Short naps and shh/pat

[Mama Kate]

I only just started BWing about a week ago with my now 9 week old DD.  From birth I did Gina Ford which worked really well up until about week 4, when DD decided she wasn't having any of it, so we went a bit off piste, but she generally ate when she woke and then played then slept).  She also had reflux and so from about week 4-8 it was pretty rough, especially at night trying to get her to bed (lots of crying, sometimes she didn't go down until 9 or 10pm).  Now she is on meds for the reflux and there is much less crying.

During the 4-8 weeks we became accidental parents, usually bouncing or walking her to sleep each night.  We just couldn't cope with the crying.  At 8 weeks we had had enough so decided to go BWing 100% and try to teach her better sleep habits.  

Our days start out pretty well, and she can go down for her morning nap around 8:15 am pretty well (wake up 7am) with about 5-10 mins shh/pat.  Then as the day progresses it gets more and more difficult to put her down to sleep.  For her last nap of the day I usually end up walking her in the pram for an hour so she doesn't fight it.

The big issue though is that her naps now tend to be only 45 mins unless I go and help her through the sleep cycle with shh/pat or HTTJ.  Can someone tell me if helping her is good or bad?  Am I a prop?  Will she learn independent sleep if I am always helping her to drift off/go back to sleep with shh/pat?

She is swaddled and rarely escapes, and is 100% breastfed.  She's in the 95th percentile for her age so is feeding well.  Could this be the 3 month growth spurt a little early?  She is 9 weeks old but was 1.5 weeks overdue.

I have the BW Kindle book (Top Tips from The Baby Whisperer) and am waiting for The Baby Whisperer Solves All Your Problems to arrive.

Thank you in advance for any advice you can give... this is really hard work but I'm hopeful it will pay off.

[Shiv52]

At 9 weeks it is not unusual to have to help a LO get through sleep cycles so don't worry about that.  She has plenty of time to learn independent sleep!

Can you post your EASY for your day? 

How long does she sleep?
How long is she awake between sleeps?
What time is she eating?

Is reflux definately under control?  That can contribute to wakening and not being able to pass through sleep cycles. 

{{{hugs}}}

[Mama Kate]

My EASY is not very consistent yet....  here is today's routine

A 6:30
E 7:00 - 7:10
A
S 7:45 - 9:45 (extended nap with 20 mins of shh/pat after she woke after 45 mins)
E 10:00 - 10:05
A
S 11:25 - 12:10 (tried to extend nap but didn't work)
A
E 13:00 - 13:05
A
E 13:45 - 13:50 (fed again because I am concerned she's not eating enough)
S 13:55 - 14:30 (could not extend)
A (quiet time in cot with dummy)
E 16:05 - 16:10
A
S 17:05 - 17:30 (walk in pram)
E 18:00 - 18:05
A (bath)
E 18:20 - 18:25
S (my husband is trying to shh/pat her to sleep now)
DF: 23:00

She has always been an efficient eater but her feeds are getting shorter and now averaging only 5 minutes, she comes off the boob crying and I can't get her to feed any more.

Since she's not eating well I think she's not napping well and is grumpy most of the day.  I am exhausted from all the shh/patting and crying and grumpiness.  I'm not convinced her reflux is under control so I'm going to take her back to the doctor.  

Do you have any suggestions based on my EASY

[anna*]

I think she's overtired. You're having awake times of 1.75hrs (9.45-11.25, 12.10-13.55) and even longer (14.30-17.05). At this age, she can't really manage anything more than about 1.25hrs awake - after a long (1.5hrs plus) nap. After a short nap, she will need that awake time to be cut back even further, to 60 mins or even less.

All that said, you're really not going to get good sleep and a nice routine if she is in discomfort from her reflux.

[Mama Kate]

Thanks - I agree she is probably overtired, but I'm a little confused about putting her down to bed early again after a short nap.  If I do this, when should I feed her?  Do I do EASASE?  Should I wake her at her 3 hr feed time?  Will she get used to taking 5 or 6 naps a day and never learn to sleep for longer than 45 mins? 

I'm so exhausted by this... the thought of putting her to bed for even more naps makes me want to cry.  I'll give it a go though tomorrow and see if it helps.

