4 month old and dreamfeed

[Mum of PA]

Hi there

This is driving me bonkers... My DS is 4 months old, is breast fed and for the last 5 nights he has been waking before the dreamfeed which my husband does at 10.30pm with a bottle of EBM. He has woken at 10.25pm, 10.23pm 9.40pm, 9.30pm and 9.20pm all after going down at 7pm for the night. He goes through periods for a week or so where he won't wake before the DF then revert to waking.  I just can't believe he can't go 3 hours or or less without a feed once down for the night.

Bit of background:
He is not a good sleeper during the day.  We are STILL trying to get him to settle on his own when going down for a nap and STILL trying to get him to go longer than 45 minutes - both with shush pat for every sleep.  We have days where he will do 1 long sleep which is great but they are few and far between.  Mostly we are trying to extend which probably works 50% to 60% of the time.

Because of the short sleeps his feeds are not a lovely 4 hourly routine but probably more like a 3 1/2 hour routine but it does vary depending on his sleeps and is sometimes 3 hourly.

I don't feel like he feeds well during the day, his distracted easily (hard not to with a 2 year old running around) and it doesn't feel like he takes a good feed in any case.   I have started giving him a breast feed before I put him down for his sleeps for the last couple of days (but not feed to sleep).

At night we also top him up with around 100 to 120ml of formula before he goes down at night - this is after a full breast feed after his bath.

He will take around 190ml EBM for the dream feed.

He wakes at around 4am for a feed or earlier if he wakes before the dream feed.  He generally will do 5 hours after a dream feed.

Does anyone have any suggestions as to how we can get him to sleep through to the dream feed?  I really feel like he needs to get more calories during the day and he is waking at night because he is still hungry - but I don't know how to increase his intake with breast feeding - does anyone have any suggestions?

Thank you so much.

[~ Vik ~]

Hi!  Hopefully I can be of some help

My DS is 4 months old, is breast fed and for the last 5 nights he has been waking before the dreamfeed which my husband does at 10.30pm with a bottle of EBM. He has woken at 10.25pm, 10.23pm 9.40pm, 9.30pm and 9.20pm all after going down at 7pm for the night.

Have you checked out this FAQ?  http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=54662.0  It's in the bottle feeding board, but has a section on how to deal with habitual waking from the dream feed.  Something in there might be helpful!

He is not a good sleeper during the day.

OT can also lead to those early-evening wakings.  So although hunger may be a factor, if he is not sleeping well and gets OT towards the end of the day that could be contributing.

Because of the short sleeps his feeds are not a lovely 4 hourly routine but probably more like a 3 1/2 hour routine but it does vary depending on his sleeps and is sometimes 3 hourly.

That's actually very, very normal for a breastfed baby.  Because breastmilk is so easy to digest, ebf babies often need to feed more frequently than ff babies.  For example, my ds was on a 3h routine until about 4.5mo, then a 3.5h routine until about 5.5mo when we started solids.  So don't worry too much about that 4h feeding routine   Do be careful though with feeding before naps.  Even if you don't actually feed to sleep in the literal sense, it can still become a prop as they get used to that closeness and the full belly before they go down for a nap.

I don't feel like he feeds well during the day, his distracted easily (hard not to with a 2 year old running around) and it doesn't feel like he takes a good feed in any case.

Have you tried nursing in the dark bedroom right when he wakes up?  That's where we had our best success, though potentially difficult with your 2 year old   I know that one of the other mods, Charlotte, had luck with her ds watching TV - she would feed on such an angle that he could see the television, and that kept him interested enough to take a full feed.  Keep in mind too that as babies get older they become much more efficient nursers and are capable of taking a full feed in a really short time!  Have a look at http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=65904.0 for some reassuring information

He wakes at around 4am for a feed or earlier if he wakes before the dream feed.  He generally will do 5 hours after a dream feed.

That's great!!  Perfectly normal at this age to do the dreamfeed plus another night feed

I don't know how to increase his intake with breast feeding

Do you cluster feed or tank up in the evenings at all?  I always fed a little closer together in the evenings to get as much breastmilk in my ds as I could   Also, there is a BIG growth spurt at the 4mo mark, so that might be throwing a wrench into everything right now.  Have a look at this for ideas:  http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=66001.0

Let me know what you think?

[Mum of PA]

This is great information - thanks Vikki.  I am glad to hear these things are normal for a 4 month old.  My DD was an angel/textbook baby, sleeping through the night at 11 1/2 weeks, great napper on a perfect 4 hour EASY so I feel like this is all 'new' to me this time around!  I do cluster feed early evening so will continue, we are desperately trying to work on not getting him too OT before bed and I will watch the feeding before his naps - I was reluctant to do this in the first place but I was hoping it get a bit more into him which in turn would help with his naps.

The links are very helpful.

Thanks.

[~ Vik ~]

Glad to have helped!