 'clock.' Anyway, whatever the case, we can only work with what we've got, right?
WU was 5:44 but he rested (not slept) until 6:15. We went for a walk at 6:40. He's currently napping longer than he has in weeks... going on 1.42. Hmmm... catch up nap? Another 1 hr NW last night. Oh... he just woke. 1.44. Not too bad.
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Hi Ladies, no post from us for a few days as I've been unwell and just trying to make this 1 nap work?!? My LO has been pretty good with an 11:30am nap. We are getting between 40mins (at daycare) and on average 1.5hrs at home. Such a relief she is sleeping at daycare again, we just need to work on the length.
We are all coming out the otherside of illness but something that is creeping in is the EW. We have had a couple of 4:30am wu and nothing we do can get her back to sleep. Her day looks like this
4:30 wake-up
6:00 out of cot (usually hubby or me has been trying to resettle)
6:30 brekkie
7-7:30 breastfeed
cat nap for 15 mins anywhere between 7:30 and 8:30am
11:00 lunch
11:30 nap
2-3:00 snack
4:30 dinner, bath, play, books
5:30 breastfeed
6:00 asleep
Pretty much exactly the same if we have a 'normal' wake up of 6-6:15.
We've been on the 1 nap now almost 3 weeks, in total I think we are getting on average 12-12.5 hours sleep per day. Would you change anything? Is having such an early bedtime contributing to the ew? We have always had such an early bt so with ot creeping in I don't really have anywhere to move other than trying for a cn in the avo which my LO pretty consistently refuses.
Really appreciate your advice and support x
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I'm not sure but the early bedtime might not be helping. Why don't you try pushing it by 10 mins for 3 days, gradually increasing by half an hour to 6.30 and see what happens? That will take you about 9 days to get to 6.30 and in smaller increments might not be so noticeable as I know I pice mentioned that she is very tired by BT.
I keep being oblivious about teething as the cause of EW so thought I'd share. Had a week of EW and then discovered 4 molars had hit. So maybe teeth?
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Thanks ladymugg I love how are thought processes are similar :) I had just read and posted in another forum conversation about ew linked to ebt!! :) Yip am thinking I am going to give it a go. Am thinking if I do it as you say in small increments hopefully that will help her manage any ot that is still lingering with the transition.
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Just another thought??? Would you also shift her dinner time 15mins each day as well? We currently have a 4:30 dinner.
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Not sure... But at 15mo early waking shouldn't be linked to hunger., their stomach size is such now that they should be able to last a while.
FYI dinner time is 5-15ish at our house (but does not have a BT bottle or WU bottle, she's a milk woth a snack girl now). Am thinking of moving this later because she seems to be able to handle it hunger wise from afternoon snack time. Breakfast at 8am which is a little bit of a long stretch but then again that doesn't (and shouldn't) contribute to an early wu. That's why I'm thinking of making dinner more like 5.30.5.45ish.
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Yeah I've thought that for awhile now. Even with the really ew her brekkie and breasfeed have never been earlier and on the odd (very odd) occasion we have had a 7:30 sleep in she quite happily waits another 30-45 minutes for brekkie.
Am thinking more change for my LO ;D fingers and toes crossed!!
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Good luck!! EW is a big head scratcher sometimes but I'm sure you'll get there. There are the things they always say (is the room dark enough, warm enough, quiet/white noise?) but I kind of expect most people are onto those things.
One thing I do know is that if you push the BT out by half an hour or even a little longer you will get more play time especially if your partner (and you) work which is just lovely as a family.
That's one of my reasons for trying to get dinner time a little later, so some nights we can eat a meal together (although being realistic there are always things on for us lost week nights, even if one of us is just going for a run). But it all helps!
:)
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First mum, I think pushing to 6:30 at least is a good idea. We did that and currently are at 7:00, trying to push to 7:30.
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Hi ladies, we have been quiet here. Painting the room while DD has her one 1h20 min nap ;) It took me a month to finish :)
About EW, yeap, we didn't have them a lot but those times were frustrating.
We travelled with DD and had very late BT. BUT she slept for 4-5 nights from 10pm to 10-11am! I was shocked as I had to wake her up which never happens here :))
But for the last two months I try not to do BT too early and she has been pretty good with WU time 7:30. Except for today's morning- 5:30 :(
I think ladymugg is right, it can also be teething . At 11 months we have only two teeth and it seemed like the upper ones were going to come out three months ago.
First mum, wish you luck with working on those EW !
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Morning Mums,
What time do you give your LO lunch? I'm trying to have Livy in the highchair for 11 and down for her nap at 11:30 as this is what daycare are trying for me. 11 is the earliest they can serve lunch.
Do you think that's too close to her nap?
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I give my daughter lunch anywhere between 11 and 11.30. Usually its lunch then a drink and then pretty much straight to her nap (nap is usually at 11.30).
I think as long as your daughter can self-settle (ie: doesn't need to feed to sleep, which I would doubt is the case at this age) and doesn't have any digestion problems, then it should be fine.
My daughter usually mucks around in her high chair having a drink and stuff for 5 minutes after the full on eating has stopped. Sometimes we even go and sit down and play or read for 5 minutes.
Hope that helps.
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Thanks ladymugg, yip that's what we are doing to.
I have another question for the group...... how long does you LO sleep for on the 1 nap and how long did it take for them to get there consistently?
We've had a bit of a rough day, wu was 3:50 and with a couple of resettles and hubby falling asleep on her bedroom floor we got to 6am. cn at about 8am for 15mins and down at 11:30 asleep at 11:35. We are sitting at about 1h15 minutes and I can't resettle her for any longer. She gets upset at me trying to resettle her, I get upset at her because she wont resettle. Then we had an epic meltdown (both of us) I had no idea what she was trying to communicate, I tried cuddling, leaving her, sitting beside her, teething gel, pamol and then some frozen fruit. As quick as it started it was gone and my happy LO was back?? Think I may have started it with getting frustrated that I couldn't resettle her and her picking up on it, plus the ever present molars coming/going.
Felt like I failed her :-[ think with 3 weeks of transitioning down to the 1 nap, ew and not long enough day naps we have an ot LO. Add to this I am trying to extend her bedtime to help combat the ew which are getting worse. Still managed a 6:10 bedtime tonight, but rubbish dinner and pretty rubbish bf so not sure what sort of night we will have.
Any suggestions? Feeling a bit stuck again.
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First of all don't worry about how much she ate/drank tonight. That's classic teething, being off the food. I think you'll find that it's the teething that's causing all those issue and. We had all 4 molars coming through over the past 2 weeks (about a week aho) and our day was pretty similar to yours... Short nap, early WU and off her food.
Just try and ride it out... Pamol when you can, lots of love and care and cuddles which you're already doing.
Throughout that time naps were averaging 1.15-1.39ish max but now we are through that stage back to 2-2.5hrs (but that's not every day mind you) and a 7am WU today even though it's usually 6/6.20ish.
I'm sorry I can't help more but I would be 99% sure all your issues you described are those molars! :(
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First mum, hugs and you are doing the best that you can. You haven't failed her. I know how frustrating it is because you know if she doesn't resettle, it is a very long A to BT. Hang in there, hun. The past few mornings I'm resettling DS almost every 1/2 hour to hour starting at 3:00am. We might be getting molars, too.
How did she go down at 11:30? FWIW, I think the 8am nap is too early. Since at this age the average A is more than 3.5 hrs (actually I think it's over 4 hrs), I wouldn't put her down for a CN until at least 3 hours after she wakes. I've heard that too early of a nap will cause sleep times to go off track. She may have been slightly OT or UT by 11:30 or the darned teeth may have bothered her enough not to resttle. I usually give meds 30 min before a nap when I know for sure he's uncomfortable. Would you be willing to try for the 9:00am CN and keep the 11:30? Any reason you're going for 8:00? Also, I started giving 20 min CN when I saw his main nap was consistently shorter. I figured sneaking in another 5 mins would be good. Watch her and perhaps she can make it to 11:45 with a 20 min CN at 9:00? Which would give you a shorter A to bed.
This transition is considered the hardest so again, hang in there. As you started when your LO was older, it probably won't take too much longer for her to settle into it and be able to handle the long A time. Ours started around 9/10 months so we were into it for months and months.
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Hugs first mum, I agree with Ginger that first CN is too early so in total the A times before her 'proper' nap probably weren't long enough to make her tired enough for a decent one, even though overall she was tired. We were doing more like 4h A, 15 mins CN, 2h A then main nap, or at least getting to 9/9.30am. You might not need that long but I do agree that 2h A before a CN is too little. It will come right in the end, just hang in there xx
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Posted my edit with you Katherine. Right on!
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Hi ladies
Just following along - a bit of background
My dd will be 1 at the end of this month. We've been on 2 naps since 6 months and in the last 3 months her naps have been very wonky. We've had teething, crawling etc too. But definitely seen a big jump in A times with her first A time being 4.5 hours now. She only JUST makes it! But I get a 1.5-2 hour nap. Have only been doing it for 6 days now - the first 4 days I had to resettle at the 30 min and 1hr05 marks. She's finally sleeping through cycles. We've only had 1.5hrs, 1.45hrs, 1.5, 2, 1.5, 1.5 nap lengths so far. If the nap ends around 1 I just do EBT at 5.30. She usually tacks on - not always though :-\ Last night we had a 4hr50min A to bed :o she was finding it hard to SS so I had to pat her bum. We had one OT wake 45mins after bed. Then 11.5hour sleep through until 5am. Then I fed her and she resettled until 7. So I guess I will try another 1 nap day with EBT. What sort of wake up time do you not allow a CN?
Also - have you had more success with a short CN at the beginning of the day or the end of the day?
My dd seems to need at least 2 hours A before bed so sometimes if I give her a CN at the end of the day the day ends up being way too long and then we get NW's.
Looking forward to chatting a long the way and sharing some advice too :)
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Oh forgot to ask - is it common for nap lengths to be on the shorter side at the beginning of the transition? Do they still think they're getting a second nap? Once they realise they're not, they start sleeping more like 2-2.5 hours?
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(((Hugs))) Ginger you must be shattered after that night - is that normal atm?
Hello Laura, good to see you again :) I'm afraid all I can say is that from DS I remember it taking a little while for that one nap to lengthen but it did happen - however not long after I had to start capping to preserve the nights! Sounds like you're doing well though, will let someone further along the process answer your other questions...
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Thanks Trimbler. You too. Hope you are well !
Well I knew the nice long sleeping through the nights were too good to be true 😩 last night was so bad. Despite a 1.45min nap and 4hrs15mins to bed we had cry outs every 10 mins for about an hour just 2 hours after going to bed last night. Then a wake at 5 then 6.15. OT behaviour you think ? Maybe I need to keep offering the 30 min late arvo catnap for a couple more weeks ?
What sort of routine are all you ladies doing at the moment and how old is your Lo ?
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Hi there
It depends on whether or not your LO is HSN or not... mine has about an 11-11.5 or 12hr (12 on the rarer side) night and then usually does 2 hrs during the day. But that isn't always the case. Depends what we have been up to - physical day, growth spurt, teeth can all make this longer or shorter.
Current routine is:
6/6.30am WU
8 am breakfast
11.15/11.30 lunch
11.30/12 sleep
1.30/2 WU (sometimes its 1pm, depends on the day)
3 pm snack
5.30 pm dinner
6.45 pm in bed, asleep
You can try for that CN but the closer your sleep gets to midday the less likely they are to take it. Very occasionally will my daughter (15mo) go for a CN, usually around 4 pm (I don't really leave this any earlier or later, as she is UT before 4 pm or if I go any later than 4 pm we are getting super close to BT). But I'm talking less than a handful of times since we went to 11.30am sleep that she will go for this.
I wouldn't stress too much about the length of sleep. I have found out the hard way that around this 15mo period is approx. when the 4 molars are about to hit and that can make sleep go a bit wobbly for a week or so. Also it is winter here and the cold season isn't helping some babies with that too.
Just go with the flow as I know you will, read those tired signs, and don't get too worried.
Hope that helps :)
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Oh dear sorry to hear that Laura, I've always assumed OT when mine have done that in the evening, especially because of the 5am WU which she resettled from. But could also be discomfort, maybe even more likely, idk... Sometimes with OT mine have just crashed out for 30-45mins and then had those typical OT NWs.
I'd felt more optimistic today when DD seemed to wake a bit later, not entirely sure when she woke but certainly better than previously, following a little nw around 3am and I think something around 11pm - can't quite remember now! Anyway DH called as I was leaving work to say she'd napped horribly and was going to have to do EBT - sure enough, she was down (though not asleep) by the time I got home :( My theory was that the later WU meant she probably needed a bit more taken off her short morning nap and so she wasn't quite ready to go down at the usual time, messed around and then did 40+40mins (UT becoming OT?), really tired all afternoon, apparently tried to lie down in the bath kind of on all fours face down, like she does in her cot! But DH wasn't convinced by that theory and thought it was discomfort - well, she does have a cold (although I thought she was getting over it) and he only medicated at BT (I'd been medicating before nap too as she was feeling rotten). Oh - and still no teeth whatsoever! So I get this niggling feeling that they're just taking a really long time to move up and causing her pain, but no facts to base that on :P Anyway, I'm thinking shave 5mins off the morning nap if we get a decent night with later WU, or not if it's a terrible night with EW... Btw we keep 'get up' time at 6.30 whatever happens, this is what DS's gro-clock is set for and it works well for getting ready for work - and CM drop off come September. I don't really want to move the nap times too much as I want to get to something that will work for the CM and school collection etc. So in theory we have few variables: morning nap length; pm nap (can move about 15mins each way and can allow a catch up atm but has to finish by 3pm by September); and BT. So should be simple, right? :P Sorry for,the rambles, I can't remember what I've already said here!
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Thanks ladymugg. My dad's only just 12months so even though she did well for the first 6 days on one nap with nice long nights and sleeping through, I don't this its sustainable as she's now soooooo OT!!!!
I cut her first A time yesterday to 4hrs10mins. She had to be resettled at the 35min mark then slept another 50mins. Then after 4hrs she had another hour nap. Then bed at 2.5hrs later. So quite a long day...she slept fine until midnight then we had another HORRIFIC night of waking every hour until wakeup at 5.30. Tried to resettle and she aitld for 10 mins or so then get frustrated again. She's getting her two teeth next to her top two at the moment. They're about to break the gum. So not sure if that's the reason.
Not too sure what to do on days where ages had very little night sleep. Will definitely be putting her to bed early!
Trimbler, definitely sounds like discomfort to me. I'm sure all those teeth will start coming down fast soon enough. She's probably dealing with heaps of pain? Poor wee things. What is your routine now ?
I really wanted to do the short am long pm but as you know I just couldn't get the second A time right 😣
I'm going to try this for a few more weeks
WU
4.15hrs - nap (hopefully 1.5)
3.5-4hrs - nap 30-45mins (depending on the night)
Bed 2.5hrs later (she doesn't go to sleep any earlier than 2.5hrs after a 30min nap
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Hi there,
our routine now is
7:30 WU
A time 5h30 min-6 hrs!
If it is less, DD has a shorter nap.
lunch
S 1h10min- 1h20
Snack
Dinner
BT 7:30
I've been waiting for her long nap for weeks. But it is not happening. Once in a while after not so good night she will nap for 2 hrs, but almost never two days in a row.
She is 12 months. We've started 2/1 transition when she was 8 m/old. LO is LSN.
Praise God her nights are good now. Although last week she was up once at night several nights and we had EW, where she needed a CN which almost doesn't happen now.
I know our A times are crazy long. But she seems to be ok and VERY ready for her nap :))
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Hi Ladies, thanks for the support. We've been trucking along and not doing to bad, unfortunately we have a sick LO again with yucky conjunctivitis, fever and the ever present teething (no teeth yet). The dribble has amped up over the last 2 days so I'm hopeful. The nap length is still a bit short for my liking but the last couple of days its been 90 minutes so who knows??
jessmum46 I actually try and avoid the catnap if possible as day-care are unable to settle her and she goes down a lot easier at 11:30 without it. I think 5.5 A is a good window for her. I'm aiming for the same on the other side with a 6:30 bedtime. I'm sure I've mentioned before but when it comes to breastfeeding I have a very sleepy baby and the early morning cn is when she falls asleep feeding, I've tried feeding sitting at the table, walking around, singing, jiggling and she will generally still fall asleep. I usually just slide her into the cot and set the timer for 15 minutes. In saying that it hasn't happened for a few days and we have been away so if it has happened she has been in the car and it is around 9-9:30. 12pm nap has suited us as we had plans over the weekend so I didn't worry too much. We had a pretty rough night with her last night and her morning hasn't been much better. Awake at 6:50 but resettled pretty much every hour since midnight and hubby an I took shifts on her floor. Very grizzly and cuddly and her eyes are just terrible, the fever seems to be less today, but I've been cycling with pamol and nurofen so it could be a result of that. CN on me at 9:40, just fell asleep sitting on the couch. I tried for nap at 11:45 but the builders next door where going crazy so no chance. Asleep at 12:20 and woke 20 mins later and took me another 15 minutes to settle and she is still asleep coming up 45 mins.
