4 Mths old w/ 20 min. nap on her own...but sleeps 2 hrs in my arms. Help !

[Lison]

Hello everyone. This is my first time on the nap board. Hopefully someone can help. I am getting desperate.

My 4 month old daughter will only nap for 20 min. She does fall asleep on her own in her crib but then wakes up crying after 20 minutes. I have tried pat/sush and pu/pd but nothing seems to work. She will only cry more and more and doesn't settle at all. She is obviously tired but the only way she will sleep is in my arms and sometimes it's for 2 hours. I want my life back but will give in and let her sleep on me if that means she can rest and not be cranky. We are on a 2-2h30 hour E.A.S.Y. I don't know what to do anymore and sometimes feel like a failure for not being able to have her sleep in her bed. What am I doing wrong ?

thanks

[Aly Mac]

Hi there - lots of hugs to you    First thing - You are not a failure!!! the fact that you are on here, asking questions to try and get your lo to sleep and happy means that you care.

Ok, first up, can I ask that you post a typical routine, so we can see the whole day/night routine.

I also suspect that your DD could go on a longer EASY routine.  Often by 4months they are on a 4hr easy. Is there a reason why you are feeding every 2/2.5hrs?  Is it because of the naps so you are feeding her after her short nap?

Anyway, post the routine and we can have a look.

[Lison]

Hi again. Here is my routine. Thanks for looking into this.

wake up around 7h00
E : 8h00am
A :
S : 9h00 - for 20 min. alone in her crib
E : 10h00
A :
S : 11h30- for 20 min in crib and maybe 1.5hr in my arms
E : 1h30
A :
S : 3h00 - again for 20 min. then 1 hr in my arms
E : 4h00
A :
S : 5h00 - 7h00pm - in my arms - usually does not want to go to sleep in her crib
E : 7h00pm
A :
S : 8h00 + sleep after

she usually wakes up 2 or 3 times during the night (11h30 - 2h30 & 5h00am)

a nurse told me to feed her every 2 hrs during the day that way she might not wake as much during the night. 

Is 4 months to young for PU/PD ?

thanks

[Aly Mac]

Ok, I'm no proffesional, but based on my mummy experience, when a lo is getting fed too often, they only snack, because they are not full enough - a bit like when you graze all day instead of having meals.  This really won't make her sleep more at night, because she's really not getting more food. 

Getting her onto a 4hr easy, you will see a big difference, but we won't go there straight away of course.  Slowly does it, so she gets used to it.  I will get a mod from EASY board to have a look and help you with a routine to get you started.  funny enough you will find (I believe ) that she will nap better on a full stomach.

Once you are in a longer EASY routine, you will also find that the naps will be better spaced apart.  At the moment, they range from 1hr to 3 hrs - sometimes she's not tired enough for a decent nap, other times she's overtired and wont' nap.

hang in there and I'll get someone to take a look...

xx

[Grace's Mom]

Hi there 

Glad to see you here and hope we can be of some help. 

I do agree that your lo will start sleeping longer and I believe will start waking less at night if you move the feeds apart and lengthen her EASY.  Right now your lo doesn't really have time to sleep due to being fed ever 2-2.5 hours. 

At around 4-5 months 'most' lo, as stated by Aly Mac, are on a 4 hour EASY.  Here is a sample routine for you (mind you this just a sample...each lo is a bit different and you'll need to piece together your own unique EASY...it may look just like this but it may not and that's ok too...they just usually have around 2 hours of A time and around 2 hours of S time, plus a cat nap)....

8am wake and feed
10-12 (1.5-2 hour long) Nap
12pm feed
2-4 (1.5-2 hour long) Nap
4pm Feed
6-6:30 Cat Nap (no more than 30-45 minutes)
8pm Feed
Bed

Of course you will want to move here gradually.  I would move the feeds apart by 15+ minutes every few days (make sure her 1st feed of the day is a nice big one and then you'll know that she can go for quite a bit with out a feed..she may cry or fuss a bit at her normal feeding times but that's because it's what she's use too, not necessarily because she is hungry).  Your lo will begin to be able to take more milk in at one time as right now she is probably full all day long from not having time in between feeds to really digest and start to feel hungry again (and with out getting full feeds she's isn't going to be set for the night, iykwim).  With your lo getting more rest during the day, she will be able to sleep better at night (good day sleep = good night sleep).  You can also do a Dream Feed at around 10:30 or so and that should help her sleep for quite awhile thereafter helping mommy get some good sleep too! 

