Ongoing major Sleep Dilemma

[redhen75]

Hi All

Haven't really posted much on here so am still quite new to all the acronyms...so please bear with me!!

I am contacting you in all desperation to ty and help us get back on track with sleeping as the whole nap and night time thing has gone to pot.

My DD is nearly 15 months old.  She had Open Heart Surgery at the age of 4 months and before this she was sleeping well from 6.30pm to 12.00am having a bottle and then back to sleep to btw 4am-6am.....

Ever since we returned from hospital I have had her in bed with me when she has woken in the night; this is for two reasons:

She was waking every 1-2 hours (therefore I was getting very ill with lack of sleep - my low blood pressure was making me quite poorly and I had started to get quite depressed) and also due to the fact that my hubby has to up at 5am to travel to work in Bristol which is a 2 hours drive away and didn't want her keepign him awake too.

We made some very positive progress around the 10 month old mark whereby she was able to self-settle to sleep (not crying) and I could leave her to settle by playing with her bedtime bear and sucking her dummy.

She then went a bit off kilter when I returned to work and she went to nursery 2 half days a week and then to my parents one and a half days a week but was still self-settling to sleep.

She then went that step further and started to sleep right through to 5-6am with having up to 2 hours of nap time during the day which is fantastic for her as she has never ever ever been one for napping from birth - only ever getting 3 x 30 minute naps out of her.

We recently went on holiday for a week and ever since then I regret doing so.  She has been a nightmare to settle during day and night....her naps are not consistent (probably cos she's at my parents and then at nursery aswell) one day she'll nap the next she'll be fighting the tiredness and then getting over tired.

She goes to Nursery from 9am - 1pm so have decided to try and cut out the morning nap as she doesn't always nap at nursery and wanted to be consistent so have tried it today and Tuesday On my days off but its been terrible trying to get her to sleep.


Nighttimes aren't as bad but she has been screamning if I let her try and self-settle....so have been doing the GW technique and so far she will settle, facing towards thew wall and then I just creep out without saying anything but then she will wake around 12am-1am screaming and not able to settle back to sleep...so the hamster wheek starts again and I get her in bed with me.

Lately she has been statying awake when I get her in with me for up to 2 hours!!! SO I am very very sleep deprived, depressed and have been falling out with my hubby alot.

I just don't know what to do with her.....I feel I am not doing her any good getting her in with me as she needs to get to sleep on her own but I don't really have an awful lot of choice.

SOme nights she will sleep through till 5.30am btut we only get this once or twoce a week and I don't understand why she can do it one night but not the next....

Our routine isn't conistent due to her going to nursdery and to my parents but I try and do this whjen we are at home:


Wake up 6.30-7am
Brekafast: 7.15am-7.45am
Then either goes Nursery/to my parents/or we go out ourselves togerther till around 11.30am
10.30am Snack whilst out or at nursery / parents
11.00am-11.15am  Can fall asleep in car or pushchair
12.00pm Lunch time
12.30pm Activity
1.30pm-2.30pm Nap
2.30pm-5.00pm activity with snackl around 3pm
5.00pm Tea
5.30pm - 6.30pm Wind down watching Kids TV
6.30pm 7oz Bottle downstairs
6.45pm Bath
7.00pm Story
7.15pm-7.30pm aAsleep

I am just at a loss at wht to so...she is teething quite badly at the mmment but just need to get some sort of idea on how I can sort thsi out..


Any help would be greatlyu appreciated.


Thanks

Lou xxxxx

[Roseii]

Hi there and welcome Ok I am v sleep deprived myself right now after a 3am start to the day but just wanted to check in and tell you I'll be back tomorrow with a less foggy mind! We need to come up with a consistent plan for you, and one that doesn't involve your bed Food for for thought-a mattress on her floor next to the cot whilst you sleep train? Also is there a chance hubby is waking her when he goes to work? White noise works wonders here for that...Anyway ((hugs)) I'll be back xx

[deb]

A couple of random observations/thoughts:

By this age, most little ones are on single naps. My thought is that she's undertired at bedtime because she's had a late sleep and therefore a short A time before bed.

You can also try a "Dream Med" in the nighttime (like  dreamfeed only with a syringe of meds!) if she's waking from teething pain, and also medicate for pain before naptime.

