If no nap happens....

[pinzer78]

If baby doesn't fall asleep during the first nap training session, how long should I keep him up after a feed? He's already completely overtired from waking early, after a night of many wakings and only 55 min of sleep during the day yesterday! Even if he seems awake, alert and happy after eating, just start nap routine maybe 1/2 hr or 45 min later and try again?

We're only on day two of all this, so I don't really want to give him a APOP nap so soon, but if the little guy doesn't get any rest today I might have to let him snooze in the carrier just so he can be a little rested.  So far this morning's nap has started off totally awful as he was way OT before even getting him to the nursery. Oh, boy!

[anna*]

Even just 10-15 mins after a feed is fine.

[pinzer78]

Are there babies who never go back to sleep? I mean, really...this is crazy. He's so tired but can't seem to do it. He fell asleep after 30 min, slept for only 30 min, and just wont go back to sleep!  :O
B/c the 5am wakeup and me caving in with a bf at 6am in hopes of getting him back to sleep for a bit, but nope. Maybe I should have just tried harder. So, he was never really wanting to get up, just tired, so everything has started off on a really bad foot! And b/c of the ew and early feed(some at 6 then some at 7 then down for a nap even before 8!), the schedule is being thrown off...he shouldn't be ready for a feed for another hour at least so that's 3 hours of trying to get him nap.  Oh, goodness.  He's just still crying when bringing him out for a break...i know it's b/c he's tired not hungry, but the crying is not stopping.
I have no idea how to establish a routine with days like this! I know it's only day two, but yikes! I wish he still liked his stroller for naps...i'd just do that. He cries himself to sleep in there, but at least it's only a short bit, unlike in his crib in his room! 

Oh, and do you only do a nap routine at the beginning of each nap, not after each small break? So, first nap of the day we do a short routine, no sleep so we have a 10 min break then go in again....just lay him right down and keep going or that routine again? I think that would just tick him off anyways, but do they need that routine every time to know what's going on?

[anna*]

Hun, on the first day of sleep training some babies take NO naps at all. Stick with it, it gets easier. OT is inevitable, but at some point it will work in your favour. Once he's started to learn to fall asleep with PUPD, the next times will get easier.

You kind of have to let go of the idea of a schedule while you're sleep training. Feed times will fall all over the place. But as long as you are putting a little A between the E and the S, you are doing good.

I'm not sure what you mean about a break? When you're doing PUPD for naps, you do it for 45 mins with no breaks. If he's still not settling, then you abandon the nap, leave the nursery, do a short A time (feed, change etc as necessary), then start again for a new nap right from the start of the wind down.

Lots of LOs prefer a really short wind-down.

[pinzer78]

I thought you tried for 45 with a short 10-15 break, then another 45....then feed, activity, changing, etc...then another nap attempt.

So, if after no nap after 45 min, how long would A time be if he is just really tired?  My boy is nearing 7.5 mo and has not been on much of a routine, and usually OT so is A times are a little shorter than the usual for his age. If a short nap, he lasts 2 hr or just a bit more, a decent nap, he can sometimes do 3 hours.  As of now, b/c of training, he's just super always tired!

OH, the fun

[anna*]

I thought you tried for 45 with a short 10-15 break, then another 45....then feed, activity, changing, etc...then another nap attempt.

This is for shush-pat, and for younger bubs who can only manage less than 1.5hrs A anyway.

So, if after no nap after 45 min, how long would A time be if he is just really tired?

Well, there's no formula really, but I would say about an hour less than usual? It's really just a case of watching him closely. If it's been a string of short or missed naps and he is super OT, you might do 45 mins A, just long enough to calm down, feed, change, wind-down again.

[anna*]

How are things going?

[pinzer78]

Well, the past two days he's gone down for a nap without hysterics. He starts to cry when I put him down, like he's going to start going crazy, but I just start the chest and belly stroking with singing, and he settles down. The morning naps have gotten a bit better, but the second nap is short. I try to settle him again, but if the fussy cries start to escalate, I abort. I just cannot let him scream like that. We did that the first couple of days, but he never stopped, making him so tired and so upset.....just upset me too much. I know the second nap is short b/c he is just always OT right now b/c of all this training.

I find it odd that he will go to sleep without hysterics, but trying to extend a nap he goes wild. He's waking up in the same environment that he fell asleep. It's not like I put him in there sleeping and he woke up scared. Heck, Im still in there when he wakes. I'm nowhere near teaching independent sleep just yet. Why are naps so darn difficult compared to night?  Sometimes he wakes after 10 min and I can manage to settle him, he sleeps soundly for 30 min then bam, he's awake and unhappy!!!

If not enough sleep happens during the day and I dont want to deal with really nasty baby until bed time, I go for a drive....

I'll try to start the second nap earlier tomorrow, before he's waaayyyy toooo OT.