Have stretched her bedtime, and we are at 6:20 but last night we had a meltdown and she was down at 5:50. Feeling a bit low with everything. I think she is ot, but to be honest I have no idea. She is still not self settling to sleep during the day and I think that is contributing to my low mood. No sure if I am riding the wave or just treading water at the moment.
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Hey girls. How are you all doing this week ?
Trimbler this last week I've gone back to trying a short pm long am and so far it's working!! The am nap is only 30 mins and after 3hours Wt. Then I get a 1.5-2hr nap 3-3.5hours later. Night times have been so bad the last 5 nights though as dd has a sore throat. Took her to the doctor and he said it's very red. She sounds so sick 😔and she's teething right now too. Last night we had a Wu at 10.30, 12, 3,4,5,6 then went back to sleep at 6.30 for 10 mins 😣😣😣😣 Im so tired. But I'm guessing it's just her sore throat and teeth. She's not eating much during the day so I've been feeding her (bf) at night.
Can't wait until she's better and we cAn see if her new routine is right for her nights.. 😴😴😴😴😴
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Just an update... to add insult to injury my LO also go hand foot and mouth and has been miserable for the last 5 days :( Night sleep has been particularly hard with long awake times with lots of crying. I've spent a couple nights with her in my arms on a mattress on her floor as any attempt to move her has led to hysteria. We are getting a good stretch from bedtime but from about 1am she is really distressed.
Day naps have lengthened considerably, I'm guessing due to the illness and ot but am hoping the habit sticks around. The cn in the morning has been a bit of a movable feast with car rides being the flavour of choice. Nap has been consistently 12:25 for the past 3 days with either 2 or 3 hours sleep. 80% in the cot and some on me.
I'm thinking about weaning the morning bf and trying to stretch her to 11:30-12 for a good na and steering away from the cn?? Not sure ??
I've done alot of thinking over the last week and I think what is bothering me the most is the time I have to spend getting her to sleep both for day naps and at bedtime if for some reason she doesn't fall asleep feeding. We have had no independent sleep for 8 weeks when she first got sick and any attempt to leave her room at nap times leads to crazy hysteria. I am guessing illness, molars and SA are all at play here so have decided to try and put all my concerns aside for another month and just go with the flow.
Thoughts? Suggestions?
Thanks again
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Sorry to hear about all the illnesses, firstmum. Sounds like you might be really sleep deprived... I hope you've been able to find and steal times to rest.
What happens around 1am and what do you do? Have you already tried a dream medication?
I think weaning the morning bf and getting to a 11:30/12:00 nap is a good idea. FWIW, when I weaned off bf or milk at certain times, I offered a snack as a distraction at first. Or an activity. Whatever works best initially. Also, when I was trying to drop the CN in the morning and/or extend A, I had to offer a hearty snack and keep DS doing a physical activity around the 9:00/10:00 hours or fatigue would set in. We were fortunate enough to have a park only 10 min walking distance away, so I would always take him there around that time. Depends on the days, but now he can handle the long A's in the morning pretty well.
Regarding independent sleep... We've also been handling illness, molars, SA, and physical/mental developments here for the past few months and I did what you're thinking... to put concerns aside and help DS get through this. After almost 3 months, DS was able to go back to going down at BT giggling ( :o ) and self-settling throughout most of the night (besides times when I knew he was in discomfort). During the 3 months, I did a lot of things you're supposed to avoid for independent sleep. Most people on this forum would probably say that once they become ind sleepers, they can return fairly easily, so I was hopeful. I didn't know how long it would take before things would get better, but certain times were more conducive to applying gently sleep training (ie when he finally mastered walking, or after a tooth popped), so I would use gradual withdrawal techniques and such. We went back and forth and even last night, we were back to DS being held and sleeping on DH in the middle of the night.
So FWIW, that's what we did and what happened. Our LOs are 2 weeks apart, and close to Ladymugg's LO, so we're probably in similar phases. Molars being a big one and then the language/mental leap in a few months.
IMO, because your LO is going through so much right now, you can do whatever it takes to get the maximum amount of sleep for everyone, then as things drop off... implement strategies to encourage ind sleep.
What do you think?
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Laura, sorry about the illnesses too! Hopefully it'll pass soon. Glad to hear the short am/long pm is working. =) Keep us updated.
How are things Mariellamom, ladymugg, and trimbler?
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Thanks ginger413.
Sometimes all it takes is for me to come to a conclusion and I cope better. We had about 4 nights where somewhere between 1-3 she would wake with a terrible cry. The doctor had said she had sores on the back of her tongue and throat and I'm guessing that's when the pain meds wore off. Really hard to console, cuddles, rocking, shushing, singing. Nothing really worked. Once I could get the pain meds into her I just cuddled on the floor and rocked quite firmly telling her it was ok, mummies here, Livys ok, over and over. She would settle for about 20 mins and then start crying again :(
Last night was an improvement, bt 6:45 nw at 3:30 when I gave pamol, throat soother and sips of water. Back in bed after a cuddle. I heard her on an off with a little grizzle or cough till about 4:20. wu 6:45. She is happily playing in the lounge at the moment with a tower of blocks chatting away to herself.
I'm not going to offer the bf this morning and see what happens. I've been giving her a good size snack at 9am for the last week or so, so that could be contributing to her not wanting/needing the morning bf?
I'm hopeful about the independent sleep. Liv has always been really good at ss from about 7 months. We had about 3 weeks where it went out the window at 1 with 4 teeth coming at once and starting to walk and it came back. I'm going to stay positive and keep rolling with it.
xx
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Glad you had a decent night last night, firstmum. And your DD sounds so cute playing like that while ill.
Sounds like things are going well considering and also sounds like you have a good plan. Hope Liv gets well soon!
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Yes get well soon, Livy and (((hugs))) First mum.
Glad I's had good naps, Laura :) Again, hope she's feeling better soon, it's so hard when they're ill or teething or something else is up and we have no idea what baseline is in order to tweak accordingly...
Lovely to hear about giggling to sleep, Ginger ;D How's the sleep nowadays?
Katherine are you still here? No pressure, I know you're busy :-* ;)
Just an update from us, not feeling in a position to advise atm :-\ So she had a great day with DH sleep-wise on Thursday, actually not too bad when with him all week, it just all goes wrong due to her messing around at naptime when it's me ??? ::) I'm really not sure at all what the nights are like or when she wakes, since I've been sleeping in the living room - DH can sleep through most of it unless she really needs him, and in that case he can resettle her and go straight back to sleep again, unlike me, who'll stay awake the rest of the night ::) So he'll report back to me in the morning, but sometimes I forget to turn the monitor off so there have been nights where he thought she woke at 6 but I know she woke at 5 and had a short NW earlier on too. Not quite knowing what happens at night might make it harder to know what to tweak, but really I wasn't sleeping well in there and my mood's so much better now I'm in the living room. Just hoping her sleep will get better soon so I can sleep in my bed again! Anyway, the 'perfect' day last week went like this:
WU don't really know but always up at 6.30am whatever happens
Nap 1: 9.30-9.55am (capped)
Nap 2: 1-3pm (she woke herself at 3)
BT: 6.45pm - and a decent night, apparently :)
When it doesn't work she may mess around a bit for nap 1, but 15mins max; nap 2 however can be delayed up to 45mins, then she'll do 30mins before waking OT but resettle herself but then do a really bitty nap. May be ww, don't think it's UT. Anyway, my plan now (I think) is to just get her up at 3pm whatever, since she'll have to do that (or perhaps even a little earlier) once DS starts school next month. BT would ideally always be 6.30 or later, so I can get home from work in time to bf her. She's often/mostly(?) still waking around 5am, never sure if she resettled as DH doesn't know - he usually does regardless :P
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I'm still around but pretty much on one nap and powering through! It's not perfect but it's ok.
We have WU 6ish, nap 11.45/12-2, sometimes a bit shorter or longer, BT 7. Sleeps most of the night, still get some early NWs a lot of the time or a broken nap if it's at home is not uncommon (at nursery he sleeps in a bouncy chair ::) ) but it's going better than it was a month or two ago. Hang in there!
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Hello ladies, I have a question about this transition. My toddler is 17 months. He loves his 2 naps but soon is going to start daycare and they only put them down for one nap so I figured I might as well start preparing now.
His schedule is
7 am wake up
7:30 milk
10 am nap ( can go from 1 hr to 1.5)
12 lunch
2pm nap ( mostly lasts 1 hour)
4pm milk and snack
6;30 pm dinner
8 pm bedtime
I am slowly shortening the morning nap since he needs more awake time in the afternoon. Cutting it down to 1 hr. If he wakes at 11 his normal afternoon nap is after 3 hrs so at 2pm. What do I do with that? I move it earlier by 15 min increments. But if I shorten the mornign nap to 45 minutes and move the afternoon nap by 15 min they still dont fall at the same time. Should i stay at one hour morning nap and still move the afternoon nap earlier by 15 min increments?
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Sorry I don't quite understand what you're asking? If you are taking the short am, long pm route you gradually shorten the morning nap and move the afternoon nap earlier so you end up with one nap at lunchtime :)
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Hi Ladies, hope all is well with your LOs and this interesting :P transition (me being positive!!)
We are doing better! Trucking on with the 1 nap, we are flexible between 11:30-12 which seems to be working. We are getting between 2-2.5 hours with the occasional horrible blip of a 30 minute nap occurring at daycare, but I am refusing to let it bug me :) If we have a morning activity I try and time the car ride for around 9am so we are getting a 15 cn.
The ew have also settled and are a bit more consistent for 6:30-7:15am which is nice. I think this is partly because I have shifted her bedtime from 6pm asleep to between 6:20-6:45 depending on how her afternoon has gone.
I have a couple of questions.
1.With mixing up her bedtime I was hoping that she would be awake when we finished her bf to put her down more awake, this isn't happening. She feeds pretty solidly right until I pop her off, I give her a cuddle and pop her in the cot, help her to roll onto her tummy and I get the occasional eye flutter but that's it. Would you suggest I wake her more?
2. When we do have an ew it is usually on the days where she sleeps longer than 2hours or after 2pm for her nap. Do you think this is related?
Thanks in advance
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Hi Ladies,
I've been on this transition for almost a week now. Since he needs longer hours in the afternoon, I'm moving earlier the afternoon nap and capping the morning nap. The problem is that my Lo is UT for the afternoon nap. Today was like this
7 am WU
10:15-11:15 nap ( I woke him up)
put him down for nap at 1:30 and took me until 2:30 to make him sleep
Previously his afternoon nap was at 2pm but by putting him down earlier he sleeps even later!
How to prevent this?
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Cut his morning nap shorter x
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Thanks Jessmum, will try that tomorrow xo
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Firstmum - just to clarify, now she's waking later in the morning and she's dropping off at the breast between 6.20-6.45pm? Or has she already fallen asleep by this time whilst feeding? If you want to put her down awake then you may need to rouse her whenever she starts to doze off - sit her up or something and then let her continue, perhaps? But at the same time I wouldn't want to change something that's working :P On your second question, I do think they could be related, perhaps try not letting her sleep more than 2h or beyond 2pm and see if that helps? However you may eventually want to push that whole nap later in the day (as well as pushing BT back), so hold that 'no napping beyond 2pm' rule loosely, if you do decide to adopt it. Do you find that she has an EW if she naps beyond 2pm or longer than 2h on days where she's had a morning CN or on days without? I'd lean towards letting her sleep longer if it's her only nap, iiwm, but you know your Dd best ;)
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Nothing to report here. Dd is sick, again !!!! It's winter here and there is a horrible upper respiratory bug going around. I've had it too. Have had a rough couple of nights as dd is so blocked up. Tried a vaporiser in her room last night and she only woke at 3.30 so not as bad as the night before. As she's sick Im letting her sleep when and as long she wants. Looking forward to getting back to the new routine when she's better. I feel like we keep going backwards at the moment😞 glad you are all having some success this week 😊
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Ha ha we're not!! DS is finally cutting his last canine plus had a bit of illness so it's been a total disaster zone. He is very OT right now, was up with him from 4.45am today and only got him back off just after 6. Am just letting him sleep as long as he will and playing the day by ear today. Will be one nap but will be a bit flexible on timings. So rubbish when things finally seemed to be settling, I hate teeth! Dreading 2y molars with this one, they were awful with DD and she wasn't even a bad teether!
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Firstmum - just to clarify, now she's waking later in the morning and she's dropping off at the breast between 6.20-6.45pm? Or has she already fallen asleep by this time whilst feeding?
Hi Trimbler, Since starting daycare I can count on 1 hand how many times she is awake/sleepy when I put her down. If it is actual daycare days or the first couple after usually within the first 5 minutes her eyes are closed and I jiggle to keep her feeding. She never drops off :-) I always break the latch, my time limit is usually between 8-10 mins each side. Other days its usually towards the end of the 2nd side that she dozes and again I jiggle to keep her going. She has such a sleepy association with bf. This was the reason I stopped her after brekkie feed a couple of weeks ago. We were getting a 5:30-6:30 wu and she was falling asleep feeding between 7:30-8:30.
I do wonder if it contributes to her nw being asleep when I put her down rather than self settling? We can have nw a couple of nights a week anywhere from 1:30-4:30 which we have been attributing to teething or coughing. Its 50/50 if she with resettle, usually with the coughing she will, but if its a painful cry I will go and whisper soothing words to her and if due give her pain meds. Thankfully she resettles easily about 80% of the time. The nw have started since her molars have been moving and bulging so that was why we thought teething but someone mentioned to me that it could be because she doesn't self settle anymore?
?!? bit unsure what to do. We are happy with the later bedtime. We've gone from starting bf at 5:30 to on non daycare days to starting at about 6:20 which is really nice as we get more family time in the evening. She really is a tired lo!! We are trying to just let her lead us but the eventual plan would be a 7pm bedtime. Am thinking the move to the toddler room at daycare in the next couple of months may help push her nap and then we can hopefully get that around the 12:30-1 time which will in itself solve the bedtime :-)
If we are aiming for a 7pm bedtime what time would you suggest the nap and for how long?
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So far it's been a disaster...he was napping fine before starting this transition...maybe I should have just staid there :(
It's taking me 45 min every time to put him to sleep/nap
Our schedule today was
7 am wu
10:15 CN but didn't fall asleep until 11 ( i woke him up at 11:30)
1:15pm nap but didn't fall asleep until 2pm ( woke up by himself at 3:30)
7:30 BT but didn't fall asleep until 9 pm
Should I just remove the morning nap all together? We 've been on this transition only for a week. Or am I doing anything wrong?
Help please!
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Hi Jazelle, how old is your LO?
My experience was the transition seemed to settle once I completely dropped down to 1 nap. At the time I didn't recognise what was going on with the naps shortening and struggling to get her down, we had illness and teeth so took me a while to figure it out. We started with nap at 11 and if she woke before 1pm I did everything I could to get her back to sleep. Bedtime was moved to 6pm.
I think it took about 3 weeks of slowly moving everything forward and we now nap between 11:30am and 12 for between 2-2.5 hours and bedtime is between 6:15 and 6:45pm.
We are now trying to stick with a consistent bedtime regardless of nap length but really trying for no earlier than 6:15pm.
We still have a morning cn on maybe 3/7 mornings. This is no later than 9:30am and is capped at 15 minutes. If this happens then I am flexible with her big nap time.
I hope this is helpful.
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Hey firstmum:) what age was your Lo when you just went to one nap ? Also how long was that first wake time when you started ? My dd has been sick so have abandoned the push in a times for now and have been letting her sleep for however long. But before illness she was doing 4.5 hrs first WT. Sleeping only 1.5-1.75 mins. And no way I could get her to resettle after that.
As soon as she's better Im planning on pushing again. And hoping the nap lengthens. How long did it take until you could stop resettling? 3 weeks ? My dd will be 13 months in a week.
We were doing short am long pm. But that's stopped working again and she won't settle for either nap until close to 3.5/4hrs of WT 😒
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Hey Lauraims, my LO was 14 months. Now 15.5. I think she may have been trying to drop down to 1 nap from about 13.5 months but as she had a cold and molars moving I was placing the blame on short naps and difficulty in settling down to that. I got advice from one of the ladies here who suggested I try 1 nap and as her sleeps at daycare were shocking I figured we would give it a go.
To begin with it was all a bit of a mess, we were have ew from about 5:30-6:15 so I think the first couple of days there was no way I could get her to 11am as she would have been awake 5.5hours, which I was terrified of :-[ I messed about with a cn between 8:30-9:30 for a few days and had a couple of looooong afternoons, but she was sound asleep by 6pm so we had a couple of bonuses! In that first week she was only doing 40 minutes stretches and I'd resettle with some bum rubbing and shushing. I spent a couple of days sitting beside the cot to anticipate her waking and push her through. Then we had a couple of 90 min runs and two weeks down and 90 mins were stretching to 120 and 120+ I haven't had to resettle since she stretched to 90mins plus. Sometimes for me I need to set a time in my head "if she sleeps 90 mins I'll be happy" and then I don't try and resettle. Does that make sense?
