BabyWhispererForums.com
SLEEP => Sleeping For Toddlers => Topic started by: Mackjack on September 19, 2015, 06:01:36 am
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Hi.
I just cannot seem to take my eye off the ball for one second with this kid. I was posting on another thread for ages as DS for months was taking ages to fall asleep at BT - stripping, throwing everything out of cot etc until he would eventually start whinging and we would have to go in ( he would nod off on his own in the end though)- and then he would EW too. So his nights could sometimes only be 10 hrs. 9 times out of 10 he would go down for his nap fine and we would cap it at 2 hrs. So his EASY was like this:
WU between 5.30 - 6.15 (6.15 would be a good day! )
S 11.30/12 for 2 hrs capped
BT - in bed around 6.45/7 - mess about for around an hr every night so asleep about 8
Then we had a glorious week away where for some reason he would either go straight to sleep at BT or mess about but not need us to go into his room at all. And he would wake after 6am. It was fab! But he reverted to normal as soon as we got home.
At the wknd I accidentally woke him from his nap at 1hr 15. He messed around at BT as usual that night but - shock! - he slept til 7am the next day! ! Amazing! So I thought it was worth experimenting with this length nap for a few days. For the first few days he slept in every morning (6.30am-6.50) but I he was also messing around at nap time. At first he messed around at nap time but went down pretty easily at BT. Then he messed around for both but woke at a reasonable time. Now he messes around for both AND wakes up early (about 6). I should say that after the 1hr 15 naps he does look tired and wants a cuddle for a long time afterwards but is otherwise fine. So yes I guess the shorter naps could be causing OT but for goodness sake, longer naps don't work either!!!!
So when I stared the shorter naps EASY was
WU 6.30
S 30mins/1hr messing about -asleep between 12.30/13.00 capped at 1hr 15
BT minimal messing about or straight to sleep - asleep by 7.30pm
Now EASY is more like:
WU 6am
S mess about for an hr, asleep by 13.00
BT mess about for an hr or more, asleep by 20.00
What should I do? ????
By the way, I've only been doing the shorter naps for a week.
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Hi, I'd personally push that nap a bit later so he's more ready for sleep and keep it capped then make BT a bit earlier so lights off ready to sleep by 7pm if up at 6am.
You could be in a bit of an UT/OT cycle, so UT at nap but then as its capped OT by BT so lots of faffing about.x
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Hi Haribo. Thanks for your reply. So do you think push nap to about 13.00 ?
Day before yesterday he went to sleep at 20.00 and woke at 6am. Because he had a short night, I tried to get him down for his nap a but earlier. He went straight to sleep at 12.05. I woke him at 13.20. Then that night i put him down a little earlier and he played with his teddy for a bit but was asleep at 19.00. And he slept til 6.40am this morn- amazing night! Do you think this was just because he was v tired from the night before?
Didn't really know what to do today after such a good night and late ( for him! ) wu. So i put him down at 12.30 and he faffed til 13.10. Woke him at 14.25. In bed tonight at 19.00 and I think he's just settled (19.30). Does any of that confirm what you think? I cant see the woods for the trees most days. ...
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I'd go for 12.45/1pm and if he wakes early just bring it forward by 15 mins or so.
Looking at your last 2 days the first one he settled really quickly with a 13 hour day and today if he's asleep at 7.30 then that's a 13 hour day thereabouts.
I think if you stick at a 12.5/13 hour day on a 1.15/1.5 hr nap around 6 hours from WU then you might see things settle a bit...as your awake times will be a bit more balanced.
At 2 yrs old my DS was regularly napping at 1pm for 1.5 hours until we had to cap further when more faffing about started.
The way I always think is if he's happy and messing then he's not tired enough so we need to have a fiddle with times x
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Sounds like good advice, thank you. I'll follow those timings and see what happens.... will let you know!
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Good luck see what happens over 3/4 days x
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I'm trying what you said but it doesn't seem to be working. He is messing about at nap and bedtime still. Stripping off. And I have no choice but to go in his room and re-dress him when he does that as if he has access to his nappy he will take it off.
