BabyWhispererForums.com
SLEEP => Night Wakings => Topic started by: ac333 on January 28, 2018, 05:55:59 am
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Hi everyone,
Just when we thought we figured it out....
so about 3 months ago we were able to get everything consistent for her naps and sleeps. When she turned 5 months everything started changing. Her night sleep started getting affected and she always slept well through the night. Now sometimes she wakes two to three times in the night and she needs at least one night feed
we started her on solids too early at about 5 months because she was really gassy and that made her night sleep even worse. So we scaled it back. Now she's better with solids. But we only give her solids for breakfast and lunch.
I'm a little bit lost as to what to do now.
In the past week she would wake up between 10 and 11 p.m. before we give her the dream feed.
She was ebf. Until we started solids.
Easy schedule is as follows
730. Bf
9am Solids
9:45 1.5 Oz topup ebm
10:15 nap
12pm bf
1:30 solids
2:15 1.5 Oz top up ebm
2:45 nap
4:30 bf
5:45 & 6:45 bf
7:30 sleep
11:15 df 5oz ebm
Her naps r generally great
Her night sleeps hav been terrible for the past 2 Mos almost.
Any suggestions on how to help w NW's? I feel like I'm always feeding her and praying that the top ups will stop soon and she can last thru the night as well
Does this mean she is ready for more solids?
Any advice will help. Thx
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Hi there sorry you’ve had no replies how are things now?
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Thx so much for replying. Ups and downs. She still waking atleast 2x in the night. If she has 2 good naps, but still wakes in the night, can it still mean she UT? She is at around 1.45 per nap. I've adjusted it to 1.40 with no help.
Lately she hasn't been able to sleep past 10pm.
Don't know where to start.
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Lately she hasn't been able to sleep past 10pm.
Sorry, can you clarify what you mean by this please? She is waking at 10pm and doesn't go back to sleep all night??
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She is at around 1.45 per nap. I've adjusted it to 1.40 with no help.
Are you waking her from all her naps?
When is she waking at night? The EAS you posted suggests her nights are pretty good, so unless you tell us when the NWs are, its pretty hard to tell what might be causing them and how to help.
ately she hasn't been able to sleep past 10pm.
Are you meaning she's waking at or before 10pm rather than staying asleep til you do the dream feed?
What's the reason for the EBM topups and the many cluster feeds before bed? Has she been slow to gain weight? Refluxy? You could certainly try offering EBM as a drink with her solids meals rather than doing topups so you're not offering food and drink so frequently if that's an issue for you.
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Hi.
When she wakes around 10, I'll feed her. Often times she'll sleep again. Sometimes it will take an hour or so to settle her.
Yes she wakes before i plan to df. But I'll feed her anyway. She usually wakes anytime from 10 to 10:30. That's why I thought I should still cluster feed. Good idea w giving milk w meals!
Her weight is great gaining well.
Yes, I'm waking her from her naps. Her naps for the most part is good. For nights it's all over the place. On a good night she'll wake around 10 and once more in the middle of the night for a feed. On a bad night it's every hour.
The past few nights she has woken twice for 2 nights and one night she woke 5 times. So it's all over the place.
Maybe it's her sensitivity to food . I noticed if I giver her a full meal for dinner, she will wake more so I've scaled back the dinner.
But she seems to take enuf calories throughout the day so I'm shocked she still wakes for a feed...high metabolism I guess?
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I think you need to consider letting her sleep for at least one nap. Capping both naps is a recipe for OT. Think how you feel all day if someone wakes you before you're ready to wake... do you feel rested? I bet your DD probably doesn't either!
Certainly she's young wnough to not NEED dinner, reasonable to dial that back if she's waking with tummy discomfort attributable to solids.
Quite normal to take a feed or 2 at night at this age. Not all babies need it but plenty do.
When she is waking at night (5x, not 2x because 2 is reasonable for feeds), is she waking more in the early evening or middle of the night or early hours of the morning? How does she behave when she wakes?
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Do you mean let her sleep past her 1.5-1.75 hr nap? I figured that may cut into her night sleep.
The only set time she wakes is around 10ish usually just before df. Other times are sporadic. She cries when she wakes. And it's quite a sudden loud cry which prob is discomfort.
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Do you mean let her sleep past her 1.5-1.75 hr nap? I figured that may cut into her night sleep.
