Author Topic: Tired eyes...need some fresh ones on my EASY pls  (Read 1145 times)

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Offline L76

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Tired eyes...need some fresh ones on my EASY pls
« on: August 10, 2010, 20:11:40 pm »
Hi

DS is now coming up 3 months.

Last couple of days I've tried moving to 3 naps - large ones - 1.5 to 2hrs each when he obliges!

But I have a few issues...one sleep related and one feed related.
Firstly, we get quite a few wakes at the 1hr mark.
Secondly, I struggle to get him to feed much during the day, most feeds are as little as 2-3oz. Whereas at nighttime he will take 5-6oz at each feed.

I will map out todays EASY for you to see what I mean.

Today
WAKE 07:30

E 07:40 (3oz)
A 07:30 - 08:45 (1hr 15 - always struggled to stay awake a long time for his first A)
S 08:45 - 10:50 (2hrs 05 - no trouble going down, no wakes, I woke him)

E 11:00 (3oz)
A 10:50 - 12:20 (1hr 30)
S 12:20 - 13:50 (1hr 30 - no trouble going down, but woke after 55mins or so resettled for a bit but very fussy)

E 14:00 (3oz)
A 13:50 - 15:15 (1hr 25)
S 15:15 - 17:20 (2hrs 05 - took two sshh's to settle, woke after 1hr 5mins - resettled with white noise until I woke him)

E 17:25 (2oz)
A 17:25 - 19:10 (long I know but have nursery run plus bathing, and feeding him takes forever)
E 18:45 (6oz)
S 19:10

This was yesterdays

WAKE 08:40

E 08:55 (4oz)
A 08:40 - 10:05 (1hr 25)
S 10:05 - 12:05 (2hrs - went down fine, had to resettle after 1hr with white noise)

E 12:15 (4oz)
A 12:05 - 13:15 (1hr 20)
S 13:15 - 15:00 (1hr 45 - went down fine, was fussy after 1hr, lots of resettling and gave up eventually!)

E 15:10 (3oz)
A 15:00 - 16:15 (1hr 15)
S 16:15 - 17:10 (1hr 55 - went down fine, woke himself - no wakes during nap)

E 17:15 (4oz)
A 17:10 - 19:00 (long I know but have nursery run plus bathing, and feeding him takes forever)
E 18:45 (5oz)
S 19:00

E 22:15 (5oz) dreamfeed
E 02:20 (5oz)
E 05:30 (3oz)

So, where am I going wrong with so many wakes after the hour or so mark?
When I go up to resettle he tends to do a big yawn so I am sure he is still tired. He also in the main resettles but not always. Sometimes he will do it himself but mostly I have to use white noise.

We were only getting one night waking until the last two nights when we have been getting two - one around 1/2 am and then another at 5am ish.

And do you think the feeds during the day are enough?

Would really appreciate some fresh eyes on this for me. Thanks

Offline Jiinx

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Re: Tired eyes...need some fresh ones on my EASY pls
« Reply #1 on: August 12, 2010, 00:38:12 am »
Hi Leanne :)

 Your routine looks pretty good. The feeds are spaced out well enough. If your baby was a bit older I would say try 3.5 hour feed schedule. Can he last 3.5 hours?

The only thing that may be an issue are his naps. It could be that he's sleeping too much during the day for his big naps. I took a peek at the http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=85130.0 for his age and it says 3 naps of 1.5 hours plus a catnap is usual for his age. What do you think? Have you seen the http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=164027.0 ?

That's all I can think of ..maybe his naps are too long and then just not getting a catnap at the end of the day?

The hour naps may be that he's not tired enough to keep sleeping. Do you think he may need an increase in A time? Not a lot 10 minutes or so? They're tired..but just not tired enough to finish their sleep cycle.

Hope that helps a bit?
*Sarah*





Offline Jiinx

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Re: Tired eyes...need some fresh ones on my EASY pls
« Reply #2 on: August 12, 2010, 16:58:27 pm »
Everything okay, Leanne?
*Sarah*





Offline L76

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Re: Tired eyes...need some fresh ones on my EASY pls
« Reply #3 on: August 12, 2010, 19:41:49 pm »
Hi Sarah

Thanks for your reply.

Feeding wise, he still is only taking about 2oz per feed - sometimes 3 if I push it - feel like I am force feeding him though. He just doesn't seem bothered though. Wakes up crying, but as soon as you get him, he happily sits in his chair and isn't looking for food. It is only the 7pm feed when he is swaddled and in a dark-ish room that he will take a full 6oz. Just have no idea why. But I suppose if he's happy then I shouldn't worry about it too much?

These last three days his first nap has been 2hrs but the others about 1hr - 1hr 15. That means I have ended up giving a cat nap at the end of the day as he can't last from say, 4/4.30pm til bedtime at 7pm. I've looked at the sample routines but they are all so different it is hard to know where to go from here.

I am so unsure now about the OT or UT thing. For example yesterday I kept his A time to 1hr 30 and he was hard to put down, woke after 10mins, then again around 40mins, again around 1hr. Seemed to not be able to transition himself. Today, his first nap was fine after 1hr 20 A (2hr nap). The second after 1hr 20 A he went down ok ish, but woke after 1hr 20. He resettled with white noise for 20mins. The third he woke after 1hr having had 1hr 30 A. So I ended up giving him a cat nap for 20mins which I woke him from.

So our day looked like this:

Wake 07:40
E 07:50 (3oz)
A 07:40 - 09:00
S 09:00 - 11:00

E 11:20 (2oz)
A 11:00 - 12:20
S 12:20 - 14:00

E 14:10 (2.5oz)
A 14:00 - 15:30
S 15:30 - 16:30

E 16:40 (3oz)
A 16:30 - 17:50
S 17:50 - 18:10 (I woke him)

E 18:45 (6oz)
S Eventually by around 19:40 (was on and off between 19:15 and 19:40)

So his daytime sleep was 5hrs.

