I just don't get it...

[aprilhoffmann]

Has anyone else had this problem?

My DD is 4.5 weeks old. We have taught her to sleep by herself in her crib, and all day, she does perfectly. I lay her down and walk out, and even if she's still awake she'll go to sleep, no crying.  However..... after her late night feed (she won't do a dreamfeed yet; she has to be awake to eat), she won't go down! She cries, fusses, and can take HOURS to finally go to sleep! Pat/shush doesn't work. PU/PD doesn't work. We do our very best not to overstimulate her during the day. Her wake times are very short. It also doesn't work to keep her awake more during the day (tried that when the in-laws were here; she was so overstim/tired she never slept all night!).

WHY does she do so well during the day and so poorly at night? She can't know the difference. It's so hard on us cause of course that's when we want to sleep!

Any suggestions/ideas of what to do or what we may be doing wrong? She's on a 3 hr feeding schedule. She's spirited and slightly touchy (we think, but it's hard to tell so young).

Please help if you can. Thanks! 

[The Vern]

I'm certainly no expert but I can relate to your problems. We went through fussy times too with our lo when she was that age, and we didn't have much luck with pat/sh either.  Pu/pd is likely too stimulating for such a young one. I will tell you what worked for us and it was a mix of BW techniques and Happiest Baby on the Block.  There are some similarities between the two.  Anyway, what we did was always swaddle, shush loudly, and slightly jiggle her in our arms.  None of it ever  became a prop.  She's a pro at falling asleep on her own.  The jiggling was easy to transfer from first being done in our arms, then while she's lying in her crib, and now if she fusses, we just have to hold a hand on her belly to put some pressure there which comforts her.  I definitely would not recommend trying to keep her up longer - this will only backfire.  Wake times are short when they are that young.  Your doing a fantastic job - you've already come such a long way with her going to sleep on her own in her crib in such a short time. I also know that df are not for every baby and can take some time to work.  And, you're right, she doesn't know the difference yet b/w night and day, though with time she'll learn. It might be worth for you to get the dvd of the Happiest Baby - we certainly wished we had had it much earlier than we did.  Good luck and keep up the fab work.

[aprilhoffmann]

Thanks for the reply. We have Happiest Baby DVD and do use the techniques, and have been since birth. We swaddle her which she likes, but shushing and jiggling only works if we're holding her.

What's so strange is she used to have her fussy period between 6pm and 12am. Now, all of a sudden it's switched from 12am to 6am! She won't go to sleep ALL night and just three days ago, she almost slept through the night (woke once).

We are so frazzled and don't have any idea how to switch her back.

[chell]

Hi, the first few weeks are the hardest. Could you post her routine, including nap times, then I may be able to help you.

[aprilhoffmann]

Hi. Her schedule varies just slightly from day to day, especially if she hasn't slept ALL night, then we usually are sleeping in the morning and let her sleep longer. But in general, it's like this:

7:30 E & A (diaper change, burping, occasionally holding/talking, etc. depending on how tired she is. She's most tired in the AM)
8:30 S
10:30 E&A (I have to wake her to eat. If I don't, she can sleep until noon)
11:30 S
2:30 or 3:00 E & A  (bathtime)
3:30 or 4:00 S
7:00 E & A
8:00 S (sometimes struggles to go to sleep at this time)
10:00 E  (often this entire schedule is shiften forward one hour, so her late night feeding is at 11 instead of 10)
10:30 S (or 11:30 depending on day) 

From this time until 5am, she WILL NOT GO TO SLEEP.  What will happen is she gets so overtired, that even if she falls asleep, she wakes up within 10 to 20 minutes (even if we sit through both twitch times, it doesn't help. Even holding her in our arms she wakes up)  I feed her again at either 1 or 2. And still she won't go to sleep. After around 5am, she's so exhausted that she finally falls to sleep. Then, the rest of the whole morning, she'd probably sleep straight through without waking up if we didn't wake her to feed her. She can sleep 4-5 hours in a row (has done a few times).

Also, of course there are times during her day time naps where she will wake up early and only sleep 1 hour instead of two. The later in the day it gets, the worse she sleeps.

I'd say about 2-3 times a week, she has great nights where she'll sleep all night, waking only once to eat.  But the rest of the time she just will not sleep at night.  Does the light/darkness in her room matter? She's in a room with no windows so it's always the same. We recently started to turn her light on during her naps. Have you heard about this making a difference?  We also swaddle her, which she can't sleep without.

We've tried letting her cry herself to sleep. This DOES not work. She's gone 1.5 hours crying without falling to sleep.

I'd love any suggestions you have.
Thank you.

[cmckenna]

Sorry, I can't help much as I am in the same boat with our 6 week old.  Naps are great during the day except when she has a growth spurt.  I thought that she was getting overtired at night and I was missing her cues.  I made a special effort last nigth to pay attention and still the same thing. Have also tried putting her down earlier with no success.  Her first nap of the day is a piece of cake after that it gets progressively worse.  At night she ends up sleeping on top of me which is not very comfortable.