Yes, that's exactly what I mean. You can cap the other nap at 45min if she naps 2hr if you want to, but ideally, you let her sleep for one nap at least to 2hr and wake her then or (more gently) when she rouses around 2:15 into the nap.
I think if you were to do that, her night sleep may actually improve as I suspect it may be OT related.
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Thx for the suggestion. I did as u suggested 2 days ago, so the afternoon nap I woke her @ 2 hrs. That night she woke 5 times. She also cried at put down.
Maybe bc she's ut? Maybe I'll bring the 1st nap to an hour only and then give her 2.15 in aft nap.
Sometimes I wonder if it's. Will keep u posted
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Look forward to your update :)
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Last night was a flop. I think dd was so tired. And she slept on the go as we had errands to run
W7:15
E 730
S 1030
W 11
E 12
S 220
W 345
E 415
S 7
W 915 (I fed)
S 940
W 1015
W 11:45 (fed)
W 4 (fed)
W 6 & 7
Not sure what to do right now. I might just go back to the 1h40min of sleep each nap.
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She really didn't have a great day there and was OT, hence those wakings.
I wonder can you let her sleep for the first nap of the day, then wake her from the second nap depending upon the length of the first nap? Is that feasible in your day? That just gives you the best chance of her getting the best naps.
You can certainly go back to what you were doing - just not sure how that's going to fix the problem you posted about.
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funny enuf that's what we did yest! By accident bc I was so tired I we both slept in!
So her naps were 10:20-12:20 approx and 3-4:30.
Her night put down 7:15
I woke her for df @ 1040 which is good. She woke @ 3 :30 for a feed. But then woke at 5:45, 6:15 & 7 afterwards.
Extending her a.m nap is a bit tuff for my work schedule so I was hoping to extend her pm nap.
I hope it works but I remember now that she had 2 hour naps before and it didn't seem to help. so I hope that it works now.
Soooo tired.
Should I even do the df at this point? I was hoping to wait until she's eating a full 3 meals of solids before stopping
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She woke @ 3 :30 for a feed. But then woke at 5:45, 6:15 & 7 afterwards.
So, this can be gas from gulping in air whilst feeding at the height of your supply (highest in the early hours of the morning). That's somewhat easier to fix than OT, as you can be sure to burp her well before she goes back to bed and you can try lying back to feed so the flow isn't quite so much to cope with.
That's a much better night.
Should I even do the df at this point? I was hoping to wait until she's eating a full 3 meals of solids before stopping
If its working for you, by all means, continue. If you're tired because you're staying up just to do the DF and you'd be better off going to bed at 9, do that.
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Hi all, wanted to update, last nite was one of the best notes in a while! Sched as follows
W 6
E 7:30
S 1015
W1205
S 250
W355
S 720pm
W 9pm - I decided not to feed her bc I knew she couldn't be hungry. I did pupd for 15min, reassured her that we are ok. Funny enough, I got a bit desperate and I started to use "ohm" to settle her. And she did after the 2nd attempt! It completely soothed her. Then:
Df 10:40
W 3:30 fed
Then she slept all the way to 7:30!
I do normally let her burp quickly so to keep her asleep by I followed what u said and kept her up a bit longer to the burp. So that must have helped.
Cross fingers and toes. So far it's almost 10 and she's still asleep. Thank you for all that u do. Your support is invaluable xoxo
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That night's much better! Hope it continues :)
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Hi, seems like dd is still waking between 9:30-1030. We did pupd and it hasn't worked as well. Her naps are still good and she has been sleeping much better through the night with just one feed. What can it be? And shouldn't I be dropping the df at this age as she's almost 8 mos? Problem is she still wakes to feed between 3:30 and 5:30. Any ideas?
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Could be a bit of OT though it doesn't fit the pattern nicely, could be anticipating the DF. You could certainly drop it and feed when she wakes (it would likely be a bit earlier than 3-5am).
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Hi again,
Dd is now 8 mos now and things have gotten a tad better. Atleast she's waking up only once per night on good days.
I've noticed a bit of a pattern. Our easy sched hasn't changed much sometimes we will put her down the for night sleep @ 7 if she's tired. And sometimes later. If we put down event 10mins later she will fuss at put down - but then once we settle her she will sleep until I wake her for df. But if we put her down early as in 7, she will tend to wake up crying between 9:30 - 10. In fact she just did tonight, early put down, woke @ 9:05 and fussed til 925 and cried bloody murder until I nursed her. It's hard to believe she's hungry as she has a feed at 4:30, dinner @ 6 and a last feed @ 6:30.
