solidifying an EASY routine for 6.5 month old textbook/angel baby!

[Alternamama]

solidifying an EASY routine for 6.5 month old textbook/angel baby!

I have read the baby whisperer solves all your problems in depth but some clarification would be helpful before I dedicate 5  (maybe 7) days 2nd week of November to start the easy routine properly that outlined on page 45. My questions are as follows:

1) Is it essential to wake up at 7am ish?? I am on mat leave for another 6 months and I might prefer 8am. However 7am would be a good time if I have to go back to work.. so probably better to use this time huh? ?Assuming its just best to be consistent whatever time is used! Moot point right now due to the time change, ha!
2) the longest he has ever slept is 7 hours straight – one time. In my bed! I worry about not feeding him at night time if he wakes- what if he is just thirsty? Shouldn’t I give him some breastmilk. I guess I could give him some water once he is more familiar with his cup.
3) She says only to feed at 7pm  if there is a growth spurt ? I don’t think he can go from 3pm feed to the 11pm dream feed. I have this thing with hydration LOL – even with my dogs so I would worry he would be thirsty at the very least!
4) Is the bedtime stated – the time he should be asleep or the time he starts his wind down?
5) Since I am trying to break the habit of feeding to sleep and co sleeping – do I just do that by jumping in to the easy routine and PU/PD? I instinctively have tried the gentle withdrawl method but he still wants to eat before he sleeps. Sometimes he comes off the boob when he is done and goes to sleep and other times he almost uses it as a pacifier. I read that perhaps it could be good to try to replace boob to sleep with rocking as this is an easier sleep association to break. From rocking, we can progress to me just holding him etc. However obviously this sleep training method is going to be hard because it would require him to sleep in the crib right away.  I should note that he doesn’t necessarily cry when in the crib but once he realizes I don’t intend to take him out, he does fuss and eventually it becomes more of a cry on most occasions. So far he has slept in his bed for two, 5 hr stretches and for a few naps but the longest nap probably 1.5 hours – all with minimal PU/PD. So I have tried her method somewhat but not full throttle. I am waiting until I can dedicate several days to make it consistent.
6) She mentions to tackle naps first but does that mean I should just start the EASY plan in the morning but still progress the same day and continue with it at bedtime? I don’t want to have this be too hard on him but I do want him to sleep in his crib and not need me as a prop! Just wasn’t sure if I should just try to stick to the EASY routine and have him in his crib in the day for a while and then once established, stop co sleeping at a later date - - however it would be hard to stay on the EASY routine while cosleeping because of the boob to sleep association.
7) When I start the process, if the baby does not nap I understand that you stay on schedule with E and A for at least 30 minutes? So that means that you would then put them down for another nap after that if needed and hence be off schedule? I assume if he can stay awake the full 2 hours until the next nap,  that is OK.
I cannot recall how long the 4 hour routine applies. At least up to a year?

My most pressing concern is getting him to like sleeping in his crib as that is where he is most safe ( I dont have a proper bed for co-sleeping but I am a ridiculously light sleeper so he wont likely roll off the bed which isn't high off the ground anyway but still..) I want to have time back to do things for myself and time to spend with my hubby at nap times and don't need to be going to bed at night so early! lol.. I am not as concerned with the night wakings. ONe thing at a time! But If I implement properly that should be helped as well!

thank you!!

[trimbler]

Sorry just saw your comment on general sleep about this post, I don't have time now but will give you a bump

[trimbler]

Hey again,I might not get through all your questions now but will make a start

1) No, doesn't have to be 7am, as you say the clock change changes that anyway Just consider using black out in the bedroom so the sun doesn't wake him up, also be aware that some LOs seem to have very strong circadian rhythms starting at their own time in the morning, no real btdt experience of that but just be aware... When do you go back to work?
2) Many LOs the same age as yours still have one, even two, NFs. If he's hungry, feed him. Have you tried a dream feed? That can help to encourage the longest stretch of sleep to happen at the same time as yours.
3)  this is where I have to confess that I lent my book and never got it back But I've certainly offered a BT feed at this age - still do at 16mo in fact
4) again, I'mpretty sure it would be the time to aim for sleep, but please bear in mind that all LOs are individuals and you may find you'll need to tweak the routine eventually to suit him better.

Ok sorry I can't answer the other questions in detail at the moment, but will have a look for a couple of useful links which may answer them...
I was thinking of the second post in this sticky, although there's lots of info there! Sleep interviews and member consults with Tracy

And for breaking the feed to sleep prop, have a look here, I've yet to read it myself though Gentle Removal Plan HTH

[Alternamama]

I go back to work April 2016 (but hoping I don't have to go back - i have to check my lottery ticket 

I could not bring myself to give a dream feed and wake a sleeping baby! I have loosely followed Tracy's method and here is what happened over 3 nights:

My goal at first is to get him to sleep in the crib and break the nurse to sleep association which I think I am doing!

