Trying to break night wakings has gone down hill!

[melthemom]

Hello! I've been reading on this forum for quite some time now but have yet to post as I usually find answers for myself through others! THANKS!

However, we've run into a new problem... Here are the details of my little one:

How old is your child? 4 1/2 months
What’s his/her daily routine? E-07 A-0715 S-0830 E-10 A-1015 S-1130 E-1300 A-1315 S-1430 E-1600 A-1615 S-1715 A-1750 E1830 A-1840 S-1900 DF-2200 - night explained below.

What’s nap routine? darken room, sing song, sit quietly, to bed with paci, shush pat till "humming"- baby transitions well into deep sleep usually on own

How long are naps? 40 minutes then he wakes and I can sometimes shush/pat back to sleep = 1 1/2 -2 hours Lately it's been harder to get him to go back to sleep. One week ago he was waking at 30 minutes and I got him up every time, not knowing he needed more sleep and was overtired. Trying to extend naps with W2S right now. Been doing that for 6 days with little success.

What's bedtime routine? Time? Similar to above with book/bath. Usually 1900

Do you bottle or breastfed?? Breast feed

How much? or how long? He's an efficient eater so- short- see above for times.

If breastfed.. one side or both?? (at each feed) Been doing both lately to try to get him to eat more to try to transition to 4hr EASY

How many wakes per night?
5 days ago I realized he was habitually waking in the night but was not hungry (cry was different). He woke at 2am and 6am and went back to sleep after feeds. So we decided to wean the night feeds and try to break the night wakings all at the same time. It seemed silly to continue doing something (feeding him at night) when I knew he didn't need it and it was habit forming. I had read that day time adjustments should happen first however I didn't take that advice....

I know he needs to be moved onto a 4 hour easy but now I can't do it because he's so tired in the morning that he can't stay awake for much longer than an hour.

At night, since we started he has woken at 2am, 3am, 4am, 5am and every 15-20 min until 7am- unable to get into a deeper sleep. He wakes, tries to turn over, fusses which then turns into cries. We've tired the paci, shush pat (which we have used since week6), and pu/pd. Pu/pd seems to "reset" his cries and restlessness and then he'll occasionally go into a mantry cry and put himself to sleep.

However this morning he wasn't able to sleep longer than 15 minutes from 5-7am. As soon as I took my hand off of his back from shush patting him he'd wake fully.

He doesn't seem to be hungry or in pain. His diaper is likely wet but not soaked through.

We also introduced pear puree on Monday. WHY DID WE DO ALL OF THIS AT ONCE?

Do they have a prop? If so what is it? Possibly the paci but before all of this started he didn't need it put back in in the night, just to get to sleep.
Do they have a lovie? no


So I"m unsure at this point what I should stop trying to fix, how far "backwards" to go and what things to focus on. I'm too tired to keep going like this. Why was he so unsettled in the early morning?

Any thoughts/suggestions?

[katie80]

Hello and welcome to BW! .

Ok, Mel... let me see if I understand you.  You are trying to wean all night feeds and night wakings, is this correct? I honestly think that at 4.5 mo, it is way to early to wean all NFs as he's EBF.  At this age, I would expect at least the DF plus a NF, which is exactly what you have with the 2 am feed.  I would actually consider the 6 am feed the first feed of the day, even though he falls back to sleep after it.  My guess is that he was so unsettled in the early morning today because he was hungry.  Also, there is a pretty significant growth spurt at 4 mo, so there's a chance he's still needing those feeds for that. My advice here would be to keep feeding him at the 2 and 6 am times, and if you want to try pushing those out, then you can do shh/pat or PUPD to do so.  But, if he wakes again within the hour of you getting him back to sleep, I'd feed him.  It will be better to try to work out the day first, like you said.

