Author Topic: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!  (Read 2516 times)

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Offline liamsmomdc

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30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« on: July 27, 2006, 22:15:57 pm »
Im not sure im doing anything right!!  please help!!  going crazy from these short naps and i am about to give up!!!  My DS who is 11 weeks old and is a Touchy baby used to nap for only 30 minutes at every cycle.  We have been using the 3 hour EASY schedule (I am mainly b-feeding) since week 8 but have only implemented the shh/pat to get him down for naps for 6 days now.  

We have read the sleep interview and are trying to do it as Tracey says but still need help!  We swaddle, have white noise and have a fan running to drown out sounds and also have blackening curtains up.  We wind down at least 5 -10 min after A time but as soon as I place him on the swaddle he starts yelling and fights and squirms.  Why do they fight naps??  Am I waiting too long to wind him down?  I feel like I a waiting the appropriate time and usually get him to be swaddled before the 1st yawn.  

Napping:  He jolts/stretches/squirms every couple minutes throughout his whole nap!  So, what I do is…I sit in the room with him and shh pat at almost every big movement/jolt, but then I am in the room for sooo long!  It doesn’t seem right!  I am sometimes there 30-45-55 minutes just watching him and his jolting.  Sometimes he starts stretching to wake up but I shhpat/use firm pressure to get him to close his eyes again.  Actually, if the jolting/movements don’t look too severe, I let him get thru it on his own.  

1.   our method of shh patt requires holding his legs and sometimes arms (he is swaddled and laid on his side) with firm pressure b/c of all of his jerky movements and struggling to sleep.  Is this right?  Will this hurt us in the long run?
2.   I have to come back into the room 20-23 minutes after his eyes close for the first time before the “jolting” starts.  It usually occurs at 25, 30, 40/45 and 50/55 minutes.  When I see movement in his body or eyes start to pop open, I shh pat and use firm pressure at almost every jolt.
a.   Is this too much attention?  Am I actually teaching him to self soothe here?  
b.   If I can see him past the 50/55 min mark, he can usually sleep around 1 hr but this involves me there the whole time almost!
c.   most of the time, he will not succumb to the shh/pat and firm pressure thing… he will struggle and wake still at 30 – 35 minutes.  I try to shh pat him again but give up b/c at this point, he is crazy and crying it seems to not work.  I will try for at least another 10 minutes then pick him up and it seems to be at least another hour before his feeding.  Then I feed and only wait about 20 min til I put him back down…sometimes less if he looks tired.
3.   Does anyone know if the short naps are due to DS not getting enough calories?  I feel like he eats enough – he has lots of wet diapers, is growing at a good rate and looks satisfied at every meal.  But – im still not ever sure!  


Sample schedule – past 6 days

E 7:30 (he doesnt get up every day at the same time - i dont know how to do this!)
A 8:00
S 8:45

E 10:00
A 10:30
S 11:15
A 11:30 – sometimes he wakes at 30 min mark and cant get him to go back down

E 12:30
A 1:00
S 1:45
A 2:15 - sometimes he wakes at 30 min mark and cant get him to go back down

E 3:30
A 4:00
S 4:45- sometimes he wakes at 30 min mark and cant get him to go back down

E 6:30 (bottle of ebm)
A 6:50 bath + some other slow activity
S 7:30

E 9:30
S 10:00

E 12:30, 3:30 or 4, 6:30 or 7


Mommy to Liam the Lovebug - born 05.12.06

Offline Zoey

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Re: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2006, 04:25:42 am »
Hi there!

First girlfriend breathe! ;)  Do you love your baby?  Ok then you are doing everything that really matters, just fine. :-*

What kind of swaddle are you using?  Have you tried a Miracle Blanket?  I think they are fabulous.  Is he using a paci?  Does he have reflux or anything like that?

1) For your Easy - you want to pick a wake time and a bedtime ans stick to them everyday including weekends.  So, yours is 730am - so everyday you will go in and get him up at 730am and start his day.  Just get him up and feed him ;)

2) You want to start the winddown 10 mins BEFORE A time ends.  So for your routine you will begin winding down at 845am and plan to have him in the crib and hopefully sleeping by 9am. That way he won't get overtired.  Have you tried the 4S's?  https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=64277.msg478965#msg478965 - I think that swaddling and then putting up on your shoulder and starting to pat/shh may be helpful.  I think he may be a wee bit overtired and maybe that is why he is jerking so much.   Have you tried patting and shhing without any pressure?  Perhaps try it, starting with him up on your shoulder and when he is settled, place him in the crib.  Here is a link for pat/shh:  https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=26671.0  Make sure you have him swaddled snuggly, this will help with the jerks too.

