10 mo am nap refusal - what approach to take?

[cath~]

Hi,

My spirited LO has just turned 10 months and has, for the last few days, been 'refusing' her am nap (i.e. screaming and screaming when we try to put her down), even when she has been showing tired signs for it (rubbing eyes, but not every day).  However, if we APOP by taking her out for a walk in her buggy then she will nod off for this nap quite happily.

Her A time (after a 'good' nap or before 1st nap of day) is around 3h30-3h45 at the moment, although she can last to around 4hr, especially if we APOP the next nap by taking her for a walk.  Her last A time of the day, before bedtime, is around 4hr-4hr15 usually and she falls asleep quickly and easily, STTN for around 11-11.5hrs (unless OT, then can be just 10-10.5hrs, but we can usually sort this the next day with an early BT).

I've read the link on 10-11 mo sleep gone wonky and wonder if I should start the 2-1 transition by pushing back the am nap, in 15 min increments, so she is tired enough to want it?  If I do this, should I also cap it so she'll still have a pm nap? Or should I let her sleep as long as she can/wants?  Also, since she is only just 10 months (yesterday!), how fast should I take things?  A 5hr A time sounds like it would be way to much for her at the moment..

Any advice/suggestions appreciated!

Thanks,

Catherine

PS Perhaps I should add that she's never been a 'brilliant' napper.  The norm (before this am nap refusal) was a good am nap, which she went down quite happily for, and a short pm nap.  However, we could hardly ever seem to get 2 good naps a day (without taking her out for a walk/drive for the second one), even though I tried all different A times to see if short pm nap was due to OT or UT.

[cath~]

Just wanted to add that once she does eventually fall asleep for her am nap (after 15-20 mins of protest!!), she usually sleeps for around 1hr15 (a 'good' nap for her - I could probably count on one hand the number of times she's napped for more than 1hr30), so I think she's not (too) UT for it..

[Shiv52]

Bumping up for you x

[*Amy*]

No help but just posted in the birth club boards that my dd is now refusing both am and pm nap ! She will also go to sleep with a little APOP! So following along to see what advice you get....my dd is doing the exact same a times as yours!

[cath~]

Thanks Shiv.

Amy - nice to know we're in the same boat!  Although it's a frustrating one isn't it?  Think I'm going to try increasing her awake time by 15 mins and see if that helps...  We were visiting familiy today so both naps in the car so will have to wait til tomorrow to see if this helps.

[cath~]

Just thought I'd post an update, plus a few more questions if anyone is following along...

So, she's 'refusing' her naps slightly less now.  Still a bit noisy but generally asleep within 5 mins of putting her in her cot, although she doesn't fall asleep independently (I sing a lullaby and have a hand on her, sometimes patting).  Her first A time has been around 3hr45 - so not really extended, but she has been waking early but then resettling after about 30 mins for another 30 mins or so in the mornings, so it's not an A time after a full undisturbed night's sleep IFSWIM.

However, we've had some really early wakings the last couple of days (around 4.30, but today was slightly better) - although she has eventually gone back to sleep, although two days ago I took her out for a walk in teh buggy at 5.30 am as she couldn't fall back to sleep and I was so desperate not to have to 'start' the day at 4.30.

I think we are transitioning to 1 nap and I had decided to go for the late, long am nap, and short pm nap.  But this obviously only works provided she gets a good am nap.

Here's what happened yesterday:

7.10 awake (but was awake for 30-45 mins at around 4.30, after 9hrs of sleep - cried quite a lot before falling back to sleep, with our help)
11.00 nap - 2 hours (this was incredible!  she has hardly ever napped this long!)
13.00 awake
16.50 nap - 20-25 mins (APOP in buggy, to get her to last until bedtime)
19.15 asleep

And today:
5.30 awake, then dozed on and off (I was sitting with her) until 6.30
9.40 nap - 1hr10 (woke on her own)
10.50 awake
14.15 nap - 1hr20
15.35 awake - just now!

I will aim for 1900-1915 bedtime.

I guess my questions are:

1.  Should I keep trying to push back the am nap and let it be as long as possible, and then have a short pm nap?
2.  If she has a 'long' am nap (i.e. 1hr30 or more), how long should the pm (cat)nap be, and how late is too late (although I'm not sure she'd take it if I tried it too early) - or should I let her have a late pm catnap and slightly later bedtime (would/could this help the EW?)?
3.  If she has a 'short' am nap (1hr15 or less), how long should I let her nap in the pm?
4.  Should I cap her daytime sleep at 2hr30 or less/more?  Would this help her get more nighttime sleep and avoid the EWs?

Thanks for any help!

Catherine

[scucci1979]

My little Alyssa is spirited when it comes to sleep and she too will refuse her am nap. I think she started refusing at 10months, so I took the long am/short pm route. For a while, I would let her sleep as long as she wanted in the am and do a 30min pm cn. When she began to fight the cn I would cut her am nap to 1.5hours and fit in an AP cn for 20min.  For now, I would stick with a 30min Cn and see how that goes.
I had to and still do sometimes extend her am nap.

I would stick with an ideal wu time so if she wakes early and you want 7am to be her wu time then count A time from at least 6:30am YKWIM.  When DD2 wakes early, I stay in her room and don't start her day until 6:30am. Ideally, I want a 7am wu time and I think that will only happen when the one nap is established. 

When we get a short am nap, anything over one hour, I let her sleep a max of 30min in the pm and move bt early.

Trying to figure out how much day sleep they need is very hard. I am still trying to figure that out. DD1 was a fantastic sleeper and loved her naps but DD2 is another story.

[cath~]

Hi Sabs

Thanks very much for your reply.  Yes, I will limit her pm catnat to 30 mins.  I was letting her sleep longer in pm if am nap not so long/early, but will try early BT instead and see what happens..  I guess I'm a bit concerned about that leading to EW (or early for me!) if she's going to bed early, but we'll see.

Your point about working out an 'ideal' wakeup and, even if she gets up early, not counting the day as having actually started until no more than 30 mins before that 'ideal' wakeup is a good one.  However, I'm not quite sure what our ideal wakeup is.  The longest solid night she has done since not feeding at night (i.e. since 7 months) is 11.25 hours (the night has lasted longer when she's been teething cos has been up during the night), so do you think I should count my ideal wakeup time as 11.25 hours after bedtime?  i.e. if bedtime is 19.00, then ideal wakeup is 6.15?  Or should I be aiming for a 12 hour night?

Yes, I've a feeling that with DD I'll never know exactly what her sleep needs really are (they seem to change on a daily basis) but I hope that we will somehow muddle through these napping years as painlessly as possible..

Thanks very much for your advice.

Catherine

[scucci1979]

11hr nights are great. If you are putting her to bed at 7pm then a 6-6:30am wu time is ideal. If you want a 7am wu time, we have to shift bedtime later.  Does that help?

[cath~]

Thanks - yes I thought 11hr nights were pretty good!  (although quite often we only get 10 or 10.5 hrs).  Will keep bedtime at 7pm and aim for 6am wu.  I'm going back to work in a month and a 6am wu will probably work best for us here.

thanks again