He has been a bit poorly the past couple of days (cold and teething) and has twice woken at 4am upset. I've given meds and then he's taken ages to get back to sleep but slept in a little til about 6.45. But even then, when I've settled him and given meds he STILL takes the opportunity to start taking his clothes off!!! And then still messed about at nap and BT. It just seems whether he's OT/UT/ill/whatever, he will mess about and I'm so sick of it. I really shouted at him tonight out of utter frustration after he had stripped off and thrown everything out of his cot and he just laughed at me. This has been going on for months. What makes it worse is that at this age, DD was a dream - she would actually ask for her nap and BT, go down with no fuss, nap for 3 hours and sleep 11 hours at night, no problem at all. And she was on that routine for absolutely ages. I know you can't expect two babies to be the same and I know a routine like hers is very rare but it just makes me feel like a failure with him. I really thought if I followed all the BW principles again with baby no 2, things would be ok. I feel totally defeated.
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Hugs Hun, these little ones just like to keep us guessing don't they, sorry things haven't improved.
It could be developmental along with teeth, we had lots of weird sleep due to language explosion, 2 year molars.
Your in no way a failure, kids come with no instruction manual and they certainly never do what you think they should.
I'd just try and stick to what your doing, if he's stripping off just re dress him with minimal chit chat, just say no it's bedtimes now, time for sleep...!
not much help Hun but try not to let it get you down x
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Thanks Haribo. I think you're right - this has been going on so long now, I don't think there's much I can do that I haven't already tried. I'm almost wishing he would drop his nap really early - at least that way, all I've got to work out is BT. Not nap time/length as well. There are just too many combinations of nap time/length and BT to try!! x
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I must admit no naps for us are so much easier, we prob started to think about cutting it down at this age....some do drop naps early so it's not beyond possible it could be happening with your DS.
Could just be coming up to birthday shenanigans too x
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Really? What sort of routine was your LO on at this age - do you remember? He just seems to chop and change so frequently. As i mentioned in my first post, at the beginning of September we went on hols for a week and he was brilliant - going down for a 2 hr nap no problem, then either going straight to sleep at BT or messing about in his cot but not needing any intervention from us. I don't know what changed but he does this all the time - routine is ok for maybe 3 weeks then he needs a change.
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I'm not saying it is nap dropping in case that made you panic ;) I do know that some ladies on here have LOs that have nap dropped by 2yrs....most carrying on for longer.
Our routine at that age was WU 6.30, nap 12.30 for 2 hours BT 7.30
But soon after this canines started cutting and we had EW BT messing and lots of developmental stuff going on and then one day he completed refused a nap and I had to walk with him stroller for an hour and half. We started cutting nap to 1.5 hours around then to make BT less faffing.
I think looking back at old posts I've been involved in its such a common age for sleep shenanigans that it's kind of stick to routines as best you can.
Maybe try nap at 12.30 for a day or 2 if he's been poorly and leave it uncapped and do BT 13 hours from morning WU see if he's OT!?
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No, no don't worry, you didn't panic me! 1 nap/no nap, I don't really mind - I just want to know where I am with him! ! That sounds a good idea as he has had quite a bit of broken sleep the past few days due to poorliness.
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Hope you get a decent BT
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Wasn't *too*bad. Stripped twice but asleep by 7.30
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:) fingers crossed for a good night x
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Not much progress here really. More than anything what I need right now is any tips at all on how to stop him taking his nappy off at nap and bedtime. It is driving me to total lunacy. Today he took it off 5 or 6 times at nap and BT. I have to sit staring at the monitor then frantically run upstairs to get it back on. I don't talk to him, don't takehim out of the cot, don't put the light on and still be keeps doing it. There is no item of clothing I can put him in that he can't remove.
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Sleeper on backwards? Sleepsack with side zip that has a snap cover (grobags are like this, so far have stopped DD3 from being able to remove them). Cloth diaper cover with snaps over top of regular diaper? Lol can you tell I have had 2 out of 3 kids who are clothing houdini's?
