4 mo habit waking in early morning

[treebutt]

hi there myia
i was hoping you could give me some advice on my 4 month old. he is feeding 3.5/ 4hourly during the day. he has his last feed at 630 and goes to sleep by 7pm.  he wakes between 12 and 1 for a feed and then again between 5 and 6am.  this 5-6 am feed really confuses my day! he sometimes only takes a little bit - 80ml of formula and usually goes back to sleep to 7 when i wake him.  i then dont know when to feed him next - as 4 hours is too far away for such a small feed, and then i worry about his napping ability on a not so full tummy??!! i feel like this 5/6am feed is also a bit out of habit as he falls asleep pretty quickly....should i try shh/ pat which has worked with extending his daytime naps?  or just wait till the 6 month mark and see if he learns to sleep thru a bit more??

also, if i am posting in the wrong spot can u let me know?? am very new at all of this - but love the website and would really like to participate!

thanks

beck

[momofclaire]

Hi Beck,
Welcome to the BW boards.  I have split your post so that it can be more easily viewed by everyone.

Can you post his routine for me,  including naps?

I think it sounds as though you are doing great.  It is very possible that the early wake (5-6) is out of habit.  Have you tried a cluster i the evening or a df? 
You could try to pat/shh him through that second wake.  If he isn't taking a full feed then he probably doesn't need it. 

I am glad you are enjoying the websight! 
Myia

[treebutt]

hi myia
what a nice morning surprise to hear from you!!

the routine is kinda set by what time he first feeds in the morning - i have listed today's predicted routine...this is a good day as the 4 hour feeds fall perfectly to end with a 630 pm feed before bed - it isnt always like this tho!! esp. if its a 5/ 530am feed and lo doesnt E properly, which is what throws the day. i get confused how to space the E to end with the last one at 630pm. should i top up at 7 and if he doesnt take any, bad luck wait 4 hours??? i worry how he will nap tho without a decent feed.

he roughly naps 1 1/2 - to 2 hours after getting up - however, we are battleing 45 minute naps so this too can change EASY...EASAS....

this is what i aim for....on a good day!!

630am - feed, today it was close to a full feed so will wait 4 hours. i always treat this feed as a nightfeed and put him back to bed after this feed and he nods off v. easily.
7am - up, i woke him, so only back to sleep for 15 minutes or so....
8.45am - wind down for nap (we are battling 45minute naps so my day will be a bit determined by how long he sleeps. i am shh/patting at 45minute mark and we are getting some progress to 1-1 1/2 naps)
1030 - feed
1230 - wind down and nap
2.30 - feed
4.15 - 430 - last nap
630 feed
7pm - bed

and then a 12 - 1am feed where he takes a full bottle. he is formula feed. like i mentioned before tho, if he wakes closer to 12am he wakes earlier say 5am which confuses my day.

naps he can get himself off to sleep on his own now w no crying esp. with a decent 10 - 15 minute wind down in his room. this is why i love this site already!!!

i find that if his afternoon feed is 230pm he feeds really well at 630pm so dont want to push the 230 feed out much more than that - but am open to suggestions!!

no i havent tried cluster or df. should i??

thanks again for your reply and look forward to hearing your thoughts!

beck

[momofclaire]

Is there a reason why you put him back down after that 6:30 feed?  Is he asleep around 9:00 for the first nap?  I notice you say "windown for nap" at 8:45. If so, does he handle the 2 hour A time pretty well?

I think you may want to start his day then.  I know that it might seem early but it may help your routine to just start then. Your routine, overall, looks pretty good.  I would try something like this based on him waking at 6:30.
6:30 wake and eat
8:30 nap (1.5-2 hours)
10:30 eat
12:30 nap (1.5-2 hours)
2:30 eat
4:30 cap nap (45 minutes)
5:15 eat
6:15 windown for bed including a top up feed, bed by 7:00
10:00 df

You don't have to do the df but you may find that the dream feed will get him through until 2 or so an then he will have one feed to get him through until morning.  You may also find that he *might* sleep in a bit later and you can adjust to that.

I am also a fan of the cluster because it gives them a little time to digest but packs them full before bed.  You can try one and see how it goes and then decide if you want to try the other.  I would advise trying the clustering first as there are some babies that don't take to the df. 

If you notice in the routine I posted he is getting a bit more daytime sleep.  That cat nap should be 1/2 hour or a little more.  I think the average amount of day sleep for a 4 month old is 4-5 hours!  I know, it sounds like a lot.

I hope this information helps.  Have you read any of Tracy's books?  If not, you should check your local library. They are great.
Let me know what you think.
Myia

Oh, why the name "treebutt?"  It makes me smile.
 

[treebutt]

gosh - ur good!!

thanks for all of that - will have a good think about your suggestions, particularly the dreamfeed....is there a spot on this site on how to with the dream feed?

i was putting him back to bed as a few resources including Tracey (? i thought, or did i miss read??) suggests to treat all feeds b4 7am as a night feed???) and the fact he goes back to sleep, even while im feeding, i was thinking he needed it and would eventally work out to sleep till 7. ??

his first nap he needs to be back in bed 1 1/2 hr after getting up so wind down starts after 1 1/4 of A time.  the other 2 naps are closer 2 hours A time which includes 15 minute wind down.

treebutt - is a nickname, longstory, that i just entered because all my other more normal names/ nicknames were taken and i was desperate to log on to this site, and couldnt think of anything else - mummy mush brain....now i regret it!!! i dont have a butt like a tree at all....its more of a spin on my last name!!!  hope it provides a giggle for a few of u out there!!

thanks again myia for ur time so far  - cant tell how nice it is to have someone respond to my queries, makes the world of difference to my day....

beck 

[momofclaire]

Thanks for the compliment but I have to say that it really is a bit easier looking at someone elses sleep problems.   I have had my own, believe me.
There are some babies that are simply early risers.  Since he is so close to 7 am I would personally just get him up.  If you think he needs that extra 15 minutes of sleep certainly give it to him. I just think it may be benificial to just start the day instead.

It sounds like you are pretty in tune with his cues.  If he can only handle 1.5 hours A time in the morning that is fine.  I might think about sloooowwwllllyyyyy extending that. You can try 5 minutes every 3 days or so to see what he can handle.

I am not finding a dream feed sticky to link you to.     Do you have the BW book?  You can look it up in there but basically...
You would go in around 10:00 and pick him up and feed him in his sleep.  I found it easier to use a bottle, I can't remember if you are nursing or bottle feeding.  I fed ebm in a bottle for the df.  Generally the baby will latch with no problem and drink while sleeping. When he is done you can put him back down in his crib.  Claire hardly ever woke because we did the df in the dark in her room.

I will look around for an information post about it.
Myia