On nursery days, does she have lunch there? Then you pick her up at 1? Any chance you would be allowed to pick her up maybe at noon and bring her home, feed her, and put her down straightway? Perhaps you could nap with her for a bit to get her used to extending her nap to one long and more restorative sleep.

[Erin M]

By this age, most little ones are on single naps. My thought is that she's undertired at bedtime because she's had a late sleep and therefore a short A time before bed.

Most definitely this. 
And the mattress on the floor would be a good idea too - you could get some sleep their overnight and she wouldn't find you missing in the middle of the night and panic.  And then you can slowly move the mattress out of her room.

[redhen75]

Hey folks

Thank u for the help so far!  It did cross my mind that she maybe undertired as she does fight her naps quite alot.

Plus I have noticed that when we have been for a day out somewhere or when she has been to Nursery that this is when she will sleep through.

I am not able to do the mattress on floor thing (have already considered it though) as her room isn't big enough for me to lay down beside her, and again unfortunately unable to pick her up early from nursery as I work on both those days 

I have had endless arguments with hubby about him leaving so early in the morning..

If she is in bed with me which is more often than not the bathroom light shines directly into our room therefore waking us both and unsettling her. He has agreed to perhaps get ready downstairs which then cuts the light but when he leaves for work he bangs the from door and bangs the gate (I have argued with him till I am blue in the face about it!!!) and her room is directly over the front door.  Have considered moving her to back bedroom but then she would wake with hubby having a shower in the morning....and yes I know have asked him to shower at night before she goes to bed but its like talking to a brick wall!!!!  So am at a loss at what to do.  I have found that when he works away from home she is alot more settled and the week before we went on our holiday in Sept (he was away all week ) she slept through all week .....so theres alot to be said, but there's no telling him as he thinks I am getting at him all the time!!

So going back to the one nap a day.......do I give her a sleep just in the morning? She can be tired around 10.30am-11.00am but has fought sleep alot of the time then.....or do I give her a sleep right after she has had lunch?  Not sure how much A time she needs before she goes to sleep?  I didnt think that 1.30pm would be too late to put her down??



Am willing to give it a go though... but the only prob I can see here is that ot won't be consistent for her as on nursery days she will be going down that hour later? Thi sis my prob you see.

Anyway, last noght was awful she was screaming at 10.30pm and I  couldnt console her  so had her in bed with me all night!!!!! I feel like suvh a failure for not getting it right and the lack of sleep just makes it feel worse.



Sorry am feeling very sorry for myself today....I do like the Drem Med idea though so I will try this tonight.  I hav been giving her Teething Granules and Kalpol before bed so could give her some more Kalpol before I go to bed perhaps???

Any further responses to thsi post greatly received.

Regards

Lou xxxxx

[Roseii]

Sorry just on my phone and got to be quick, but how about the White noise?? We have a cd playing on full blast in dd2's room and I'm sure it helps her sleep through us crashing around. And I'm not sure she is UT, she may be OT from the inconsistency and restless sleep

If she's going to be on one nap it needs to be as in the middle of the day as you can get it-something like.

A 7
S 12-2
S 7

As she's at nursery however you need to either get them to keep her awake all
Morning then put her down as soon as you get home, or get them to
Give her a cat nap (30 mins max) then you put her down for a slightly later nap...

Sorry gtg x

[Erin M]

Just give her lunch early and the nap after.  Eventually it will get later as she gets older.  That way she'll go to sleep on a full tummy.

White noise works really well for us too.

[redhen75]

Hi Folks

Just wanted to check in and update and ask a few more questions if may?

DD slept from 7.15pm last night through to 3.30am then went back to sleep with me till 7am.

I didnt medicate before I went to bed but she did have a better night...so am a little more pleased.

I have started Charlibob suggestion to try

A 7am
Nap 12-2pm
BT 7pm

So far its not doing too bad...I gave her her lunch at 11.20am then she went off at around 12.05pm but then woke at 12.25pm and I found her sat up in her cot....I had to go up and re-settle her to sleep by stroking her head ad she has gone back off now, so fingers crossed she'll sleep a bit more now.  Oh no she's just woken again.....just come back from settling her back to sleep....

I am so frustrated that she could self-settle before our holiday and now is an absolute nitemare.....I did leaver her to self-settle the other day but that meantr 10 mins of crying and I felt so guilty....


Gotta go she;s woken up again now!!!