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Thank you! Have tried backwards sleep suit. He's not been in a sleeping bag for months as he just would not keep it on. Could try the cloth nappy idea. I'm glad you know my pain! !!
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Thanks for the suggestions Heidi...I was lucky with my DS didn't have this he's just an EW x
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Ladies.....This is getting totally out of hand. He is stripping completely at least 5 times every nap and BT - it can take up to an hour. The last 2 nights he has not fallen asleep til 8pm and then woken at 6am.
DH is at home with him today and just called me in total exasperation saying he has put him down for a nap and he has stripped 7 times so far and just weed all over his cot. DH is giving up and has taken him out of his cot - he's going to give him no nap today.
When he does nap he is reeally tired when we wake him and often tries to fall asleep again on the sofa. Haribo - is this the start of the 1-0 do you think? Is he messing about because he doesnt want the nap then messing around at BT because the nap has made him UT but then not getting enough sleep at night because of all the messing...etc etc. What do you think? ??
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Oh hun what a pain for you. How is he with no nap days have you had any yet?
Rather than no nap if you dont feel he is quite ready could you take a strategic drive around say 2.30pm and see if nods off and let him have just 20-30 mins?
If its a no nap day make BT early so you dont run into OT messing.
Have you looked at this thread, might be useful to join in if you feel you heading down the nap dropping route
Support for dropping the nap part 12
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No this will be the first no nap day. Yes we do the school run at 3.25 in the pram - do you think that's a bit late? DEFINITELY going to do early Bt tonight - I think he will either crash out straight away or go completely doolally with OT.
Does 20 months seem stupidly early for 0-1? Will definitely look at the thread. X
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If it was just a quick 20 min CN it should be fine...my DS sometimes nods off at that time and doesn't make much difference on the odd occasion.
It is early but some to drop early, Heidi who's commented on this thread has an early nap dropper in her DD3, sometimes it's just a developmental blip but you might need to apop naps for a while till you work out what's going on.
How's the day gone?
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Terrible. He haD no nap and DH took him to bed for 6pm. 45 mins of repeatedly removing his nappy. I don't know what on earth to do.
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I don't know what to say with the nappy removing as we didn't have that...maybe just remain consistent and out back on saying no we leave on its night times.
Hopefully he will sleep well for you x
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Thank you. I just don't know whether to try to give him a nap tomorrow or not. I don't know what he wants/needs anymore. I guess I just have to see how tonight goes - any NWs or an EW - and take it from there....
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I would see how your night goes, but I'd prob still offer a nap even if it's a quick CN to get him to BT.
If will get better Hun you might find the nappy thing is a phase he gets bored with soon x
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Thank you. I hope so! He's been doing it on and off for about 5 months!
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Are you using pull ups or normal nappies?
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Normal nappies. Sometimes he undoes the tabs, sometimes he pulls the nappy down like a pull-up.
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Have you tried a onsie?
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When you say a onesie do you just mean an all in one sleep suit with poppers?
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Yes but maybe one with more difficult openings
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Well - today I cut the feet off a onesie and put it on backwards for nap time (I've tried this before but he managed to get it off but this one's got stiffer poppers). I also put a doll in his cot with several layers of dolls clothes on in the hope he would strip the doll and not himself.
He undressed the doll for 10 mins or so then threw her and the clothes out of his cot. Then he started trying to get his onesie off. He got one arm out and opened a couple of poppers. Then he started getting annoyed and threw out his pillow. He then started whinging. I waited til he was properly crying to go in his room - when I did he was v upset and wanted cuddles and his pillow but I didn't give him a cuddle or give back anything he had thrown out. I kept telling him to lay down or I would leave. I returned to his room every few mins as he was still crying and if he didn't lay down I left. Eventually he laid down but didn't like the feeling of the poppers in his back so I laid him on his front stroked his head, said he was a good boy for laying down and left the room. He went to sleep. All took about 45 mins. So no nappy removal but he still attempted it and still messed around for ages.
So i don't know what to do tonight - I feel bad putting him in a back to front onesie if the buttons dig in his back when he lies down.