3) You don't want to help more then you have to.  You do not want to become a prop.  To avoid that, only help to settle and see if he can do the rest.  Use your judgement.  Your job is to support and settle him, and his job is to fall asleep - which he can do if he is settled.  Have a read of this:  https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=26672.msg487695#msg487695.   That is how you want to try and do pat/shh so you don't become a prop.  It is silly for you to be in there every day for the whole nap.  I think he may be overtired and that is why he is having so much trouble.

4) On the 3 hour Easy, make your feeds every 3 hours and let everything else fall around those.  Try to relax, it will all work out I am sure of it ;)  If he wakes early from the nap, you can try to pat/shh him to help him settle back down.  If not, then you get him up and do quiet A time until his next feed.  Remember if he only slept for 30 mins he will not be able to handle the next A time being as long as it usually is. 

You are doing a fabulous job!  Relax, you are doing everything just fine.  The first 3 months are SO hard, you are not alone with how you feel trust me.  Have a read of this stuff and post back and tell me whatcha think.  We will get through this, we will figure out what he needs to sleep better.  Remember this... at 3 months, they are having a huge growth spurt, arranging sleep in their brain, noticing more about the world, its all developmental!  Its a busy time!!  Have faith, this is normal. 

Ill check back soon!
BIG HUGS
Zoey


      

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Offline ~Lori~

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Re: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2006, 05:05:20 am »
I have a Touchy 11 week old DD who does the same things:)  As soon as I put her on her swaddle she freaks out...she knows what is coming!!!  I have often had to hold her legs to get her to settle because she just moves like crazy.  We use the Miracle Blanket and I know everyone loves it, but I don't see it making too much of a difference for Sophie.  Occasionally she will still get an arm out (don't ask me how).  SOphie often wakes at the 35 minute mark and usually doesn't go back down, even with 40 minutes of sh---patting....I've been doing sh---patting since she was 5 weeks old. 

I don't know if it has anything to do with Touchy babies, but I am learning that most things do not work for her as all the books say they will.  Just keep trying and finding things that work.  I found that shhhhh'ing really set my LO off.  So now I just tap her back lightly, and put my hand on her side (with pressure) and often that works. 

I can do the same thing day after day for naps, using the 4S for windown...sometimes they work, sometimes not.  Sometimes we get past 35 minutes, otherwise not.  I think they are still learning to organize day sleep so I'm hoping it'll happen soon!

Lori
Mom to:

DD--Touchy, then Textbook, 2006
DS1--Spirited, 2009
DS2--Textbook, 2012
DD2--Angel, 2014

Offline meldee

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Re: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2006, 15:52:18 pm »
Glad to hear that I am not the only one going through this! Sometimes, especially when he is screaming like a banshee, I feel like I am the world's worst mother and want to completely give up. I just have to remember that this is going to take time.

Zoey, I love the suggestions and I will give them a try. I find getting my little guy down at bedtime is the hardest struggle, but I think it has to do with the time I am putting him down. I try to keep him up so that my dh can have some time with him before bed.

totally unrelated, but how do you attach the photo. I"ve tried several times and I can't seem to get it right.... 

Offline Zoey

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Re: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2006, 16:32:06 pm »
I know its hard when DH's work later - I went through the same thing - but its better for baby to go to sleep earlier.

Are you trying to attach it to the left?  Or just anywhere?
      

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Offline meldee

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Re: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2006, 16:44:22 pm »
to the left

Offline Zoey

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Re: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« Reply #6 on: July 28, 2006, 17:02:20 pm »
https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=66586.0 - post the pic you want here - someone will fix it.  It has to be really small to post there - someone I think Helen (Ennypen) is resizing them for people.
      

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Offline liamsmomdc

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Re: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« Reply #7 on: July 28, 2006, 22:53:34 pm »
Zoey,

Hey there…ok…breath taken!  ;D I do use the Miracle blanket…but he wont take the paci at all.  We don’t know if he has reflux…I have him on Zantac and a slight incline in his basinet b/c he has some signs but he doesn’t have a lot of the major symptoms.  My dr told us to try it and see if it makes things better.  Not sure if im gonna take him off of it soon. 