Daycare days are messy, she wont cn in the morning so can do 5.5-6 A in the morning and because she has such poor sleeps there her afternoon A time can be about the same. It was seeing her do this and realising that she was ok that gave me the confidence to push her A time at home as well. My LO has always been really good with set times for naps. I never got good tired signs so found it easier to just push to the chosen time and have only recently looked at the A time. Most days now my aim is 11:45 but try and be flexible 15 mins either side.
Does that help?
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Thanks FIrstmum,
My Lo is 16.5 months. I will give it a go at cutting the CN all together and just go with one nap.
I was confused by the fact that with 2 naps everything was fine and since we started this transition everything went bad. Wish me luck
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Hey everyone,
Hope it goes well Jazelle, not wanting to confuse you but tbh looking at when you were trying to put her down, I wasn't surprised that she took a while to get off. Mine have both had odd days where they've struggled with the morning UT CN, however mostly it was ok. The trick is to make sure they're tired enough for the pm nap, also to keep everything really consistent so they know exactly what to expect. For example I find mine is ok most of the time going down in the pm, unless we have a picnic lunch out, and then she seems just ready to play when we get home and not sleepy .at the usual time! You might find that yours handles a big jump really well, some do, but if not, you could always try stretching that A before the pm nap.
Eg we do:
Up 6.30
Nap 1: 9.30-9.55
Nap 2: 1-3
BT 6.45-7
Naps aren't too bad atm, depending on circumstances, but nights are still awful! I keep wondering whether it's possible that multiple NWs including during the evening could be UT rather than OT - I'd always been conditioned to believe it must be OT but now I'm not so sure?? Maybe I should push BT but we did pretty recently, it did seem to help with EWs but we still get loads of NWs so maybe she only tends to sleep a bit later because she's been up all night :P
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Hi Jazelle, what prompted you to drop to 1 nap?
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Hi Ladies, quick question.
My LO is 15.5 months and has been on 1 day nap for about a month now. Awake time in the morning is becoming more and more consistent of 5-5.5 hours with a 2-2.5 hour nap and bedtime after 4.5-4.45 awake. We are getting nw after about 7-7.5 hours and more often than not needs help to get back to sleep. Really performs if its Dad which is leading to a tired mum. On a good night she will resettle with reassuring words and a quick back rub (max 5 minutes), other nights I can sit beside the cot or lie on the floor and resettle every 15 ish minutes with words and rubs for up to 2 hours ???
Would you suggest stretching her awake time in the afternoon to a similar 5 hours, could this be ut before going to bed? This is what our day usually looks like...
A 6:30-7
B 7
S 9
L 11
Nap 11:30
S 2,3,4 ;D
D 5
BF 6:15
Asleep 6:30-6:45
I have been giving nurofen before bed as molars have been giving her grief and assumed the 7.5 hour wake up coincided with pain meds wearing off as she is generally really upset when she wakes. I often hear her cough or give a grizzle at other times in the night but she self settles back to sleep after this (if she wakes at all??).
nw usually only crop up when unwell or teething and the poor bubba has had illness after illness for almost 3 months.
TIA x
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Thanks for that first mum. That really helps! Day two of pushing a times. I put her down at 4.5 hours waketime and she self settles within 10 mins. Yesterday she woke at the 1 hr Mark but managed to get her to resettle for another 35mins. Early bt. Because of the early Bt wake up is around 5.45!!! So today there's no way she cAn only have one nap. Don't know what to do on these days ? I want to keep morning nap consistant after 4.5hrs Wt in hopes that her body will get used to it and the nap will lengthen. But today that only took us to 11.45!!
She's been sleeping way better at night since stretching a's. Makes me think all her night wakings on two naps were due to UT!
Hope someone can help you with your query 😊
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Lauraims are you getting pm nap refusal? If you get an EW and pm nap refusal is an issue I think you need to try a different tactic for those days otherwise you will perpetuate a long OT cycle by having nap too early and a long A to bed. I used to go for a catnap around 9.30am of 15-20 mins then put down again for second nap around 2-2.5h later. Then try again the next day. The 2-1 I found was one time where we couldn't be totally consistent every day as some times LO just couldn't make it.
First mum those sound like teeth wakings to me :( Have you tried a dream meds?
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Hey luv. Not everyday do we have pm nap refusals but she'll only take one If its at the 4hr+ Mark. What sort of length catnap should I let her have in the arvo if she does a 1.5 first nap do you think ? Short am long pm was working for about 3 weeks while she was sick. 1hr am, 1.5-2hr pm. But I'm wondering if that's why her nights were bad, too much day sleep. She'd be up every hour from
About 3am!!
Last night was good. Bed at 6.45, woke at 5..took me an hour to resettle her though !!
Argh it's just so tricky 😌 i would like to hang onto two naps for a while longer as I thinks he needs it. Just don't know how many more of the horrible afternoons I can take trying to make her have a catnap. Is it pretty normal to have to APOP the second catnap at this stage ?
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I think quite a few do APOP the pm CN, but as you know, I really don't have a feel for long/short, sorry! I'm expecting wonky sleep now anyway as DD is settling in with the CM... So although I feel more stretching/capping coming up, we'll probably put that on hold whilst she naps badly etc. But maybe I'll be surprised? :)
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First mum those sound like teeth wakings to me :( Have you tried a dream meds?
Is that just like a dream feed?
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Hmm I really need to work out what I want to do. I know she likes a longer a to bed. But with having to APOP a catnap that doesn't really work, as it can take ages to get and then it's very late in the day.
Maybe I need to try and shorten her first nap right down to 25minutes like you're doing Trimbler. How old is your lo again ?
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She's 14mo :) I do like short/long because if they do go down for the first UT nap (less likely as they get older) then you know they're at least going to get their two naps because they can't get through the day on 20mins, or whatever you're capping at ;) Also if you know she likes a long A to bed then short/long can give you that if they take a nice long pm nap... But as we all know, that's a big 'IF' :P
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Well, that didn't go to plan !! Put her down at the 3hour mark and she's currently still awake at the 4.5 hour mark !!! Playing around! Got her up after30 mins and put her back in at 4 hours. Argh!!!
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Arghhhhh.. So she doesn't fall asleep until 4hrs45mins then only sleeps 1hr10mins. I tried to resettle for 45 mins too. What the ?!!! I haaaaaaaaate this transition soooo much. Now I have no idea when to try for a catnap 😣😣😣😣😣 how on earth do babys cope with going cold turkey to one nap?!!! Oh how I'd love a 1.5hour first nap 😞
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Oh dear sorry, I feel responsible :-[ Well I guess she's not one for going down UT unless she's ill? So in the end she went down after a very slightly longer than usual overall A time, but that included two lengthy periods in her cot where she wasn't settling? So she probably wouldn't have been as tired as she would have been after 4h 45mins proper up time and I guess that's why she didn't sleep so long. How was the rest of the day and night? Does sound to me like you're just going to have to push... When you have APOP'd a pm CN, how long was it? Can you make it really short, like just 10mins? As you know I don't really have a feel for long/short, but it does sound like she prefers her long A times...
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She always used to like a short first a!! But I guess with me pushing over the last couple of days her body's like, ummmm no I'm not ready yet !! Oh no hun it's not your fault !!! It's so great having others to chat to about this ! Will just continue on with the longer first A and hope that nap starts to lengthen. And I'll have to come to terms with the fact that from about 4/4.30-5 she'll be having a catnap on me for a while! Lucky she's the only child 😜 how is your dd getting on ?
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Yeah they just need to get that little bit older don't they, and we need to wait it out the best we can in the meantime :P you surely can't be far from one nap though, hang on in there!
DD's ok, well her naps are usually ok (well more often than not at the moment) and BT seems to have got better, but the nights are still not great, several NWs and usually EW... Wondering if I need to push BT further, but don't want to do that after a bad EW like this morning as she's just be OT. Then again in some ways it's easier having the good naps to fit around DS and CM etc, rather than having good nights and bad naps.
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Hi Ladies, what are the main reasons for capping a long lunch nap? I don't think I have a problem yet..... but its jumping around in the back of my mind?!?!?
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You might need to start capping it if they start struggling to settle for BT early enough to get enough night sleep. What's 'enough' will vary between LOs, after the 2-1 we found DS got really tired the next day if he'd had less than 11h. Or you might start to get UT nights, perhaps with nw and/or EW, so you need to cap so that they're tired enough to get enough night sleep in again. Does that make sense? If you're not having these issues, enjoy the long nap ;)
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Thanks Trimbler! It's only early days but I have noticed her overnight sleep is creeping back from 12-10 as her day nap is stretching from 2-3 hours. Think I'll watch for another week and if it continues I might tweak it a little bit.
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With DS I found that just shaving 15mins off his long nap made a noticeable difference ;)
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Hey Trimbler:) hope your weeks going good. And hi to the other ladies 😊 I've been trying a capped 30 min nap then a longer nap again, as her 1 nap after 4.5hoUr Wt was too short. Basically just trying to prolong the two nap thing for a couple more months (or 1 month 😁).
Monday we started new routine. 3-3.5hours first WT, depending on how good her night was. She won't go down at 3hours if she had a good night.
So a bit like this
WU anywhere between 6/7.
3-3.5 hours
Nap - 30mins
3-3.5 hours - 1.5-1.75 mins
In the afternoon it takes her 10-20 mins to fall asleep but she's definitely not fighting the nap like she used to if we let her sleep however long she wants in the morning, which is great.
However, bedtime and after the afternoon nap is weird. She seems soooo tired.
Almost OT when I put her down at 2.5hours after waking up from nap. I would of thought she would beable to handle at least 3hours. She's Also taking 30 mins of on and off crying to get to sleep. I don't intervene as it upsets her more. She's been waking between 4/5.30. I feed her then she goes back to sleep for 1-2hours. So getting between 10.5-11.5 hours of night sleep.
Hmmmm not too sure how to proceed...maybe it's just a phase ? The bedtime battle I mean ?
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Hi ladies, think we need a tweak and was hoping for your suggestions. Our day is looking like this
we 6-6:30
cn 9 (capped 15 mins)
nap 11:30 (2-3 hours)
bt 6:45
The later bedtime is a new thing which we are liking as it seems to have stopped the ew BUT they are creeping back. For about the last week or so her nights are getting shorter and she is waking between 4:30-5:30 again. We were getting about 11.5 hours over night and combined with the nap I was happy with how much sleep she was getting. Nights are now about 10-10.5 and with her incisors just cutting the nw can be quite long. So really isn't getting enough sleep.
I like the 11:30 nap where it is because if she wakes 2-2:30 I still have a good awake period before a 7pm bedtime. So I'm guessing the cn needs to go. My only concern is she is ot at the mo and also has a bit of sleep debt building up because of the short nights, ew and nw. She is also pretty wobbly on her feet and accident prone because of the ot. Its a bit dog eat dog really :-\
Any suggestions?
tia x
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First mum, do you think the EWs are due to OT and she may need EBT to catch up? Or will she not catch up after EBT? Please ignore if you think that would just lead to even earlier EW :P If you were able to get her to catch up then perhaps you could try pushing BT back a bit once she's well rested again? I wouldn't worry about BT getting late during the 2-1 before making the switch.
Laura - hmmm... Well, sleep's not so great here this week, but thanks for asking ;) so not feeling in the best place to give advice :P Do you think she needs to sleep a bit longer for her long nap, when she wakes? Or do you already give her a chance to resettle and she just can't? Clutching at straws here... Could she be having a growth spurt? I only ask as she's taking a feed at the EW - or is that just to get her back off again and not really a proper feed? Have you tried a slightly shorter A time between the naps? I think that's probably what I would try next, 1.5h after a decent A time can be OT, mine will often have a little cry around then and go back to sleep again for another 30mins. My own feeling with short/long is you want to be gradually moving the pm nap earlier as the am nap gets shorter, and stretching the last A time to BT, but perhaps she's already tired out after up to 7h A time total before the pm nap with just a 30min am nap, iyswim? So then she struggles to do a longer A to BT. What do you think?
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First mum, do you think the EWs are due to OT and she may need EBT to catch up?
Thanks Trimber yip I think your right its the ot. We did ebt last night, just 15 minutes early and she woke at 5:30 and I could hear her playing in her cot happily till 6am when she shouted for attention :P No cn today and doing well so far.
We are goin to do the ebt for a few more days and see how she goes.
Thanks
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Ok so she may have ended up with a little more night sleep than she has had recently? Hope that continues and you can get back on track - EWs can be so frustrating!
We've had rough nights, not sure how much is discomfort and how much needing to push, so trying some gentle BT pushing and we'll see what happens. She finally has a tooth which feels nearer the gum than the others, so perhaps her first tooth will cut in the next few weeks...
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Teeth are so frustrating aren't they! We had a night waking at 10pm last night and I can see the incisor just about to break the gum. When I put gel on her gums she wimpered :-[
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Thanks Hun, I see what you mean. Makes sense. I have to APOP that first nap. So going forward. Should I give her a 45 min morning nap, or try have her going to sleep at 3hours WT and no later after the 30 min nap ? OR do I need to shave off the morning nap by 5 mins ? She does still seem tired after a 1.5-1.75 afternoon nap. But won't resettle at all.
She woke up at 5.15 am this morning, was asleep by 6.50... So not sure what that's all about. Trying to wean the early morning/night feed. So usually I would of fed her and popped her into bed with me and she would sleep another hour or so. Didn't do that this morning. And she wouldn't settle. Just cried. I wonder if instead of just giving her a quick cuddle in the morning, and leaving her, I should stand by her cot and resettle? Then she'll get used to going back to sleep at this time without a feed?
I've finally cut the BF before the morning nap too 👏 now just got before arvo and night to go !
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Laura I'm thinking those 1.5-1.75 naps are OT, not tired enough to resettle (I rarely have success resettling after an hour of nap even if DS is tired) but not long enough to be rested. I'd be tempted to pull the pm nap slightly earlier after the 30 minute am nap and see if that makes a difference to nap length or how rested she is in the afternoon. With your mornings I would probably resettle her if you can, if DS wakes early he will rarely go back if I WIWO but if I lie next to his cot and shh or give him a gentle back rub he will at least try to sleep again. In any case I feel it's more restful than crying until WU time.
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Same here Laura, anything earlier than 6am and we try to resettle. Sometimes success and other times she is just quiet and restful. Early start for us :-[
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Hi ladies,
Quick question... when LOs are ill and they happen to sleep in, what have you done with nap times? Just watch for signs?
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I've tended to let them sleep in a maximum of half an hour (if on one nap) and tried to keep the nap around the same time, but pd earlier if they obviously need that, and let them nap as long as they need, again do EBT if necessary. Depends on how ill they are etc, but sometimes they just need loads more sleep for a day or two. Get well soon, Max :-*
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Get well Max :-* I've just tended to let them sleep on and then watch for cues but often nap around the normal time x
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Me too. When Im's sick I just let her do what she wants.
Ok thanks ladies. She's 13.5 months now. Do you think I possibly need to cut the morning nap back to 25 mins to achieve a longer afternoon nap ?
I put her down at 2hrs50mins but she doesn't actually fall asleep to 3.15-3.30hrs.
We stayed at parents in law last night as we're painting. So wasn't the best night, I had to settle her to sleep for bt, so of course we had some NW's. 😣 hopefully tonight is better.
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Yip same here. I try to keep nap about the same and go for an ebt.
Fingers crossed for a better night Laura.
My lo is nearly 16 months and we started the transition officially at about 14.5 months. For the month prior to that her morning sleep was around the 30 minute mark about 3.5 hours after wu. I stayed there for about a month and then reduced to 15 minutes. This is when she started to really lengthen her main nap. I was giving the cn about 5 days a week as she is in daycare 2 days and it never happens. On really busy active days I can push her through and found this was happening more and more. We are now 5 days no cn and she goes down really well at 11:30 for 2-2.5 hours. I'm always watching for signs but more often than not now the morning has flown by and we are sitting down to lunch together.
I think if you try anything you need to do it for about a week so you can really see the benefits (or not) and then you can tweak again as needed. We are now at the point where I don't look at the a time (unless its a super ew) and go with a set nap time. I know I've always got an ebt up my sleeve if needed.
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Thanks first mum. What A time did you do after the 30 min catnap ?
