10.5 month olds naps

[SarahE]

Hi there,

 I posted a month or so ago thinking my lg was starting the long road to 2-1 transition. At the time she was napping at 10am for 1 hour 15 then second  2.30 to 4pm. We started having a lot of bedtime resistance (BT normally 7/7.30) with bedtime being more like 8/8.30pm which for us is a little late for us as a family and awe end up having to wake her in the mornings to get her to daycare on the days she goes. We also had second nap refusal at least once or twice a week and earlier morning wake ups.

Having read the 2-1 transition posts, I tweaked her naps, cut her am one so it was 10-11am and her pm one became 2-3.30 and BT 7.30 - ideal.

However, in the last week she's refused two arvo naps, and is a bit trickier to settle for bed....BT is creeping back to closer to 8pm and wake ups are 5.45-6.30. Sometime times we can go back in any lie her down with her dummy and she'll chat to herself or go back to sleep til 6.45/7 which is ideal wake up.

It started feeling similar to prior to tweaking her naps so I thought I'd get on to it early...the last two days this has been our schedule

5.45 - wake - resettled
6.50 - up
7 - brekkie and BF
9.30 morning tea and top up BF
10.10 - sleep
11 - wake. - have to wake her otherwise won't sleep til 3/3.30 which is too close to BT
12 - lunch
1.50 -BF
2.20 sleep
2.50 - wake - resettled
3.40 - wake - woke as if sleeps much past 3.30 resists BT
5 - dinner
7.10 BF
7.40 BT

Today

6.15 wake - resettled but stayed awake happy in cot
7 - up
7.15 brekkie and BF
9.30 - morning tea
9.50 - BF
10.05 - sleep
11 - wake - woke up as above
12.15 lunch
2 - BF
2.15 sleep
2.50 - wake - resettled
3.35 - wake - on own chatting but seems a little sad

I'm feeling a bit stuck as I feel I'm constantly waking her form her naps and the last few days she's waking and not resettling herself as usual in her arvo nap....I'm wondering if this could be because I'm waking her in the mornings.

I'm also not sure where to go from here...should I continue to cut back the first nap to a catnap - will this fix the earlier wake ups as well as the arvo nap resistance? Should I keep waking her from every nap?

I know from what I have read that they really need help with this transition and struggle to cut short their sleep by themselves so I guess waking is quite common?
 
Or should I switch and let her sleep as long as she wants in the am and do a shorter pm one? My concern with this option is the days she's in daycare so far they have followed her schedule but their preference is for 10 and 2 pm naps for those with 2 naps and 12 noon for those with one nap....so I'm working to achieve 12 noon eventually when she's ready to drop to one. If we do a longer am one it makes it harder for daycare as she will for a while be asleep during lunch which they give at 11.30. I know they won't let her go without lunch but I also appreciate the job the do and they have a number of other babies to look after too so want to try and fit with them as much as possible!

Her A time is generally 4 hrs but the middle one has been 3.5 though I'm wondering if this needs to be 4 too - is that why she's waking mid arvo nap I wonder.

Would love your thoughts.

Oh and I should mentions on Xmas day and Boxing Day her top teeth can through and she is currently on her second round of antibiotics for an ear infection, neither seem to have bothered her too much and she's generally continued to STTN with the occasional need for help resettling.

[SarahE]

So we tired a 30 min nap this am....and she refused her arvo nap  .

She generally was fine and happy with the exception of a grumpy half an hour...

[lolsyb1982]

Hi the 2-1 is fun isn't it!!!

I would continue with the short first nap and then the longer pm one. She may refuse it for a day or so but I'd imagine she'll then be tired enough to sleep.
What time were the naps or tried attempts?

[SarahE]

Hi lolsby1982!

They are GREAT fun ESP when you have in laws coming to visit in 7 days and meeting Lo for the first time (and no doubt forming opinion of parenting in whilst here  )...

We are trying to fit as much as poss with daycare re: nap times. They do 10 and 2. Prior to Xmas the first two weeks she started daycare she was doing 10am for 1-1.15 and 2.30pm for 1.10-1.5 hrs. They have had no problems getting her to sleep. I usually don't either. She was doing 10am at home for 1-1.15 and 3pm for 1 hr, however bedtime was difficult and she was refusing the arvo naps sometimes so I cut the morning one to 1 hr and was getting her down at 2.30 in the arvo til 3.30 and BT was no issues again.

