I need to get rid of these NW...anyone?

[~Emma~]

 OK ,so baby D was STTN for a good while before the move. Now she's not, not even close. I usually feed her when she wakes at about the 1-2 am mark as I am so tired ( DS been NW/EW too). I have tried resettling but she wont have it.

 I know she can do it. She also did it the first night we were on the house and almost did it one night last week going just over 10 hours.

 She is on 3 BF during the day, 3 meals during the day and has 7/8oz before bed. Should I think about offering water instead?

 PU/PD doesn't do it, she's too spirited and has far too much stamina even for me! She gets really, really upset when she is left in her cot with me rubbing her back etc.

DH is back at the weekend for 10 days. I need to get this sorted before he goes again. I have nearly went mental the last few days and tiredness is the reason.

 

[scucci1979]

so many hugs Emma. We had a two hour NW last night. I ended up feeding her.

[bubbabear1]

Sending huge hugs (((())))  Hope you get it sorted soon and get some sleep!! Bet it's good to be back in Cornwall tho eh!!  Hope the move went ok!

xx

[annette.xx]

reading along...

Annette.xx

[~Emma~]

 My night went like this

 6.30pm - put D to bed, didn't settle until 7
 7.15pm - put B to bed
 7.15 - 8.15pm WI/WO with B
 9.30pm- I go to bed
 10pm - Dylan wakes
 10pm-2am - Dylan screams intermittently - fed at 12 in the hope
 5am - Dylan wakes
 6am - Brodie wakes ( good boy stayed in bed until 6.30)

 I cant go on like this. I really cant. I am tired beyond belief

[scucci1979]

OMG Emma! I am so sorry you are going through this. Do you suspect pain? Teeth or tummy pain? Is there any props used to get her to sleep? Is she crying like she doesn't want to go to sleep? More A needed? Trying to throw out some ideas here.  How are her day time naps? 

[~Emma~]

 I gave her meds at about 11pm. Not sure about the prop thing, 9 times out of 10 she has a feed and goes back to sleep. Sometimes she falls asleep in bed with me. She sleeps independantly for bedtime and naps.

 During the day I have been trialling short AM nap and long PM nap after thinking she really was a truly low sleep needs bub. It was going well. 45 mins in the morning and  couple of hours in the afternoon. A to bed really long though. Today I let her sleep for 1.5 hours in the AM as by now OT must be an issue with these horrendous nights. If I let her sleep in the AM she usually refuses PM nap altogether but lo and behold she has just fallen asleep for her PM nap now. I am speechless!

 Please keep your fingers crossed for an OK nap.

 I cant work out the cry. Its on and off but def not a mantra, if I leave her it escalates EVERY time into a hysterical cry. If I pick up she stops and screams as soon as I put down. I have been known to do PU/PD for over 3 hours to no avail. DH is back in a couple of days and going to tackle NW's. I'm thinking of quitting BF'ing too. Its just too easy in the MOTN.

 I  cant cope with NW. Dont mind feeding but its clearly not hunger and the milk she is having is totally throwing the day off. Its the length of them that gets me. I got angry last night, angry at my lovely baby. I shouted in anger and I feel so bad.
 

[scucci1979]

Sometimes she falls asleep in bed with me.

When she falls asleep with you, does she sleep longer? 
I co-slept with Alyssa for the first 5months. She too would sleep independently in her crib for nap and bt, but then when she woke up at night and I couldn't settle her, she I would bring her into my bed and let her sleep there.

I completely understand your frustration.  It is very normal to lash out when we are sleep deprived and have two los to take care of.    You can probably sense my desperation from my posts.  It is so much more difficult with two. 

If I pick up she stops and screams as soon as I put down

there must be some comfort thing going on here.   Alyssa does this too. PU/PD is not working for her. What if you rub her back as she is crying in the crib. 
Alyssa now, pulls herself up and it is such a fight to get her back down. Last night we had a 1hr nw and I finally caved and fed her.  We have this habitual thing going on here and I don't have the strength to fight it ATM as I do nights by myself. 

I def think she is OT.  I remember when I tried the short am and long pm nap for Madison, it got me in an OT mess.  I would let her catch up a little then reevaluate.
When she did a longer am nap, you say she fought her pm naps.  If you cap it to 1.5hrs, will she still fight it? Can you AP that nap, even if it is 30min and do an early bt? Just a thought.

I am hoping someone can point something out for you. 

[~Emma~]

 Thanks Sabrina honey.

 Well when she falls asleep in the bed its because I have fallen asleep and I generally just get up put her back in her cot. But she will fall straight asleep with me there in the bed with her. We dont do it often, only when I am truly knackered and cant stay awake even to feed her.

 Rubbing her back doesn't work either. nothing does. She gets herself in such a state. I know pu/pd would work eventually but she has far more stamina that I do atm. My longest pu/pd to record is four hours. Four long hours then she passed out. It must be a comfort thing for her. SHe is just so pully and grabby right now though. You know that scratchy hair pulling phase? Its so hard to comfort a baby thats scratching your eyeballs out. i wouldn't mind so much if she'd just snuggle up for a cuddle!

 So for this afternoon she slept 2 hours. That almost never happens. She's OT for sure and I think you are right, I need to re-evaluate this short AM malarkey. I think its more like her window for the PM nap is really small. Really teeny tiny. I always have capped the am nap to 1.5 hours when she was taking a longer one.

 I dont know. I think I might just have a good feeling about tonight, She's caught up today for sure so here's hoping.

 So is your habitual wake at exactly the same time every night?  Have you thought about w2s?(((hugs))) on the pulling up. I remember it well with B. Nightmare.

 

[scucci1979]

Wow! You have a little fighter on your hands when it comes to PU/PD.     She is going to be a leader when she gets older.

i hate that scratchy pulling phase.   

I would reevaluate that short am nap or you can let her catch up and then try again. 

How was your night?

I do think my waking is habitual. She is waking at 3am-30min give or take.  I didn't feed her last night and she settled quicker then normal, but woke up at 6am so I fed her there and she went back down.

[~Emma~]

 I would seriously consider w2s if I were you. I tried it myself for a habitual wake a few months back and I was amazed with the results. If you are getting up anyways honey you have nothing to lose but I do know how daunting it it.

 Sooooooo, yesterday she had 2 x long naps and then she STTN! Bed at 6.30pm and was awake at 5.30, I cant grumble at an 11 hour night. Didn't get her up until 6 when we started our day.

 This morning she pulled out a short am nap, 45 mins. Def not UT as A was huge from the 'EW.' She does do 45 min naps as OT as well though. Just put her down again and she's asleep and coming up for 1 sleep cycle. The day is a bit screwed as she wont take a nap later and wont be AP'd either.

 The STTN is a bit bittersweet really. Now I know that she will STTN when she naps good the pressure is on to get good naps. I need to work on the middle of the day A and get it spot on I think.

[scucci1979]

Those pesky ews. lets hope she takes a long pm nap. 
Tell me about the pressures to get good naps. 
let us know how today goes.

I will try W2S for the next three days.

[~Emma~]

I will try W2S for the next three days.

 Do ti honey. You have nothing to lose.

 Today was rubbish. She did nap for 1.5 this afternoon but that only took her to 1.20pm and ten she didn't sleep again. I put her to bed at 6. Fingers crossed.

[scucci1979]

fingers crossed. Alyssa was up for 4hrs this afternoon. She was playing in her cot and pulling herself up.  I think it may be teething.