I've been doing it for 2 weeks now. :)
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It was when I was still hanging on to the 2 naps so the 30 mins was at 9am and then down again at 1pm, so 3.5 hours awake. Both naps were rubbish and it took me awhile to "click" that it was time to change. We tried cold turkey for a couple of days with 1 nap which was about 10:45 and just rode out the afternoon with an ebt, couple more days and pushed to 11 and again couple more days and got to 11:30. I stayed here for about another week still keeping an ebt of 6pm. The ew started to creep in and I thought she wasn't doing too well so found that a short cn in the car on the way to something at 9am was helping. Kept the nap at 11:30 and over the space of 5 days the length of her main nap got better and better. This had the knock on of stretching her bedtime back out to about 6:45.
We had a couple of battles for the 11:30 nap so I figured it was time for the cn to go. Since taking the cn away bedtime has settled at 6:30 and will keep it here for a bit, before trying to push for 7pm.
Does that make sense?
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Great description of your plan, firstmum. How are things lately?
Lauraaims, how was the night?? Hopefully better than the other night with Nws. And to echo firstmum, I also reduced CN to 15 min for a little while before dropping it.
Thanks ladies and Katherine and Trimbler for the feedback on lay ins. Naps have been horrible for us the past couple of days (45min or less) and today, resistence but thankfully he fell asleep. He's slept well enough before even with congestion so not sure what it is. Molars? Last night was very restless for both of us. Many NWs.
We were on our way to a set 12:15 nap time with around 6:00am WU until he got congested and nights were so broken. Before this we were hovering around 11:45/12:00. Naps were inconsistent between 1.10-2.20. Not sure what causes the shorter naps. His nights also vary,10-11 sometimes around 9 (regardless of nap length).
Katherine, how's B at nursery and home for naps? Nights? And is he better? (Will also check in BC ;)
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Hey Ginger, that sounds really rough! Have you tried a vaporiser? I know not for everyone but we have found it a life saver. Livy has had 3 really bad colds this winter and the coughing at night got really bad. We noticed an immediate improvement once we started using one.
Otherwise we are doing ok! I've given notice at Livy's daycare as I'd just had enough of the inconsistency and them not following our routine at home. It was only 2 days a week but the 3 days following are rough as she is so ot. I have enrolled her with a homebased carer and we start at the beginning of October. My next challenge is to get her ss for her lunchtime nap and undoing all the bad habits since starting daycare. Any tips welcome :-)
How was your night Laura?
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Argh would love tips on self settling for arvo nap too ! Ever since Im started crawling she started finding it hard to ss. She can at night, but hardly ever for the arvo nap.
I have to stand next to her until she falls asleep.
I'm hoping once she goes to just the one nap it'll be easier for her. This two nap thing can be so tricky !! I tried today again for a 3hour WT before arvo nap, but she just doesn't fall asleep until 3.5. Still asleep now but only been 45mins so far.
Night was good!! Well, asleep at 7, WU at 5..back to sleep 5.30-6.30.
Her long 12-12.5hour nights are over Im afraid.
Yes Ginger, the vapourisers with a decongestant oil in it are amaaaaazing !!!
Hope the bugs go away quick.
Looking forward to summer here ! It's been such a cold sick winter for us too FirstMum!
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Hey ladies yes we are doing good when teeth and colds don't get in the way :) I woke B after 2h from his nap yesterday and he slept 11.5h overnight :D Hooray, it's so nice when it works!! He sleeps well at nursery, a little too well at times ::) believe me not a problem I thought we'd ever have! But we've had a lot of BT resistance when he does a nap much over 2h hence the starting to cap. Though randomly sometimes he'll only have an hour or so then BT is rather OT and silly....
I think we are done with 2-1 - yay. Hang in there everyone x
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Hi ladies, hope all is will with you all!
My lo has been pretty consistent with 1 nap at 11:30 for some time now. Did you experience a really tired phase with your LO? My LO is 16 months nearly 16.5 and the last week or so has really struggled to make it to 11:30 and even snuck in a cn on Sunday. Today I sounded like a total banshee trying to keep her awake heading to the supermarket. She has shortened her nights slightly with an on-going cough but if its quite significant I just do an ebt. If anything leading up to this I thought we were heading to a new nap time of 12.
Any ideas?
TIA x
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Help!!!! Eva is now 13 months and we have been struggling with EW since march :(. I was just abut starting to accept she was LSN as we only seem to get 10-10.5 at night regardless to daytime sleep. We went on holiday a few weeks ago and I thought we had cracked the routine, we were getting long naps (still 2) and although BT was falling later than at home things we more consistent, sme night were still 10.5 but naps were good. This continued for about 2 weeks back home, managing to get 11 hours at night and 1.5-2 hrs daytime, then it fell apart again :(. We are now getting EW, short naps. I don't really know what to do tbh, my head says early BT but I am getting so much resistance from hubby who says later. Our older daughter was always a nightmare with early rising and his argument is I never got her sorted and we did things my way then. I really don't know where to go from here and feel really lost, she used to be such a good sleeper then it just changed overnight. Everyday at the moment is all over the place, but this is what we aim for.
WU 5am
1st nap 9 for 30 mins
2nd nap 12.30-1pm but this could be 40 mins or 1hr 10
BT 7pm
We have tried longer am nap and then had longer A time inbetween also.
Today she did 30 mins am and 1hr pm.
She self settles but suddenly cant get herself through next cycle.
I need help putting a plan together, I do have to do school run in the pm so that afternoon nap cant finish anylater than 3pm.
Thank you x
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First mum - canines?? Major tiredness and not making nap time here when those hit :(
M&E - will she go down earlier after a 30 min nap? My instinct would be you a getting OT second naps so I'd pull back second nap to say 12 and see what happens x
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Hi, she may go down earlier. I put her down to bed tonight at 6.15, so goodness knows what time she will wake :o. So would you suggest sticking to 9 ish for a 30 min nap and then bring 2nd nap to 12? what about BT if she still cat naps? or has a decnt nap what time for BT. Sorry to bombard you with questions, need to attack this head on ;D
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Hi M&E this sounds similar to what my lo did betwen13-14 months before we started dropping to one nap. I brought that first nap right back to 15 mins and had a set nap at 11:30. It took a couple of weeks to get to 11:30 we had a couple of 10-10:45 naps which I would do ebt. Bedtime for a few weeks or so was 6pm and its only now we are stretching her back to 6:30. ebt is always my go to if we have short nights or rubbish nap. My lo is usually good at tacking on.
I tried a couple of 7pm bedtimes to see if it helped with the ew but all it did was make her more ot. We have accepted that when stuff is going on she will ew. Its usually 5:15 (5:20 today) but thankfully we are now at a place where she will play and chatter until just after 6 when she shouts out for daddy ;)
Do try and resettle with the ew?
Have you tried one nap?
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Well we went for an earlier night and got 11hours!!!! so that's a result, no idea what to do today lol x
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Take the win!!
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Hey ladies how are we all going?
Trimbler I just read your thread before...so frustrating isn't it...Im definitely no expert as am dealing with my own issues at the moment..
But if I was you I would MAYBE - cap the morning nap even further?? You know her best though. Or - another option -
APOP the arvo nap to make sure she is getting two hours for a good few days to get rid of the OT - then reduce the morning nap by 5 or 10 mins?
We were going pretty well until the weekend when dd got a bad temperate - and sore throat/virus.
Nights obviously got pretty bad...and still are as I think because I've been letting her sleep an hour in the morning - to catch up cause she's been so tired as she's been sick - she's then sleeping two hours in the arvo - and her TWT is so low - she's then staying up for an hour sometimes an hour and a half usually around 3.30am!!! Too much day sleep?? She's a lot better now - so am going to start capping morning nap again as before she got sick she was doing really well.
We were doing
WU (Around 6/6.30) She was having 1 NW at 5/5.30 and previously I was feeding her and bringing her into our bed..But we stopped that and she only whinges for 10 mins then goes back to sleep. YAY
Nap - 3 to 3.15 hours after wake up for 45mins
Nap - 3.15-3.5 hours after MN for 1.5-2 hours
Bed - at 7
My DD will be 14months at the end of this month for reference.
These times were here and there - but pretty much like this..and she was STTN..For a week!! Then she got sick!
so we're back to trying this routine again...Ahhhh it never ends hey!!!
Hope everyone else is going ok??
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Any one have ideas or experience on what a long NW means? We've started capping morning nap again. Back down to 30 mins as dd is better now. But still getting two cry outs at around 2hours after bed, then at around 1.30 ss quickly. Then a full wake up at around 3.30/4. This Wu she requires a cuddle and she's quite upset. She eventually calms down but she then tosses and turns and babbles a bit for an hour to an hour and a half... ??? Then goes back to sleep for exactly 1hr40mins then up at 6.10!!
Any ideas ? These long NWs started when she got sick last weekend. Before that she'd either not wake up or settle herself within 10mins.
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Hi Laura!
We were having lots of Nws not too long ago and I don't know exactly what to attribute to it. You could certainly try several things but it'll probably take a while to see what works or doesn't.
People have suggested:
Extending A times
Capping morning nap further
Capping total daytime nap to 2 hrs
All the while medicating if you see signs of teething
What are your thoughts on what your LO is going through?
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We have had two semi successful day/nights. Putting to bed at 6.15, we are getting 11 hours at night and 1hr 30 total in day with a 5.15 Wu, so not great on the WU but felt more confident. Then there was yesterday!!!! I messed up big time :(. We had a 30 min nap in am as normal, then she dropped in a whopping 2 hour nap in the pm, finishing at 2pm. I was unsure what to do with BT given the longer nap time, I didn't want to push A time too long, and worried about pushing Bt out too late so I kept A time at 4.5 and went with 6.45BT, she was fussy and went down like a dream, until 4.30!!!! when she woke for the day :'(.
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Hi mamas,
I would love your advice! Over the last couple of months our daughter who is now almost 13 months has been on interesting schedule. Although its been super consistent. We were traveling and when we got home it seemed to be the only thing that worked although it hasn't been a typical schedule for her age.
7:30-8am wake, nurse
11-11:30Nap 30mins, Nurse
12 lunch
3:30-5 nap 1.5 hours nurse
5:30 dinner
7:45 6oz bottle
8pm asleep by 8
Over the past couple of weeks she's been pushing out her naps. She often won't take her second nap until 4pm or later. She isn't always going to bed so easy and she's been waking up much earlier in the morning normally around 6:30.
Do you think she's beginning to drop her morning nap? What would you suggest?
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Well as I predicted today has been a mess :(, 30 mins nap at 8am, she was falling asleep on lap so couldn't push her anymore then 50 mins pm, finished at 1pm
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Hi M&E we too had a couple of really early morning cn but I think 30 mins might be a bit too long so your lo may not be tired enough for a decent lunch nap. From memory we rolled with a few really early morning cn of 15 minutes and stuck to set nap at 11:30. One of the ladies on here had posted that quite a few bubbas will want to go back to sleep 1.5-3 hours after waking just because, but if I wanted to get a better overall sleep for her I needed to push her through. With her big nap anything under 1.5 hours and I do everything I can to resettle even if its just me being there so she has quiet/restful time. I then made a real point of keeping her going over this sleepy time. New activities/baking/messy play. Anything to keep her occupied and over the sleepy hump. Big hugs!
Hi My tribe sounds like it :( to be honest my lo did this too but I kept pushing for 2 naps for another month or so. If you think your lo still needs 2 naps why don't you cap the morning nap right back and then go for an earlier 2nd nap. It may mean an earlier bed than you are currently doing but might be worth a try?
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Hi Ginger 😊 I really don't know...?
Could be SA, teething or a routine issue I guess! Would be good if she could just tell me!!
I've extended her morning A before her catnap by 30 mins so will see if that makes a difference.
If for another week we continue to get these long NW's I think I'll cut MN down to 25 mins.
She'll be 14 months in a week so that 1 nap goal should be almost in reach 😁😁
I'm not feeding her in the night now. Think she's hating that 😞 usually is quickly feed her at the early morning wake and she'd go back to sleep a bit quicker. Maybe that's why, she's a bit shocked by the change ?!!
M&E and MyTribe
I'm in the same boat. We were doing 30min Mn then 1.5-1.75 an
She then got sick so have been doing 45min mn and 1.5-2hr an!!
But think it's now affecting her nights as possibly too much day sleep.
Will be following along ! Sorry I have no advice 😁
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Hello! Just found this thread and sounds very similar to what we are going through. After a few weeks of going between 1 (4.5-5hours after WU for 2-2.5 hrs) and 2 naps (10-10.15 & 12.45-2.45), we have been solidly on one nap now for about a week. We are getting a solid 2ish hour nap every day but a big NW every night anytime from 12ish onwards but typically 3ish. We still get this with 2 naps but also get EW so just jumped solidly to 1 nap. This means although our nights are approx 11.5-12 hour length, with the 1 hour-1.5 hour NW, he is not getting enough sleep! May be teeth so am medicating, but feel like there is something more up??
We are on
WU 6.30-7
Nap 5 hours after WU
Bedtime 7pm (typically this is 4.5-5 hours after nap WU).
Any thoughts?
LO is 12 months
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Quick update, we cut am nap down to 10 mins and then did a lunchtime nap which worked still kept BT around 6.15-6.30 as she would only do 1hr 30. Night sleep was around 11 hrs with wakes ups getting as late as 5.45 yay!!! Lasted 3 days. Then it went wrong :(. The last 2days naps have been a nightmare barely an hour all day, with an early wake up at 4.30 yesterday. We went with a 6pm BT last night which got me a 5.40 am wake up, today I thought I would aim for 1 nap as the last 2 days she has only had 10 mins in the morning but pm nap had been 30-40mins. Today I bought the nap forward from midday and she settled at 11.30 only had an hour so will prob go for an early BT tonight again .
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Hi - I hope I am doing this right by hitting "reply" instead of doing a new post. Also, I am not sure which area to post in, but I think our challenges right now mostly boil down to the nap transition!
So, my daughter is 14.5 months and even before 1 year she was showing some signs of the 2 to 1 nap transition but it was inconsistent and everything I read seemed to say hold off as long as you can, but now in the last couple weeks, it has gotten ridiculous! I have been all over the map trying different timing and such. We may hit the target one day but mostly we seem to be missing it!
Here is her schedule:
~7 a.m. WU
7:30 Breastfeed
8:30 Solid Breakfast
10:30 Snack (sometimes just solids, sometimes breastfeed too)
11/11:30/Noon Nap (if it gets too late, I try to get lunch ready before her nap instead of the snack, but then it is usually at 11 a.m. or so)
Wake up is all over the place, usually anywhere from 45 minutes to 1.5 hours but lately it has been closer to the lower end of things
12:30 pm (Or when she wakes up) Breastfeed
2 p.m. Lunch (if not done earlier) or Snack
3:30/4:00/4:30 Try to do another nap but lately she has only taken it once
5:30 Breastfeed
6:15 dinner
7 p.m. bedtime
Then she has been waking up through the night to BF again! There had been a few weeks where there were no wake ups after dropping the DF really late in the game, probably around 10 months. Then they started back up again. I realized I had to make some changes because she was nursing to sleep at bedtime, I believed partly because I had been getting her to bed at 8 p,.m. but really it was a habit long before that started. I had to fix all that, which I did, and we had one night with no wake ups, and then they started again! :( Of course in the night, I always think she must be hungry so I go pretty quickly to the breast and over the last couple weeks there was at least one wake up, but usually more like two and sometimes even three. The first wake up started to get consistent at around midnight and so the other night when I realized it must just be habit I broke that pattern and she didn't wake up again that night so i figured it really was just habit. Then last night she woke but resettled at midnight, but then woke again at 2 and again at 5:45 :( Tonight I am pretty sure she has some teeth coming through and I am hoping she can rest more but I am doubtful that will be the case especially since she just woke up at 8 pm after going to sleep at 7 pm. I gave her some medicine and she went right back to sleep though.
I was doing bedtime at 7:30 p.m. before so 7 is on the earlier end, but I have a really hard time getting everything done to get her to bed any sooner! Thus, I am pretty sure we are on an OT roller coaster ride right now. There were a few times when she took a 2 hour nap at around 11:30 a.m. but it has been a while. We were getting about 1 hour 15 minutes or up to 1.5 hours pretty consistently for a while but lately it has only been 45 minutes. The one time I tried to wake her up early in hopes that she would take a second nap, it didn't work at all so she just seemed even more tired. I am reluctant to try that especially since now she is only sleeping for 45 minutes during the day, but if someone has some ideas of what would work best, I would be willing to give it a go. Thank you!
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Could you skip the 5.30 breastfeed, give her dinner then and get her down to bed (with breastfeed if needed) a bit earlier? 6.30pm? It's only a short time you'd need to do it for before hopefully her nap will lengthen and you can push things back out again x
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Thank you for such a quick response JessMum46! I will try that today and see what happens - great idea by the way :) Sometimes it is hard to see a possible solution when you are stuck in the daily grind of it :D
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Hey girls how are you all getting on ?
Awinkza my dd would bf once sometimes twice through the night, I think she was teething so was using me for comfort. Over the last month I've only been offering water, and if she does wake in the night I give her 10 mins and usually she self settles. She's stopped waking so much. Maybe because she realises she doesn't get milk now. Hope that helps !