As for any other NWs, yes, I think it's time to start transitioning to a 4 hr EASY.  However, many, many EBF babies don't make it fully to a 4 hr EASY until they are on solids.  Lots stay at 3.5 hr EASY, or if you go to 4 hr, they need a little top up feed before the nap.  You're likely getting short naps, because he's not tired enough to sleep past 40 min.  At 4.5 mo, I would expect his A time to be pushing more toward 1 hr 45 min-2 hr.  So, why don't you try to push that out gradually by 10-15 min and then resettling if he wakes early.  This should be easier to do when he's been awake longer.

The last thing I would say is to hold off on the solids for now.  He really doesn't need them yet, and you don't want anything else, like digestion issues to be in the picture while you're trying to figure out NWs.

[melthemom]

Thank Katie for your thoughts! We'll try working out the daytime schedule and revisit NW later.

[becj86]

How are you going, Mel?

[melthemom]

Thanks for asking! I appreciate it!

I added a middle of the night feed back in and it's going a bit better. However he's still waking around 430 or 5 and very restless until 7am.

We are almost to a four hour routine but we really struggle for day time naps to be long enough! Have tried W2S, multiple different ways, decreasing stimulation during wake times and he still always wakes at 40 minutes. Takes a lot of time and effort to get him back to sleep but eventually he does.

HOWEVER! The other day my husband and I realized that his urine smelled really bad so I took him into the Dr and we found out he has a bladder infection! Going to pick up antibiotics today and hopefully that this UTI was causing all of the extra restlessness.

We'll see! It'd be nice to have a "reason" for the restlessness.

[katie80]

Oh no, poor little guy.  Keep us posted on how it goes.  If things don't settle down, we can try to help you tweak to get it right. 

We are almost to a four hour routine but we really struggle for day time naps to be long enough! Have tried W2S, multiple different ways, decreasing stimulation during wake times and he still always wakes at 40 minutes. Takes a lot of time and effort to get him back to sleep but eventually he does.

I do think this sounds like it could still be a bit UT; the 40 min wake and taking a lot of time and effort to get him back to sleep.  How does he wake, chatty/crabby/quiet?

Tell me about what you're doing for W2S, as well.  I used it at 5 mo with my DS and got great results, so I'd be happy to try and help if possible.

I hope those antibiotics do the trick and he feels better soon!

[melthemom]

When he wakes at the 40 minutes he's usually quiet, looking around. He gets crabby when I try to put him back to sleep. I lay him down for his nap when he starts fussing around the time he "should" nap. Which I have always attributed being tired to. He does do the stare as well but yawns much less than he used to!

For w2s I've tried a few different things. I've gone in at different times from 26-35 min and stirred him, just enough to get a sigh or a twitch then waited for him to drift off into a deeper sleep. Instead he wakes up. Sometimes right away sometimes not until the 40 minute mark. I've also tried patting him down after noticing him come out of his deep sleep. He still wakes up. I've tired laying my hands on him with some pressure during that time too!

The only thing that has made his naps longer recently have been to sh/pat him back to sleep after he wakes up at 40 minutes.

He got a rash from the antibiotics so we are heading back it today for some more investigation.

Still waking up ever hour or hour and a half at night (after sleeping for four straight hours)! I feed him at 630, put him to bed at 7, DF 10, feed 2 then he wakes often till 7am. We are going to try to wean his paci to see if that's the problem. He wakes crying at these times, we've tried leaving him for a while to see if he'll settle but when he doesn't we leave him in bed and sh/pat him.

Any other ideas of the multiple night wakings?

[becj86]

When he wakes at the 40 minutes he's usually quiet, looking around. He gets crabby when I try to put him back to sleep. I lay him down for his nap when he starts fussing around the time he "should" nap. Which I have always attributed being tired to.

This behaviour seems undertired to me. I'd try changing up the activity when he gets fussy and see if he remains fussy when he's definitely not bored... then if he's still fussy, put him to bed for a nap. If he's happy in the new activity, rinse and repeat til he's ready for a nap.

I really think the NW's will be helped when the day is right for him.