16 month old still in 2-1 mess. EW, short naps and EBT doesn't work..

[Buttonbobs]

Seeing as your morning is pretty long anyway, I would start by pushing BT out. Perhaps start by giving him an extra snack in the afternoon so he can last a little longer until dinner. Then offer food for dinner a little later, then start your BT routine later. Maybe go out for the afternoon and do something to keep him more occupied, my DD can always last longer until sleep if we're out, but I don't know if this is the same for you. Maybe do something quiet before bed like reading or watching a bit of Tv together. Then go for BT at 7.30 and cross your fingers. Whatever happens the next day go for a 12.30 nap and then do BT at 7.30 again. Keep going with this for at least a week and see what happens.

[Loafie]

Ok thanks Naomi. That sounds scary! His naps are getting shorter already, down to one hour with current 5.20 am ish wu and midday nap and 6.30-7 pm bt so I have absolutely no idea how this will work...
I actually had to do earlier bt last night at 6.15pm  since its all getting abit much for him I think:(

He slept till 5.20 am so at least he caught abit.

I'm not sure the set naps has been that successful tbh...

I have to get the courage up to do this pushing the day out thing and might wait afew weeks till my partner is on hols for moral support!

Ill keep you posted

[LittleM]

hi Loafie


same problem here... we've been down to 1 hr naps at lunchtime and the EW has been creeping earlier and earlier (5:15  )
I actually decided that the EBT was causing some of our problems, as she was adjusting to the new BT and waking earlier.  So the last 2 nights I have gently pushed her back to her usual bedtime of 6:30 and this morning she slept til 6 - felt like Christmas. She also slept for 2 hours at lunchtime yesterday.

I think that the other issue for us, with the EW and short naps, was that she was hungry ... she's been too tired to eat properly.
so I made sure that I gave her a 'banker' meal before putting her down, as I was finding that she wasn't eating enough before her lunchtime sleep (11 am for us for now).  So I loaded her favourite yoghurt and strawberry smoothie with peanut butter and ground almonds, and she ate the lot.

just some other options to think about  - and I hope that one of the more experienced participants will put me right if I have given you bad advice

hang in there hun, it will get better.  make sure you are looking after you too
xx

[Loafie]

Hi littlem

Thank you for your words of support. Your advice is great. The food thing i dont think is so relevant for
my lO. He eats like a horse and is above average weight glad its worked for you though!! i know what you mean about ebt and EW getting earlier and earlier.  For us, I can use it as a one off but after that , it doesn't work.
It's just so so so hard with a short napper to get some consistency. Honestly, I envie mums that get even 1hr 30 naps!!
Yesterday at daycare was 5.20 wu

Nap noon
Wu 1pm
I had to do ebt again since he a mix of hyper and screaming and crying by 6 Pm:(
I figured it might work since the night before he slept till 5.20 am

But no. Catastrophe..
Asleep 6.15 pm
Wu 4.40 am

Would not go back to sleep. Did wiwo for 2 hours. Gave teething gel etc.

So today is daycare day again. I have no choice but to keep persisting with this noon nap plan but honestly,  lost. I don't see any improvement....

Does anyone have any other ideas. Other than ebt, set nap and pushing the day out? ( which I'm going to try , I just need the courage to do it!)

Sorry for the depressing post. I just don't know how we are going to sort this out. Short naps and EW have been going on forever. And I'm exhausted...
Hope someone out there is having a lovelier day:)

[nevinsmama]

Just wanted to drop off some (((hugs)))... these transitions can really be the pits!! Fingers crossed for a long sleep tonight and a fresh start tomorrow. I am sorry if you have already mentioned this but, any sign of canines? ((HUGS))

[Loafie]

Thanks nevinsmama:) yes, transition is the pits. Problem is , its an issue of EW and short naps that I've been trying to fix for 10 months. Not just this transition:( 

Yesterday at daycare they did 2 naps...
They said they just could not keep him awake , he was screaming and crawling into his bed at 10 am. I agree that when its this bad with 4.40 am wu with no resettling then  there is no choice...

So he slept 10-11.10am
Then again 3.30-4.00pm

Meant I could go back to later bt of 7 pm.Although loooong day I know.
Wu:4.25 am this morning:(

Would not resettle.. I did wiwo till 7 am.

It's crazy:(

Yes, his canines are cutting  ( all 4 have now cut ) and I medicated at bt then as soon as he woke this am but obviously was too late..
4.25 am is the middle of the night though and I just don't understand with a later bt how he does it.
He even ended giggling and squealing to himself for ages from around 5.45 am ??

Is teething what this craziness is all about?
I'm going to try dream meds tonight and If we still get the 4 am wu then we know there's another prob..

I'm with him at home today and he just fell asleep on the couch at 10 am. I just cannot bring myself to wake him. I know I've been consistently doing one nap at noon ages with anything past a 5.15 am wu but I cannot do it whilst he isn't  resettling from a 4.30 am wu.
Am I making it all worse with 2 days of 2 naps?