So for the last two weeks we've been having great success, with a 20-25 min nap (25 if her night was broken or she seems extra tired in the mornings) after a 3hr WT..I do have to APOP this! She's a bit reluctant ! Then 2.5/2.75 hours later a 2-2.5hr afternoon nap. Usually waking up around 2.30/3. Then a 4.5hr A to bed.
We've had a couple of long NW's but they only lasted two nights then another a couple of nights ago.
Anyway the issue now is that she's waking up at 5.30/5.45... Not too bad but we'd prefer 6/6.30.. She's getting 10.5-11.5 hours of night time sleep.
What do you suggest? Do I need to do the MN at 3.5hours WT and for only 15 mins now do you think?
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Hi Lauraims glad you are getting a nice long lunch nap!! Yip I'd reduce that morning nap right down to 15mins and see if it helps. How old is your LO now, do you think the cn is still needed?
The other thing you could try is capping her long nap at 2 hours. I thought I was going to have months of a really long nap but we noticed pretty quickly that if I let her sleep more than 2 hours bedtime was still easy but we had less overnight sleep which resulted in ew.
We are now looking like this
wu 6:15-6:45
nap 11:30-1:30
bt 6:30-6:45
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Thanks hun. She's 14months 1 week.
Will try 15 and see what happens. A 6.30pm bedtime lastnight, and another 5.30am wakeup 😁
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I think my LO was about 16.5 when it dropped completely. I think we have only had 1 in the last month and we had had a rough night so figured she needed it!!
I actually found it quite good as she woke in a happier mood :D
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Good to know! Thank you. How did you know she was ready to drop the morning cn?
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Because she was in daycare 2 days a week and it didn't happen there and I had a few really busy days with her at home and found she was lasting fine. I think I dropped to like 3 days a week and I would do it just to make sure she wasn't getting too ot. Then as she was more active I found she needed less.
She also started to resist her 11:30 nap, it was more towards 12-12:30 and because I wanted to keep bedtime at the latest 6:30 I didn't really want her sleeping past 2 in the afternoon, so that was my big queue to drop the cn completely. For a couple of weeks I needed to keep her really busy around the 9am time and I also started offering a snack.
I always did her cn in the car going to something. It never worked in the cot or the pram. Even now I do my best to avoid car trips at that time of the morning as I am sure she would still nod off!! Today I needed to be in town for 9:30 so gave her a muslie bar and we sang really loud songs all the way into town :-)
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Ok, I'm back with a report. Yesterday seemed to work brilliantly other than the still short nap. It looked like this:
7:15 a.m. Wake Up/BF
8 a.m. Solid Breakfast
10:45 Snack
12:10 BF
12:30 Nap
1:40 woke up
2:00 BF
3:00 "Lunch" (Didn't plan to put her down so late for her nap, otherwise would have done lunch before that!)
5:30 Dinner
6:00 Bath/BF
6:30 Bed (fell asleep within 15 minutes)
Then she woke up 2x to BF through the night, once at 11:15 p.m. then again around 3 a.m.
Today was more challenging for me, but I wasn't as prepared as I was yesterday and that made it harder. Here is what it looked like:
7:15 a.m. wake up
7:30 BF
8:30 Solid Breakfast
10:15 BF
10:30 Snack
11:15 a.m. in Bed, fell asleep within 15 minutes
12:20 Woke up
12:40 BF
1:30 p.m. Lunch
3:20 Snack
5:50 Dinner
6:30 BF and she fell asleep
6:45 Bed
I was aiming for a 6 p.m. bedtime since she didn't sleep very long and seemed pretty tired, but I wasn't able to make that happen.
Anyone have any suggestions on timing the nap for optimal sleep length? Will it just get longer naturally or are there other things I can do to extend it? W2S? Something like that?
Maybe I should just keep aiming for close to 12:30 pm since she actually seemed to do ok that day and then if it is a short nap she won't have to make it as long till BT? I'm open to ideas.
Questions for Lauraims: Thank you for your note. When you say you have only been offering water, do you mean if she wakes in the night? Or during the day? Or when you said you give her 10 minutes did you mean BF? TIA!
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Thanks first mum. Argh we've been getting bedtime meltdowns all week 😩 put down at 4hrs15mins after a 2-2.5hour nap. She's definitely tired. The meltdown only lasts max 30mins. But she gets so upset and I have to go in and out 3 or so times.
She used to be the best self settler. No crying. But not in the last 4 months 😞
Awinkza...yup water if she wakes at night. Even if she wakes at 5.30. We don't offer milk all morning now. I give her 10 mins to whinge, call out if she wakes through the night. Usually she's actually still half asleep.
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Hi Awinkza I got advice from someone on here that around this age most lo respond really well to set nap times rather than awake times and it has been very true for us. My lo has never been very good with tired signs when she was younger so set naps have always really worked for us.
We started the transition about 14 months and regardless of wu my aim was for 11:30, in the beginning if we had a really early wu it was a struggle but after a few weeks she got the hang of it and 3 months on her nap is still at 11:30. We get anywhere between 1h15m to 2 hours, which is the max I let her sleep as we also have a set bedtime of 6:30.
Maybe you could try the 11:30 time for a week and see what happens? I found timings for lunch quite difficult in the beginning so sometimes she would get half before and half when she woke up.
Lauraims I feel your pain. My lo started daycare at 12.5 months and stopped self settling with the first illness >:( we are now finally at a point where I am not rubbing or shushing to sleep at lunch but I do stay until she is asleep. Its taken me awhile but that is now only a couple of minutes. BT I am lucky that she is super sleepy if not asleep following her bf.
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Argh still getting 5.30 am WU's! Makes it so hard to keep my schedule.
Should I Stick to a catnap no earlier than 9 for 15 mins ?
Do you think her sleeping 15 mins in am and 2.5 over midday, usually about 12-2.30 is too much dts?
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Just a thought Laura, do you think she may need a shorter A to BT now she's doing 15mins morning CN, as she's more tired? I just say this as I remember DS needing BT a little earlier each time his morning nap was reduced, or he'd be OT, which could result in EW. Actually we've recently cut down DD's am nap consistently to 20mins and beginning to think we need BT earlier, since this seems to be working better for her, she had BT meltdowns when we tried to keep BT the same. Or do you think she's actually UT at BT and needs a push?
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Good idea hun. How much earlier ?
What's your easy at the moment ?
She seems to often cry out at about 4/4.30 then 5.30. She tries to go back to sleep for ages but just can't. She could be OT at BT and thTs the reason for the meltdowns. I was always calculating total wake time though. ??
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Hi all-
We have been doing a set nap time for a few days but I am concerned that she is still getting too little sleep and getting OT. She is pretty exhausted by the end of the day and actually before the end of the day, but I am not sure if her nap will eventually lengthen or if we should try something different. I guess it has only been 3 days, but her nap length is so erratic I am wondering if we should try a morning catnap and a little bit later afternoon nap? I saw Lauraims is doing 15 or 20 minutes for a morning catnap and I am wondering if that might be a good idea? I have also seen some people that alternate 2 naps with 1 nap and I'm curious how that works. Not sure that is a good idea for us as I think a set schedule would be better but today we only got a 30 minute nap so I'm wondering if maybe we should try something else. She also woke up about an hour after getting to bed tonight but eventually resettled herself, then woke around 10:30 p.m. (I did BF her that time). Are there guidelines that help determine what might work best for certain lo's?
I haven't tried the BF ban at night yet - I am always worried she will be really hungry and I think it would be miserable if I was hungry and couldn't eat :( Am I overthinking this?
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The small catnap in the morning works really well for me hun.
We're doing,
3.5hr first WT, (sometimes 3 if a rough night)
20min nap (might start consistantly doing 15 as waking at 5.30am)
2.15hr second WT
2-2.5hr nap
BT - not 100% yet. Was doing 4hrs WT but going to try 3.5 now IncAse that's the cause of eW.
Lastnight we had 7-6.30 night straight through !!! 👏👏👏
Yesterday was a different day nap wise as we had plans so altered her day a bit
3.5hrs - 30min nap
3.5hrs - 2hour nap
4hrs - BT ( tried for earlier but think she was OT so took awhile to settle.)
Hmmmm
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Hi Lauraims, I would stick with the catnap at 9 regardless of wake-up. My lo has ew when her overtiredness sets in so that's my que to do a few nights of ebt to help her try and catch up. I know when I'm getting it right as she will stir and sometimes cry out around the 5-5:30 mark but will either resettle for about another hour or play quietly in her cot.
Have you noticed a pattern with shorter nights if the main nap is longer than 2 hours? I watched for about a week and a half and knew it was the reason. It's really hard especially when I know she has had a rough night with teeth or ears to try and be consistent and keep her day nap set.
Awinkza, no harm in trying the morning cn. I found it helped so rolled with it for as long as she needed. I did it at 9am regardless of wu and capped at a max of 15 mins. I then stuck with a set lunch nap at 11:30 which is pretty consistent for 2 hours with bt of 6:15-6:45.
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Hey, sorry for slow reply, how's was the earlier BT, Laura? I'd have said to reduce that last A by 15mins and see what happens, if she just messes around then perhaps she wasn't OT and you may need to push instead (?), if she goes straight to sleep but still seems like she might be OT then you could try earlier. I'd been pushing to 7 and hoping that a further push might sort out the long NWs, but found instead that she was so tired, I had to do EBT and that was the key - seems like 6.30pm is probably her ideal BT atm, although she's had a few other issues recently and I've wanted to get her down earlier but haven't been able to for logistical reasons... What's Im's total wake time? What do you think it should be? I think we need around 14h TS here, maybe a little more - I'm sure DS had lower sleep needs at this age.
Awinkza, I like the short am nap (when it works!) as they can build up enough tiredness for a good pm nap, without having massive A times. I'm not sure about alternating 1/2 nap days, with DS I just offered both every day until he was rejecting the am nap most home days, and then we dropped ct. But I know lots of others have done really well alternating nap days, or playing it by ear and seeing how tired their LO seems.
Our ideal routine (I think!) is:
Up 6.30
Nap 9.30-9.50 (often she takes a while to get off so it may be 10mins later)
Nap 1-3 (always wake at 3 for school run, staying consistent at the weekends)
BT 6.30
Unfortunately we had a busy weekend and lunch/pm nap got a bit late, resulting in OT and waking early to poo! Haven't been able to catch her up after that but home tomorrow so will try earlier BT... I think we have teething going on too so not expecting perfection right now anyway ;)
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Well that good run lasted 2 weeks 😣😣😣 now she's taking ages to fall Asleep in afternoon then waking up after an hour absolutely hysterical and won't go back to sleep. Great, now what ?!! 😓😓😓
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Oh that's rough Lauraims! What else is going on at the moment? Is it a just a batten down the hatches and ride it out or do you think a change is needed?
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Hey Hun. I'm not sure. It's happend the last two days.
I'm laying her down at 2hrs10mins after a 20 min nap. It was working up until yesterday! She'd then fall asleep at about 2hrs40mins. 😣😣 hmmm don't know.
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hmmm, maybe try for a few more days and if still resisting shave another 5 minutes off that morning cn and see if that makes a difference
Hugs x
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Thanks for the hugs 😊 already had an OT cry out 1.5hours after going to bed. First time in ages 😞
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Or you could try putting her down for the pm nap a little later, say 15mins? Or were you doing anything different just before the nap, which may have excited her more than usual?
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Tried 15 mins later today. Still took her 40 mins of mucking around to settle. And she wS definitely tired as her night was pretty short due to a NW from 3-4.45😣😣😣 OT has set in😓😓 no idea what's going on.
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Does you lo tack on with an ebt Lauraims? Could you do a super ebt tonight to try and help catch up?
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HELP!!!!! I am truly at my wits end :'(. We have been struggling with EW since March. I think we have tried allsorts of different routines, I was sick of trying to work out schedules, A times, BT blah blah, so thought I would try set clock times. I have been consistent and in my head it couldn't fail ;D. Well we are definitely getting better naps but I keep coming back to what I have thought for a long time, we have a LSN toddler. On the odd occasion I don't doubt OT has been the reason for waking early, but watching her the last week we are always averaging 12-12.5 hours. This has been our schedule
WU 5am
Nap 11am
Nap 1hr 30
BT 6.15
WU 5.15
Nap 11am-2hrs
BT 6.20
WU 4.20!!!!!
Nap 11am - 1hr 20
BT 6.20
WU 5.30 yay!!!
Nap 11am -2 hours
BT 6.30 had every faith in this routine as this is where I would like to be, thought def would result in a good wU
I could have pushed BT out last night I guess but was trying to be consistent and worried about pushing too far.
Today 4.30!!!!!!
She is an independent sleeper, she rarely wakes in night and wakes happy in a morning. She is generally in good spirits all day, goes to bed like a dream, but everything is so damn early. My idea was if I could get the above routine to work I would gradually push out. I truly could have cried this morning when I saw how early it was, and worse still I will have to admit hubby was right :-X. So I guess I need help in getting our routine moved up, especially with the clocks going back soon.
I mean even if I am wrong about her sleep needs and she does need a little more on occasion then great but on the 10 hours nights we have got to be looking at a better start than 4.30! I can handle 5.30 but 4.30 I just too much, im already in bed early.
Please help I feel like I am going insane. FWIW my other daughter only ever did 10hrs too, u would think id learnt, but Eva was always so much better at sleeping than Maya ever was as a baby then it all changed.
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Oh that sounds rough! You mentioned that she is happy during the day, have you thought of pushing the nap later in the day and going for a later bedtime? Say 8pm then if you are getting 10 hours it would be a 6am wu?
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I just don't think she will go any longer unless her WU get later. This morning she fell asleep on me at 10.45, then woke at 30 mins, got her back off but only did an hour in total, so nap finished at 12pm. I don't think I could stretch her any later tonight, I could prob get away with 6pm tonight which would prob give me a 5am start tomorrow but any later I wold still get 5am or earlier, I panic about later BT now. I have completely lost the plot lol x
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Well after the 1hr nap at 12pm, she was falling asleep on grandads lap, so I let her have an afternoon nap at 3.15, she slept for 45 mins but only because the dog woke her. I wasn't sure what to do about BT so I pushed til 7pm, she still went down a dream. We shall see what tomorrow brings x
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Hugs - keep us posted :-*
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Fingers and toes crossed its enough to break the cycle and start fresh xx
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Haha First Mum I always hope that !! Hope all's going well M&E'sMummy, 💗
So yesterday she fell asleep at 3.10 wt after a 20min nap and slept 2.15hrs without waking once. BT at 6.30. And woke at 5.30am again. Maybe even more like 5.15! 😮
Today was another bad day. 20 min am, 3hr second WT but only a 1.20hr nap and almost went back to sleep. But didn't.
BT just now at 6 (ekk) hope not another early Wu. But wouldn't surprise me if she wakes up through the night cause she's OT again. 😣
When do I know to cut out the mn? When the an often doesn't work ?
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Oh gosh no she's only just gone to sleep now.
Nearly 12 hours of Total wake time and just 1.40hrs of sleep. I feel it's going to be a horrific night 😩😩
She couldn't even settle herself she was that OT. I'm thinking I'm going to just go cold turkey to one nap. I'm so over the wake times I just want to set an appropriate nap time and get on with things!
It really gets to me trying to figure it all out. 😟😟
If she's up at 5.30 every morning. How do you do 1 nap! At 10.30!! Then such a long stretch until bed. Arghhhh just a tad over things today
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Well todays wake up was 5.18! so better than 4.20. Today we go to a music and dance group so had to be out the house at 9am, she napped on the way there so had around 10 mins. I then put her down for a nap at 11.30, she went off at 11.40 and woke at 12.50. I still think she is LSN but surely this is still on the low side? totalling just under 12 hours overall sleep . Not sure what to do about BT this evening, scared to go earlier incase we get another 10hr night but also scared to do later incase OT. Any thoughts? Gosh I feel so out of control I hate it!!!! :-\
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tbh Lauraims I didn't think I would ever get to a set 11:30 nap with my lo especially with the run of 5:15 wu we were getting at the time, but she did surprise me. I think it took just over a week and I realised she could do it so stopped clock watching.
I think the first couple of days we had like a 10:45 nap and then I did everything I could to get her to sleep for 2 hours (I spent a lot of time in her room). Then I got her to 11, then 11:10 and finally 11:30. My ideal is 1.5 hours sleep but 2 is ideal. I had to have activities planned most days, just around the house, lots outside and also we had 15 minutes of quiet time watching a penguin cartoon.
And then I did a 5:30-6 bedtime. As the nap got more consistent at 11:30 I started shifting bedtime back to 6:30 is small increments.