Also I find if she cries between 9:30-10, she can sleep through the night after the df.
Any thoughts?
O yes, and to boot, she decided to start rolling around in her bed.
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It sounds like she's OT when she's going to bed at 7pm. You say you're putting her to bed because she's tired and she's waking in that first 3hr after BT which is classic for OT at BT.
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Really? Because she usually wakes @ 7:30. Today was not so good. Here is our sched again:
W 7:30
S 10:30
E 12:15
S 3
E 4:45
S 7:30
Today she cried each time. We put her down, leave and after a few mins or so she would fuss and then roll and over and fuss more like a protest. If we go in and sit by her she stops.
Is she UT? Last night she cried for a half hour til 8ish and then slept until 7:30 this morning w a df. So maybe she had such a good sleep she's ut?
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When are you putting her down? At 3hr or just before?Certainly she could be a touch UT. Not by much though if she's napping the length of naps as you posted there. I'm wondering what's bad about that day? That she was a bit grumpy pre-nap?
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I put her down usually 10-15min before depending on how tired she is. I notice she waking up a bit more know from her naps.
Yest she slept well thru all her naps. Even her night put down was good as well. But again she woke crying around 10, this time was unusual as she pooped which could be why.
She is waking up much less now during the night. Usually only once for a feed. So that's good.
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I put her down usually 10-15min before depending on how tired she is.
This could be why you're getting that protest cry - you really only need to PD with 3-5mins to settle for most babies, so you can safely reduce that settling time if she's regularly upset about being PD for the naps.
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Thank you for all your help. U all r so amazing
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Glad we could help :)
Don't forget to increase her A time as she grows - it keeps increasing fairly steeply through 6mo-9mo so if you're PD 3-5mins before nap time and still getting protest cries, or naps are getting shorter, or she's waking progressively earlier in the morning, or she's having long happy wakings at night - those are all signs to increase A time - just by 10-15mins is usually enough if you catch it early enough.
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Thx for the the tip...we will be adjusting it soon by the looks of it....
Your support helps me feel I'm not doing this alone. Much appreciated.
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Your support helps me feel I'm not doing this alone.
I'm glad. That's why we do this xx
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Hi. Not sure if I should make a new post or should I reply to this one. Apologies in advance. Looks like we're still having issues with little one. She still seems to wake up often at night although we've had some pretty good nights. She can sleep through the night sometimes and sometimes he does not. I don't seem to find a pattern.
Here is her new sleep schedule that doesn't seem to be working.
W 7:30
S 1045
W 1145
S 3
W 4:30
S 7:45-8
She still wakes up sometimes around 10:30-11. Or at other times in the middle of the nite. Can she still be hungry? She's almost 10mo and she takes 3 meals of solids + 4 bf's a day.
There are days she sleeps through the night
I'm stuck on how to figure her out. Pls help
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Hmmm... Certainly some babies are still hungry for a feed - I found doing topup BFs/offering EBM in a cup/bottle at solids times helped increase the calorie intake in the day and helped drop NFs around this age. Is she waking just the once? Wonder if there's an OT/UT cycle going somewhere in there. Can you post a few days in a row, please?
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Ok, so the past few days as follows:
W 7
S 1035-1215 (planned for an putting so longer am nap)
S 3:45-4:30
S7:30
Woke 1:30 bf and went to sleep
W7:15
S 10:45-11:55
S 3:15-430
Putdown 7:40 cried and slept 8:20
Woke 2:20 and 6:30 bf both
W 7:15
S 10:35-11:45
S 3:15-4:30
S 8
W 4 (bf and back to sleep)
W 6:30 pu/pd w no success
Thx in advance.
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Ok tonight is a huge flop.
She had two good naps of 1h15min approx
My dh put her down around 7:45 and she still isn't asleep - it's 9:45. So we have been at it for 2 hours. Doing pu/pd, and shushing. I have no idea what's going on..
Her naps seem ok altho she seems tired still after she wakes, not sure if it's bc she's had so many ew's.
I would say this is her nite sleep at its worse. It may hav been bc we swapped after an hour which we never did before - bc we never had to.
Tonight is a really challenging one....
Any suggestions?