I do feel at a bit of a loss though as she used to be able to self-settle and now she reolies on me to settle her ack and off to sleep at all times.


I wonder if any of you guys could give me an idea on how I can teach her to do this again...am currently doing

[Roseii]

hi sweetie sorry I've been unable to get on much, how are you doing now? So when she is crying, if it's not a heart-felt "I need you" cry, you can leave her a few mins. Do you think she has a mantra cry? If it's not escalating and is more of a whine, it's OK to hold off a bit longer before you settle her. Are you currently in the room when she falls asleep? If so, problem is, she wants you where you were when she fell asleep, so if she stirs/goes into a light sleep she'll expect to see you again yk?

THis is where WI/WO comes in to its own, if you can be "out" when she drops off you're getting there...Have you seen this?

http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=80750.0

[redhen75]

Hi Charlibob

WI/WO sounds exactly how I eventually got her to self-settle in the first place!!!  Didn't know there was a name for it!

I do generally try and do this nap time and bedtime so will just have to persevere.

On the upside I have discovered that she is probably not ready to ditch her mornng nap as when I have only given her one nap per day I have found that she has only slept for an hour and this is not enough to keep her ticking over...so I have put back her AM nap around 4 hours after she has woken and then will give her another PM nap another 4 hours after she has woken.  Do u think I am doing the right thing in being quite strict with times for naps or should I wait till she is showing major signs of tiredness?? I seem to get it right with the timings 90% of the time but have had a couple of probs as she sometimes isn't/seems tired enough...?

I am up against an inconsistent routine though due to her going to nursery and my parents - yesterday at parents all day and they put her down at 3pm for a nap!!!!!! She woke at 4pm and then was an absolute monster last night going to bed!!  So you are right about the A time I am giving her and the fact that she is more OT than UT.

I have found that with her 2 naps she isn't so restless during the night when she comes in with me and goes straight back to sleep.
I have also just discovered she is cutting an incisor tooth down the bottom and another up the top so I expect more than likely she will be waking due to this?  Am I right in saying this?  I guess this is right as she does sleep through on occasions so guess her teeth aren't bothering her then?  I am medicating before bed, using teething granules and teething gel but still wakes up!  Am planning on medicating before I get to bed tonight to see what happens?  I guess if she sleeps through after medicating later on then it must be her teeth keeping her awake.

Anyhow, thanks for your responses as I know you are just as sleep deprived as the rest of us...its nice to know people care though.

Take care

Luv Lou xxxxx

[Erin M]

Teeth can definitely cause more frequent n/ws.  Dd1 was always quite rough at night when she was cutting teeth.  Hope the medication helps!

[redhen75]

Hi there

Yes DD has really had a rough ride with her teeth ever since she was around 5 months old.  She started drooling alot and then hasn;t really stopped.....she didnt get her first tooth till she was 11 months old so has been NW every night bar a few blissful nights in the past couple of months.

I really don't think the Heart Surgery helped either.....as she was really good at sleeping before we had to go to hospital.  That then was the death knell on any kind of sleep really and we have never really recovered from it!

I have discovered that she is quite a sensitive little girl who does not like change one bit, so this has added to the problem.

She does however relax to white noise and I am in the process of recording our dishwasher.

Still I am going to stick with the WI/WO but just have one more question as to to whether it will be a rough ride due to her co-sleeping with me since February this year???  She has now started to expect me to take her into bed with me when she wakes up and even though I have tried to settle her down I always give in as i am just so so tired and depressed with it all. Any advice on this would be gladly welcomed.

She was a nightmare to get to sleep again last night even though I used WI/WO - not sure if she was tired enough as she was going absolutely crazy around her cot before I settled her down for a story.  But she had had over 4.5 hours A time from afternoon nap to bedtime so should have been tired enough.....i give up!!!!
I am prepared to do it to get some sort of results - fingers crossed huh?

Thnaks


Lou xxx

[Roseii]

The thing is you need to choose a method and be consistent, I know it's so hard. If WIWO is too draining then revert to GW, as you said the poor little mite's been through so much upheaval in her short life! I know you can't lie next to her, but sit next to the cot? Gradually move towards the door night by night. ANd don't PU, just use your sleepy phrase, she knows you're there for her. Re the white noise I have this CD on in her room: http://www.littlesleepyhead.co.uk/?gclid=CJOMzsupiKwCFYYe4QodPGgERw