Molars or something else? Going insane!!!

[Boobop]

My 21-month old is getting her last set of teeth but I'm not sure if that's what's contributing to her sleep difficulties or if she needs a schedule adjustment. She's never been a good sleeper but was taking her 2-hour nap daily without much difficulty (well, she needs me to rock her or rub her back to get to sleep). She's also been quite cranky and clingy and cries much more. Anyone else have a problem with these teeth?

[FroggyMom]

Could you post her current routine (wake-up, eat, naps, etc.) so we could take a look at it?

Teething can disrupt sleep.  Are you giving her any meds for this?

Also, has she ever been an independent sleeper, or has she always needed you to help her fall asleep?

[Boobop]

She's always been a terrible sleeper and we've been through pretty much everything at this point. In her early months, I rocked her and cuddled her to sleep and before long we began co-sleeping..it was the ONLY way we could get some sleep. I tried BW PU/PD when she was about 7/8 months old and after a couple of months and being exhausted, I went back to co-sleeping. Since moving into our house in July, she went from staying in her crib all night (but not sleeping through the night), to getting in bed with us in the middle of the night. I let her cry at one point because I was just losing patience and it seemed to work fine but then she had to stay at my mother's house a few nights and she got messed up all over again. So, we're back to her needing my touch to get to sleep in her crib and then joining us in the middle of the night. She cries like a maniac...when she wakes, if I leave her, if I stop touching her.
Her routine is usually
wake at 7:00am
breakfast at about 8:00 or so
She used to nap at about 11/11:30 but not really anymore
Lunch at 12
Nap now starts around 1
Wake at 3
Bath at 8
Sleep by 9 (if I'm lucky)

She's always been very low sleep needs. She dropped her second nap when she was 13 months old.

[FroggyMom]

My DS is now 22 months old, and we went through a situation that sounds a lot like yours when he was about 13 months old.  Before that time, he was never an independent sleeper.  In the early days, he slept in his swing.  Then, we started rocking him to sleep and lying him in his crib once he was already asleep.  When he was about 13 months old, he began sleeping terribly and waking up almost every hour at night.  That is when I discovered this site and received a lot of great advice from the people on here. 

I did gradual withdrawal (GW) sleep training.  I know you said you have tried PU/PD, but have you given GW a chance?  BW does not promote the CIO method and feels you lose some trust with your LO when you do this.  (I too tried it before I found BW, and it did not work.  As you said it worked for a little while, but then when she got out of her routine, her sleep was messed up again.  Not a long-term solution).  GW is usually a good sleep training method with LO's who have never been independent sleepers. 

If you are interested in GW, you start out next to your LO and eventually move farther and farther away until you are out of the room.  For instance, I slept on an air mattress next to DS and held his hand/rubbed his back until he fell asleep at first.  Then, I moved to the other side of the air mattress and did not touch him but only talked to him while he fell asleep.  Then, I moved to sitting in a chair by the door and talking to him.  Finally, I moved the chair outside the door out of sight, but he could still hear my voice.  This method was very successful for us, and he now sttn in his toddler bed with no problems!

All of that being said, teething can definitely disrupt sleep in LO's, so that may be at the root of what is currently going on with her.  If so, I would suggest waiting until the teeth come through before you try any sleep training (if that is even what you would like to do....it just worked for us and stopped DS's night wakings.)

Good luck! 

[Boobop]

I like the idea of GW but tried it before and it didn't quite work totally. It got to the point that she didn't need my touch but I was sleeping on a cot beside her crib but that's as far as we got. She wakes frequently at night, so what should I do when that happens if I'm in another room? Once teething is over (it's so hard to tell with her!), I guess I'll start with sleeping next to her crib and gradually moving away. But what happens when she wakes and screams bloody murder? Do I just lay there and ignore her? How long should I do all of this?
On another note, why did you move to a toddler bed so early?

Thanks for your help!

[FroggyMom]

When you tried GW, how long did you spend at each stage?  For some LO's, I think you can move through the stages quicker; however, I knew DS's need to be rocked to sleep was totally our fault, and I choose a slower approach with him.  My goal was to spend 1-2 weeks at each stage.  However, due to circumstances such as having to go out-of-town for about a month, it took us about 3-4 months to totally move from rocking him to sleep to lying DS down in his crib after BT routine and just walking out, shutting door.  

I slept on an air mattress beside DS's crib for probably WAY too long!  But, if he woke up at night, I was there to help him back to sleep at whatever level we were on (i.e.  pat to sleep, saying our "sleep phrase," etc.). By the time I was totally out of the room, DS's night wakings had been eliminated.  So, I do not have any experience with NW's once sleeping in another room.  However, if you are in another room, I would not let her CIO as this may cause her to lose some of her trust.  (okay to let her cry if you are in same room and using rubbing or talking to comfort her though).  So, perhaps you could go to her and rub her back, use "sleepy phrase," etc. to see if she will lie right back down.  

Hopefully, someone with a little more experience in that area will come along with some more advice for you!

I do have a couple more questions for you:  Do you have a key sleepy phrase that you consistently use all of the time?  Does your LO have a lovey that she sleeps with?

We felt we had no choice but to move DS to a toddler bed at about 20 months because he climbed out of his crib!!!  I had totally planned on leaving him in his crib for as long as I could (over 2 years old).  However, once he learned to climb out, he did it consistently, and we were afraid of him injuring himself.  Much to my surprise, DS did WONDERFUL with transitioning to a BBB.  I thought we were in for weeks of sleepless nights and GW training all over again, but it only took him a few nights to learn to sleep in his BBB.  Now, after his BT routine, he climbs right in his bed himself and lies down....sttn in his bed...and sits up in bed (but stays IN the bed) and waits for me to come in and get him in the morning!  I have a baby gate right outside his door just for my peace of mind as well.

How is teething going?

[FroggyMom]

Just bumping up for you....hopefully you can get some fresh eyes on this!

[Boobop]

Hi! I'm not sure what's going on anymore! My child hates sleep, that's for sure. When she wakes up she has a full-on meltdown, crying like she's been abandoned. She's always been this way. Today, for the first time ever, she refused to nap. I tried everything! Rocking, patting, singing, etc. but she would not go to sleep. She's asleep for now but who knows what the night will bring. This is what confuses me with teething. It's always been difficult to tell if she's teething or not because she doesn't really show the usual symptoms. I can see one of her back molars that has just come through and it seems like it came in really fast but I have no idea if it's actually bothering her. And even if I medicate, she still wakes.
Previous attempts with GW wasn't as smooth as it seems people talk about on BW. I don't usually use a sleepy phrase because it seems it just makes her more annoyed! She has several stuffed toys that she sleeps with but there isn't a real attachment. Her main attachment is me! I think I'll wait a week or so to make sure the molars are done and start from scratch, whatever that may be. I guess I'll have to get an air mattress to start because she does get in our bed every night which I wouldn't mind but it seems it's getting earlier all the time.
That's all I can tell you, I think!