NWs or EWs, time to drop the catnap?

[Sui]

Hello,

DS is 22 weeks tomorrow and we have come a long road since I started SP at 14 weeks. I now have an independent sleeper, and after spending 8 weeks in a darkened room with a chronometer, we have managed to extend naps to 1.15-1.30 for the last two weeks, without intervention at 30-40 min marks! So, firstly I would like to thank everyone who helped me here, you are great.

Last week DS had again started to have either NWs or EWs. If he has NWs (mostly during the second half of the night), he's having an 11 hrs of nightsleep. If not, like yesterday, then he's trying to be up at 10-10.5 hours or less. This morning he was up after 9.5 hours (with only one NW for a feed), and I had to AP him in order to start the day in our regular time.

For the last two weeks our routine is something like:

7.30-8.00 Awake and Eat (BF and solids)
Then he has 2 hr 15 min A time
10.00-10.15 Sleep for 1.10-1.20

12.00 Eat (BF and solids)
A time here is 2hr 45min, and depending on when he woke from the AM nap
14.00-14.15 Sleep for 1.15-1.30

16.00 Eat (BF)
17.30-17.45 Catnap for 30 min

I BF him when he wakes, then A and we start the bed time routine including bath and bottle.

We go to bed around 20.30. He's usually asleep by 20.45.

His nighttime sleep is 11hrs at most, and if we have an early bedtime then we have an early waking. If he sleeps more than 3 hrs 15min (anything close to 3.5 hrs) during the day, he is very restless during the night. I am to start the day at 8.00, because otherwise I cannot come from University to home for noon feeding, as I have class by that time.

Anyway, he also started shortening naps to 1.10-1.05 yesterday. Given we have either NWs or EWs, and that he has more A times than an average 5 mo old (2.15 for AM and 2.45 for PM), do you think that we are about to drop the catnap? Should I start increasing his A time 15 min? or more? When we are out (e.g. shopping) I have seen that he's even making 3.30.

P.S. For the AM nap today I put him down after 2 hr 25 min A time and got a 1 hr nap.

~Melike

[becky1969]

I think he's OT from a day of short naps.

Looking at your routine, A time is a bit too long hence the short naps.  At this age, we usually see more like 2h15 hours. I realize you're only doing 2.5 hours, but even 15 minutes at this age can be too much.  Also, if he's getting teeth in at all, that can make him more tired than usual.

I think I'd try the 2h15 for a day and see if that lengthens your naps closer to 2 hours.  Or at least 1.5 hours.

He should be getting FIVE to SIX hours of daytime sleep! So, I find it hard to believe thatmore than THREE makes him restless.  My guess is that even if he gets 3.5 hours of sdaytime sleep it's still really insufficient, so he's restless because he's desperately sleep deprived.


Try the shorter A.  If 2h15 doesn't work, I'd actually go down to 2h.  With babies who have had trouble extending naps I often find that they are *very* sensitive to being OT and high on the sleep needs scale.  Try it this way (3 days at each new A time) and if that doesn't work, then we can explore increasing As to find his sweet spot.

[Sui]

Thank you Becky.

I frankly tried all, especially considering that he may be OT and attempted shorter A times, but in this case he either refused naps, or woke only after 30-45 minutes, happy. On another experience I had with NWs last month, I thought he was OT and made him sleep around 4 hours a day for a few days, and what I got was doubling NWs. Then one day, he had less sleep during the day and was up for only once during the night.

During the last few days, the A times and corresponding nap times are such:

2.30 A time, 1.20 AM nap
3.05 A time, 1.45 PM nap
2.25 A time, 1.05 AM nap
2.45 A time, 45 min PM nap, needed to be settled for an additional 30 min.
2.00 A time, 30 min AM nap, woke happy and cannot be resettled
2.50 A time, 1.05 PM nap

Given these, I am quite sure that he's an exception with sleep needs in the realm of 5 mo olds. I don't think he is OT, I mean then, isn't he supposed to have 30 min naps? What I am getting is 1 hr-1hr 15 min naps, which I read to be UT.

Moreover, he's OK with 13-14 hrs. of total sleep a day, and now even trying to cut nightsleep to 10 hrs. Plus, his CN is 25 min. now.

I am wondering if a 5 mo old can try to drop the catnap. If yes, how will we achieve this? Should I continue to offer a CN / enforce a CN until I am sure that he easily makes 3 hrs in the PM?

Thanks,
Melike

[becky1969]

Boy, I think I'm going to let a low sleep needs mom answer this.  You're getting daytime sleep that on par with a 9 month old.  That just seems way too little to me.  Even a low sleep needs child gets more than that, I believe.


It does look like he slept longer with more A time.  3h looks about right.  I think I would try 3h As. for a bit and see where that gets you.  YOu may never have a 2 hour napping babe! But we do want to see about 1h30 I think in order for him to get the restorative sleep he needs.

If you move your As out to 3h and start getting 1.5 hour naps, then the cat nap will simply drop out on it's own.  For example:

7 am wake

10 am nap (1.5 hours)

11:30 awake

2:30 nap (1.5 hours)

4:00 awake

7:00 in bed for the night.



This gets you 3 hours Daytime sleep and hopefully closer to 12 at night.  Our goal at this age is 14-16 hours total sleep.  And with this routine we'd get 15 which is right in the middle! Even if he does an 11 hour night but gets 3 hours during the day, that should hopefully be OK.


You know your baby! So if you truly feel OT is not at work here, then it's not.

Now, with multiple NWs that's rarely caused by being OT.  1-2 NWs yes can be caused by being OT.  But more than 2? That's usually discomfort.  So I would wonder whether he's teething or has an undx problem like an ear infection or reflux.  Any of that ring bells for you?

[Sui]

So it seems that we are not able to drop CN unless he can handle some 3 hrs, or at least 2.45 in the morning, which is not the case for now. And given the 11 hr sleep at night, I think we have to survive through the coming weeks.

Anyway, naps are now going wonky, and I think teething is playing some part here. I am wondering if we have too many short naps during this period (because it seems impossible to find the right A time), do they again become a habit? Or does he again start to take decent naps once this period is over and we find the right A time. I have fought for a looooooooong time with short naps, I really don't want to start from square one. 

[becky1969]

Teething will make even the best napper short nap.  It's just one of the trials of the first year.  But they usually go back to normal when it's over.

Usually teething makes them more tired than usual.  so chop 15 minutes off your A times adn see if that helps.