Author Topic: PU/PD - 18mo... HELP  (Read 1578 times)

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Offline HLS

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PU/PD - 18mo... HELP
« on: May 11, 2011, 18:25:21 pm »
My dd has always been a fab sleeper, i've followed the EASY routine since birth and she is a text book baby.

Lately she has become clingy and for the second night in a row she is screaming bloody murder at bed time, she just doesn't want to go to bed.

I'm just (right now) starting PU/PD, well PD as she's standing in her cot! I've been going in every 3-5 minutes and laying her back down but she's in a dreadful state and hasn't stopped screaming now for over 20 minutes.  When i go in she is clinging to me so tightly and is so very upset, getting herself very hot and worked up. Am i doing the right thing?  It's breaking my heart but i know i need to nip this in the bud and take control  :'(

I have no idea what's wrong with her. She is cutting her final molars (she's very ahead with her teething) but she's fine until the moment i start taking her up to bed. I brought her down last night and she came to bed with me (i thought as she's always perfect at bed time something was genuinely wrong with her).  As she's doing it again now and has been fine all day i'm sure she's just being difficult.

Advice greatly and desperately welcomed...
« Last Edit: May 11, 2011, 18:27:47 pm by HLS »

Offline Lolly

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Re: PU/PD - 18mo... HELP
« Reply #1 on: May 11, 2011, 21:04:22 pm »
Are you giving her meds for the teeth just before bedtime? Can you post her routine, it could be that her sleep needs have changed a bit with her development and a bit of tweaking will get her back on track!

{{HUGS}} my toddler is giving us the run around at bedtime at the moment too - it's fun ::).

Laura


Offline ~inbalance~

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Re: PU/PD - 18mo... HELP
« Reply #2 on: May 12, 2011, 00:23:20 am »
Hi there!  I agree it will help to have a look at your routine and see if there is anything going on.

I do think that 18mos is a big time for sleep regression.  There is a support thread if you want to have a look:
http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=176250.0

A lot of LOs will experience sleep disruption around birthdays and half-birthdays that coincide with leaps in development.  Things like that, as well as teeth, do play a part.

I would actually avoid doing PD with her at this age.  If she has slept well in the past, you can take more of a walk in walk out approach which might be a little more age appropriate.  It is along the lines of what you are doing, but without actually putting her back down again.

Of course if she is teething you will want to address that first because it is a genuine reason and she's in discomfort.  2yr molars though, wow!  At least you know it is the home stretch for teething for you!  ;)
Em
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Offline brenda2

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Re: PU/PD - 18mo... HELP
« Reply #3 on: May 12, 2011, 03:29:28 am »
hi
i would stick with wiwo as well, however if she is full on crying then you shouldn't be leaving her for 3-5 minutes before you go in.  i wonder if she is experiencing some SA when you leave her that long and getting even more worked up?  you need to go in right away when she is crying her "i need you cry", comfort her, talk to her tell her sleepy time and then you can walk out. pause and listen to her cry.  if she is still crying go right back in and repeat.
   

   


Offline HLS

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Re: PU/PD - 18mo... HELP
« Reply #4 on: May 12, 2011, 10:26:46 am »
Well... her routine is:

7am - Wake up
7.30am - Breakfast
12noon - Lunch
1pm - 2pm (ish) - Nap
5pm - Dinner
6.00pm - Bath
6.30pm - 7pm - Bedtime CBeebies
7pm - Bed

The teething pain isn't the issue here. I think the upset is separation and not wanting to go to bed.  I waited 3 mins a time last night night, laid her down, didn't speak... she finally went to sleep within 40 mins.  She was stressed and upset but she was the night before and as soon as i brought her downstairs she was playing and fine.  This is how i know she's really ok.  It's horrible and i'm dreading tonight - any further advice now you know my routine?

Offline ~inbalance~

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Re: PU/PD - 18mo... HELP
« Reply #5 on: May 12, 2011, 12:44:16 pm »
The only thing I can see is that her nap is a little on the short side, so maybe she is OT at bedtime.  Has she always only napped for an hour?  If you think she is OT then I would try putting her to bed a little earlier.

Don't discount the teeth, if she is teething they are probably playing some kind of role at least.  Teething tends to make separation anxiety worse.

Again I think you have the right idea as she did settled, but if she is sounding really distressed I think you should be returning within 3mins and not waiting otherwise it could be CC which is what you are trying to avoid.  It's important to know her cries.