Yesterday we were a bit lack as we were tossing up shortening and pushing the first nap...we ended up pushing and shortening...nap was 10.30-11 in the morning and we attempted at 2 for the second - which was poss a tad early.

The reason we pushed was because she had been waking earlier then we would like.

Last night she we to bed without fuss at 6.50pm. - we were expecting the overtired scream within an hour or so and there was a soft cry but she self settled. We were then expecting the random middle of the night overtired wake up but nothing...slept through til 6.30am which is better for us, in fact pretty much ideal as she then chats to herself for 10-15 mins before we get her up.

Naps today we did 10-10.30 - we didn't push today's as thought the wake up may have been a little late for her yesterday so she was UT. Attempted nap at 2 again hoping she would get 1-1.5 hrs...got her up at 2.20 as she's had a poop (and thinking about it yesterday she had a poop shortly after we got her up....mmmm). Got her up for 20 mins and are trying again now to try and get 30 mins in....

Probably the wrong time of the week to start trying as she's in daycare Tom and Tuesday and I'm wondering what to ask them to try and do....they have always managed to get her down easily 30 mins before me at daycare in the arvo...I'm guessing sticking to 10am for 30 and 2 pm for as long as she wants/ up to 3.30.

It's reassuring it could take a day or two to adjust.

I'm also wondering is 30 mins too short? Though she's not upset when we pop her in bed, just crawling around and sitting up. When we leave she's standing but not particularly distressed so I don't think she's OT from that!

I still can't get over how okay she was yesterday with only 30 mins sleep and that she slept so well overnight!

How much time should we be aiming for her getting across her day naps?

[Scottishmummy]

Hi

I'd try to stick with a change for a few days to a week at least before making any other changes.

30 mins for a short nap is in the range normal at this age.   But it is likely she needs another longer nap afterwards. At least 1.5-2hrs.  If after a few days of trying this routine, you find you're getting 2nd nap resistance or 2nd nap is so late you're having to wake, I'd try cutting  the first nap to 20 mins only and bringing 2nd nap earlier.

You may find she sleeps differently at daycare. My 2 always have. I just asked daycare to go with the flow but tried to be consistent at home.

[SarahE]

Thanks Scottishmummy,

Today at daycare she did 30 mins at 10.10 and and hour and 10 mins at 2.10....so we are getting there. I've asked them at daycare to wake her at 3.30 as we were prior to this change doing that as leaving her til 4 was leading to resistance....does that still sound like a sensible wake up time with the short am nap? So her total for the day will be around 1.5 to 2 hrs...

I'm glad she did two sleeps today as the one very very short one took its toll last night with a night waking!

Will stick with it for a week - tomorrow is daycare again then home the rest of the week!

[SarahE]

So yesterday her A times we, 3.5, 3.5 and 4.20 - took her to bed for a 3.5 A time but didn't settle til later. Was generally happy so think poss UT. Nap 1 was 30 mins and nap 2 was 1 hr 10.

Slept through but had ew at 5.30 - again she was generally happy stood up rattling bars a bit but mainly chatting...just resettling now hopefully will go back to sleep for an hr!

[Scottishmummy]

A longer A time before bed is pretty common.

That EW and 2nd nap could be a sign of UT.  She might need first nap cut a little shorter. But hold the current routine for a few days first to just observe how she gets on with it.

All LOs have different sleep needs so it's har to say exactly how much daysleep she needs. Just observe and see how she is. Personally I try to avoid capping both naps and try to time 2nd one so LO can sleep as long as they want/need.

[SarahE]

Awesome, good suggestion re second nap and not capping it. I think her second nap would need to be earlier than it has been in order for us to let her sleep as long as she wants as otherwise her BT ends up 30 mins to an hour before mine Which isn't ideal! But I know this is a process and things are rarely ideal! I guess after a few more days if things are tight shortening the first nap a little more would naturally bring the second nap earlier?

Out of interest was signs would you look for that the first nap is ready to go? I absolutely know she's not ready for one nap, but it would be good to have some loose plan forward!

Today she woke 5.30 am  but resettled and awake again at 6.15, and I got her up at 6.30.

Then daycare recorded
Nap 1 - 10.20 - 11
Nap 2 - 2.25 - 3.40

And BT was 7.10 - very quickly self settled

So A times were, 4 hrs 50  ,  3.25, and 3.5

She's at home for 5 days so will see how she goes over the next two days sticking with 30 mins in the am and then reassess.

