OT baby - how to change her routine so no more tears at bedtime!!!

[bethanys mummy]

Hi all

looking for advice on my lo's routine - at the moment she is OT nearly every bedtime - either falling asleep on the breast or howling herself to sleep (dont worry I am with her but its still heart breaking )

Few background comments

- 5 months old

- she is a chronic short napper, but I am working on this. Nearly always have to intervene with her naps - sometimes I think she would have been ok alone (then she ALWAYS  does 1 hr, 10 - does this mean anything?), but most times I go in at 30 mins and stay for 20 mins to see her through the jolts - soemtimes its quite easy, othertimes a real battle. So naps vary from 1, 10 to 2 hrs but always with some intervention and with no predictability that I can see.....

- usually goes down ok for naps if I catch her right - wind down, lullaby etc, sometimes a little pat or 2. So its just the extending - which I hope she will grow out of..

- she will carry on for ever pretending she is ok - playing, grinning etc, its only when it comes to actually switiching off at night that she goes "wrong". She tends to play for a while then break down...

- we do have a bed time routine - bath, b/f upstairs (away from DD1) etc

- she does struggle with her wind at night, has done from birth, DD1 was the same but grew out of it at about 7 months so hope DD2 will too. So nights are unsettled, hence the shorter day, I found if I got her up earlier she had a very short 1st A time

- at least "E" is not an issue - she is happy to go for 4-5 hours between feeds so can largely put these where I want in the routine...

So at present we are at:

A 8.30 to 11 (incl wind down)
S 11- 12.30 (average, varies)
A 12.30 - 3 (incl wind down)
S 3- 4.30 (average, varies)
A 4.30 - 5.50
S 5.50 - 6.20 - cat nap
A 6.20 - 7.30
Feed starts 7.30, then try for sleep....

Please any comments. Also if both sleeps end up at 1hr, 10 what then??

Thanks so much, dont know what else to do to stop the bed time tears...

[Grace's Mom]

Hello.

Sorry you are having such a rough time at night. 

The one thing that I notice is that her A time is about 2.5 hours long (the 1st two times).  That is a whole lot for a 5 month old. How long has your lo been staying up that long?  That may be why your lo is OT.  Just a thought...of course, I could be completely way off.  Then the A times are really short after the 2nd nap.  She may not be tired enough at bedtime with her only having been up for 1 hour but is then mixed with OT from earlier on during the day.

Maybe try something like this....

8:30-10:30 A time
10:30 -12:30 nap
12:30-2:30 A time
2:30-4:30 nap or so
4:30-6:30 A time
6:30-7pm cat nap
8:30/9  bed

Or if you don't want your lo going down that late a night, move wake up to 7 or 7:30 (or somewhere around there) and go from there moving bed time to 7:30pm.  Of course nap times will vary...that is just an example.

Have you thought about possibly changing up your night time routine?  A slight change or two might help out with the probelms you are having at night. 

-Melissa

[bethanys mummy]

hi there

many thanks for taking the time to try to help out

YOu may be right, TBH her A times vary between 2-2.5 hrs, but moving towards the 2.5, perhaps too much for her at the moment... esp if naps usually no more than 1,20

I think my problem is still the nap length, even though I can often extend its not 2 hrs, which is a world away from 1 hr, 10 or 20. If she got 2 x 2hrs in I think she could cope without the cat nap and have an earlier bedtime (she has done this twice) but there is little chance at present as its a battle to extend at all. so up to the cat nap she may only have had 2.5 hrs sleep

The other issues is that bed time does have to be 12 hrs + as she is so restless with the wind. Bit of a viscious circle at present with bedtimes crying giving more wind and more tiredness

But taking on board your comments and my lo's habits what do you think of...

A 8.30 to 10.50 (incl wind down)
S 10.50- 12.15 (average, varies)
A 12.15 - 2.40 (incl wind down)
S 2.40- 4.00 (average, varies)
A 4.00 - 5.45
S 5.45 - 6.20 - cat nap - maybe should try for 40 mins???
A 6.20 - 7.30
Feed starts 7.30, then try for sleep.... so bed about 7,45.

so in total about 3 hrs sleep, maybe 3,20 but before bed about 40 mins in the previous 3.5 - 4 hrs, is that too little???

comments really welcome

If she does 2 x 1, 10 do you think I should try for another long nap - what length of A time do you think is appropriate for a 5 month old if nap length is only this long?

Thanks!!!

[Grace's Mom]

Yes, a cat nap can be between 30 minutes to 45 minutes, so if you want to bump it up a bit then go for it. You just don't want her getting too much sleep at that time that she doesn't want to go down at bed time.

I think it's great that you know your lo so well 

The routine looks good.  Not all lo's need 2 hour long naps, so even if your lo is getting 1.5 hours that is not a bad thing.  It would be nice if they all did the exact same thing, that way we'd all know what to do at each stage, but sadly they aren't   

About A time....some lo's can handle a good amount of A time with little sleep while others are the opposite.  2 hours is about where 'most' 5 months olds are at....some moving closer to 2.5 hours and some can't stay awake 2 hours yet.  I know that doesn't help you out too much   

Just watch her cues closely and you'll figure out exactly what she needs.  My lo seemed to always need more sleep than others at this age but now needs less so it's all just a process of getting to know them over and over and over again. 

[bethanys mummy]

Thanks

will try for this, although today of course she did a long pm nap so no time for the cat nap, little tinker

What I meant by the A time was that, if she had only had 1,10 rather than the hopeful 1.5-2 hrs then obvioudly A time would prob reduce, as it does for a cat nap, what do you think, about 1.75-2 hrs?

I know she will change again soon, just want to do best for little tinker, and she likes to "hide" her cues if she is busy so have to take her away from activity to see if she is tired

Are there any particular signs if a lo is under tired at bed time??

Cheers

E x

[Grace's Mom]

Signs of being undertired are sometimes similar to being OT....weird, huh?!  Like, crying when being laid down...they could be crying because they aren't tired enough or because to are too tired.  One good way to tell is if they are wide awake for quite sometime and are not falling asleep but aren't crying or what not along with the absence of their normal tired signs (rubbing eyes, yawning, etc.).

Have a great weekend.

Melissa