Maybe just try 1 day and keep you lo really busy and see if you can get to 11-11:30
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M&E I'm not really sure what to suggest with lsn, but I just see that yesterday you ended up with two naps which seemed to help stretch the day and get you a better WU than you had yesterday - do you think this could work again to push her day later? I'm just thinking that if she does have lsn overall, she might possibly still struggle with the long A times that would mean on one nap, but if she has two (one of which short, if she'll take it), then she can still get a high wt overall without having to do the long A times, iyswim? Ignore me if I'm not making sense ;)
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Thanks First Mum 😊 the first week, was she OT waking throughout her nap ? Did she resettle easy ?
I'm going to try get her caught up over the weekend with some APOPing to make sure the second nap is 2 hours. God knows why her days have become inconsistent. I feel she could handle one nap. But only if it was 2-3 hours. So fingers crossed!!!! Monday is a new chapter! 😁😁
Heaps of baby's her age in her play group are on one nap already. !
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I think the first couple of naps she was waking at the 45 minute mark and if I got to her quickly she was easy to resettle, I think I may have done this twice to get a total of a 2 hours nap. Then she stretched to an hour straight, so for a couple of days I sat by the cot at the hour mark and just gently rubbed her bum/back when she stirred. She kept stretching it longer. Bit more difficult to resettle when she had done 90 mintues straight but I did manage a couple of times. Then 2 hours became the norm.
Unfortunately I think I have a bit of ot setting in from short nights and ew, which are causing her to shorten her nap back to 1h15-1h30. So am tossing up doing an ebt tonight to try an catch up?!?
Yesterday she only did 1h15 but when I picked her up she snuggled in and did another 45 on me in the chair so I did a normal 6:45 bt. nw at 2, 3 and 5:15 when I brought her into bed with me and after an hour of fidgeting she went back to sleep to 6:45. She gave me a right performance at lunch nap today, I lost it, she lost it and the whole thing was pretty yuck. Not sure what that means for bt tonight???
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Well, I'm back and I need some help. We tried a day with a short morning catnap of 15 minutes and then an afternoon nap a couple hours after that and she actually slept both times, but the afternoon nap was only 45 minutes. I tried to do it again the next day but she was up there for 45 minutes for the morning catnap and didn't sleep so it ended up being a late afternoon nap by the time I got her back up, fed her and got her down again. That day she slept for 1 hour and 15 minutes. Then today I decided to just stick with the one nap, but it took her 40 minutes to get to sleep and she only slept for an hour and 10 minutes. She was napping so well before and is very good at getting herself off to sleep, so now I am wondering if she just needs less sleep or if we are dealing with OT? We have been trying to keep to the 6:30 p.m. bedtime but tonight it was more like 6:45 and the night before I think it was about 7 p.m. (Obviously I need to keep better track!) She has continued to wake 2x a night and has woken up crying in the morning, earlier than usual although not at horrible times (i.e. 6:20 a.m., 6:40 a.m.) although this morning was more like it used to be (about 7 a.m. and relatively content). She used to consistently wake up and be happy in her bed for quite a while around 7 or 7:15 a.m. I had gotten into the habit of nursing her at night when she awoke but then I tried the advice given here about just giving water at night and that seemed to work (she only woke that one time) but the next night she woke earlier (around 9 p.m.) and really seemed hungry and so I gave in and fed her, and she actively ate for 20 minutes. Then last night I thought I would "stay strong" and not nurse her and after crying her heart out I was able to get her to lay down, she tried to get back to sleep for 30 minutes but eventually cried out again and I decided she must really be hungry so I nursed her. Then she woke up again 2.5 hours later at which point I knew she couldn't be that hungry already so I offered the water and was able to quickly settle her down and she went back to sleep. I have been prepping her all day today, telling her there wouldn't be milk during the night, so I feel more confident that she had opportunity to eat enough :) Tonight I am planning to only offer the water especially since I really think that when I do nurse her, it causes more wake ups. Any pointers or advice about this would be appreciated.
Also, should I be trying to lengthen her naps somehow right now or do you think they will naturally lengthen? I have decided I need to stick to the one nap for more than a week and then make a change if things are still not working well. I was also wondering if I might be still dealing with OT? She is a lot better than she was when I first posted this thread, but I feel like something is off. Help!
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Hi Awinkza with the morning cn are you able to apop it so that you know she is going to go to sleep. I did it in the car everyday that I wanted my lo to have it as the cot and pram wouldn't work. It took my lo about 2 weeks to really lengthen her midday nap so the ebt and cn were more about helping her stay on top of her sleep needs.
What did you day look like on the day you tried the cn?
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Hi ladies, dd is almost 11 months so not quite a toddler yet, but the baby 2-1 thread seems very quiet so thought it might be better to join in here if you don't mind?
I think we're in 2-1 territory, dd has always been a long AM short PM napper but has been refusing her PM nap (it clashes with school run time) and wakeup time has been getting earlier. I've tried pushing her AM nap later so we could just stick with the one nap but OT was setting in & her nap shortened & wakeup got even earlier. I've decided to chop AM nap to try & force a longer pm nap so today did
Up 6am
Nap 9.30-10.15 (I woke her)
Nap 2.30** - 3.15 (i have to wake her for school run)
**I attempted pm nap at 1.30pm (first signs of tiredness) but refused. Attempted again at 2pm & finally asleep at 2.30 so 4hrs 15 A time after a 45min nap. Does this sound right?
I will have to wake her after just 45 mins for the school run so she's only had 1.5hrs total naps today where usually if I let her nap in the morning its 2-2.5hrs. I hate waking her from naps too so if I go down this route I only want to have to wake her from one. Does the am nap need to be shorter? How short? In an ideal world it would be good for her to have a quick am catnap then a long nap 1-3pm but not so sure how achievable that is?
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Went with 6.30 last night and got a 5am wU :(. Thought I would try a short am nap 15 mins and hope for a longer pm like yesterday. She fell asleep at 9.40 and I woke her at 15 mins, she was in a really deep sleep and really struggled to wake her, attempted to put her down at 12pm , but she didn't go off until 12.45 and only slept for 45 mins :(, so totally back fired on me. AARRRGHGH!!!
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First Mum - thanks for your reply and questions. Unfortunately (or fortunately?) she doesn't/won't sleep in the car anymore so an apop car nap is out :( There have been times I really wished that would still work! On the day we did the morning cn she had woken at 6:20 a.m. and I can't remember what time I got her into her bed, but she was asleep at 10:40 and I woke her at 11 a.m. I was thinking it was only a 15 minute cn but I see in my little note that it was 20 mins. Then I had her back in bed about 1:25 p.m. and she slept from 1:45 p.m. to 2:23 p.m. :-\ I had a hard time getting everything done in time for dinner etc. and got her in her room to nurse at 6:43 p.m. and she bascially fell asleep nursing at about 6:50 p.m. and finished nursing at about 7:08 p.m. at which point she stopped and I got her to her bed and she went back to sleep. I had been planning to get her into her bed earlier than that for the cn but I am confused which is better, a set cn time or a set amount of time based off of wake up time? (i.e., 3.5 or 4 hours after wakeup?)
Last night I got her to bed about 6:45 p.m. but we had a rough night since I wasn't allowing the nursing. She woke up around 11:45 p.m. and I was in and out three times to give her water until she finally was able to get back to sleep around 1 a.m. Before that she was trying to go back to sleep but was pretty much awake that whole time. Then she woke again around 5:40 a.m. and cried out a few times then settled down but I am not sure when or if she actually fell back to sleep. I think so, as she was awake again around 7 a,m. and seemed content, talking and playing in her bed. I thought I would try to put her down for a cn around 10:30 am. and do a bit later afternoon nap, but we had Kindermusik this morning that ended at 10:15 so by the time we got home and got a snack, it was pretty late so I am just going to let her sleep it out and see what happend. She was staring the tired stare in the car on the way home.
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Hey Awinkza with my lo I have always gone with set naps instead of awake times as when she was younger we had very little tired signs and it worked for us. With the cn for my lo, regardless of wu it was at 9am. if it hadn't worked by 9:30 then I carried on as normal for the 1 nap at 11:30 and did everything to make sure it was 2+ hours. It didn't happen for over a week but did get longer and longer on her own.
If it was a rough day with short naps or grizzly then it was an ebt of 6 to help her catch up.
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Hey Awinkza, hang in there. Might just be a rough patch. In regards to not feeding overnight, it takes a good week for them to get used to it.
I know for sure my dd wasn't waking because of hunger as the nights she didn't have milk, she wasn't even overly hungry for her breakfast. As long as they're eating 3 good meals a day plus a few snacks they really shouldn't be hungry at night. If my dd wakes she has A huge skull of water! So probably more thirst than hunger. 😊
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Well lost the plot yesterday! Had a stupid idea to push BT out to 7pm and a disastrous nap day (what was I thinking?) :-[ and we were up at 4.30 this morning! I think I will just let her sleep whenever today to catch up as we are def in OT territory. No idea what plan of action I am going to follow from now on. Got myself all confused. Need to go on holiday we had some lovely sleeps whn away ;) x
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Oh hugs M&E that sounds rough!! Maybe do what you can today to get 2 good naps if you can?? And go for a sebt. Hopefully you will have a couple of good days and you will find your mojo again!
Does your lo sleep well in the pram? Could you apop the naps to make sure they happen?
Your not alone!
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Morning, yes she does sleep really well in the pram. I did that yesterday for her early nap, shame I had to wake her :(. x
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Firstmum - I'm curious how you determined your set nap times? I feel like 9:00 a.m. is super early! I don't think she would be ready to sleep by then, but maybe I am wrong? Did it take a while for your lo to start sleeping when you went to that schedule? I think I am going to keep with this set nap of 11:30 a.m. for at least a week and then I will be prepared to switch to the 2 set naps if it seems like it really isn't working! I;m trying to gather all the info I can so I can be prepared for the transition if needed!
Last night went a bit better with the NW; she woke at 12:30 a.m. and cried so I offered water and she only took a little and then I put her back down. She tried to sleep but cried again shortly so I went back in, she drank a lot more water and then wanted to get back in her bed and she was off to sleep. It was much quicker than the night before. I expect this will keep getting better! Then she will probably be less tired during the day as well and hopefully we can get things settled in :)
Thank you all for your responses - every little bit helps me make better decisions and feel more confident in my decisions as well!
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Clairebear! :D Blast from the past! Funny, I was thinking of you the other day as I remembered our discussions on here (was it 2-1 or 18mo regression? Or both?) and wondering whether you'd had another LO or if I'd bump into you here again sometime! I had a break from here in between so I don't know if you've been around but hadn't spotted you until now. How are things? So you have one of each now too, lovely :) We have the same with school runs although of course DD is a bit older, but on the HSN side of things - how about yours? How much sleep overall do you think she needs? Ours needs a bit more than DS did so got a bit tied up in knots a few weeks ago but I think we're reasonably settled for the time being, at least we know where we should be, even if things do get disrupted :P We've been doing this recently:
06.30 Up
09.30-09.50 nap
1-3 Nap
6.30 BT
At 11mo the morning nap was probably more like 45-55mins, can't quite remember, but then the pm nap had to be after preschool pick-up and lunch, so from 1.15/1.30 and I didn't have to wake her. DS, on the other hand, at 11mo, started with a CM and did something like:
06.30 up
09.30-10 nap
1-3 nap
7 BT
He did have to be woken at 3 as the CM had school run to do. So as you see it's possible to make it work with school runs, dd I think would naturally be a long/short nap LO, but as you know that doesn't really work around everything else, so she's been forced into short/long and we're doing ok atm, although tbh it took me a long while to find her rhythm, as many of these ladies know :P
Hugs M&E, how did it go today?
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Ok - had a mess today. Wake up was good around 7 a.m. but then I put her down for her nap around 11:30 a.m. and she fell asleep at about 11:55 and woke up again at 12:30 p.m. ??? I thought she might fall back to sleep but she eventually started playing around in her bed and then fell over and hurt herself against the bars on the side so of course that was the end of that. I thought I would just give it a try on an afternoon cn but of course she didn't sleep so then I thought I would shoot for an early bedtime of 6 p.m. but she was fighting it and then fell asleep nursing and was finally in bed at 6:30 p.m. She just woke up crying at 7:55 p.m. and I got her back in bed and she is still trying to get to sleep.
I know I said I was going to try the 1 nap for at least a week and now I'm already doubting myself, but at the same time I just don't think she is going to fall asleep so early in the morning if I try an earlier catnap. I'm so confused! Oh! I forgot to mention that she is just now standing up a lot and starting to cruise around furniture and walk a bit so I'm sure that is adding to this current sleep challenge.
Suggestions?
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Awinkza my 9am cn came from her original 2 nap schedule. Prior to the transition my lo was having 2 good naps 9am and 1-1:30. When she started to shorten both naps by HEAPS I figured we would give just 1 a go. Ladies on this site suggested the 11:30 set nap so I knew I needed to have a small cn to get her through. Decided to roll with the 9am and just capped it at 15 mins max. Really helped her to reach 11:30. When she started to resist the 11:30 nap I just cut the cn.
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Awinkza, not all LOs can manage a morning UT CN, mine both take/took it as it was kept at a consistent time (from when 3h was a stretch), with a consistent pre-nap routine, by this stage both have been less reliable getting off for it, I'm hoping to stop it completely once it's been refused consistently and we've (hopefully!) had some success with the resulting one nap. I'd say if you're going to try it, perhaps try after an awful night when she's tired anyway, you never know, this could be the silver lining of your rotten day :P oh hang on, quick time check - guess I'm too late for you today now, sorry!
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Thank you First Mum and Trimbler for your responses...last night turned out to be so much better! After the early evening wakeup, she didn't wake again until 7 a.m.!!!! Finally feel like we are making better progress! I was considering switching to the 2 naps, but remembered that I promised myself to at least give it a week so stuck to the 1 nap and I'm glad I did...she actually slept for 1.5 hours! That is the longest stretch we have had in at least a few weeks. I can't really remember now, but after such a good night's sleep I felt much more prepared to deal with anything so a longer nap was such an amazing topping on the cake! Of course, then we took an afternoon trip to Ikea which ended up being much longer than I planned, so she wasn't in bed till 7:30 p.m., but I'm hoping we will still continue to have a good night and a good nap tomorrow! I will report back soon :)
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Well after the disastrous wU of 4.30 on sat am, I decided to let her sleep what she wanted in the am, so she napped at 8.15am for an hour, I put her down again four hours later . She fell asleep around 13.15 again for an hour. Was undecided what to do about BT so winged it tbh, we had visitors so it was 19.45 when she went off. She woke at 5.45! s much better. Decided to follow same formula, although its going to clash with school run with the later WU however I don't have to do school run until thurs, so could give this a good go. Anyway yesterday was pretty similar, however bought BT a little earlier at 7.30 and we got a 6.30 WU,yay!!!! Just hope she is not coming down with anything :(. Will have to jiggle around but maybe if she is getting 2 hours nap in any combination and the later Bt may work for now, we shall see x
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Hi ladies,
My DD is 2 weeks shy of her 1 year (ack! too fast!) and naps have never been great. Never over 1.15h (once, 1.45, once...) and usually closer to the 40-60 min.
So now we're at some nap refusals, major teething, learning to walk (crazy cruising and occasional across the room!), and if a nap, 30 mins max, sometimes on a parent. Terrible.
tons of NW, EW, but super happy any time she's not being put to bed. Generally laughing, playing and non stop movement - on 2 x 30 min naps and BT ~7p and up ~4 times at night, sometimes for an hour or two of PU/PD crying, and then up ~6:30a.
Disaster. But happy?! It's weird.
So this has been for two weeks, before she'd long nap, short nap and get to BT pretty ok with 2-3 WU and some EW (never great!). We think its time to start the 2-1 nap transition. I'm thinking closer to cold turkey.
This worked for paci wean, night wean and PU/PD EASY reset at 6 mons. It was a bad 9 days but then we had ~2 months of 11 hour sleep at night! :) and then she started teething and crawling... hmm.
So if our schedule (ish) is:
7a WU (whenever she wakes before 7am I keep her in the dark bedroom and hold her until 7am to diaper change and nurse, she CNs generally)
7:15a E nurse
8a breakfast with us, solids
10a Nap (30 m or the before 1.15h)
11a E bottle BM
12p E lunch with us
2p Nap (30-40 m)
3p E Bottle BM
4p E solids/snacks
5:45p dinner with us
6:15p bath
6:30-45 bottle BM
7p BT
Bed time took ~2 hours last night to get her down, crawling around laughing, crying standing, shouting, shrieking, laughing....
Then PU/PD, finally asleep and the fire alarm started chirping!!!! :(
randomly all night. ridiculous.
you just have to laugh.
Suggestions on schedule?
Thank you (sorry so long!)
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Hey lovely to hear your good news, M&E and Awinkza :D :D
Welcome, chauncycay :) Have you tried pushing out that first nap, and if so, what happened? Sorry it's been so tough - and the fire alarm, really! ::)
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ok, so we tried to push the first nap to 11a today. My husband is daddy day care and I work from home (separate office in our yard, so I say goodbye, etc. in the am and they go for a walk while I go to work - in the back yard :)).