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Can he undo zips? Maybe look for a more or one with poppers didn't the side or zip!? He's a little magicians isn't he ;)
Maybe put a nappy on doll? How long did he nap for?
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Yes he can undo any kind of fastening you can think of! !! Nappy on the doll is a good idea. I capped his nap at 1hr 15 which is what I have been doing for almost a month as it *seems* to help with EW but he is always really tired after I wake him and just cuddles me on the sofa trying to go back to sleep so I am never really sure whether I'm doing the right thing with his naps. He's laying on me now nodding off....
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You could try putting the doll to bed game, put the nappy on tick her in etc and say good baby for keeping nappy it's night times see if a bit of roll play works!,
With the nap id prob keep as it is for now see if it passes but if still not helping push it later and cap it a bit more!?!x
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My son takes his diaper off too, the only thing that helped is putting his diaper on backward..
I was worried about leaks at first but we haven't had one and we do this a few times a week since be turned one
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Hi Mel. Did he do it at nap and BT? I don't know if that'll work with DS unfortunately as he takes his off like a pull up sometimes.
Haribo - I'm worried that cutting his nap anymore will make him really OT as he's already so tired after his nap?
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Hi Mel. Did he do it at nap and BT? I don't know if that'll work with DS unfortunately as he takes his off like a pull up sometimes.
Haribo - I'm worried that cutting his nap anymore will make him really OT as he's already so tired after his nap?
Just at naps, when he took it off he undid one side and then pulled it down..after I started putting it backwards he searches for the tabs and then gives up
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I guess with naps it's a case of seeing how he goes for a bit and if gets bored of nappy thing sleep might come quicker.
You know him best honey and if you want to keep nap the same then do it and ride out the nappy taking off...I'm sure it will stop. There are lots of developmental things going on at this age x
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Thank you both. I put him in the back to front onesie again for BT and he did exactly the same as at nap time - basically ended up crying so I had to go in his room a few times.
I think I will stick with nap as is, Haribo. Difficult as he is to read, I just have a feeling that cutting it further could spell ( even more) disaster.
Oh I wish he would just go to sleep without all this messing - it's just so exhausting.
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But he didn't manage to get out of the onesie? If he didn't I would keep doing that and then when he is upset keep going in with a key phrase and keep the interaction to a minimum. If he is still tired after his nap could he be ot? Is he cutting teeth or getting ill at all?
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Yes I will keep on with the onesie. That's what I'm wondering - if he could be OT. Because with all this messing about he's only getting about 11 - 11.5hrs sleep a day. He used to have a 2 hr nap and he would go down for his nap fine and only mess about at BT. We cut the nap to help with EW but now by the time he's finished stripping he's not asleep at night til 8pm and wakes at about 6am so the short nap doesn't seem to be achieving anything anymore. I *think* all of his teeth are through the gum now ( how many molars do they get again? ?? Can't remember!l)
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Did you try making the nap earlier and leaving it uncapped like we talked about to see if that helped as if he's OT he could be messing from that, unable to settle nicely etc?
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Hi Haribo - no I didn't - not intentionally, I just have so many different things to try, I forget! But yes I'm going to try that next - when you say uncapped, how long do you think I should dare let him sleep?
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I'd go for 1.5/2 hours max
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They get 4 molars around 1 year old and another 4 around age 2. 20 teeth in total.
Honestly I would be tempted to let him have an uncapped nap and see what happens, along with being firm about the backwards onesie.
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Right well I kept up with the backwards onesies and reverted to a longer nap (2hrs). As soon as I started letting him have longer naps, the stripping stopped! A bit of playing in his cot at sleep time but not for long and no intervention needed. Brilliant. Thought I'd cracked it.
Til today.
Granny was looking after him. He woke at 6.15 this morning (from 7.15 the night before). Granny put him down for a nap at 11.50 and he basically performed an all-singing, all-dancing cabaret in his cot for over an hour until granny finally gave in and got him up. By 16.30 he was shattered abs v whingy. She put him to bed at 18.00, he stripped and messed about til 18.35. I wondered if maybe that nap was just a touch too early causing him to be too UT to go down bit honestly, I can't keep making excuses for him....