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Aw :( Its hard when LO just won't go to sleep. Run through and check for pain, hunger, etc as you usually would. If she's not upset, leave her to it, she'll fall asleep/cry out for help eventually. If she's upset, stay with her and do your best to soothe her.
W 7S 1035-1215 (planned for an putting so longer am nap)S 3:45-4:30S7:30Woke 1:30 bf and went to sleepW7:15S 10:45-11:55S 3:15-430Putdown 7:40 cried and slept 8:20Woke 2:20 and 6:30 bf bothW 7:15S 10:35-11:45S 3:15-4:30S 8W 4 (bf and back to sleep)W 6:30 pu/pd w no success
This suggests to me that she needs a touch more A time - to make that long nap longer and to encourage her to keep sleeping in the early hours of the morning rather than waking earlier - and she's probably ready for one long nap and a short (20-30min) CN.
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Ok. We did the long nap a couple weeks ago w no success. We can go at it again.
So for the long nap, shd I follow Tracy's suggestion and let her sleep as long as she wants or shd I cap it?
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I would let her sleep up to 2hr, then cap if it gets to that.
What was the trouble when she was taking a longer nap? Refusing the catnap?
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She would still wake up in the nite. Hopefully she's a bit more mature now. Will update in a week. Thanks so much. I'm Sooo tired...
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How's it going?
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Thx for checking in!
She has consistently been waking @ midnight....and sometimes we r in there for over an hr settling her. But atleast she is good on all putdowns and she sleeping til 7:30 mostly.
W 7:30
S 10:30
W 12:15
S 345
W 4:30
S 8
At this point I'm guessing push her A times? 30min pm nap seems short and I don't want her sleeping past 4:30.
Any suggestions are appreciated
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O my, so tonight was a bit of a disaster.
She cried on pd few min after.
Not sure if ut or ot
I chg the sched
W 7:30
S 11
W 12:45
S 4
W 430
S 8 - but fought sleep til 9
I did just pd each time she stood up. And she thought it was fun so we did that for a half hr. Then I had to tend to my ds so I had to let her cry for a while. Once I went in I held her til she was practically asleep and then finally went down.
Geez, w my dh not here, it's what it has to be.
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An update on past couple days.
I figured I would stick to the same schedule. W her napping @ 11am and 4pm.
Both nights she fought a few mins after I put her down. Then both nights she woke at around 2am and 4/5am.
Brutal.
Does this mean I'm on the wrong track?
Should I go back to giving her even time naps and push her night sleep later?
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I did just pd each time she stood up. And she thought it was fun so we did that for a half hr.
This sounds UT.
What's she doing when she wakes at night?
How old is she now? I'm losing track!
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She's 10.5 mos. Our sleeps are everywhere the past few days.
Yest we put her down at 11am and she only napped til 1145. I put her down earlier today but she cried so I pushed the sleep to 11:45 and slept 1h45m. But then she didnt sleep a 2nd nap. So I put her down earlier for nite sleep @ 7 and she cried.
I did wi/wo again . In the end she became overtired so I nursed her but she cried when I ran out of milk so I prepped some formula and she slept after. She hasn't had formula since she was 3mos so not sure how her system will handle it.
Maybe she needed extra topup bc she was so tired?
She had a big dinner and I bf her before bed (which prob wasn't much).
Anyway, hope that is the reason. Atleast I know that is one of the reasons she won't put down at nite.
So if she naps from 11:45- 1:30, how would the 2nd nap/catnap fit in? Or would it be early bedtime? So confused and so exhausted.
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You could try a stroller nap or similar around 4pm for 20-30mins.
You could try a short AM nap, capped at 30min then a longer PM nap - it can take some fiddling to find the right A time in the middle of that though. It will probably then become your routine for ~2-3months before you start moving even closer to 1 nap.
If the 2nd nap is only being refused sometimes, you can try EBT.
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Hi, so last nite she woke up @ 11pm, and 3pm. Both times taking awhile to settle. I nursed her eventually bc she cried for so long. Today I chg'd her sleep bc she really didn't seem tired and she cried when I put her down before:
S 11:45
W2:30(i woke her)
Pd nite sleep @ 7:15
S 8:15
Her nap was great. But still she cried after I left the room for nite sleep. She didn't seem tired @ 7:15 which is unusual bc she's already been up for almost 5 hrs.
Could it bc she so use to sleeping around 8?
Should I b using wi/wo? When I come in she stops crying immediately, if I stay in she starts babbling and standing like it's play time...again not seeming tired. Once I leave she cries.
