Maybe it's time for a change? 14mo.

[CattyPads]

Hi everyone

It's been a while, with all your help I managed to get a great routine going, but I think a time for change is approaching....but I am not quite sure how to go about it. I have a 14mo boy, and this is our EASY,

Wake up 08:00
E 9
S 11:45 - 1 hr 30mins
E 13:30
S 17:15 1/1:30 hrs
E 18:30
E21:15
S 21:30

So basically the issue is, he usually goes down v easy for his first nap, and sometimes I even have to wake him up. The second one he has started to fuss lately (even though he seems tired and rubs his eyes before I put him down) and his BT is a tad late but as he has napped until 18:30 then otherwise it would be too early?

I don't know if his second nap fussiness means he is ready to move on to one nap but he looks tired before both naps    And, his bedtime is a bit late cause of the naps but I am not sure I could fit it all in otherwise?  Could he reaaaaaally need his first nap cause he goes to bed late? I sense I need to make changes but I am not sure how to go about it.

Forgot to add, if I wake him from a nap to cap it he gets veeeeeeery angry  if he wakes by himself he is a happy baby!

Thank you so much for reading! 

[Buntybear]

Hi, So his last nap can be 1.5 hours?? I would be looking to cap that now to get a better BT. Even before 1 Olly was down to a 30 min CN (which I had to APOP ) to get him to BT. x

[CattyPads]

Thank you. So you think all that needs tweaking is the second nap? Is the first one ok?
And what sort of time would you suggest for his BT? And would that mean an earlier waking?

Oh and as I said earlier, if I wake him from a nap he gets suuuuuper cranky 

Ps sorry for the million questions!

[Haribo2012]

I agree that 2nd nap could be a lot shorter, long am nap and CN in car/stroller for 2nd one. By this age we were down to 1 nap.
If you want to keep the WU time the same you will prob have a 13 hour day on 2 naps but when you go to 1 nap you may have to bring BT earlier.

If prob try WU 8
Nap 12 for 1.5/2 hours
CN 5pm for 30 mins
BT 8.30

My DS is cranky if I wake him too but we just have a drink and cuddle or look out the window until he cheers up x

[Buntybear]

Agree with Zoe, at this age we had a 13 hour day and 11 hour night x

[CattyPads]

Thank you very much, I appreciate your replies!

One question, is there any way we can switch the naps you suggested and have the longer nap second? It would be easier to fit it with everything else. If so, what EAS routine do you suggest?

Thanks again  you don't realise how much your help means!!

[Buntybear]

Yes I know some mums do this. I am not sure how though! Have you looked at the support thread for dropping to 1 nap? That might help.

[Haribo2012]

I know some that do it too but I could never get a predictable long 2nd nap but think they generally do CN about 9 for 30mins then pm nap 1pm ish, but defo check out the support threads Support Thread for 2-1 Nap Transition cont'd pt 6

[Emami]

I know some that do it too but I could never get a predictable long 2nd nap but think they generally do CN about 9 for 30mins then pm nap 1pm ish

Yep, short am long pm nap worked here.  If I let DD have a long morning nap I could never guarantee that she would go down in the afternoon, whereas by keeping the am nap short she was always tired enough but not OT.  So you could keep you first nap at 11:45 but rather than let him sleep the full 1.5hrs you wake him.  Since he is not used to a capped nap it might be best to try 45mins at first, but mine could last a full A time on a 45min nap so I cut it to 30mins.  Whatever works for your LO!  Then because the first nap is short he should be ready for the second one earlier, so you pull it right forward, let him sleep, but then he still has a decent amount if time to get tired again before bed.  So something like:
WU 8am
Nap 1 11:45-12:15
Nap 2 2:45-4:15
Bed 8:30/9

If he is really grumpy on being woken, you could try the first nap earlier so that he goes down UT and wakes naturally himself after a shorter sleep.  I could never do that though as my DD would just mess around if she was UT, but if he'll sleep at 11:15 or 11:30ish you might get that short nap without the cranks!

[CattyPads]

Thanks, working my way through that thread 

Hey emami, I remember you, you helped me lots when my lo was smaller   

Thanks, that gives me hope. It seems like I need a change NOW, he is starting to refuse his second nap and having veeeeery long second A times! And a very tired baby!

Quick question regarding your suggested routine, isn't the second A time very short, about 2,5 hrs? I worry that wouldn't go down too well? Currently his first A is 3,5 hrs and the second about 4 hrs.

Oh, and, he has been struggling to go down at night, and waking up slightly earlier, could that be OT? I am so frustrated that everything has gone wrong 

[Emami]

Yep, 2nd A time is short but it's because it's on the back of a 30min nap.  The morning nap is just enough to get through to the 'real' nap, because once you're done with the 2-1 transition that pm nap is going to be the one nap.  Some people find they reduce it to 20mins, 15mins, even a 10min micro-nap before it disappears completely and you're left with the one long one, so the A time is short because the first nap isn't restorative.  Personally I never went below 30mins and did a mix of one and two nap days until the transition was done.

Also yes, the BT troubles and EWs could definitely be OT if he is skipping his second nap and having a long long afternoon until bed.  I think it's pretty much impossible to completely avoid OT when their routines are changing though.  I remember having some rough nights with DD during the 2-1 too, and it was really tempting to compensate with a long morning nap but then she wouldn't go down in the afternoon and it made everything worse.  I really hated waking her after 30mins but it was what worked best for getting the most amount of sleep, and distributing it in the best way throughout the day.  Hope it gets better for you soon - and once he is properly on one nap it is so freeing in terms of going out, but you still get a nice break in the middle of the day!

[CattyPads]

Thank you so much.
I wanted to try it out before getting back to you.
I have been capping the first nap to 1hr and now he is sleeping in the afternoon again, but he is sleeping late (5pm-6:30pm) then he won't sleep until 10pm  even though I put him down at 9:30pm.

So I am slowly going to cap that morning nap shorter and shorter to your suggested half hour so his second nap can be at 3ish, for say, one and a half hours? Is that enough sleep in the day?
And therefore an earlier BT. - will his WU time remain the same you think?

He is soooo clingy and fussy at the moment and I can't help but wonder if it's due to his routine  he is also growing teeth all over the place, and has a bit of a poorly tummy so it's hard to pinpoint!

[Buntybear]

Hi how are things now?

[CattyPads]

Thanks for asking.

Well there have been some changes and I am not sure if it's right,what do you think:

Since I started capping the first nap, eventually he started waking up later and later in the morning. I am not sure if I am doing the right thing but I figured he was tired and let him sleep, so he has been waking up close to 9:45/10am everyday  so then he naps at 3ish for anything between 1:40-2:30 hrs, then to bed at 9:15/9:30pm.

By the time he has his first nap he's quite tired, the A time is close to 5 hours, but I figured otherwise his second A would be too long before bed?

Do you think I should wake him in the mornings and squeeze in two naps or carry on like this? Some days he wakes up at 8 and we do the two naps, so I play it by ear a bit now...

Please let me know your thoughts, thank you very much!