Hmmm…I will try the start awake time thing its tough b/c he still gets up every 3-3.5 hours at night to nurse.  So, if I space the feedings at 3 hours each, then the awake time is different every day.  For example, sometimes he wakes at 3 and then wakes at 6 to feed.  Is there activity time after this then a short nap til 7:30?  Or, if he wakes at 4, then gets up at 7 – is this close enough to the “start awake time”?

Also – do you know how I can get him to cut down on the number of feedings at night?  Sometimes he gets up b/c he has a wet diaper and its around the 3 hour feeding time so I just change him and feed him anyway.  But, he really does keep the same 3 hour schedule like daytime except he does not take 30 min catnaps at night.

I feel like I do get wind him down in plenty of time before the actual sleep time.  But, the wrench in that is that as soon as he gets into the tightly wrapped swaddle (otherwise there is too much jerky movements and he gets his arms out!), he gets crazy hysterical.  Then I rock him for a couple seconds or put him on my shoulder for shh/pat (this doesn’t work much to calm him, actually makes him scream more) and then I just place him in the bassinet.  Then I shh/pat him more there until he settles and finally stops the movements and closes his eyes.  There has been some progression there…it used to take 15 min of shh/pat but now it takes less than 5! 

Say he goes down for 30 min then the next feeding is in one hour,.  I feed him, then do I do activity for 10 min and try to get him back down again?  Then what happens when he only goes down for 30 min again?  Then its one and a half hours or one hr 45 min again til the next feeding!!  So confused. 

BTW – sorry for so many questions and thanks so much for your encouragement…I just didn’t think it was going to be THIS hard.  You are a godsend to this message board…how do you find the time??? 
Mommy to Liam the Lovebug - born 05.12.06

Offline Zoey

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Re: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« Reply #8 on: July 29, 2006, 00:26:53 am »
Hi there, I am glad you are breathing ;)  I have MORE questions!!!  I'm Sooo fun, aren't I?  Lol

Have you had any thoughts about moving to the crib? ;D

He wakes up exactly 3 hours after his last feed in the night or do you wake him?  Do not wake him to eat unless he is super under weight or was a preemie.  At night, let sleeping babies sleep!  IF he wakes up then go ahead and feed but don't wake him. :)

I'd pick a time, and try your best to stick with it.  That will help him set his internal clock.  If he wakes close to your start time, give him a quiet half feed and put him back down to bed.  Then start at your start time, knowing he'll take less cause he had half.  Make sense?

Wet diapers at 3am, that happened to me and I did the same thing - I fed him!  I got these:  http://www.tinytots.com/shopping/tushies/tushies_mates.html  --  they go right inside the diaper and give extra absorbency.  I use one of those and 1 huggies overnight, the next size up then what he'd usually wear.  I put TONS of A and D on him and he has yet to be wet come morning since I have done this.  I got the link on this site and they have been a God send cause he stopped waking up cause he wasn't wet!  I say give em a try girl!  I must add, my son has never had a diaper rash so don't worry bout that - just put A and D or Vaseline all over his area.

Second, some babies will require night feedings until their 1 bday.  It's more common then uncommon for them to need a DF plus at least one more feed at night.  Your best bet is to get alot into him during the daytime.  My night bottles are bigger, like my 630pm and DF are 8oz and the rest are 6oz.  I know you BF and I don't know much about that, but can you pump some?  Maybe give him a top off with pumped EBM after the 330pm and 630pm feeds?  I don't know when he will not need to eat at night - its a secret!

It may help to do a Dream feed.  How do you feel about BFing him at 630, giving him as much as he'll take, then in bed by 7-730pm and then not feeding again til 10pm and giving him as much as he'll take between BFing and EBM?  This may help cut down on the night feeds cause he will be getting more.  Make sense?  At night, when he feeds, is it BFing?  And are they full feeds like during the day?