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So happy he's stopped for you, was it the same today? My son is almost 20 months and he acts differently when he's with his grandmother. She lets him get away with more so he does more naughty things lol...maybe it's something similar with the sleep situation..He acted differently that day because granny isn't mommy.
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I'm not sure it is because granny was there as she looks after him a lot and he usually acts the same with her as he would for me. He slept from 18.35 til 6.15 this morning so let's see what happens at naptime today. ..
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That was a good night :)
Maybe he needed a few catch up naps and nights and now not so OT maybe push nap a bit later by 15/20 mins!?
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Yes I was thinking that Haribo. When he's had a rubbish nap the day before he tends to be tired the next day so I think I will put him down normal time today and if he sleeps ok I will then push his nap later tomorrow.
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Good plan, hope it goes well x
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Plan not working so far. Granny put him down at normal time - he had a tantrum about going to bed, messed about and really sobbed in his cot so she gave him meds. 30 seconds after having meds he was singing in his cot, stripping and chucking everything out. Upshot was he had no nap but fell asleep for a few minutes in his pram on school run. What do I do with this kid?!!!
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He just like to keep mummy in her toes!! How did BT go?
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BT was ok actually - granny said he played a little bit but she didn't need to intervene and he was asleep quite quickly at 19.05.
Other thing is he's being really naughty and defiant during the day time and I don't know if it's because he's so tired from missing naps.
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Hopefully he will sleep well and have s catch up night! Could well be OT and mood affected but if he's been having some naps and good nights it might be just developmental you know finding his boundaries and he's nearly 2 and they have birthday shenanigans, my DS has always been a month or so early with these behaviour leaps.
They get to a certain age when you can only offer the best opportunity for sleep and if they don't take it then you have to carry on with your day. Just keep using EBT or CN if he won't do a proper nap :)
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Ok - update. The next 2 days he played at nap time as usual until we eventually gave in and got him up - so no naps. We put him to bed early 6pm and both nights he went straight to sleep and slept 12 hrs. Today I Didn't even bother trying for a nap because I could see there was no way he was going down. He got tired in the afternoon about 4ish and half heartedly tried to nap on me but didn't. Hes been fine in the afternoons the past couple of days with no naps - even when he was in his pram at 3-4pm on fri when i really thought he would nod off, he didn't. I put him to bed early tonight and he was asleep at 6, no fuss.
The past 3 nights, including tonight, when he's gone to bed early, he's had brief early evening NWs (easily settled).
I'm thinking he is dropping the nap but is struggling a little and it's catching up with him, hence getting tired late pm today. The early eve NWs I'm guessing are due to OT. I'm thinking of trying putting him to bed about 17.30 tomorrow night if things go the same as they have been. He always wakes about 6.15am so I think I need to help him tag more sleep onto the beginning of the night as he never tags it on to the end.
What do you think? Does it sound like he's nap-dropping? Anybody know of any other LOs that have done it this early (nearly 21 months)?!
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My DD3 dropped her nap at 22 months...but she was obviously lsn from the get go, went to 2 naps at 4 months and one nap at 7.5 months.
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How did she cope with it? Did you get a lot of OT?
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She is a bit of an odd duck with sleep, and handles ot really well so we have had issues only when she is ill or someone at daycare lets her nap (she would happily nap at first and then not go to bed or have ew, now she will not nap at all).
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Argh we are getting NWs now and EWs are creeping in. Think I mentioned he's been waking about 9pm ish and is easily settled which is fine. Although he's been sleeping about 12hrs, when he wakes at about 6.15, he doesn't seem happy.
Yesterday morn he woke at 5.30 am. Last night he went to sleep about 6.15, cried out at 9pm but didn't need me to go to him. But he woke at 4am and I was in and out his room til about 5am when he fell back to sleep til 7.15am. Granny got him down about 6pm tonight. He's just woken and I had to go in twice over about 30mins to settle him. So I'm expecting another NW in the early hours.
