Need help with NW and EW..........so had enough of it now

[louis-mummy]

Hi

My little fella is nearly 9 months old and has never STTN.  I think that his severe eczema - itching - has been a big cause and has lead me to do some AP.  The eczema is a lot better now (steroids) but i wonder if he still has the remaining bad habits?

Still, i have been trying to follow EASY for months now and he has been happy to have a routine but still not STTN......could anyone please give me any clues as to where we are going wrong?
He usually wakes 3-4 times during the night, sometimes with a cranky cry, othertimes straightaway screaming.

7.30 (this has turned into 6am recently) Wake and BF
8.30 Solids
10.30 Nap for approx 1 hr
11.45 BF
12.15 Solids
3.30 Nap for 45 mins-1hr
4.30 BF
5.15/30 Solids
18.00 Bath
18.45 BF + Bed (goes to sleep independantly after a few minutes of crying)

Where i think we may be going wrong -
He seems OT a lot of the time
I BF him maybe once during the night   1. because it works to get him back off to sleep and 2. it stops the noise!!  Other wakings me or DP do shh/pat and this works OK 50% of the time. PU/PD drives him insane.
I struggle during the night to decipher between a 'come and get me' cry and an 'asleep cry' - maybe i am intervening too soon?

He very rarely falls asleep feeding and we got rid of the dummy/binkie, doesn't fall asleep in arms or rocking, doesn't seem to be teething too badly.

Have i missed anything?

Please help, i am so tired i am dreading going to bed and turning into an angry cursing monster during the night AGAIN

Laura

[rob1lu2]

Hi Laura!

Welcome to the boards!

Well, from looking at your schedule I would say your LO is seriously OT. His daytime sleep is very short for how long his A times are. My girls are 13 months and they have a similar schedule, but they didn't at 9 months.

I would reduce his A times to see if you can get him to sleep longer naps during the day. When he wakes at 6am do you still put him down at 10:30?

Also, is he on the cusp of something developmental? Crawling or walking?

Once you correct the OT you will probably see his NWing diminish and his EW should correct itself.

What do you think?

Lu

[*Natasha*]

Ditto to what Lu said that first awake time needs to be shortened to 3hrs at the most and aim for a 1.5hr nap then shoot for a 3-3.5hr awake time after she wakes from the morning nap and another 1.5hrs in the afternoon. Then 3-3.5hrs awake time before bed.  I agree once you get the day sorted you will see an improvement in EWings and NWings.

[louis-mummy]

Hi

Thanks for your replies.  It really helps me for someone to say what the problem is, being totally shattered doesn't help me make sense of anything myself.  I think you are both right though 

Do you know what? he slept through til 05.45 today! Longest he's ever slept for. Typical 
I had given him Piriton for his itchy skin though and yesterday was a disaster for naps so sure we're not 'fixed'....yet

I did know he is overtired but he is such a light sleeper i have a real struggle to extend his naps and daren't go into his room to check on him or he wakes up.  He used to have 2x 30min naps - even from 5months old    It almost became like his short napping and grumpiness was 'normal' IYKWIM.  I feel really bad about that now.....
Plus he is very nosy and inquisitive and hates to miss anything...even very young he realised if he went to sleep he might miss something.
He has started to nap better recently though and can often go for over 1 hour without any intervention.  If i am vigilant i can usually extend - so that's what i'll do!

Does this sound ok for today?

05.45 Wake + BF
06.00-07.00 Back in bed (asleep for 20mins maybe?)
07.00 Up + BF
08.00 Solids
09.30 Nap (aiming for 1.5hrs!)
11.00ish BF
12.00 Solids
15.00 Nap (we have dr's appt @ 14.30)
17.00 Solids
19.00 Bed

Perhaps this is selfish of me but i feel as though we will be housebound? If i need to be at home for naps of a total of 3 hrs per day plus lunchtime for food then it doesn't leave much time to go anywhere?
Will we be OK to relax on the timings once he has started to STTN (it really will happen one day?!!) and nap better?

Thanks again for your help 

Laura x

[louis-mummy]

Uh-oh! it went wrong already 

We did the morning nap as planned - 1hr 20mins, not bad for him - but then he fell asleep in the car when he should have been on A time.  Couldn't believe it after his good night's sleep and morning nap. 
Tried to get him to have his pm nap still, later at 16.00, but he wouldn't have it.  He looked tired but didn't act tired, i was patting + shushing but he just lay there with his eyes open
So this is what we ended up with

 A   07:00 - 09:30
S   09:30 - 10:50
A   10:50 - 13:30
S   13:30 - 14:20
A   14:20 - 18:40
S   18:40

Was i right to get him to bed earlier tonight since the naps went wrong?

No doubt tonight will be an all-night party

Sorry for the essay but i feel like this could be the answer to our prayers and i need to keep on it!

Laura x

[rob1lu2]

Absolutely - I am a huge fan of the early bedtime. I compensate for how much nap time they missed and calculate that into the early bedtime.

So today, for example, one of my girls refused her PM nap. Bedtime is usually 7:30, but hers will be 6:30 tonight. Other twin took her PM nap, so she'll get the usual 7:30 bedtime.

Keep us posted!

Lu

[louis-mummy]

Hi!

Thanks for your reply    Worse happened yesterday   

I couldn't extend his pm nap - only had 45 mins - and then he fell asleep on my lap for an hour, waking 45 mins before he was due to go to bed 

I didn't know what to do so kept him up long enough for food, bath etc and as soon as he seemed tired again i put him to bed.

We ended up with this
A   07.00 - 10.00
S   10.00 - 11.15
A   11.15 - 2.30
S   2.30 - 3.15
A   3.15 - 5.00
S   5.00 - 6.00
A   6.00 - 7.40
S   7.40-11.30
S   12.20-3.30
S   3.30-6.30
A?   6.30-7.15

I've cancelled all plans to go out today and going to concentrate on extending his naps.  Just hope we don't end up completely housebound 

Any thoughts appreciated

[rob1lu2]

Hi Laura,

I would say that yes, sometimes you are housebound for a few days to correct some OT. It can be as fun or suck as bad as you want it to be. But remember you are trying to correct something long term, so the short term matters.

I think it's fine that you let him sleep on your lap. And then just getting to the bedtime business is great too.

Remember, it will take him a while to catch up. Just keep at it.

I see that he woke at 3:30, did you BF him there?

Let's just concentrate on getting him some sleep. Keep up the good work! And keep us posted!

Lu

[louis-mummy]

Hi Lu

Thanks for your reply, i'm afraid i seem to have 2 threads on the go   
I am going to post on the other one about last night, which was awful!

Yes i do tend to BF him if he has slept til a 'reasonable' time - mainly cause i am so tired.  I think you are saying that is OK

thanks again
Laura *YAWN*

[rob1lu2]

Hi Laura,

Didn't realize you had two threads going.  What I am saying is that it needs to be OK with you, knowing that eventually you may have to break him of that habit.

If you want to include your link to the other thread, I can help you out there. Or at least just take a look at it.

Lu

[louis-mummy]

Hi Lu

Thanks for your reply again. 

Here is my other thread, its much the same as this one (oops!) 

https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=121143.0

Laura x