If he is fighting badly at naptimes - I would start the wind down like 15 mins earlier and get him in bed 15 mins earlier as he may be over tired.  Perhaps try putting him down 15 mins earlier for all naps for a few days and see if that helps any.  Awesome job with pat/shh - remember don't pat all the way to sleep or it will become a prop.  Do it to settle him and let him fall asleep on his own.  I wouldn't rock, as that will become a prop.  Keep swaddling him and up to your shoulder and pat/shh, perhaps if you do it all earlier he won't put up such a fuss?  If he continues to freak out, then skip the shoulder stuff and swaddle him and put him right down in the crib, you can pat there if he needs it.  Do you have any white noise?  A fan on high facing the wall works great, it's soothing to them most often.  Also, make the room as dark as you can. 

If he only sleeps for an hour, you will go in and pat/shh him til he settles back to sleep.  You do this until he settles and sleeps, until the next feed or for 40 mins whichever comes first.  If it's 40mins, you stop, take him out of the room for 10 mins then go back in and start again.  Always stop for a feed and always wake him for a feed during the day.  It sounds daunting I know, but it will get easier.  I think he is overtired and that is why he is having a hard time.  You have to, well kinda train him - what times are feed times and what times are sleeping times.  He can't figure that out on his own - know what I mean? 

So, lets say he sleeps 30 mins, and you do pat/shh for 40 mins and by that time its just about time to feed so you stop and feed.  If he only slept 30mins, he will not be able to handle a full A time this time - so yes I would feed, then change him, kisses and cuddles and start the wind down and in the crib.  If he again only sleeps 30 mins, then again you will pat/shh until he settles and goes back to sleep, for 40 mins, or til the next feed time.  Whee!!

So, lets recap!

He is most likely overtired - so you are going to start his wind down 15 mins earlier and get him down 15 mins earlier.   So, at the moment his first nap is at 845am - you want to start your routine at 815am and try to have him asleep by 830am.  Go in, make the room ready, get some white noise, make the room dark, change him, swaddle, and sit in the chair (no rocking!) and sing or read/tell a story - or you can reverse these two and swaddle right before you go in the crib.  In the crib with a phrase - I love you, whatever.  Then duck out of sight!  Wait and see what he does, if he cries go to him and start pat/shh.  Don't over help - you settle, he sleeps.  Try to get as much BM/EBM into him as you can during the day and especially the feeds near bedtime.  Think about making that switch I mention above and doing the dream feed at 10pm.  Think about some diaper doublers.  And remember to breathe!   ;)

Lol I find time cause Owen has been through sleep training and now he sleeps!  For the most part lol, everyone has a wonky day here and there! :-\

Keep me posted, ask as many questions as you want - no worries, Im here to help ya!  Read the links I posted in the last post, they are helpful.  Knowing is half the battle... GI JOE!

Love,
Zoey








      

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Offline liamsmomdc

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Re: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« Reply #9 on: August 04, 2006, 22:10:45 pm »
I am about to give up…for real this time.  I am breathing, trying everything you and the BW book and the Sleep Interview is saying to do.  Nothing is working and Liam is fussier than ever. 

I have him on reflux meds, I am off dairy and don’t eat the other “offending” foods.  I have even stopped taking my pre-natal vitamins b/c it has iron in it.  He also takes a hypo allergenic formula. 

We are transitioning him to the crib this wknd by placing the bassinet in the crib first then taking him out of that straight to the crib. 

I definitely never wake him…he just wakes right on the dot…3 hours to feed.  He seems hungry. I really do try and read his cues…especially when people say that there is a 3 month growth spurt which he is 3 months today. 

As for the same “awake” time…he is waking at 6:30 or 6:45 now…I guess his clock is “set”.  Goody for me.   :-[

I still cant do the DF feed b/c he gets up around 10 or 11 to do a standard feeding.  I have tried giving him more formula towards the end of the day…no luck with that to cut down on the night feedings.  Oh well. 

I think I have given up on him the fact that my LO will get any easier.  i have decided that i just ahve a difficult baby and thats that.  People tell you that it gets easier after week 6 or the 3rd month.  Well, he’s just getting worse.  I have been trying to get him down like you said, even earlier, but then when he gets up 30-45 minutes later and I tyr to get him back down and it doesn’t work…then there’s all this time before the next feeding.  Then the vicious cycle starts all over. 