When should I feed her after she doesn't settle? The past few days it took an hour and I worry she may get hungry.
Sorry I keep asking for tips. I'm struggling a bit.
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When should I feed her after she doesn't settle? The past few days it took an hour and I worry she may get hungry.
I get this, but if she's wanting to feed to get back to sleep, she knows if she cries long enough, she'll get fed. It sounds like this might be a feed to sleep prop.
What does she do when she wakes? Is she upset? Playing?
How does she get to sleep for naps and bedtme?
Could she be hungry? What is she eating through the day?
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She cries when she wakes.
We just put her down and she will sleep.
She has 3 meals of solids, all whole foods: avocado, yams, oatmeal, bananas, meats, etc
I bf her 3x now in the day.
Yesterday I thought maybe she was fussy bc she wanted milk, so I gave her the bottle before bed and she only took an oz.
Last nite she was better.
She napped 2h45m in the day
Cried at 7:20 til 8:15
But only woke @ 12:30. She took a full feed. And fell asleep right after
Hopefully we'r on to something.
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Hi, wondering if she's waking fr ot, do we still do wi/wo? And do u suggest walking out all the way even if she is crying? Or immediately tend to her even if we haven't even exited?
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Sorry, yes, if LO is waking from OT, she will likely need a bit more assistance to fall asleep and she's asking for that. You can still do WI/WO and you don't have to be out of sight before going back. Ideally you would provide her that reassurance when she asks for it such that she learns you can be relied upon to meet her needs. She has emotional needs as much as she has physical needs and you'd never tell your friend she can't have a hug when she's sad or scared and asks for one, right? Same here.
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Yes we have scrapped wiwo as it seemed too hard for her. We stay in the room.
She seems to sleep well now w the 2.5 hr single nap. Except she wakes after 3 hrs of sleep (again) at nite
I was nursing her but I knew it wasn't the solution so we have been doing shush/pat.
Took 3 hrs 1st nite, and last nite 2 hrs,
Tonight I'm going to see if wake to sleep will work.
Hope this works out.
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Fingers crossed for you. That's a long time to be doing shush/pat but its probably a prop rather than hunger at this point.
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So of the 5 nights I have stopped nursing, she has slept thru the nite once. Which gave us a glimmer of hope.
She has woken up still at the 3 hour Mark even w the wts.
Any idea why she wakes @ 3hrs? I think she isn't able to get into that deep sleep comfortably
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3hr after BT? Consistently? It can be habitual - you could try W2S for that. It can be OT at BT but its almost too consistent to be that and she's otherwise sleeping well so it might be worth it if she resettles independently or fairly quickly. Did you do a DF at some point? Could be left over from that but I'd think not... I think either try the W2S for the 3hr waking or just give it a bit more time to settle with the fewer NWs and see if she stops on her own.
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Ok. We did 3 nights of wts and it didn't help much.
Some nights are brutal. She wakes at the 3hr Mark and sometimes she's awake for 2 hours and will cry if we leave.
Yes. Df but has almost 2 mos.
We are at a week of doing this and she's only sttn once. Whoa-is-me.
If not habitual, can it be 2.5 hr nap is too long?
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What does her EAS look like now? She's 11months, right?
She is napping well but her day may just be a bit long for her - she's very young for one nap.
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Her sched is:
W 7:30
S 12
W 2:30
S7:45-8
Yes activity time seems long but not sure how to do the naps bc her wake time seems approx 4-5hrs. She fusses if we put her down earlier. Than 4hrs since we had this sched she's been going down well. It's just that dreadful 3hr wake
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I think pull BT 15-30mins earlier and see how you go. I'd aim for no more than a 12hr day for a week and see if that helps.
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Hi, wanted to update. We hadn't had much luck w the sleep until just recently. It didn't matter what times her sleeps were - she would still wake atleast twice per night so I looked at other avenues. A few things I think really helped.
- I cut out any caffeinated drinks out completely
- we gave her an herbal remedy prescribed to soothe and calm babies during sleep. One ingredient in it was catnip which apparently has always been used for babies with high energy and colic. 2 drops of that and it worked wonders
Hope this helps any mom's out there who have done everything and still no luck
I'm happy to report she has been sleeping through the night for a couple is weeks now.
Thx again for Ur help and for keeping this website alive!
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Glad you found something that works for you and your LO :) Great news!