Back at Drs Tom to check ears for infection as second course of antibiotics has been completed and the is still a lot of tugging going on...fingers crossed.

[Scottishmummy]

Hope you can get her ears sorted, poor thing.

My 2 gave different signs they were ready for 1 nap.  My DS' first nap got shorter and shorter to make sure he'd go for 2nd nap & he did a micro-first nap (10-15mins) from around 15-18mo.  Around 18mo he just stopped going to sleep for the first nap, so we dropped it and he went through to 2nd nap at normal time.

My DD went to 1 nap around 12mo after 2-3weeks of a short first nap but also earlier and earlier waking.  I had to push her through for just 1 nap in the middle of the day to get to an acceptable wake time, but it was messier & she still has some 2 nap days now at 15mo.

[SarahE]

Good to hear others experiences thanks.

She slept 7.10 to 6.50 last night 

Went for her nap at 10.20 and I'm just going to wake her now at 10.50.

I get a sense she will go to one nap within 2-3 months ish do round the 13-14 month mark, though she may surprise us and stick with 2 for a little longer.

Thankfully ears are all good now 


Update: tried to pop her down at 2.20pm...went to sleep at 3.05pm  - generally happy but a little shouting...slept til 3.50 and BT was 7.30. She STTN til 6.30 which is great.

So A times were...3.5, 4.15 and 3.40 with a total of 1 hr 15 sleep across the two naps.

So far in Thursday we look like this

630 - wake
10 - nap
10.35 wake

Usually I BF prior to nap as part of routine not BF to sleep, today I didn't and she settles easily and quickly though I could tell she was really tired as she was rubbing her whole face...not just her eyes!
When I woke her at 10.35 she was okay - not upset but once I got her out her sleep bag she laying down...now she's up she seems fine, if a little tired.

[Scottishmummy]

Bless her, maybe tired from 2 short naps the day before? How have last few days been?

[SarahE]

She's been doing well on 30 mins and then 1.15-1.5 in the arvo. 10 and 2pm with bed just after 7. She did seem a little grumpy so we extended the 30 mins to 40...but then she wasn't tired enough for second nap til 2.45 which pushed her bedtime very late again. She's getting about 13-13.5 hrs in 24 hrs which I think is fine for a nearly 11 month old.

We have also for the last 5 days dropped her pre nap milk feed as it was dwindling (I know as I express for daycare..went down to 70 ml the two days she was in daycare)... Was slightly worried as I thought it was a sleep cue though not a aid, but poss edging that way recently..however, nope...she shocked me totally...sleep sack on, curtains drawn, dummy, bed - s.t.r.a.i.g.h.t  to sleep 

[Scottishmummy]

Sounds like things are going well and she has a routine that suits her. Dropping Pre-nap milk sounds right for her too, especially if it seemed to be getting to be an aid. You might find she looks for milk/snack on waking though, my 2 always have!

[SarahE]

So 1.5 months on, my lg is 1 on Monday.

In the last month or so she's has quite a few sleeps on the go with rellies visiting etc. so naps times have not been as exact but typically 10 and 2 give or take. So days she's fallen asleep early as we've been in the car. Generally sleeps 30 mins at 10 and 1-1.5 at 2.  she has also started walking a couple of days ago, still careful wobbly steps but she's wanting to walk rather than cruise now and she's standing pretty solidly now.

The last few days and the odd few days last week as well she she has been difficult to get down at 10, but seems more ready at 11/11.30. When we have put her down at 11 for 30mins we have found she either won't go down til 3 pm and we wake again at 3.30 as if she sleeps past then she won't go to bed until after 8/8.30pm which is too late for us. On some days she just refused the second nap and we popped her to bed early.

I'm wondering if this is just a walking/development thing or if she's ready to drop to one nap?

At night she sleeps usually 11 hrs, sometimes 10, sometimes 12. During the day she is happy with 1.5-2 hrs sleep anymore that 2 hrs nighttime is a struggle.

Oh I should mention night time has been a struggle again for the last free weeks...

So in short the signs I have are refusing morning nap, if morning nap is taken, it's usually late and leads to arvo nap being refused. When naps do happen as norm, bed time is a struggle. She's not unhappy, just not ready to sleep.

Today she refused the morning nap so we kept her up and she went to bed at 11.20 and woke at 1.20. She lay quietly from 1.20 in her cot til 1.40 when we got her up...