Getting 12 week old into bedtime in cot not carseat

[KookyK]

Baby Hugh is nearly 12 weeks old. He has only once successfully gone to bed in his cot at bedtime 7.30. Since about 7 weeks he has instead gone to sleep in his carseat in the living room with us. Initially he'd go to sleep quickly but now it takes longer more like 8-8.45. We did it as I didn't want to be missing my dinner spending hours upstairs and him disturbing DD.

In the past week I've been putting him to sleep in his cot but he wakes as he does his naps after 20-45 mins as then its re plug dummy over and over or him waking up like a power nap and we end up bringing him downstairs to the carseat.  He's always liked sleeping in the carseat hence this starting.

At about 9-9.30 we transfer him to bed and he sleeps at night in his cot (albeit with various feeds and NWings but that's another thread for another time lol).

Any ideas to help bedtime?

Our routine is sort of like this
A7.30
S 8.45-9.30/10 (I try to get to 10 with replugging dummy)
S 11.30 usually only 45 mins to an hour with me trying to extend
S 2.30 (school run someines i set off early if hes woken early from last nap)-4-4.30
S 5/5.30 for 40 mins

Bedtime we try from 7.30 due to fitting around DD.

[brummum]

How does he go to sleep for naps and how do you resettle night wakings that aren't night feeds? There proobably is a bit of a prop issue with the car seat so just wondering how he goes to sleep at other times to see what the best way might to be to progress him going to sleep in his cot. In terms of routine I think it would probably help to try and get him down to 2 long naps and a cat nap as with the 4 naps in the day he might be a bit undertired at bedtime which is going to make him even less likely to go to sleep in his cot at that time. I think he might be undertired for that first nap. The average awake time at this age is 1:20-1:30 so do you think keeping him up a little longer might help him do a longer first nap? 45mins is typically undertired also as they are not tired enough to sleep for another sleep cycle, although it's quite common to get 45min naps at this age as they find the transitions difficult. Can you accidental parent one of the naps (probably the second one as the first is usually the easiest to settle them for so is a good one for doing in the cot and working towards introducing self settling) to get a nice long one? So 1.5hrs+. That would help towards getting through the day on 3 naps. What do you think? Is there anything that could be causing him discomfort? Any reflux symptoms?

[*Ali*]

Copied across from BFing thread.

DS used to wake twice at night to feed 2am and 5.30 having gone to bed 7.30-8.30. He had a virus two weeks ago and has been gradually getting worse since then. I've had two nights of two hourly feeds. Meh I'm so tired. He also has a wakeful patch due to wind around 5am.

He often falls asleep at the breast and I have got into a bit of a habit of using this as a prop to get him off.

His routine is sort of
A 7.15
S on school run 8.45-10.15
S 12-1 or1.30 been working on nap extending
S 3-4 or 4.30
S 5 or 5.30 for 20-45 mins

He feeds 2.5-3 hourly. He doesn't have reflux. He has a dummy and has started to need that re plugged at night since being ill.

I've had days where he's napped more and days where he's napped less but not much difference at night.

I've posted elsewhere but no replies.

I look forward to hearing your replies to Brummum's questions in her post above so we can offer further advice.

[KookyK]

Ooh thanks Brummum lots to think about.

I don't think he has reflux but I tbink he suffers wind as I have a fast let down and at night I'm nervous to get him too wide awake burping him so prob dont do enough.

I'd not heard of 45 min naps as under tired - really interesting. Trouble with he first nap is he always falls asleep in the car it seems unavoidable. Maybe I shd wake him earlier??

The way he falls asleep is something I've been thinking about. When he was v poorly with a virus a few weeks ago and in hosp a few days I rocked him lots and allowed him to fall asleep on the boob. And sort of continued! I'm not strong enough to remove dummy which he's also quite reliant on but i re read my baby whisperer solves your probs and have been trying to out him down awake but sleepy. He's not wanting his dummy every time which is heartening. His naps are still quite short. But he's been going to bed in his bed at bedtime and the past three nights has got increasingly less wakey (tonight I've not heard from him since 7.30!!!!!! And it's 9.30. Before I'd be in and out).

Nights are still iffy esp after 2am lots of wakings. Hoping the other improvements will feed into it.

[KookyK]

Ps Ali thanks for alerting me to Brummums reply and pulling my threads together!

[brummum]

Trouble with he first nap is he always falls asleep in the car it seems unavoidable.

Is there anyway you can avoid this? Do you have to be out and about at this time?

But he's been going to bed in his bed at bedtime and the past three nights has got increasingly less wakey (tonight I've not heard from him since 7.30!!!!!! And it's 9.30. Before I'd be in and out).

I'm glad he is able to settle in his cot now, that's great progress! I think working towards him going down awake in his cot like you have been and moving away from feeding/rocking to sleep is probably the way to go. Are you using ssh pat?