I cant seem to get him to nap without shh/patting at the start (b/c he is hysterical when he is laid down) and then i come back at the 25 min mark and then all the way thru to the 40 or 50 min mark.  I have been staying there past the 40-50 min mark b/c I need him to sleep!  And this is the only way I can get him to do it so he sleeps for at least 1 hr 15 min.  it seems as if  he cant do it by himself.  I have tried to not do it and he’ll wake at 30 or 40 minute mark.  He can be happily smiling cooing and as soon as I get him near the swaddle, he is hysterical.  I don’t know how to get around this.  We use white noise, a fan and have blackening curtains up.  We feel like we have tried everything and nothing is working. 


Mommy to Liam the Lovebug - born 05.12.06

Offline Zoey

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Re: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2006, 22:36:53 pm »
Please don't give up - it's only been 3 months.  Please don't give up - you have a life time with this Lovebug.  He is worth not giving up no matter what, right?  I am going to help you and I'll have Stacy look in and help too.  I am sorry this is so hard, but please don't give up.

Please post your exact routine again:  exactly how it is and indicate when you start the wind down.  There is a solution, you have to be willing to work with us to find it.  I know its hard, I have been there - but if you give up, what is your alternative? 

Have  a read of this:  https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=65443.0

I'll be back to see your routine.

Big Hugs, hang in there girl,
Zoey

Oh tell me abou tthe reflux and Zantac - wheres that stand?  All this could be pain.

I also think the tiny bassinet is causing some trouble too.  I'd switch to a crib asap.

Have you tried wake to sleep?  Before you put him near the swaddle, how does he seem?  Tired awake? 

Please tell me exactly how you do pat/shh.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2006, 23:38:52 pm by Zoey »
      

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Offline liamsmomdc

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Re: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« Reply #11 on: August 05, 2006, 01:12:22 am »
Thanks for the words of encouragement, Zoey.  and you're right...i dont have another option for giving up!  its not like a job that you dont like and can quit and get a new one!  i am getting very defeated tho and my LO defineitly can tell.  Just cant help it. 

i like that post from stacey.  i know need to think more positive...its just so hard when i cant think straight and i think everything is going against me.  another issue i cannot figure out is if he is getting enough milk from me.  he has enuff wet diapers and gaining weight well but the whole 3 mo growth spurt thing has made him a super fussy eater -at the breast and the bottle.  ugh...more to add to this situation.   

Routine – as of this week: (it fluctuates a bit if i haveto go out and od something during the day, which i dont liek to do b/c he fusses and cries everywhere we go and i normally have to leave places early or leave stores b/c he is hysterically crying)

Wake at 7:00
E 7:30 ( I am using Zantac for reflux so it says you have to wait 30 min prior to feeds)
A 8:00
S 8:45 (morning naps for some reason are easier to prolong)

E 10:15
A 10:45
S 11:20 * typical nap = go in at 25 min mark to pat/shh at 30, 40 and 50 min marks to get him to nap for over an hour

E 1:00         
A 1:45
S 2:00 * typical nap

E 4:00
A 4:30
S 5:00 * typical nap - usually when i give the zantac agian b/c he doesnt sleep up until his next feeding so i can give the meds 30 min prior

E 6:30
A 7:00 Bath
S 7:30 * typical nap (this one frustrates me…id like for this to be bedtime…but it never happens)

E 9:00 (short feedings for the rest of the night – very sleepy, but I always try to feed him more)
S 9:15

E 10:30
S 11:00

E 1:30
S 1:45

E 4:30
S 4:45

Awake anywhere between 6:30 and 7
Mommy to Liam the Lovebug - born 05.12.06

Offline Zoey

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Re: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« Reply #12 on: August 05, 2006, 03:03:42 am »
There you go girlfriend - Stacy is Nap Woman - and I am going to get her a cape and theme music.  I second everything she says here. 

Stay on top on the Zantac and its effectiveness - it works by weight, so as he gains he will need an increase.  Pay special attention to growth spurts as he will grow and be heavier!

Also, I am NOT telling you to go against your doctors recommendation - however I found this link in regards to when you can give the zantac:  http://www.medsafe.govt.nz/Consumers/cmi/z/ZantacSyr.htm - naturally use as your own discretion.  Owen is on it and we haven't been told about the before food thing, so I looked it up to make sure.  That seems like a great link, lots of info.... half way down the page is dosing info.

Keep us posted girl friend - please don't give up - come back for tons of hugs and love, and support.  We are here for you!!