Let us know what you think.
Melissa

**Please also check out the feeding boards.  There is a FAQ's thread at the top of each of the main pages (Breastfeed has one, bottle feeding has one, etc.).  There is some great info with in the FAQ's that will better help you sort of the feedings.

Melissa

[Lison]

Thanks very much for the advice. I will definitely try putting her on a 4 hrs E.A.S.Y. schedule. I will let you know how things go. I agree that she was probably feeding too often for a 4 months old. Hopefully I will get my life back...

[Lison]

Hi again. Iforget to ask. Should Ido pu/pd when she does sleep 20 min? or should she sleep in my arms? We had a horrible night. She woke up between 3h30 and 5h00am before I ended up putting her in my bed from exhaustion and she sleept until 9h00am.

[Lison]

At this moment, things are very difficult. I am trying to do the 4 hr E.A.S.Y. and she slept the first nap for 20 min. Then I did pu/pd and she slept another 30 min. which is really great but now for the 2nd nap she slept for 25 min. and then woke up and we are trying to do pu/pd but it is not working. Right now she is with my husband and has been crying for almost 45 min. non stop. She will not settle...what is going on ?? Can we do pu/pd with a 4 month old ?

[Grace's Mom]

There is an entire thread for PU/PD under SLEEP.  I would check it out.  There is a FAQ's section with step by step on how, when and when not to use PU/PD. 

Your lo is probably overtired which is why she's been crying so much.  I would take a few minute break....walk her around make sure she isn't wet, etc. 

When doing sleep training...patt/shhh, I wouldn't have her sleep on you as it could confuse her as she doesn't really know whats expected of her....does mommy want me to sleep in my crib or does mommy want me to sleep on her? With any kind of 'training' you will need to be as consistant as possible to make things easier on everyone.

 

[LucyA]

It's fine to use pu/pd for a 4 month old. How does lo go to sleep at the start of her naps/at night? I agree with pp about consistency. Have you tried sh/pat? How does she respond to that?

If you feel at the moment you can't be consistent with pu/pd for all her sleeps, maybe hold off for a few days while you work on her routine. The new routine will hopefully improve her sleeping anyway.

[Lison]

Thanks everyone for the info. I have done your suggestion and read the board on PU/PD. I saw that PU/PD is sometimes not good for extending naps and that it might be better if I go in the room and put my hands on her before she wakes herself up. I will try doing this tomorrow. She has to be swaddled to sleep because she wakes herself up when she jerks. You are all right about being consistent. I agree. It's very difficult sometimes not to cave in. This afternoon I could see that she was really tired and I wanted to have her sleep on me and it was hard to not do it. Hopefully things will come around.

[Grace's Mom]

Things will come around, I promise!  Sleep training just takes some time and patience.  We started sleep training from 2 months on (well from the beginning but we didn't know Tracy's techniques until the day she turned 2 months) and she didn't learn nap time sleep until 6 months (babies learn day time sleep from 3-6 months).  At times I thought it would never happen and then one day, we laid her down awake, left and she went to sleep on her own.  ...yes, I cried I was so happy.   It was the best feeling in the world and were just 1. praising God for allowing me to find this site and 2. so thankful for Tracy and all her wonderful techniques. 

It will happen! 

Melissa

[Aly Mac]

Things will get better.  Just takes a little time to get in the swing of it, and for them to learn to sleep by themselves.

So glad you have found some more help 

[Lison]

Thanks everyone for your feedback. It is really appreciated. I noticed that my daughter actually jerks while she sleeps and that is why she is waking after 20 min. I tried yesterday and today to stay in the room to put my hands on her while she jerks. The only thing is that it's a little long but I hope it will help and make her go through them shortly. I read that technique in another post. Hopefully it will work.