I know this is the OT manifesting itself but what can I do? I know the advice is probably to let him have a catch up nap day but a) he won't go down for naps b) yes I could ask granny to take him out in his pram/the car to get him to nod off but what time? And how long for? If I get it wrong which I undoubtedly will, it will mean a BT fight and then there will be further fall out over the following days. I just don't feel willing to go back to a nap "guessing game" but I'm worried the NWs will get worse and he will prob EW too. So what shall I do? Super EBT??
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And sorry, Masyn, I meant to say thanks for sharing your experiences. I wish he handled OT like your LO!
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If you think it's OT then I'd do sebt or a catch up nap!
Are you having NND then now or still using a CN?
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ARRRGGGGHHHHHH! GIVE ME STRENGTH! Firstly toanswer your question Haribo, we are having NNDs every day. After the early NW last night that I mentioned in my last post he slept all night and woke happy at 6am. I asked Granny to have him in bed tonight for 6pm. She took him up at 5.45pm. He then proceeded to strip 3 times and mess about for an hr!!!!! WHYYYYY????? I thought the messing about at sleep time had been cured by dropping the nap!! What does this child want??? WHAT????
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*just realised the "arrrgh" looks like it was directed at you Haribo - it wasn't!!*
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Don't worth I kind of realised the argghhhh wasn't at me! I know it's frustrating honey sometimes there is just developmental stuff going on we can't fix.
I'd try forcing the CN for at least 20 mins just to see if it helps!?
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Thanks Haribo. But when do I do the CN?
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Hmm that I not sure of timing, but I do think I would pull out all the stops to get a nap in. I think ot is accumulating and the stripping etc is likely down to development not being ut if he is still doing. Have you ever laid out expectations out of the moment? We get a lot of mileage out of that lately!
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I'm not sure what you mean by "laid out expectations out of the moment"?
He slept all night btw, but woke at 5.50am
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What time had he fallen asleep at the night before (guessing 7 ish?).
What I meant was we finally clued in here that although DD3 was not talking a lot her receptive language is quite good so when she was happy and calm I would tell her what I expected - ie "when you wake up tomorrow everyone else is asleep so no shouting from your bed" or in your case "bedtime is time to get in your pj's and get ready for sleep. We do not take our pj's off at bedtime". Just had a thought - what type of fabric are the pj's? Tags? Could it be more a sensory thing?
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So to recap the last few days (as i'm losing track myself! )
Monday
Asleep 6.15
Cried out at 9pm but didn't wake
NW 4-5am
Tues
Wu 7 15
Asleep about 6pm
NW 9pm for 30mins
Weds
WU 6am
Bed at 5.45 - stripped/messed about til about 6.45
Thurs
WU 5.50
I see what you mean now. I will try saying things like that to him - thank you
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Sorry those days should be sun, mon, tues, weds - not mon-thurs
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He was in the car with granny today and nodded off at 2.30 for about 30mins so she's going to put him to bed at 7. I'm fully expecting a lot of bedtime nonsense.
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How did it end up going? I hope no news is good news ;)
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He went down ok. Not sure when he actually fell asleep but it was some time between 7-7.30 Just heard him wake up at 5.45am. Seems happy.
However granny said his behaviour was appalling after hours car nap yesterday.
I dont really know what conclusion to draw from this. Yes it's good that he went to bed well but he was going to bed well with no nap til the other day. And 7/7.30 til 5.45 isn't a long night, is it?
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Depends on the lo...11 hours is a pretty normal night for us, we get 11.5/12 sometimes but not often. DD3 fell asleep in the van for 30 min today (totally unheard of lately but we had had a busy day) and was a complete bear afterwards too! Sheesh if I had a nap I would be perky, not grumpy :P
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If he had an hours nap then that's nearly 12 hours total sleep so not horrific. My DS used to be awful if he was woken at an hour, must've been in a deep sleep!?
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So do you think if he's doing around 11/12 hrs a day whether that includes a nap or not, that that's enough sleep?
