How long is it ok for baby to cry when ssh/patting?

[Kitty44a]

I have a 10 week old girl who is sleeping brilliantly at night but I'm struggling with her naps. She's used to a variety of props (walks, car, breast) and I'm trying the BW method of training her to go down for a nap awake. I tried today and for the first two naps she screamed for about 30 mins then I spent an extra 10 mins getting her into deep sleep, but she only slept for 30 mins. The final nap was a nightmare - she screamed so hard that she actually started hyperventilating. I carried on trying and after about an hour she was so upset I couldn't go on. We were also heading towards a feed so i didn't know whether to carry on into feed time. I know I'm supposed to keep at it, but how long is it ok for her to scream? I feel awful getting her so upset when she's actually a very sunny baby. Also I was sshing for so long and so hard it made me feel sick! We both felt awful afterwards and I feel really discouraged.

[anna*]

It's OK for her to cry - if you are with her, no harm is going to come to her. For naps you would do shush-pat for 45 mins and if she's not settling you'd take a little break - just 10 mins or so - out of the nursery and then try again for the nap right from the beginning of your wind-down.

Sleep training is hard work. When you're teaching a new way of sleeping like this, some overtiredness is pretty much inevitable, which in turn makes it harder for them to fall to sleep. As she gets better at falling to sleep, she'll be better able to catch up. If she has a short nap, remember to bring her next nap earlier.

When she's crying, keep in mind that she's not upset, afraid or in pain. She's just tired and frustrated.

Finally, welcome to the boards

[Kitty44a]

Thanks Anna. I tried again this morning with the same result - she screamed for 45 minutes with absolutely no hint of getting droiwesy - she seemed to be getting more and more wound up. We both ended up in tears - I feel so awful making her cry so hard, and terrible that I got us into this mess in the first place. I'll try having a time out and see what happens.  If she keeps crying even after we start again, and we run into a feed time, do I stop to feed her and the do activity even if she hasn't slept, or try napping again after feeding?

[anna*]

Are you doing shush-pat in your arms, or in the cot? How long has she been awake before you start to shush-pat?

If you run into your next feed time, stop shush-pat, feed, and then put her down for her nap afterwards - just don't feed to sleep. So feed, nappy change, then start shush-pat for her nap.

[Kitty44a]

Thanks Anna. I was doing the ssh-pat in my arms and then when she settled I put her in the cot and then ssh-patted her when she started crying again.  Basically she starts to cry and fight as soon as I take her into her room for the wind-down, so it's not much of a wind down! So after putting her in her sleeping bag and reading her a story (by which point she's already crying) I start by standing and ssh-patting her on my shoulder until she calms down, but the minute I lay her into the cot she starts to scream again, so I ssh-pat her in the cot - this can last up to an hour, before she finally falls asleep (or I give up and take her out of the room). I've been taking her upstairs the minute I see her yawn or rub an eye so think I'm doing it at the right time, but maybe I'm leaving it too late.

[anna*]

Some babies get OT really quickly so it may be that you need to watch the clock as well as her cues. How long is she awake between naps?

[Mia's Mommy]

I'm in the same boat as you Kitty...

I'm just beginning the ssh/pat method as my hubby and I are trying to wean off rocking our LO to sleep. It is really hard work. My LO is a preemie, 9 wks actual age and 4 1/2 wks adjusted age. I immediately begin winding down after burping and changing diaper as her wind down period takes so long, sometimes wind downs begin before her first yawn. I begin ssh/pat standing still rather than sitting as suggested in the Four S's. Then as soon she her eyes begin to shut, I put her in her crib. Her eyes open back up but she doesn't cry. She just looks so awake but I know she's tired as she was yawning while we were standing. I ssh/pat, 30-45 mins. Most times she looks wide awake, sometimes she cries and even wails, but I keep BW in mind, and try not to p/u. Just continue to ssh/pat. If her wail is too intense, then I pick up and ssh/pat on my shoulder, but only briefly until she is calm and then try again to put down in crib. It is really hard to hear her cry... I feel your pain...

[lesliemarie]

I'm having an issue with my 12 week old DD as well with naps.  I've been rocking her to sleep due to reflux and I'm now going to start the sleep training as I think the reflux is finally under control.  I was just wondering if either of you have made any progress.

[Mia's Mommy]

Hi Lesliemarie.

I've been keeping a log for the last couple of weeks to see if there is a pattern and my LO's schedule is not consistent and I'm not sure if there is a pattern. My hubby reminds me that she is so young to be on a set routine and keeps assuring me that it will get better/easier as she gets older. Today she is 10 1/2 wks actual age / 5 wks adjusted age.

A couple of weeks ago, she had 2 straight days of consistent EASY. She was feeding every 2 1/2 to 3 hrs, taking nice long naps, the ssh/pat method worked after just a few mins.

Then it seemed she was going through a growth spurt because she was no longer taking long naps or any nap, and fed every 2 hrs. It was sooo exhausting and I got very overwhelmed and discouraged.

Then again, last Wed and Thurs, she had 2 great days of good feeding and napping.  And again, back to eating every 2 hrs.

I am trying very hard to stay positive.... my hubby has been great and keeping me encouraged.

Good news is... I think she has switched her days and nites.  She only wakes up once to feed in the middle of the nite! And I began doing the Four S's as wind down and I can lay her in her crib awake but drowzy, and she can fall asleep on her own. No more rocking!!!  My hubby continues to remind me of this great progress and try to not get to hard on myself because of her feeding/napping is so all over the board right now.