I am not sure I could increase his A time - he gets really fussy after about 1hr (sometimes as early as 50mins) so even getting to 1hr 20 / 30 is a struggle! He gets really jolty and makes wah wah noises IYKWIM?
« Last Edit: August 12, 2010, 19:43:25 pm by Leanne76 »

Offline Jiinx

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Re: Tired eyes...need some fresh ones on my EASY pls
« Reply #4 on: August 13, 2010, 16:42:42 pm »
Hi Leanne,
 they do want to get to bed rather quickly, don't they? Especially that first nap. The first nap are usually great. If you think you've got the sweet A spot, then I do think that the rest of the As should be longer. Can you read to him? take him out and show him the trees, leaves and flowers...?

Is he okay with his feeds? It's common for them to tank up for the night. My daughter would eat more when she was drowsy ..but that was bc of her reflux. So everything I know about feeding in the first few months is influenced by reflux ::)

At 12 weeks most babies start having short naps.  It's a developmental phase they go through.   It happens because their REM/non-REM sleep pattern changes, causing a light sleep phase at around the 45 min mark.  Since that hasn't happened prior to this period,they tend to wake up.  We have to teach them to go back to sleep.  For this, HTTJ (holding thru the jolts) tends to work best.

Have you tried HTTJ? It could be that he's waking due to his own transitioning as this is the age they start to sort out their day naps. However, since he's sleeping for 2 hours, 1 hours, and 1 hour and 20 minutes i'm not sure it's the jolting. I think it may be that he's genuinely UT? You mentioned that he's happy when he sees you. Does he seem really tired? Have you tried extending his naps with shush/pat?

How are his nights? Does he go to sleep right after feeding?
*Sarah*





Offline L76

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Re: Tired eyes...need some fresh ones on my EASY pls
« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2010, 21:15:12 pm »
Hi Sarah

If I get the first nap right, we then start the day on such a better foot! If that one goes wrong...rubbish day lies ahead!

He gets soooooo grouchy, fussy, grumpy etc at around 1hr. Thrashes about. Legs going up and down. He's a bit of a nightmare to be honest. If we are out in the buggy, goes mental if I stop moving, same in the car. If I put the music on his bouncy chair on really loud, that keeps him content for another few mins!

Feeds wise, they are rubbish during the day. 2-3oz at best each feed. Evening, df and nf are all around 5-6oz though.
Wondering if I will even notice the 12wk growth spurt!

HTTJ wise, he is swaddled so would this still work? Can't do it yet as the door scrapes along the carpet so it wakes him every time you go in!!! Must get that sorted!

Today, we did 1hr 20 for his first A. Slept for just over 2hrs.
1hr 30 for 2nd A - slept for 1hr 50.
1hr 20 for 3rd A - slept for 1hr - extended it easily with white noise for another 35 mins when I woke him.

I always try to extend the naps - sometimes it works, sometimes not. He always seems tired. Once he's stopped crying, he will always yawn! I use white noise to extend them plus sometimes put a firm hand on his chest or cover the basket with a muslin so he has no stimulation (although wont be able to do this much longer as he will need to come out his moses basket soon!

Nights are really good - he goes down by about 7/7.30 - sometimes needs resettling but usually the culprit is wind! Then we df him at 10ish - goes straight back to sleep. Wakes around 2/3am and again, straight back to sleep. Each feed takes about 20mins.

He was going a lot longer stretches at night - like 5-6hrs sometimes as much as 8 hrs. But that was when A) he fed alot more in the day and B) was up screaming (evening colic!) from 4/5pm til 8/9pm - sometimes later. It is a shame we are down to less nighttime hours in his stretch but never mind.

Sometimes he wakes twice in the night - say 2am then 5am. But the last three nights he's not which has been good. He will go from 2am til 7.30am. But he doesn't seem starving when he wakes - but DD was like that too.

So I am really none the wiser. I wouldn't mind trying to extend his A time if he was a bit of a happier chappy. Grumpy babies are so hard to read and soooooooo hard work! Not great when you have a toddler around. And I refuse to continually hold him - I have a friend who held her baby constantly and he was a nightmare as he got older - so clingy. There is a time for cuddles of course but I want him to be able to sit in his seat, tummy time, on his play mat etc. Plus I have a 2.5yo to attend to as well! But I am my own worst enemy I know - I love routine, and am obsessive about getting independent sleep!  ::)

Offline Jiinx

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Re: Tired eyes...need some fresh ones on my EASY pls
« Reply #6 on: August 14, 2010, 16:40:30 pm »
Hi there!

Then we df him at 10ish - goes straight back to sleep

Does he wake for the df? This may interfere with his sleep cycle. If he's just going in and out of sleep I'm sure that's fine.

So I understand you're doing three big naps...but I think he still needs more daytime sleep. I think you said he got 5 hours one day, which is good..but I think he needs 5 hours spread out better. However, his nights look good and since he's going to sleep right after feeding, I think you're good.

If he's swaddled, then I think it's fine. Does he break out of his swaddle? I personally just did sh/pat or months.

So if he's pretty adamant about going to sleep, then yes, it would be hard to put him down. I can understand how you'd want to put him down. Does he respond to an extra long wind down?

But I am my own worst enemy I know - I love routine, and am obsessive about getting independent sleep!  Roll Eyes

I was too. You'll get there. I never thought I would...but your persistence and watching him will pay out. *hugs*
*Sarah*