[jwig]

Hello - I am very new to this site but did follow BW for my son who was a text book baby.  We have a 7 week old spirited baby who has turned our nice little life upside down.  I put her on 'easy' at 4 weeks but with a toddler it has been hard to follow every day.  She is a belly sleeper (I know, a 'no-no') and tonight I am going to try the Aussie swaddle and put her on her back.  

I know that what you are going through is very, very common.  Mornings are best for most babies (even text book) and as the days go on their little digestive systems and minds go in to overload.  This happens whether they get great sleep during the day or not.  Of course, with text book and angel babies they deal with things much better than our spirited babies.  I will go through what I have tried and what has worked and I really hope this helps.

I charted her days with the topics, Eating (time, how long, which breast), Activity (time, which actvity, how long), Sleep (time, how long) and realized that while I was following a pretty strict schedule the times were off.  Once I started to chart, things sort of fell in to place and the times got more consistent.  I do let her cry since she will not let me hold her for any length of time.  I do everything in 3 minute increments.  I let her cry for 3 minutes and then pat lightly for 3 minutes and then start again.  I try to not take her anywhere during the day unless I am prepared to either put her down somewhere or to suffer the consequences at night - even being slightly off schedule means a really bad night (like last night).  I always put her down either in her crib or in her bassinett (for travel purposes I keep using both right now - bassinett is portable).  At night, I feed her, bath her, and then feed her again (she will never fall asleep on the boob) and then rock her for a few minutes and put her down while patting.  I would say that 2 out of 7 nights I still miss her window and it takes us an hour to get her down but the rest of the days she is pretty good with about 20 minutes to go down waking up at 2:00 and 5:30 AM with the last feed before that being at 9 PM.  I do not find DF works for us but have only tried a handful of times.  

Again, she is by no means a text book baby and it has taken me a while to realize that she is not going to magically turn in to one  I am trying to work with her and realize that some days will be bad no matter what I do.  Yesterday I went to a friend's house for lunch and she did not sleep therefore we had an awful evening and night which resulted in a cry/melt down from me (silly, I know).  My goal is 80/20 - if we can follow this strict schedule 80% of the time my little spirit and I are both pretty happy.

I hope that this helps.  I tried to incorporate some techniques and also tried to help you understand that some nights will be bad but with a focus on the good nights you seem to get through.

Gotta go - my 3 minutes is up

[aprilhoffmann]

Stacy,
No I don't think you're reading it right. She only takes 2 hour naps . She's on a 3 hour feeding shedule, so she eats and has activity for one hour, then sleeps for 2 hours, and then wakes up again to eat. This is what I've read is recommended everywhere.  That puts her at an average of sleeping 12 hours a day; this isn't too much from what I've read (newborns need 16-20 hrs a day, right?)  Perhaps I wrote the schedule down in a confusing way, but basically she's on a 3 hour schedule.

Jwig,
Thanks for your input. My husband can't seem to accept that our baby is so sensative. I find that if we do ANYthing different, even have one guest over, it seems to throw her off and things are bad that evening and night. I thought perhaps I was just making things up and that she wasn't that sensative, but it sounds like perhaps it's possible that she is. If you can't go anywhere without messing up your baby, then it sounds like a problem that truly exists. I hope this won't last forever...I don't want to have to stay home the rest of her childhood!

I charted her schedule to the minute for days and days, but what I find so hard is that because she won't sleep at night, by the morning I'm too exhausted to set an alarm to make sure she wakes up and feeds the exact same time every day. If she goes to sleep finally at 6am (after being up all night), I can't find it in me to wake her up at 7 to eat!  Dreamfeeds don't work with her, either. If she's asleep, she won't eat. I've been told by other moms that they often have to be older before DF's work.  Sounds like your girl is sleeping pretty well at night though 9-2; that's amazing! I wonder if maybe I shouldn't wake her for her late night feeding at 10 or 11?  Maybe I'll try that tonight and see how long she sleeps.

It's good to know that someone else is going through the same thing. Thanks again for your message.

[Cory'stiredmommy]

Hi April,
My LO is 7 months now and we did find that waking him to feed at 11pm was difficult (when he was your LO's age). He wouldn't feed well unless we really woke him up and he would be up for about 1.5 hours. I started not waking him for the "DF" and he would wake on his own anywhere between 11:30 and 12:30... take a super big feed.... and go back to sleep quickly.
By waking her fully (which I understand you need to do in order to get your LO to feed well - we had to do the same) this may be causing her to be in an overtired state - you know what that is like;-)... and this may be why she is wired and not going back to sleep well.
Definitely give it a few nights of letting her wake on her own. Some nights Cory woke at the regular feeding time and sometimes he slept longer.
BTW, I now do a DF at 11:30... and it is really working for us. Although he sometimes wakes a little sooner!
Good Luck