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It really depends on LO, my DS did 10.5 hour nights and 1.5 hour naps then nights but it varied depending on what developmental things were going on. Sometimes he did 2 hour naps and 11.5 hour nights but quite rare for us. At 3.5 he does no nap and 10.5/11 hour nights...we dream of 12-13 hour nights lol
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It really varies! At this age my DD1 got 13/14 hours, DD2 a whopping 16 and DD3 gets 11, sometime 12.
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Helpful to see how much LOs can vary. I want to try to be consistent with him. If hes not napping through choice I don't really want to have to apop naps in the car every day - it's just not really do-able. So I want to try to get him to bed at the same time every night but I guess I'm worried that in some way I will be depriving him of sleep by not apoping naps.
He nodded off in car again today for about 10mins close to 3pm. Granny put him to bed at 6 - he started to strip so she went in his room and just picked him up and held him. Seemed to calm him a bit as he went straight down to sleep after although he woke upset about an hr later.
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Ladies. I am so grateful for all your advice but I really believe there is no solution to this nonsense at BT.
Today he woke at 620am after a decent night. Nodded off for 10mins in the car at 10.30 am. I put him down tonight at 6.pm. He immediately started stripping. He did it over and over about 20 times. I have no choice but to go in his room and dress him as he takes off his nappy too. Each time he started stripping again as I was leaving the room. And he laughs as he does it. I have to hold him down to get the nappy back on as he kicks and writhes frantically, laughing all the time. The more I hold him down, the more he laughs. Honestly, he's got red finger marks all over him where I had to restrain him to stop myself getting kicked in the face. You wouldn't believe how infuriating it is. I'm ashamed to admit this - and I'm only admitting it because I didn't actually do it - but I've never been so close to smacking a child. And that makes me feel awful.
He first started doing this in about April so if it's a phase, it's a long one. Over the months he has done it more and more regardless of :whether he has had a nap, nap length, what time BT is , good or bad night the night before, OT, UT, busy day, quiet day, whatever he's wearing. Ok maybe it's just him. But I have no tools to tackle this with and nothing left to try.
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Oh sweetie don't feel awful they do test us and we are all at one time or another close to cracking. If it gets you that mad walk away and leave him too it.
If it was me honestly I'd just leave him stripped off, stick a towel on top of his bedding and see how long it takes him to go to sleep then just put nappy back on. I would be close to loosing my temper if I had to keep going back for that amount of times. It seems like it's a game to him now so you maybe need to let him realise your not playing anymore!
How firm are you with him? Do you say no, and if you take nappy off again mummy won't be coming back!?
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You're right, it is a game to him. I used to tell him off but I've learnt that the more I say, the funnier he finds it. And if I get angry he just find it hilarious. So I literally say nothing. But the thing is, I'm really questioning myself. I thought he was playing at sleeptime because he needed to drop the nap. We dropped the nap and the messing about stopped. But obviously has now started again at BT. So I'm just totally clueless now.
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I would just leave him to it then, just for a few night to see if it changes when he realises he's not getting your attention from it.
I'd still think he needs some kind of nap as he wasn't really LSN before but he may learning new skills and its hindering his ability to drop to sleep.
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Hi Haribo. I'm sorry, this must be frustrating for you as you keep coming up with things to try and I keep telling you they haven't /won't work but - I'm just not brave enough to leave him to it. A couple of times when we've not been quick enough to get to his room when he's taken his nappy off, there has been pee everywhere - bedding, wall, carpet....
I've just put him down tonight at 6 ( he woke alt 5.55am). He tried stripping bit was in his backwards onesie and for some reason, struggled with it tonight. He was crying so I went up and he asked for a cuddle. I'm usually v strict and don't give in when he asks for cuddles after messing about at night but I felt like it might calm him so I gave him a quick one and he seemed to be asleep at 6.20. Bit there's no rhyme or reason for why tonight's BT was slightly better than the night before.
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Only you can do what you feel comfortable with honey, I'd just carry on being firm then no chat and put nappy back on and forget the rest if he's stripped off!
