Another question re: crying before naps

[doodlebugg]

OK- thanks to all of you.  I think I was a bit defensive earlier and I apologize.  I need to visit the support board for spirited LO's!  My DD is SO fabulous, but incredibly frustrating at times- and I can end up snapping.
Bethany- I am SO glad you too benefited from Ferber's sleep requirement charts.  I have noticed too that they are much lower than any others I have seen- but they seem spot on for my LO.  I was pulling my hair out when my DD was around 4 months old and everything I read said she should be sleeping 14-15 hours total.  That's never happened!
Re: tired signs and the morning nap- Yes- my babe always shows tired signs before we move to put her down.  Our windown routine is quite short- and yes- my spirited LO can handle a long A time just fine.  She's actually been awake for a 6 hour stretch before and other than being very sleepy at bedtime- was happy and just fine.  I guess that's one thing I need to be thankful for- she isn't one of these touchy babies who melt down if they miss a nap.  My friends have been amazed at how social and engaged she is- really tolerating a ton of stimulation just fine. 
Having written all this I've come to two conclusions.  I think I've been pushing the naps and stressing about it because we've had so many night sleep issues- I also think I need to extend her A time in the morning to try to even out the schedule.
Thanks again to all of you.  So sorry I was a defensive wench earlier.  7.5 months of sleep deprivation has taken its toll-
All best

[marensmama]

Hi again.  Just for the record, my DD2 is a spirited/touchy baby who has suffered with reflux since birth, and if it weren't for the BW methods and community, I would certainly have gone crazy by now.  I know how hard it is to have an infant that screams and cries for most of the day and night.  While the medication helped her reflux after those first months, I had become her prop and she needed to be weaned of that.  I also was dealing with the challenges that arise from her spirited/touchy temperament, and it was tough.  I remember well those days of sleep deprivation and get glimpses every once in awhile when we need to make changes to our routine. 

There is no need for apologies here.  We're honestly just interested in supporting moms who need help implementing Tracy's strategies.  I think it's great that you are tuned in to your babe enough to recognize that she doesn't fit the 'cookie cutter' ideal for sleep times.  My first DD was a textbook babe, and I was amazed at how she did everything 'on cue'.  My second DD has definitely been a greater challenge that way, but of course I'm as smitten with her as you are with your DD.

I agree that evening out the day in terms of balancing A times is likely to help.  OT can cause NWs and EWs, and if she's spirited she might get past the point because she doesn't want to miss anything.  It's nice that she's happy through it all - although sometimes that makes the troubles harder to pinpoint IYKWIM.

Let us know how you get on!

[doodlebugg]

I completely forgot to mention DD also has horrific reflux- has been on Zantac since she was 7 weeks old.  Because of this- she has always struggled with the bottle- which has made it extremely difficult to get her on EASY.  She sometimes can't take more than 4 ounces from her bottle- we end up taking breaks, then coming back to the bottle.  I know it can be considered accidental parenting- but we sometimes offer her a small 3 ounce bottle before naps because we're afraid her tummy isn't full if she hasn't had a good feed. 

Just an update- she actually slept through the night last night.  Hoorah!  Went down easy at 8pm and didn't hear a peep until 6:30-- 10.5 hours as always.  I really stretched her morning A time- waiting until I got 3 yawns right around the 3 hour mark.  I carried her around with me the last 30 minutes (geez my shoulder hurts now!) and I offered her a small bottle because she only took 5 ounces right when she got up (I know, I know- bad habit- but it really does seem to settle her- I nursed her to sleep for the first 12 weeks of her life, BTW- not nursing anymore, just getting formula)- held her for a bit longer as part of her windown- put her in crib and she fussed and had that scared look on her face and starting whining (this usually happens before the wailing would begin when I walked out of the nursery) so I stood over her and patted her back.  She rolled around a bit, then began talking and grabbing her feet- seeming like she wanted to play.  That went on for about 5 minutes- when she began grabbing her bumpers and pulling herself up to get to me I did a PU/PD- modified because instead of holding her just in front of the crib- we sat down in the rocker and cuddled a moment with her blanket- she was DEFINATELY very sleepy- so I put her down again- she had a moment of that scared look but turned the other way in the crib and I walked out.  I had 20 seconds of a fuss/cry then quiet. 
She went immediately to sleep!
So- here is what I am surmising from all this- I've GOT to stretch out her A time- I think she needs to be up 3 hours in the morning in order to be tired enough to nap.  Do you think its bad if I offer her a small bottle during our windown- or am I using a prop or creating a bad habit?  Keep in mind this is a babe withe reflux- so I know the rules are different.
Thanks moms! 

[marensmama]

Wow!  Great news!    As far as the top-up goes, I'd do it if it helps.  Anything that gets done until they fall asleep will become a prop, but if she's not falling asleep on the bottle then it's OK, IMO.

[doodlebugg]

She is not falling asleep on the bottle- just filling up then settling.
BTW- how's this for not being able to catch a break?
30 minutes after I posted my success story- 30 minutes into her perfect nap- the fire alarm went off in my building- and in my condo and it was BLARING.
She woke up screaming, my dog began howling- and we all ended up on the back deck waiting for help to come home to fix it.  ACK!!!!!!!!!!  I can't catch a break!
My husband puts her down for her afternoon nap and he says she went straight down after her bottle and slept a peaceful two hours- so we should be back on track!

[*Natasha*]

to the fire alarm
  to the naps really hope you are back on track 

[marensmama]

Great update - well, aside from the fire alarm/dog howling bit.  I know just when we're sorting stuff out that's when my neighbor chooses to mow his lawn!  

Let us know how you get on, but I'm really happy that things are working out for you.