I feel very confused:(

Help!!

[Haribo2012]

I'm hoping all this craziness is teeth and the wonder week that happens about now! My days all over like yours and WU is random times every day!
Personally I've found if we need a 2 nap day it does mess our nights and WU about but hey that might be coincidence right now lol can't work it out!

[Buttonbobs]

Teething could really cause these happy chatty wakings, at least they do with E. have you ever tried a dream feed of meds? It means you setting some kind of alarm for yourself at about 3am to give him some meds without waking him, but for me if that meant getting to sleep again from 3am until proper morning it was well worthwhile. Perhaps worth a try?

If not, have you tried W2S?

[nevinsmama]

Hey there, how are things going for you and your LO? Have canines popped through yet? I have just been mulling over all this and am wondering, pending knowing what is up with naps and night times, but for the EW have you typically done WIWO for that? Have you ever tried the appraoch of staying in the room, in the dark, the very boring, bland Mama just muttering "sleepytime, Mama's here, it's OK" etc?? Maybe the WIWO is really winding him up and cutting chances of him going back out? Just a thought! Please let us know how things are going, hope we can help out!! (((HUGS)))

[Loafie]

Thanks for checking in Nevinsmama:) you are sweet. 
Well we've been doing dream meds at 3 am since last week and he's been sleeping till 5.30am  so no more of those crazy 4 am WUs!

The canines have all popped but I'm not going to stop dream meds
for awhile yet! Too scared:)

In regards to our routine , well you know what, I've just decided to accept it.
5.30 am WUs, 6.30-7 pm bt and for the moment, midday nap which tbh is getting shorter and shorter, most days now only 40 mins.

I've stopped resettling since I don't think it's helping at all plus bubs two is due in jan and I can't be resettling for hours with a newborn! I've been resettling for 16 months and enough is enough!!!

I've been on here on and off since November about EW and short naps and nothing I've done has changed anything long term ( other than the odd good day here and there)
I don't for the life of me know whether he's ot or ut since his naps are rarely over an hour , whether I do 5 hrs or 6. hrs a time ...
Anyhow, ill probably be on here again soon but for now, I've accepted it.

Hope you are getting on well with ivy:)

Xx

[amateursuch]

Hi Loafie - glad the dream meds are working. I think your attitude is right tbh and I think it's good you've stopped resettling. Like you I did it for 17 months and it drove me mad. Slowly slowly DD is doing longer naps but we get goo and bad days (and I have to say her mood and nights aren't necessarily better after the holy grail of a long nap). I want to cultivate more of your attitude I think. Constant tweaking and assessing hasn't really helped us - I'm about to aim for set BT along with our set nap and have done.

What will the gap be between your littles? It was amazing how having DD stoppe me worrying about DS' sleep (which is still not great but doesn't particularly phase me). Guess I had another lot of sleep to worry about instead!

Good luck!

[jcsmom]

Hey there. So sorry you are still going through this. Your DS sounds so much like my DS was at that age. I kept putting him to bed early due to a short, early nap and we'd get an EW. I also did the 10 am catnap and he would wake at 4 am ready to go for the day. I went INSANE.

In retrospect and after doing some reading I think I should have pushed his nap to 1pm. Some babies do best with a 12:30/1 pm nap, it's just their rhythm I have read that keeping a late morning is not good for too long. But what do I know? My DD is a short napper herself and I have a feeling when on one nap we will be where you are in  few months.

Just wanted to let you know I am thinking of you. xx

[Loafie]

Hi ladies and thanks so much for your support and words of encouragement.
It is easier said than done to just relax and not worry about routine and stick to set nap and set bt but tbh , I think it's no harder than stressing every morning about what the day will bring.
Stopping resettling naps has proved fairly unsuccessful so far but who knows? Hopefully he will learn to resettle himself but its not like we've ever had naps over an hour anyway so I'm not suddenly wondering why they are shorter iykwim??

I did think about pushing nap out to 12.30 pm to see what that would give. Midday has been nap time since we've been on one nap for a couple months and it hasn't helped lengthen them or stop EW. Just so scary to  go till 12.30 pm with 5.15-5.30am wu!

Will try next week when partner is on hols for moral support and let you know how we go:)

LO and bubs will be 20 months apart and so I am preparing for tiring times ahead! Fingers crossed this bubs will be a better sleeper and if not , then at least i hope her arrival will help to take my mind off of Los sleep problems!

Hoping alls well with your bubs and sleep although I'm reading your posts and know I am not alone going through crazy sleep stuff 

Xx

[Haribo2012]

You'll prob find lo2 will be so chilled out as you won't have the same time to worry about sleep...this is what all my friends say with 2 kids lol!!
I'm trying to chill a bit as my LO is refusing any naps in cot it results in an hour of screaming so I'm just having to do stroller and car naps as other wise I spend whole time crying and worrying about it!
I'm hoping "this too shall pass" famous words ;-) x

[Joy-filled]

How are things going?  Has the nap lengthened?