Good nap in morning, afternoon falls apart!

[Glitter2707]

Hi all, I'm after some advice - my four and a half month old is doing well with sleeping at night (7-7 with 10.30 dream feed) but is always crying and overtired in the evening due to her afternoon naps.

She goes back to sleep about 1.5hrs after waking up & sleeps for 2 hours, usually I have to wake her up.
After that it all goes wrong... I try & put her down again around 2hrs later or when she shows tired signs - she goes down ok but only ever sleeps for 30-40 mins - wakes up crying & will not go back to sleep. So then we try again, usually about 1-1.5hr later, same thing - goes down ok but 30-40,ins & wakes up crying. She is definitely then overtired & struggles until bedtime, when she goes down fine and stays asleep.

Can someone offer any suggestions? Should I try decreasing length of morning nap? Decreasing A time after morning nap? I feel if I can fix this we will be in a really good place!

[Glitter2707]

Or maybe she is under tired for 2nd nap? She does seem tired & wakes up crying though... Aah it would be so much easier if they could talk!! 
Will maybe just have to play around with A time after morning nap...

[katie80]

Hi there, have you found anything with your tweaking?

I was wondering if you might also gently push that first morning A time. 1.5hr is on the shorter side for 4.5mo (maybe she is still tired from the lack of sleep in the afternoon the day before, but she does a great night ... it's like she's tacking on to her night). But, if you push that one and still get a good nap, then you can maybe more easily push the second one as well (or you may not need to change that one as shes had more A time in the beginning).

[Martini~]

I would have couple of thoughts, totally different so try to assess which one is more about your DD:
- have you considered her being HSN (high sleep needs)? I guess there are not many children who do 7-7 so 12h nights without a peep; if she is a HSN maybe her A will be lower than average and 2h is too much for her; have you tried putting her down earlier so let say after 1,5h A? She gives you good nap after that so I would try
- maybe she only looks like HSN and sleeps so good at night and has a good nap because of low sleep in the afternoon; even if that's the story I would try solution above to catch up on OT for couple of days and than keep an eye on her and after couple of days on good naps, she maybe ready to lengthen her A time
- my last idea and also recommended only if above solutions are not working would be to cap her morning nap at 45min mark and hope for a good noon nap; you may end with an extremely overtired baby but I remember when mine was having long nap in the morning (1,5-2h), he refused to lenghten second one to more than 45min; and if she is able to do only one long nap during the day, it should definitely be the middle one with catnap before and after to prevent OT

[Glitter2707]

Thanks for replies, very much appreciated!
I think she is definitely HSN - my mum tells me I was the same as a baby!

So it seems putting her down after 1.5hrs (so she is asleep by around 1h 40/45) does the trick - she has done a few days of 2 x 1.5-2hr naps and 40 min catnap. She loves her sleep! Luckily for me even if she is overtired during the day it doesn't affect her night sleep (just takes longer to settle initially).

I may try pushing morning A time slightly - although she literally just falls asleep where she is (playmat, bouncer, propped up on sofa...) once she has had enough!

[Glitter2707]

So this is what we had yesterday:
7am wake up & feed
A until
8.30 settling, 8.40 sleep

10.45 wake up
11 feed
A until
12.15 settling, 12.30 sleep

2.30 wake up
3pm feed
A until
4.15 settling, 4.30 sleep

5.15 wake up
A until bedtime routine
7pm bed

Is she sleeping TOO much?!!! She was a happy baby though so that's what counts!!

[katie80]

I don't think so. She's still within the norm for her age. If it starts affecting her nights (i.e. long, chatty wake-ups) or she starts waking earlier and earlier, you'll know she's getting too much. And if her naps start shortening, she may have caught up from built up OT (as Marta said) and then you can gently push the A times out. Sounds like you've got her figured out!

[Martini~]

LOL! I would dream about baby who sleeps too much:).

But being serious, don’t worry about the amount of sleep but just observe your baby. If her naps after 1:30-1:45 A time start to shorten, you may think about pushing her A further (starting from the first A), but I wouldn’t be proactive. The same with nights: until she sleeps through, has no cot parties or extremely morning wakups, I would let her sleep as much as she wants/needs.

I read somewhere that good sleep is in fact one of the best gift you can give to your child, as his/her brain is developing the best when sleeping. Don’t know if that’s true, but I believe it:)!