He took her to the big park - longer walk, played on the swings, etc.
She went down with a bit of a fuss (was super sleepy, couldn't even read to her, wiggle/fuss/out, then up and back down ~20 min)
Slept from 11:20-noon so 40 min nap.
Not horrible.
Bottle, went to lunch as usual and then the playground to keep her up (she's beat after horrible night and short nap but had fun on the playground with 3 other little girls :)).
My husband's distracting her while I wrap up work and then I'll nurse her at 3p which is usually nap at 2 and nurse or bottle at 3p.
she'll likely fall asleep on me for a bit.
Hopefully. that nurse/CN will help us get to a slightly early BT.
Any tips? does that sound ~good for a first try?
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Wow that's a big push! Hoping someone who's had experience with a long am nap will jump on, as I did short/long with both... Just be aware it could take a while for that nap to lengthen. Also I wanted to mention that much of the disruption might be developmental leaps, there does seemto be a lot going on! I may not have tried to push quite so far on the first day, but others may disagree, let's see... :)
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Yes definitely a lot going on. She's had some naps at 10:15 or 10:30 start before and the walking started a couple of weeks ago, but really took off last week. The teeth started last Wednesday.
So it's been about a week of chaos. She's beat.
She just nursed/napped/nursed on me for the 3p
35min CN + nursing.
Ugh.
ok, off to see how we go with BT!
trying for a tiny bit earlier ~6:30.
Hopefully it doesn't take 2 hours like last night :(
And battery backups are in those silly (but very important) fire alarms! Ack!
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:) dh got her down for us at 6:30p. She fell asleep on the bottle though and didn't finish the last two ounces of seven... Eek.
We shall see!
At least if she does her usual wake at the 40 min mark I've got some milk for her...
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Back to 5.30 start this morning :(, but she did lie down in cot for around 30 mins which she normally doesn't do, cant shake the feeling she is coming down with something. At least 5.30 is not 4.30, every cloud and all that lol x
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Ugh, 5:30 :( definitely been there - a lot!
well our experiment went ok.
down at 6:30p after only ~10 minutes. She passed out and never finished her milk.
Woke up at 8p, 11p and 2a (approx) and then finally at 6:30a!
She did a fuss/wiggle at 5:30 but settled herself - yea!
So I gave her ibuprofen at 2:15a. I'm thinking some of it is the teething/growth spurt pains.
We just measured her on the wall mark today since it seemed she'd been eating a ton and yep, she's grown about an inch and a half in 3 weeks! yikes!
DH is keeping to the 11am nap today to see if that works again. I've got a meeting at 3p so I can't nurse her so we'll see how the afternoon goes with bottles and dada...
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Ugh. Disaster. She's crazy OT :(
So the 10:55 ish nap was only 30 mins. Super cranky. Woke up angry.
DH had to stay in there and now he's all frustrated because she napped on him.
So, I think that's what you all mean by apop'ing a nap (accidental parenting on purpose) - is that right? Doing something that's a prop to just get them to sleep at the right time and longer to preserve the day/schedule shift so they're not crazy OT?
Can someone clarify? I think we're scared of that since the sleep training with PU/PD was so hard and our issue was definitely over holding from the beginning. We did the pu/pd at 6 months to course correct the over hold and remove night feeds (with a dream feed back then) and the paci. All props gone - rough 9 days but it worked and she was a super sleeper and very happy for months.
DH is going to try to feed her this bottle in a bit and get a CN out of her to save some of the afternoon. She can't go 12 hours with a 30 min nap :(
Disaster! Help! any tips welcome for today.
(And I know this will take a week at least which is what I'm trying to remind DH of, and probably why we should have waited to start on the weekend when i take over but she was totally dropping naps already... :'(
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so yesterday she took a 40 min nap at 3p
5:40p dinner
6p bath
6:25p bottle and it took an hour to get her settled
she was crawling all over me, talking, shrieking, laughing, crying, etc.
I put her in the crib and this continued
I'd say the sleep words and walk out, stand up silent, then cry,
walk back in PD, words, walk out,
stay for a bit sometimes, with a hand on her, or she'd grab my hands etc.
she cannot ever seem to settle herself entirely without one of us either holding her or a hand on her for the entire time she works it out.
7:25p sleep
8p UP, cranky super sleepy, standing crying.
got her down very easily
1:30a up, standing a little crying, super sleepy, easy to get back down
6:30a up, standing and talking. I scooped her up and laid down in her room on the daybaed and she CN a little.
7:15a, diaper, nurse
then today we went to yoga, lots of great activity
it ended at 10:20a, we nursed a little there and she was fussy/tired
she fell asleep hard in the car on the way home (never happens with this one!)
I attempted a transfer at home, she woke up while I was putting her down.
I tried 3 more times, nope. So i let her sleep on me - over an hour!
So we'll see how the afternoon goes.
I'm nervous there's a lot of sleeping on me. I don't want to mess this up but I know she's super needy and has growing/teeth pain right now.
Thoughts? Should I be concerned and correct anything?
thank you ladies!
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Hey sorry to be rubbish about responding, chauncycay, it's just that I'm used to babies who struggle to manage long A times and had to go about things differently, so lacking in btdt experience. But I know loads of mums on here will know exactly what you're going through and have a pretty good idea how to tackle it, I wonder if you've thought about starting a thread of your own? Not that you can't post here, of course - in fact please let us know if you do start another thread and I'm sure some of us will pop over there to support you, but you might get more eyes on it elsewhere, what do you think? Try naps in sleep, perhaps? And copy/paste in that day above, rather than writing it all out again ;) Sorry to be rubbish :-[
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Of course!
I know we have a super spirited one here - she's so much happier than she was when she was under 6 months. We're over major reflux. Everything pales in comparison! :)
I'll copy and post to the naps board - thanks for the good re-route!
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Hi, still battling EW's, we are getting more consistent 5.15-5.30 timings and naps are much better although we have reverted to naps in pushchair :(. I have experimented with later BT, earlier BT but still doesn't seem to make much difference. She is having on average 2hrs to 2.5 hours and Bt is falling around 7-7.30 depending on WU. Yesterday and today she has resisted her nap at 9ish so may be able to push her A time a little more now she has caught up on sleep. I guess even though we are still having EW she is getting more overall sleep, 10 hours just seems to be her thing at night. Lucky me has to get up in the morning with her so with the clocks going back a lovely start for me :(, however next week I am off for a spa weekend so 2 nights of sleep catching up lol x
Half term next week, so may tweak a little as we have no school runs to do, so may just watch out for cues and see what happens.
Rachael
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Just back for a quick update. We made it through one week on one set nap but it didn't seem to be extending at all and I felt like we were still battling OT, so on Sunday, on a whim because she seemed extra tired, I put her down for a short a.m. nap at 10 a.m. for 15 minutes and she actually fell asleep pretty fast and then I had her down for a longer nap in the afternoon around 12:45 p.m. and she slept for around an hour and a half which put us way above her average for the past month! I decided to stick with the 2 naps and see how it goes and so far it seems like we may need to tweak a little but I think we are finding our groove! So excited! Still struggling with some NW and nursing but I think if I can stay strong we will get there! Thanks all for your help!
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Hey chauncycay, I noticed you'd started a thread but haven't been able to pop over yet, glad you're getting help there but do pop back and let us know how it's going :-*
How's it going after the clock change, M&E? Have you had your spa weekend, or is that next weekend? :)
Yay for the improvements, Awinkza :D Keep us posted...
We're just doing our clock change now, slowly! Technically half way there as of yesterday, although sleep not so great today. Things are so much better than they were though, and she does have a tooth about to cut, so I'm not complaining :P
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Hey, we rreverted back to 2 naps which seemed to be working although still battling 5.30 WU but think that is here to stay. Then the weekend happened :(, she refused am nap n sat and pm nap was a disaster then with the clock change she woke at 4.30! which I knew would happen as her body clock would think 5.30. Anyway we had a disastrous nap day sunday too, we had a slightly later WU Monday so pushed her 1st nap out a little later and let her sleep as long as she wanted we were out and about on monday due to half term and she fell asleep for about 30 mins in the pm, we aimed for a 7.30 BT and got a 6.30 wu !!!! Next day we did the same formula but she ended up sleeping 2.5 in day split over 2 naps so think I could have pushed BT to 8pm but we got 5.30 again, weds we did same 1.5 am nap 30 mins pm nap, BT 7.30, WU 5.30. I think that pm nap just helps get her through to a later BT. Yesterday was a pain s she took her good nap in am bt missed catnap, fell asleep in car on way back at 6.30 and up at 5am! I am off to spa today so hubby is now in charge so no point in worrying til I come back as he wont take any notice of what I say regards naps/BT so she will in no doubt be in a massive OT mess when I come back, but he has to deal with it over weekend so more fool him :. Enjoy your weekend, see u on her Monday in desperate need of HELP!!! lol xxx
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Yeah clock changes are a pain, aren't they! I tend to to for the slowly, slowly, shifting the whole day approach, but DH wasn't so keen this time so we've done it slightly faster (ie 15min increment every 2 days rather than every 3) - regretting it now as she's got really OT and EBT is harder with DS being more out and about doing different things over half term...but then it'll be harder next week too with me back at work, so we're just going to have to ride it out and do EBT whenever possible to get over the OT. I've learned the hard way that whatever the situation, if she naps more than 20mins in the morning she will never take a decent pm nap, so I can't let her catch up then. Definitely teething going on too... And we're out tomorrow visiting friends so sleep will be messed up anyway, perhaps she'll crash afterwards, then again perhaps she won't :P On the plus side, despite a few short-ish NWs last night, she woke up at 6.15am this morning (our planned WU time for this stage of the shift) with a giggle :) Clearly still OT and babbling away now instead of napping - ww storm this week though so it's all happening here ::)
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Hang in there everyone, it will come right. Just not fair for the clock change to happen at the same time! Fwiw we've always found the 'crash' approach to the clock change to be better than the gradual one but we've had to do it that way due to work. DS did take two naps as one-off this time but 2-3 days and he was totally back on track. Keep going!
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Yeah what we need is the spring clock change - worked so beautifully for DS dropping the morning nap, moving WU later so that it all fitted in nicely with the CM :)
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Morning all, hope the 2-1 is going well. I posted in another forum but didn't get a response so thought I'd try here. My lo is 18 months now and pretty consistent with 1 nap at 11:30 for between 75-120mins. My lo is in home based care 2 days per week and naps a max of 30 minutes. For such a short nap she does surprisingly well but I have been doing an ebt on these days to keep on top of her ot but she is tacking on less and less making those mornings really early. This is what we look like..
Daycare
wu 6:00
nap 11:30-12
bt start bf at 5:30 asleep by 6
Home day
wu 6:00
nap 1130/11:45-1 (the 2 hour naps don't happen as often anymore, usually awake at 1pm)
bt start feeding 6-6:10 asleep by 7 (at the latest)
We are dealing with a few nw at the moment, but she is easily resettled and am sure its either teeth (7 new ones) or developmental so am not too bothered.
Since I started the ebt it has stopped the early blipping in the evening but as I mentioned the ew are now pretty consistent and was wondering if you think I should continue to do ebt or just go with normal routine and let her sort herself out? I hope she will sleep longer at daycare but we have changed provider and the pattern seems to be the same.
TIA x
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Hey sorry you didn't get a response on the other board - where did you post? I can try and chase it... So what time is she waking now? Is 6am the EW or is it earlier but you get her up at 6am? My first thought would actually be to try pushing the nap a little later, but if she's actually waking at 4 or something then that might be counterproductive! I don't have long now sorry, I just thought that if her naps at home are starting to get shorter then it might be an indication that she's not so tired and perhaps she'd even start sleeping longer at daycare if she had a little more A time - what do you think, based on how she is during the day?
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Hey Trimbler, yeah the ew is around 4-4:15. I can generally resettle her but its usually only for about 30-45 more minutes and then it can be a bit hit and miss if she can be resettled again. This morning she woke at 4:00 took about 5 minutes to resettle with pamol and teething gel. Slept till 4:50 then was pretty resistant to go back to sleep. Managed to finally nod off at 6 (just as hubby was coming to get her up) until 6:30. Nap at 11:35 hubby said she was pretty out to it when he was putting her in her sleeping bag. Has just woken now at 1. We usually get her up now and have snuggles in the chair in her room and 90% of the time she will nod off again for anywhere between 15-45 minutes.
tbh with the ew where it is now I don't see how I can push her later than 11:30 for her nap. Some days are a real battle and she can get pretty upset around 11:15 when she wants to go down. With her only sleeping 30 mins at daycare and knowing how tired she is with me at home prompted me to go with the ebt on daycare days. Now I'm not sure if I just start pushing for 12pm nap and keep to the 6:30 bedtime regardless of nap length, or do I push for the later nap but keep with the ebt on daycare days??? Oh the dilemma :P
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Oh it is tricky isn't it, and of course you're right in the 18mo SR territory... On that note, before I forget, one thing that stuck in my mind from hanging out a *lot* on the 18mo SR thread with DS, is that one by one, each of us realised that our LO's overall sleep needs had dropped and that they no longer actually needed the sleep we thought they did. That helped each of us to come up with a more realistic routine based on their actual sleep needs, however we did all struggle through for a few months :-\ hang on in there :-*
Do you feel that the 1.5h naps at home (as opposed to previous 2h naps) are OT then, due to the EW? Or did that start before the EW started? Oh sorry DS has just returned from being out with DH and requested that I do his BT, so I'll be back later ;)
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Ok sorry where was I? Oh yes, the nap timing...personally, I'd say start pushing it later despite the EW, especially if the nap started to shorten before the EWs started, but I'd still do EBT if the nap was bad, she needs to catch up the OT somewhere after all. What do you think? You know her best! :-*
Btw we're battling EWs again, I think partly due to it being hard to get her down early enough on my working days, so she's OT, and also because she's really congested at night and coughing :(
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Thanks Trimber, tbh its a bit of a blur on what came first the nap shortening or the ew. I think it was the nap shortening?? I've thought for some time that she may need less overnight sleep. Prior to the teeth explosion of the last 7 weeks we were getting on average 11.5 but with all the nw and ew I think we may only be getting 10-10.5. Combined with roughly 80 minute day naps I THINK she needs more. But as you mentioned, maybe she doesn't need as much as that anymore?? We get a bit of grizzling and she can be very clingly some days but tbh she is usually really good.
My only concern is that with her day nap 99% of the time I can apop back to sleep. I can't do it in the cot anymore as she gets really angry with me. But if I don't speak to her, pick her up and sit in my feeding chair she will snuggle in and go back to sleep. So with that combined I can generally get 90-120 mins. I do think I get a bit of bedtime resistance if I let her sleep more than 90 mins so I start to wriggle a bit and then she will usually wake. We had about 2 weeks of bringing her into our bed in the wee hours as hubby and I were wrecked from all the nw and she would snuggle down and usually go back to sleep till 6:15-6:45 so that too makes me think she still needs more but is just struggling to resettle on her own.
Hubby and I decided this weekend that no more bringing into our bed and we just need to suck it up and keep trying to resettle her in her room. Gosh aren't the ew hideous!!
This week is pretty yuck as I have conference and my mum is looking after my LO so am thinking come Friday I need to make a conscious effort to move the nap, at least for a week and see if it affects anything. Do you think a week is long enough? What do you think about bringing back the 15min cn in the morning to help her through?
tia x
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Yeah you may be right that she needs a bit more overall than what she's getting now, but it may be less than what she used to need, of course I can't say for sure, but you know her best, you know how she is etc.
Yes I think you'll be able to review things after a week of trying the later nap, that may mean you decide to evaluate again after a further week, or push further, or try something else. Bear in mind that she may find she's more tired even after her usual nap length, when you push it later, so probably keep BT the same time rather than pushing it later to keep the same A time, iyswim? Also, I hear you on BT resistance with longer naps, personally I found DS needed 2h for some time, it just got later and then eventually shorter too, but again, your DD will be different and you know her best ;)
As for the morning CN... Personally I never found that helpful once DS dropped it, we found EBT worked better for catching up, but I others have found it works. How long has she been on 1 nap solidly now?
As for the EWs and NWs, don't forget to give her time to settle herself before rushing in, you never know she may surprise you. And of course you can probably chalk some of it up to teething and SR, it will pass :-*
Btw we finally had a good WU this morning, poor thing was so tired and had EBT again, woke up twice in the night needing her nose cleared and meds/teething gel, then was still asleep when DS came in at 6.30, let her have another 10mins as I was enjoying listening to her obviously dreaming :)
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Oh bless that does sound like a nice morning! My lo hasn't self settled for nap or nw since starting daycare 5 months ago :-[ we had about 2 months of illness and then walking/teething/leaps and now regression I don't know if she even remembers how anymore.
Am gonna make a conscious effort to leave her for a solid couple of minutes with the nw and see where we get. This is my plan for later this week.