His naps are still quite short.

Are they? from the EASY above it looks like 3 1.5hr naps and a cat nap?

There is a 3 month growth spurt so this could be contributing to the disturbed nights too. Does he feed well during the day? is he taking full feeds?

[KookyK]

I have to be out for school run so I make those two of his nap times. I guess as he gets older he might not always fall asleep at those times. I'm trying to get a toy for the carseat handle perhaps it'll distract him and I can put it on when needed!

The nap lengths vary the morning one is always at least one hour as is the afternoon one. The midday one in the cot is hardest as I have to stay with him if I want to catch him stirring awake to resettle.

Last night was bad as he wouldn't catnap and so was v v OT at bedtime and fell asleep only to wake 45 mins later about 7.30 and not go back to sleep until nearly 10pm! In the end we got him up for a bit but low key stuff and I took him back to bed at 9.15. I got him up as my dinner was burning and DP was out until later! In the night H was v wakeful 3.30-5.40am I guess from the OT-ness.

He feeds well, breastfed. Quite often but big feeds usually both sides (2-2.5 hourly). My daughter did not eat as much as him by any means. He's above average weight and height.

Thanks Brummum for looking at this for me.

[KookyK]

Forgot to say re shh pat he hates being patted. He likes shhing. If he's upset i shh him til he's sleepy if not i don't always shh at all. If I put my hand in front of his eyes it helps him to close them again if he opens them or stirs awake after a bit. He likes a hand on his tummy to resettle too or when first going off. He is swaddled.

[KookyK]

Hmm today has been bad. Apart from nap 1 which I woke him from (8.45-10.45) he has fought naps and only had 30 mins lunchtime and 30 mins mid afternoon. He has screamed when I've tried to help him to sleep and all usual techniques such as eye covering and shhing not worked.  Oh phooey I'm so disappointed. I tried to shhh pat but that really seemed to wind him up and wake him more. Dreading the night. Foresee lots of early evening wakings and restless from 3am due to OT now :-(

Wondering whether to shorten morning nap more to make him more tired for lunch time nap. Maybe do a 2 hr Awake time from 1st nap. It seems like all sleep happens at the startof the day and he's always tired the other end.

[brummum]

I think he probably does that longer am nap because he's tired from a short disturbed night. I wouldn't shorten it if it were me as that is the most reliable one and you don't want to end up with 3-4 short naps and a very overtired bubba! How long was he up for after that first nap before you tried for the second? do you have any success with extending the naps? How long are you trying for? How is he waking up.. upset? raring and ready to go?! Will he do a longer nap in the middle of the day if he is in a sling/buggy etc...? I'm just wondering whether he still needs that help at the moment to get longer naps and avoid overtiredness. I know at this age our guy wouldn't have done longer than 30-40mins in his basket, so we did lots of buggy, holding and car naps. I think we started introducing teaching him to self settle at around 3 months and that was only for the first nap of the day and at bedtime. It took until around 4 months for it to start paying off and even then he needed his dummy (which then had to be weaned at 5 months due to waking up every hour at night for a replug!). Some little ones just aren't ready or able to transition between sleep cycles or settle independently until nearer 4-5 months.

[KookyK]

First nap wake up to second nap (asleep) was 1 hour 30 he was showing tired signs and I was surprised so soon.

 I tried to extend it the usual way with eye covering shhing and tummy touching but it didn't work today. So I picked him up and tried to shhh pat which seemed to make him cry more but he did get sleepy when I shhhed and held him close. Put him down and he pinged awake and I repeated once more. I stuck at nap extending about 30 mins.

He does sleep longer if in the buggy or out and about. He wakes up lots but is rocked back off by the motion and can then get into a deeper sleep. But he needs fairly
Constant motion.

I'm just disappointed that he could sleep in his cot and go to bed in it the past few days and now not again!

[brummum]

Its still very early days, I wouldn't expect too much, I know it's frustrating when you think you have it cracked and then they change the game plan. If it were me I would shoot for that second nap in the cot using your current approach but if you end up with a short one then do a long buggy nap for the next one to let him catch up and avoid OT. That was my main exercise when little one was younger.. all the 2hr buggy walks!

[KookyK]

Thanks Brummum I really appreciate your replies and ideas.

Today was odd as he was more up for sleep. First nap went a bit wrong only 20 mins I think UT. But he did 1.5 hours in cot!! Hurrah!!! Had to extend but it worked. Then after sensory class he napped 1.5 hrs jn carseat. He then did 1 hour during ballet class in carseat. I actually woke him from those three naps. He actually wakes happiest if I've woken him too. Strange. As last nap was late ish and not a catnap I have left bedtime to 8pm. Fingers x'ed for the night. Will be interesting to see how the naps affect him or if he's slept too much.