[anna*]

(((hugs))) I know, it's such hard work at this age.

Remember that EASY is a routine not a schedule. Naps can't fall at set times, because if baby has a longer or shorter nap, the next awake time needs to be adjusted. Yes, that does sometimes mean doing 5 naps in a day BUT she should be a little easier to settle if she is less OT, and also it may be easier to extend the short naps if she is less OT. It is really difficult to extend OT naps.

Personally, I'd let a baby sleep for say 30 mins after the 3hr feed time, but not much more than that. If you sometimes wind up with EASASEASAE etc - that is fine. The main point is not to feed to sleep. Most babies will start to extend their naps naturally somewhere around 5-6 months old. Before that, it's worthwhile trying to help them but don't get too hung up on it because some of them just never make it on their own until they are developmentally able.

We do need to make sure that reflux is controlled - also is she swaddled/taking a paci?

[aidenmc]

milas_mum. just wanted to let you know i am in the same boat with the 45 minute naps these days and i too find it totally exhausting. This morning I was already sick of putting Samuel to sleep on nap #2. Nap#3 happened in the Mobi wrap for my sanity only. The weird thing in that some mornings he will wake briefly at 6 or 7 (he's in my bed by this time) and fall back to sleep until around 9 and those are great nap days! Other days he's up between 6 and 7 and I have to haul myself out of bed to get him back to sleep for his first nap. Seems no matter how early I try to get started on that first nap he cries and he ends up with a short nap. I've been planning to start pat/shush next week but it sounds like you are spending as much time getting your lo to sleep as  am with my current AP methods. Anyway, I wish you best of luck with your lo.

[Mama Kate]

Thank you all for your replies and words of advice and encouragement.  We had a much better day today, starting with her sleeping through the night until 7am when I woke her (she roused at 5:30 but put herself back to sleep!).

I tried to be super observant today, and act on the very first tired cue.  We started off well with a 2 hour nap all on her own with no help from me.  Her second nap was 1 hr 10 mins, then the third nap was another hour.  After this she got a bit overtired and I couldn't settle her for another nap, but she got a 25 min cat nap in the pram in the late afternoon.  She was quite difficult to put down to bed because she was OT but was sleeping by 7:15pm.  

I have to remind myself that just 2 weeks ago she wouldn't go to bed until 9 or 10pm after LOTS of crying, so we are making progress, albeit slowly.

My EASY for today looked like this.  If anyone has advice on how to handle the afternoon when she's already had a few short naps and is OT I would love to hear it!  It seems that as the day progresses her naps get shorter, so does that mean her A time also gets progressively shorter?

A 7:00
E 7:10 - 7:15
A
E 8:05 - 8:10 (fed her again as she wouldn't take any more at the first feed)
S 8:15 - 10:10  (very quick settling)
E 10:10 - 10:22
A
S 11:15 - 12:25 (very quick settling)
A
E 12:55 - 13:02
A
S 13:25 - 14:25 (bit more time settling but not too bad)
A
S 15:25 - 15:50 (would not settle, didn't really sleep so I got her up since it was time for her next feed anyway)
E 15:51 - 16:00
A
S 16:50 - 17:15 (walk in pram)
E 17:50 - 17:55
A
E 18:15 - 18:20
S 19:15 -

aidenmc - hang in there - the shhh/pat does work.  We are onto week 2 of shh/patting and at times (esp the first week) it was exhausting and breaks your back, but it is worth it when you get a nap where your LO goes down with just 5-10 mins settling and no tears.

[Mama Kate]

anna - she is swaddled, and I use a paci to help settle her, but she's not very good at keeping it in her mouth (we only started using one at about 6 weeks) so I use it to help her stop crying during our cuddle, then when it falls out if she's not crying anymore I don't bother putting it back in.  I'm off to the doctor on Thurs for the reflux.

[anna*]

It sounds like you are making great progress!

It seems that as the day progresses her naps get shorter, so does that mean her A time also gets progressively shorter?

Exactly. A 1.5-2 hr nap, and she can probably handle around her max A time, but anything less and her A time needs to be reduced correspondingly.