Bedtime was 730pm but he cried for about 45 min and slept from 830pm to 230am. I feed him  and then he slept from 3am to 630am. I did not do PU/PD to get him back to sleep (I figured due to the time change, it was really 730am anyway!)
The next day he slept in the crib for 30 minutes

Bedtime 8:30pm and he slept from 9:30pm to 1230am. I fed him and then he slept from 1am to 430am. I fed him and he then slept fro, 530am to 8am.
Again next dayt he had a 30 minute nap in the crib.

Last night was worse as he woke 3 times! Bedtime ended up being 8:00pm and he fell asleep pretty quickly whereas the last 2 nights he cried about 45min. He woke at 10pm though so I guess I did a dream feed! It didn't help though as he then only slept until 2:30am. I fed him again and he woke up around 430am. I changed him because he was very wet and tried not to feed him but he was still protesting. Instead of doing PU/PD I fed him.. Then he slept from 530am to 730am.
Today he  napped for 35 minutes only but he went down without a fuss! The wake to sleep method did not work for me.

I did re read tracy's suggestions for short naps so I will have to work this out. I have a question on this but will post in the sleep forum.


Where I diverged from Tracy's method:

-no regular dreamfeed (but I feed him before bed - the first step in the windown routine). I also feed him when he wakes as long as its been 3.5 or ideally 4 hrs since last feed as he should at least be able to go as long as he does during the day. I have introduced solids but he hasn't been a very enthusiastic eater but he does eat a bit.
-not totally consistent with wake up and bed time but consistent in the spacing and order of the E, A, S -  I will give him about 2 hrs of activity before naps, eating every 4 hours etc.

something to note - his crib is in my room and when I feed him at night i take him into my bed for the feed (but we don't side lie, just cradle him and feed in the dark and put him back in the crib)

I am a first time mom and finding it hard to stay on the routine in terms of the timing - I know its not a schedule and doesn't have to be exact.. It just seems like time flies when you are looking after baby!!

Just wondering how you think he is doing based on this first attempt?

[trimbler]

So can I just clarify, during the days he slept about 30mins in total, or 30mins getting to sleep in his crib without feeding, with other naps taken using props? If 30mins was the total sleep he got during the day, that would probably explain all the wakings last night, he was OT. But if you want to be totally consistent during the day then I'm afraid this is just normal, once he gets used to falling asleep without nursing and does so more quickly, he'll be able to catch up on the lost sleep and recover from the OT.

I think if you've got him to go to sleep without feeding then that's a great start As you keep going and keep being consistent, he'll learn and eventually be able to get to sleep himself without taking so long. And then you'll be in a great place to do any routine tweaking that you might need to do. Bear in mind that sleep training can seem like one step forward, two steps back I'm guessing that the backward steps are probably accumulated OT, but then once he's recovered from that, things should improve again. So hang on in there I feel a bit of a hypocrite as I sleep trained a little earlier and used props heavily in the meantime to help them catch up on lost sleep. But at this age I think sleep associations can be harder to break and you're probably right to be consistent so that she lovingly gets the message on how you expect her to sleep from now on.

Naps and night sleep are different, apparently different parts of the brain or something, so I wouldn't worry too much about nursing to sleep at night, personally. But if you get to the point where she's reverse cycling (feeding more at night than during the day) or needing you feed to get back to sleep every time, then you may need to start a different approach at night.

I hear you on time flying - it does get easier and less intense, as they get older and need fewer naps and can do more A time in between

[Alternamama]

Hi there, when I started sleep training I still made a point to try to get Levi to sleep 3 hours in naps a day. So when he does a 30 min nap I will try to make up for it with a long walk in the stroller.

He is improving with naps in the crib - I think his longest nap was a bit over 1.5 hrs in there.  However he does still have 30 - 45 min naps.

I am so glad the boob to sleep association was not as hard to break as I thought it would be. I even feed him at night in my bed and occasionally leave him there for a few hours if it is close to wake up time but he is still ok to go down in the crib. Won't make a habit of that though - -with the recent news in Paris just felt a need to cuddle 

Now that he is used to the crib for sleep I need to work on tweaking a routine to ensure longer naps in crib and less wake up at night as he often wakes 2-3 times.

In regard to A times - I was under the impression that 2-2.5 hrs is still the norm at 7 months. I did see on this forum that there are sample schedules at different ages but where did that come from? Is that in Tracy's books? So far the 4 month and beyond schedule seems to jive with Levi quite well.

[trimbler]

Hey that sounds like great progress, well done, both of you I'm afraid short naps are still pretty common at 7mo, regardless of when LOs were sleep trained. But you seem to be doing all the right things, often it just comes down to having a strategy to deal with the short naps afterwards, eg EBT. Actually 2-2.5h is on the short side for 7mo, you will probably want to push that out, especially once you're getting some good naps. Here are a couple of links you may find useful, feel free to post your own recent routine if you'd like some suggestions on where to go next, but you may find you come up with your own plan after having a look at the links...
What are A times and how do they fit into the EASY plan?
chronological EASY samples, 7-9 months