I agree that it doesn sound like a separation anxiety issue, in which case it is even more important to return promptly and not break her trust.  Hang in there!  :)
Em
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Offline HLS

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Re: PU/PD - 18mo... HELP
« Reply #6 on: May 12, 2011, 15:46:18 pm »
Her nap can be as much as 2 hours but usually averages to 1 - 1.5hrs. She goes to Nursery you see, she naps better at home with her blackout blinds...

She has generally become more clingy, i think she has become more understanding that mummy goes to work and she goes to Nursery... also i've had a couple of weeks off where we were together 24/7, so that prob doesn't help either.

I will wait only 3 minutes between visits from now on. I don't like the idea of wi/wo because i feel it is teasing her and would rather lay her down myself. 

Offline HLS

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Re: PU/PD - 18mo... HELP
« Reply #7 on: May 12, 2011, 18:19:25 pm »
I put my dd down kicking and screaming at 7pm and she has gone straight down :-)  She must have realised i wasn't going to bring her back down so she may as well have gone to bed!!

She napped for 1.5hr today, not sure it's that she's not getting enough sleep as she has always been amazing going to bed and her sleeping pattern hasn't changed.  Fingers crossed it was a temporary blip... Thanks for all your help and support!! :-) Hx

Offline *Ali*

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Re: PU/PD - 18mo... HELP
« Reply #8 on: May 12, 2011, 22:41:05 pm »
I will wait only 3 minutes between visits from now on. I don't like the idea of wi/wo because i feel it is teasing her and would rather lay her down myself.
3 minutes must feel like a very long time for an LO to be crying and wondering why mummy isn't coming back in. This is really controlled crying if you are going by the clock and not responding based on her cries. I am sure you want her to be going to bed knowing mummy comes when she needs you rather than just giving up that will come back anytime soon so I think it is important that you forget the clock and just go by her cues.
I agree it probably was SA due to spending so long at home with you and then having to go back to nursery while you go to work. She probably just needs a bit of reassurance that you are still there for her.
She may not be crying just because of the pain of the teething but it can make them pretty miserable and they don't understand why. I hear the molars are some of the worst so I would definitely medicate if you think she is in any discomfort at all from the teeth.
I thought it might be useful if she needs your help at BT again for me to share a modified WIWO that I do with my DS when he is OT or upset at BT. I put DS in his cot as usual, say our sleepy phrase and leave the room. If he stands up and cries I return immediately. I lay him back down and say "It's sleepy time honey, lie down and go to sleep" in a kind, reassuring voice and then I leave the room. If he is still upset, I wait until he stands up again and go back in immediately. This might only be as long as it takes him to stand up, so about 20 seconds perhaps. I repeat laying him down and saying the sleepy phrase and then I leave again. I do this as many times as I have to until he doesn't stand up again and this normally means he stops crying as well. He might still be fussing/moaning a little but it's not a proper, upset cry. If however he seems to be getting more upset then once I have laid him down I will rub his belly a little and say a few kind words to help soothe him. Normally that will help to calm him within seconds and then I leave again. Sometimes now he is used to this method it only takes me going back in once for him to realise I am there and there is no point in keep standing up crying. Sometimes now he will even lie back down when I go back in the room so I just say the sleepy phrase and leave.
The other thing I wanted to suggest is don't be afraid to do a slightly earlier BT on the days she naps badly at nursery to help avoid the OT.
HTH
Ali
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Offline brenda2

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Re: PU/PD - 18mo... HELP
« Reply #9 on: May 13, 2011, 00:05:48 am »
I will wait only 3 minutes between visits from now on. I don't like the idea of wi/wo because i feel it is teasing her and would rather lay her down myself.
3 minutes must feel like a very long time for an LO to be crying and wondering why mummy isn't coming back in. This is really controlled crying if you are going by the clock and not responding based on her cries. I am sure you want her to be going to bed knowing mummy comes when she needs you rather than just giving up that will come back anytime soon so I think it is important that you forget the clock and just go by her cues.
I agree it probably was SA due to spending so long at home with you and then having to go back to nursery while you go to work. She probably just needs a bit of reassurance that you are still there for her.

i agree.  waiting 3 min regardless of type of cry to go back in is called controlled crying.  it is not BW.  BW technique would be to listen to the type of cry and go in based on that.  if she is mantra, whining, fussing etc then leave her alone regardless of how long but if she is really screaming then go in immediately even if you just left the room and comfort her by doing PD or just wiwo.  this reassures them that you are there if they need you.

i also agree that if her nap is only 1 hour that you should try an earlier bedtime.