At a total loss

[brummum]

Yes, I appreciate the irony... A sleep mod who has absolutely no idea what's going on with my little ones sleep! This will be long and rambling so I apologise. Little one has been EW the last week or so. I am convinced he's overtired but he is doing a really good impression of not being! He's teething canines having reflux flare up as a result and ima going to try him with infant gaviscon to see if this helps. Sleep meds in early hours are a no no as cant get them in him without waking. He's probably still in 18 month sleep regression to just to make things worse. So anyway he should be OT because he has been short napping for a while. Over an hour is rare. He was napping at 12 when wake ups were 6:30 ish (usual on the earlier side not later) with a 7 bedtime and no bedtime resistance. Then he started short napping sp pushed it back to half past.. Didn't help... Same nap lengths. Always wakes up happy. Then the EW started at about 5 half 5. Initailly could resettle with a fresh blankie and lying him down. Then progressed to EW happy and wanting to play with no chance of resettle. The last few mornings I have had to do WIWO to tell him to lie down as do not want to turn light on and get up for the day before half 6 to not reinforce EW but he will not go back to sleep for love nor money. Now if it wasn't for the short napping (sometimes as little as 30mins with grand parents and nursery days) I would totally be saying UT from his behaviour and capping the nap but there's nothing really to cap and there's no way a 19 month old would be UT on those naps right?! also we have had a good few sleep throughs with the EW and previously if ot we get a few pre midnight upset night wakings. have tried early bedtime which only brought the wake up early (he has never really tacked apart from when he transistion to one nap and then only briefly. I have tried squeezing in cat nap which only grout bedtime resistance. The only thing I haven't tried is pushing nap to 1pm and that's because it's practically impossible with the early wake up. Easy for yesterday for what it's worth was.

W 5:30
Nap 11:15 -12:15 (passed out in trike but managed to transfer to cot at home)
Bedtime: 6:30

Wake up this morning 5:15

I have had to put him down at 10 for nap and there was no resistance. I'm jus lost.. Completely clueless! Any fresh eyes? Am I not seeing the wood for the trees here?? Help!

[brummum]

So the intention eas to cap this nap t 20mins and put him down for his proper nap early afternoon but just couldn't bring myself to do it and now he is going on for 2 hrs and I have no idea how to play the rest of the day. Sigh.

[jessmum46]

I would let him sleep as long as he needs today. I agree he sounds OT and hyper, not UT.  J gets like this and then it all comes crashing down one day . Just let him sleep, then I would probably offer an EBT too as normal 7pm BT is likely to cause OT from too long a day.  When we get into this sort of a mess (as you know with a LO at nursery it happens fairly often) then I usually do a day of nap when it's needed as you've done today, then try to get back to normal naptime but stick with BT on the earlier side until I'm sure she's caught up.  It usually takes a few days here before we get back on track, longer if teeth are in the mix.  I find teeth increase J's sleep needs, more than I expect, and just wondering if that's what's thrown everything off for you too?

[brummum]

What time do you think Katherine? 6? I'm just worried cuz it's nursery tomorrow and it he doesn't tack then he's not getting a nap til 12:30 tomorrow and they will have a very unhappy bunny on their hands and I will be worrying about him all day. Eugh.

[jessmum46]

What did you do?  I would have gone for it at 6/6.15 I think.  I hate sending J to nursery when she's had an EW too but I actually find she copes better there with loads of distraction than she does at home with just me.  It's hard not to let the sleep thing go when so much of it is out of our hands, I totally understand

[brummum]

He was in bed for 6 in the end but resisted going to sleep (really? after a 6hr very active a time?!) until 6:30. Fingers crossed for a decent wake up tomorrow. His top 2 canines are out now and I can see the bottom 2 just below the surface. I think its really me that's the problem. I just don't do 'flying by the seat of my pants' very well. I like predictability and routine and knowing what the day has in store..... and then came little man and he obviously hadn't been briefed appropriately! Do you think aim for a 1pm ish naptime if we get a reasonable wake up (for him this is anywhere between 6:00 - 6:30 sometimes a fraction later) or stick with 12 that we were doing before all this hit? is the advice just stick with your routine through the regression and it will settle back down?

[Emami]

I would go with 12, it's still a decent amount of morning A time, and if it's a fun teeth / 18 month regression combination it should settle down.  I've had a few times with dd acting UT like you say and I've been on the verge of tweaking things, but I agree with Katherine that OT can look a lot like UT as they get older.  When whatever's bothering DD has passed she will go right back to her old routine.  Then when she actually does need a routine change I find it's more obvious because I know she's not OT. If I have any doubt whether it's OT or UT I tend to be cautious and stick to what I know!  It's generally worked well so far
Hope he gives you a good night and is refreshed and ready for nursery tomorrow

[brummum]

Thanks both. He woke at 3 (yikes!) and I have been up and down like a yoyo with WIWO since then. Although I'm pretty sure he fell back to sleep for a little around 5 and then final wake up was 6. Its quarter past and I'm lying here listening to him chat to himself. Going to be a long day for both of us. *sigh*. I have absolutely no idea what to do with this cheeky little  monkey.

[jessmum46]

Ugh, that's a horrid time of the morning . Does WIWO usually work well for you?  Just wondering if you had any 'cheat' solutions that would get him off to sleep quicker as an exception if you think OT is an issue?  Also I may have missed it but are you medicating for teeth?  Unsettledness from 3/4am onwards often is related to discomfort here.

[brummum]

No apop cheats unfortunately! If it is an upset wake up usually a fresh blankie (he chews them!) and laying back down will do but if its a happy wake up its a case of WIWO or if I'm really tired just lying on the floor next to his cot with my hand through the bars, but it doesn't send him back to sleep any quicker it just stops him getting increasingly frustrated and shouting at me. I have been giving meds at bedtime if he looks like he needs them but I can't do dream meds in early hours because it wakes him and when i have done it at the early wake up it hasnt made a difference, he still doesn't go back to sleep. Oh Katherine can't you just wave a magic wand or something?! Please?!

[Emami]

Ugh, that's rough Mine used to respond to rocking but these days is pretty much un-APOPable, and I've spent those frustrating hours on the floor. I know this is no help at all, but for us it's always been a case of just waiting it out and it goes back to normal.  It seems like forever when you're in the middle of it though

[jessmum46]

Oh Katherine can't you just wave a magic wand or something?! Please?!

Hang on a minute, let me check my bag........no, just as I thought, right out of magic wands today Though you'll be first to know when the new order arrives!

[brummum]

Seeings as Katherine has failed me in the magic wand department I think youre right and I'm just gonna have to ride it out. Thank you for your short ladies x