Fri, Sat, Sun Lunch 11:15-11:30 and nap at 11:45 (15 mins later) I'll give a bigger and later snack mid morning
Mon, Tues I'll ask her carer to push everything 15 mins
Wed Same again, but will be mindful of ot from previous 2 days
Thurs, Fri, Sat, Sun Lunch 11:30-11:45 nap 12
Will keep non daycare day bt at 6:30 and daycare day 6pm
What do you think?
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That could work, but tbh I'm reluctant to second guess the next step after the first push, without evaluating first - I never could/can predict that sort of thing with my own, I'd always try but then they'd surprise me, so I prefer to take one step at a time :P When you say to ask the carer to push everything 15min, you just mean to get the same routine as you're planning over the weekend?
I'm amazed if you can get from starting lunch to being asleep in just 30mins :P I've had to allow a whole hour for that with both of mine, I guess they're both slowish eaters, and always need a good amount of time once they've finished to poo - I learned the hard way to let them have that time, otherwise it would happen during the nap ::)
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Yip I think I'll make the call midway after I see how she is. We've already had a few late lunches and naps when other stuff is going on so think the 15 mins initially should be ok.
My lo is in the highchair at 11:00 and generally out at 11:27 and asleep 11:30 ;) I do have to watch her as we have the occasional snooze in the highchair. My lo poos in the afternoon, but interesting you should say that as I think we have been dealing with a few tummy upsets. The nights are particularly bad when she goes a day without pooing. Just this week we have upped her prune juice to try and stay on top of it for her.
Something to watch I guess.
I always worry that after lunch if I let her play she will wind up and I will never get her down :-X
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Yes I know what you mean - my DD is in the highchair just after 12 and sometimes is only just finishing her lunch around 12.40, she then gets down and potters around for 5mins or so, fills her nappy which I change, then we have 10mins or so to clear out her nose, give teething gel etc, perhaps paracetamol, wind down and settle off to sleep around 1pm. You run a tight ship :)
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Hi we are back :). After my wonderful spa weekend, which feels like a distant memory things seemed to be better. Hubby manager great, both kids were still alive ;). ANyway he threw all routine out the window and put her to bed later against all my better judgement and although it pains me to say it she was no different in the amount of sleep he had overall, still did 10 hrs at night 2 in day, so I guess what I have thought for a while this may be all she will do at night!. So I took the bull by the horns and thought I would go with 1 nap, to stop all the second guessing with A times, EBT blah blah, so aimed for 11.30 nap and 7pm Bt. We have had a brief illness inbetween but it seemed to be working well. As long as I capped nap to 1.5hours she would do 11 hours at night, so a WU of 6am, loved our new routine. However all good things must come to an end :(, and now we are back to 5am starts boo! I think we shall revert to 2 naps today see if we can push BT out a bit later again. I still do think on average 10 hrs is ok for Eva, as she will take the extra sleep when she needs it, just need to et some consistency again. Trouble is I love EBT but don't like EW, x
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Hi all. Hope you are doing well. In your experiences would you say a 1hr20 min nap is OT? Even if a resettle isnt possible? My dd is only doing the odd 2 hour nap, the last week it's been 1hr15-20.. And I know she needs more as these days she wakes in the night and EW's at 5.30...
I was doing 5.45min first A before nap...
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Welcome back M&E and Laura :) yes it could well be OT, Laura, hard to tell without more info - but probably still hard to know with it too :P are you moving the nap forward when she EWs, or fixing it? Does she tack on with EBT?
We're definitely in the final stages of the 2-1 now, she' struggled to get off for the UT morning nap recently so have had a couple of days where we've had to play around with A times after a non-nap. Hard not to offer it at all just yet hoping to muddle through until Christmas holidays and then shift WU a bit later and drop the morning nap completely - could do that now but then when we need a two nap day to catch up the second nap wouldn't work with school collection...so as I said, we'll muddle through and play hunt the A in preparation for dropping it completely. Thankfully they've both been good at napping with the CM so she should hopefully nap ok there.
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Hey Trimbler!! So she EW's most days. 5.30 usually. This morning was 5.15, but she went to bed at 6.15 due to a short nap so not a bad night!! So no she doesn't tack on. So that's my issue. When she doesn't nap 2 hours+ I need to do an EBT which then leads to an even earlier WU 😣 she won't do an early catnap. Well she would but first A would have to be 4 hours...
Could this work ?? I'm trying to figure out if doing a 15 min cN after 4 hours, then a longer nap after ??? Not sure what A time here as she started to take ages going down for it and that's why I got rid of the CN.
She goes down sooooo easy, like she's literally asleep as I put her down after 5.45a.. But then wakes crying after 1hr25-20.. But then the odd day she'll do 2 hours. Oh this is so difficult.
We're stuck in an EBT early WU cycle... 😩😩 Also when she wakes at 5.15/5.30 am she wakes crying.
Oh yay you'll be glad when you can get rid of the cN! I find all these A time calculations so draining!!
How old is your dd now?
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Hmm to me it would sound OT but I'm not convinced about the morning CN... Could you APOP a late afternoon CN if she doesn't nap well? I wonder if you'll need to bring the nap forward to more like 5.5h A, especially if she's a bit OT? As you know, I've been able to keep the UT morning CN for quite some time, even if not everyday, so don't have btdt experience with that, but I'm sure some of the other ladies still lurking around here do? ;) So this is just me typing the first thing that comes into my head :P but if no one else chimes in you could always start a new thread on the naps board, if you want more eyes on it? Hugs for the EWs!
My DD is 17mo tomorrow :)
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Can't believe how fast time is going! Do you think you'll have another Trimbler? Hmm I could try the late cn..she needs about 5 hours A time after a longer than 1 hour nap though. If I get a little 20min ?? Nap in, that would only give us an hour to do dinner bath bed?? Hmmm
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Hey ladies have been out of action for a few days or maybe a week not sure. Am struggling a bit at the moment and was hoping for your tips or coping strategies. I said to hubby tonight I don't think I can keep doing this, I feel like I am constantly trying to get her to sleep, get her back to sleep or keep her asleep. What gives?!?! I am so tired and am seeing no progress/improvement. We haven't had a run of good nights since before 21/9.
Ug!! Sorry that was a bit of a powerchuck all over the screen. Am feeling very sorry for myself and need a good shake!!
We had a couple of good nights last week with sttn till 4-5 and then resettling to 6:30. I took the bull by the horns and since Friday (4 days) have shifted her nap to 12pm and she has gone from 1h15m naps to 1h45 to 2h15 which I am really pleased about. We have been able to move bedtime from 6:15 to 6:30-45 and will hold here for a bit. Unfortunately the nw continues. Last night was horrid with her waking at 11:30 and struggling to go back to sleep for nearly 2.5 hours. I have no idea what was going on I cuddled, rubbed, teething gel, water, sleep drops, nurofen and still we had quiet periods with crying and her just lying there not sleeping, she gets really upset when I try and leave her but then that is also a bit hit an miss as I try an rub her leg or give her a cuddle and she is arching and pushing me away. We had a bit of this a few weeks back but this came out of the blue.
The night before was just as bad with bedtime 6:30 nw at 9, 10, 11:30, 1 and 4:15. Felt like a zombie so broke my rule and brought her in with me and she slept till 6:30.
My lo turned 18mths on Friday so I know we a bang in the middle of regression but this has already been going on for 8 weeks.
Sorry for the total brain dump. Just after your coping strategies. Hubby and I usually take turns at being the positive one who encourages the other one to keep going, but tbh we are both pretty down.
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First mum, how long has she been on one nap? Is A before bed different based on her nap lengths? Chuck, scream, shake all you need. It's been really rough for you and your DH. :/ Hugs.
We had a couple of good nights last week with sttn till 4-5 and then resettling to 6:30. I took the bull by the horns and since Friday (4 days) have shifted her nap to 12pm and she has gone from 1h15m naps to 1h45 to 2h15 which I am really pleased about. We have been able to move bedtime from 6:15 to 6:30-45 and will hold here for a bit.
Yay! But it's bittersweet, isn't it, as it gets your hopes up. :/
The night before was just as bad with bedtime 6:30 nw at 9, 10, 11:30, 1 and 4:15. Felt like a zombie so broke my rule and brought her in with me and she slept till 6:30.
Eeek. What was that about?? Understandable to bring to bed, and I've done the same.
tips-
-stretch A before bed to 5.5
-re-sleep train (this worked when there's no teething or illness)
Coping-
-keep telling yourself that this phase will end
-take looong warm showers to ease tension/muscles
-neglect minor housework, eat takeout for a week, and sleep as soon as she goes down, including naps
-neglect your smart phone (if you have one) and/or computer at night time
-allow some tv time for LO so you can just sit and relax (super simple songs Was recommended to us)
Whatever works for you and your family. I thought I'd never let him watch so much tv but my sanity depended on it. I also let him play with my iphone on the floor of the bathroom while I took a long hot shower (it was also good for his nasal passages).
Keep us updated. We've been permanently on 1 nap for a while so am not on this thread much, but will keep an eye out.
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Thanks Trimbler we have been on 1 nap for 4 months now for the first 6-8 weeks we had a 15 minute cn at 9 most days and then the main nap at 11:30. My lo has always done well with set naps so 11:30 was where we have stayed until just recently with pushing to 12pm. The 11:30 nap was quite hard a few weeks back when the ew were creeping in and I was tempted to restart the cn but held off and with the super ew we really push to get her back to sleep. They seemed to have settled and even with a 5am ish wu the 11:30-12 nap is fine. Thankfully her nap at home has lengthened over the last week so prior to this her afternoon awake time was around 5.5 hours. It is now around the 4.5-5 mark and I was holding here purely because with the nw her overall sleep I think is still too low.
I still do an ebt 2 nights a week on the days she is in care as she only sleep a max of 30 mins so on these days she is in bed asleep at 6. This has stopped the early evening blipping which I put down to ot.
Otherwise regardless of ew or nw her main nap is now 12 and unless that is less than 1 hour her bedtime is 6:30-6:45.
Would you suggest a tweak?
Thanks for your other advise. Will share with hubby after dinner x
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Sorry thanks Ginger ???
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Firstmum... as usual, it depends on whether or not to tweak. Has any of her teeth popped through? Is she all well now? (I remember you guys being ill for a while). I recall someone telling me that an hourly waking is usually related to pain. But who knows for sure. We had hourly wakes not too long ago and I medicated at BT with ibuprofen (ours last 6-8 hrs) for the next 3 nights. But like I mentioned, a couple nights it worked, then it wouldn't. ?? I know you've medicated, so not sure what else you could try. I even did a 5:00 milk feed that we haven't had in months to help him sleep longer recently. It worked, but tried again and it didn't. =/
Regarding your 11:30 NW... our DS woke at 11:30/12:00midnight crying/screaming for a good several weeks as expected for 18mo reg. I know your DD wasn't responding to your efforts... so perhaps leaving her be (if only fussing, not too distressed) one or two nights to see what happens? We did that for DS and eventually he self-settled more, but it did not completely stop NWs, as last night's nightmare attests. I'm sorry this has been going on so long for you... did it overlap with illness? Ours started beg/mid 17mo and now about 6 weeks in and going.
Btw, Laura, hi again! I think it depends on your goal... if you're willing to ride the 'early wakes' for a while longer until LO is older to handle longer A before bed, then don't introduce the pm CN (assuming DD will take the apop?). For us, this caused some night time issues. How old is she again? If you want to shift her schedule, then push A before and/or after nap and ride the crankiness. And OT that eventually sorted itself out for us. And stick to a new BT for a while... it took us 3-4 weeks. Have you been waiting about 5-10 mins. after she wakes at the 1.20 mark? How are things lately??
Trimbler...gosh, you went through all this recently with multiple rounds of illness. How are things now?
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Hey Ginger good to see you here again :) Oh yes, the 18mo SR...how I'm dreading it :P Seem to remember being very active on that thread with DS, perhaps we'll all end up over there in a few weeks/months and get the chat going again, if not already :P all I can say from last time is that eventually we all realised their sleep needs overall had decreased, so they didn't need the amount of sleep we thought they needed, and we managed to tweak the routines to account for that. We're still very much here, Ginger, now with three teeth finally and bug-free for the time being, making the most of it! Slightly crazy day for reasons out of our control so OT at BT but I think we're looking at being on 1 nap by Christmas, or at least the new year...
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Thanks Ginger, yeah I know there is a good reason for the disruption since the 21/9 we have had 7 teeth cut, the 4 canines and 3 molars. The last molar is now bulging and I think was giving her grief last night. I think with the yucky 6 weeks of these coming through another cold in the middle and now the SR am feeling a bit sorry for myself :P
Last night was still rubbish but maybe ?? slightly better ?? She was out cold at 6pm and I heard her fussing with the occasional cry at about 8:30pm. I heard her on and off for about 15 mins but she did self settle back to sleep. 11:30pm saw my hubby tend to her and it was a quick resettle. My turn for 1:15 and again at 3. Both times all I did was lie her back down run my hand from the top of her back down and I left the room. at 1:15 she settled fine. From 3-4 not so good and at 4 my hubby had a go and trying to help her back to sleep. Just intermittent sleep with her crying out every 20 mins or so. I brought her into bed with me at 5 and she slept till 6:30.
Hubby and I talked about slowing our response to her as you have suggested and to be honest we probably do respond to quickly. Its def only a grizzle and a bit of an attention call and I am going to try and leave her longer.
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Hey Ginger. Yeah I've been waiting 30 mins. She tries to go back to sleep but just can't. So frustrating. Just had another 1hr20 nap. So yes things are the same 😣 I just don't understand why she won't sleep for 2 hours when she's obviously tired? It's been 3 weeks now and we've only had about 3/4 two hour naps. She won't APOP in the late arvo. Only early morning.
Sighhhhhhh
The other day we accidently kept her up for 6 hours. She woke at 50mins, cried for about 3 mins then slept another 1hr15. So pretty good. She had a good night after that too.
Do you think this means 6 hours, she will eventually get used to?
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Oh my goodness she went back to sleep after 10 mins 😳😳 hopefully she stays asleep for a bit longer. She woke twice lastnight which was strange, so she ended up sleeping in until 6.45, not her usual 5.30/6, so I put her down at usual time of 11.30 do was only 4hrs45mins awake time..
If she wakes at 5.30 though, then putting her down after 4hrs45mins would be too early and end up with a long a to bed..???
Hmmmmmmmm
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Hi all, no idea whats going on over here :(. We have gone from some lovely Wu, long naps to around 10 hours at night and 30 mins nap all day :'(. Going to do an super EBT tonight incase we are in OT territory. We also have had NW's , so cheesed off with the unpredictability of it all and sick of early mornings :'(
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I feel ya M&E bug hug to you!!
How old is your lo now? Do you think its a leap?
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Yes sorry M&E and first mum. Definitely with you !! I can't wait for consistancy!!
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Hugs M&E and hugs all around. The unpredictability is the worst isn't it?
Ever have that day when you can't WAIT for bedtime? Love the kiddo to pieces, but that 5:00 hour is so rough and I'm usually by myself. I wonder how I'd ever handle more than one! I'm weak sauce. Haha.
Laura... yes I think she will get used to 6. DS is doing 6 A in the morning and it was a little while for him to get comfortable. I don't know why they don't sleep longer when needed... I figure it's either developmental, discomfort, tummy troubles (poop), or the wind is blowing the wrong way really. =/ Overall sleep pressure has something to do with it, I read somewhere.
Trimbler, yay teeth and being bug free... that was a doozy of a phase for you guys. And awesome goal...one nap by Christmas! And hey, if it doesn't work out and you have to tweek it, it's ok. I've *almost* accepted the trial and error, let go of control type of parenting. ;)
First mum, How was last night? Yeah, waiting might be worth a shot. But you know... I would say I would do something, and circumstances changed... for instance, DS would sound SO distressed and I went in immediately. I'm sure you're doing you're best for yourselves and your LO. Your instincts are better than any of our advice combined. And these past months and all the phases we're enduring... well, let's hope that the baby/kid amnesia thing is real because it's quite traumatic. Don't you think?
I can't wait for consistancy!!
Or the teeny blips of it we'll get for the rest of their lives!
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Hey Ginger, last night was good. Down at 6:30 and not a peep till 3am. Quite upset again so gave teething gel and seemed to help but only for short stretches. Easy enough to leave the room and quiet for 20-30 mins. But despite multiple resettles I brought her into bed with me at 4:15 and she slept till 6:30.
We kept her up an extra 15 mins and did crazy active play in the lounge and then quiet time unscrewing and re-screwing a chair leg :P. Bath was good and we have ditched the books for a bit as she is really anti them during the bedtime routine. I also gave her half a banana when she got out of the bath. We did pretty much the same tonight so everything crossed we get a similar result?!?!?!?
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continued here Support Thread for 2-1 Nap Transition cont'd pt 7