Fingers crossed you get a good night x
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We did have a good night - except we had a 3am WU due to a leaky bloomin nappy! He was v good, let me change him and his cot and went back to bed with no fuss but it took him a while to nod off and so he ended up sleeping in til 7.15. He was v tired this afternoon and nearly nodded off on me in a restaurant at about 4pm. Went to bed fine though at 6pm.
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Great news apart from the nappy x
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It's been a while so I thought I'd update to help anyone having the same problems ( and to ask another q!). Basically we have stuck with the no naps and the stripping at BT seems to have stopped (pleeeease! )
I think the transition is taking a while though - he is after all only 22 months - and he will sometimes drop off if in a car/buggy during the day and we have to wake him. Because of this I was questioning myself as to whether he really is dropping the nap or whether I'm pushing him and hes not ready but a recent holiday proved me right, I think, because we were in the car a lot meaning he sometimes napped between 30 mins and an hr. On those days either BT would take forever or he would wake for a couple of hours at night so I think that proved to me that naps are disruptive to his night sleep.
Only thing is for a good while we were getting 12 hr nights witjhno naps but recently we are getting almost habitual EWS - 5.40am - and for the past week or so, maybe longer, he's been waking early evening. Sometimes he's really upset, sometimes a quick cuddle is all it takes and he goes back to sleep. I try to get him to bed as early as poss - on a good day he is asleep by about 18.20. Is he in an OT vicious cycle do you think? Here are the last two days EASY
WU 5.4am
S nodded off for 5 mins at 10.30am in car
S nodded off for 10 mins at 17.10 in car (aaargh!)
BT not as bad as I expected following that late mini nap - asleep by 18.45
No NW
WU 5.4am
S nodded off in pram for 5 mins at 15.30, had to wake him
BT asleep by 18.20
NW 22.40 - quick cuddle *seems* to have settled him
Any ideas?
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Sorry those WUs should read 5.40am not 5.4am
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Idk for us an 11 hour night after a catnap day is par for the course! Our nights are normally 8pm-7am, sometimes 7:30. The last time she had a catnap (7 min) she was up until almost 10 pm.
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Aaargh it's amazing isn't it, that literally closing their eyes for a few minutes can "charge"them up so much!!! What do you think about the NWs?? After the brief one last night he woke this morning at 6.20 am. So that was a 12 hr night with a v short waking at 22.40.
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We get random nw's a lot...sometimes all she needs is covers tucked in or her doll. Plus on nights where I was not home at bedtime she tends to call out to see if I am back when she is in a lighter sleep cycle I have noticed.
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Yes I Don't mind the NWs so much if they're easily settled and are early eve but I just wonder if they're ot related. We've had a few no NW nights the past few nights but I'm sure we'll get them again.
These EWs are becoming a problem though. I know I probably sound unreasonable expecting him to sleep later than 5.40am when he's gone to bed by 6.30pm but he is very clearly still tired when he wakes. Yesterday he was v tired during the day and nodded off for about 10 mins in the car at about 10.45am and again at 13.45pm. When we woke him he was v grumpy and crying and (we were out) he just wanted to be carried around by me and DH the whole time while resting his head on our shoulders looking like he would nod off. So we got him to bed by 6pm last night as we knew he was so tired but he messed around blowing raspberries and asking for cuddles til about 6.30pm! No nws but as usual, awake at 5.40 this morning sounding grumpy and tired but again as usual he just won't go back to sleep.
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What do you think? Shall I try WTS? Hes been up at 5.45 every day this week. Went to bed at 6pm last night, 2 NWs - 9pm ish and just before midnight - v easily settled literally within seconds. But he's woken just now at 5.45am and I am tiiiiired.
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If he always wakes at the same time w2s is worth a shot. Ugh ew are the worst! I am so not a morning person, they are tough.
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Yes he does. Ok great will give it a try i think. Need to work out when to do it as I find it really hard to get back to sleep if I wake early hours of the morning and don't really want to go to work on a 4.45am start....!!
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No definitely not!