Love and Hugs,
Zoey
      

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Offline liamsmomdc

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Re: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« Reply #13 on: August 05, 2006, 16:40:34 pm »
thanks for that link about the zantac..i will check with my ped dr on monday.  i am really still unsure if he has reflux...thats the main problem.  i guess i can ask about that as well...if we should even be on it.  and the whole 30 min prior is weird.

and we are starting him on the crib as of this am. 

when we swaddle him, he is either crying/fussy and this means maybe i waited one or 2 seconds too long to get him down (he is that quick form happy to crying) or sometimes he had a yawn or sometimes i just look at the clock and if its about 1 hr 15 min from last time he napped, i put him on the swaddle.  he doesnt give me great cues for his tiredness.  i look for them, believe me.  someitmes we can just be playing or singing and the next second his body gets tense and he's fussy/crying and thats when i say its time for a swaddle and nap.  i dont know how to get him before this point.  i mean, maybe i get him into it while he's happy and playing?  that doesnt seem right either for his development. 

yes - i was meaning to go see the lact consultant next week to see whats going on wiht his intake.  i would be so distraught if i had to stop nursing him...i mean, wiht all the trouble i did to get my milk in and all the heartache this has been.  and now to go on formula strictly...just not sure.  but, i guess if it would mean for him to sleep better and not be so fussy, i could do it. 

yeah...the nap in the morning we try to get him to be awake only an hour and a half - sometimes it goes over.  for example, this am, he woke at 6:45, i gave him the meds, he ate at 7:15 then put him down by 8:00.  he only slept for 40 min.  now - this is the part that is the most confusing to my dh and I:

if we try and keep shh/patting him til the next feed (or do some low key activity) then feed, then another low key activity for 10 min and then naptime agian.  so as zoey said before, he wont be able to stand that long of an A time, then he naps again for 30 minutes...am i shh/patting for the next 2 hours to get to the next feed?  it just doesnt make sense. 

this is how i see it:

E 7:00
A 7:30
S 8:15-8:45
A 8:45-10:00 (shh/pat or low key A)

E 10:00
A 10:30
S 10:40 - 11:10
A 11:10-1:00 (sshhh/patt or low key A)

does this keep going all day?  when will he make it up?  is my life going to be just shh/patting all day and trying to get him to nap?  how do you combat the overtiredness if he wont sleep?  he can sleep sometimes but that is with us helping him the whole way thru.  i am afraid he hasnt learned how to sleep on his own yet no matter what we do.   ???  as of right now, whenever we see or hear him stir past the 30 min mark, we have to help him all the way.  he strggles so much that he gets hysterical and i ahve to walk out of the room so frustrated by the process.

i ahve not tried w2sleep in a while.  i guess its worth a shot at this point.  i tried it a couple weeks ago and didnt work for him. 

i just got Tracey's 3rd book - had someting in there about habitual waking.  know anything about this?  i wonder if Liam is doing this...he's on such a strict internal clock...he eats every 3 hours on the dot and gets hysterical if he's not fed at the 3 hour mark, that he is getting up at night knowing that im gonna feed him.  before i started EASY he was sleeping 4-6 hours at a stretch at night.  i can barely get 3.5 hours now. 

thanks so much in advance guys.  and stacy...i am only hoping that I am your twin!  does that mean that in 2 months of this hellish time that maybe it will get better?  sigh.  i guess i am so sad b/c of the fact that as hard as we try...nothign seems to get better. 
« Last Edit: August 05, 2006, 16:43:52 pm by liamsmomdc »
Mommy to Liam the Lovebug - born 05.12.06

Offline Zoey

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Re: 30 min naps - dont think i am doing anything right!
« Reply #14 on: August 06, 2006, 03:35:31 am »
Hey hunny.

My thought is:  There is SOMETHING keeping him from being able to sleep.  Be it discomfort from reflux, be it hunger due to a BFing problem, be it developmental, be it habitual - there is something.  Start at the top of the list and eliminate things.  Go the the lactation people - make sure it's not that.  Then, go for another check up regarding the reflux.  There is something, we just have to find it and fix it.

Wake to sleep - you have to do this for 3-4 days, for all short naps, then stop and see.  I don't know which way your doing it, but I do the second method where you stir them.  I find less is more, I would go in 10 mins before he usually woke (usually for him, he'd wake at 45 mins, so I'd go in at 35mins) I touch his cheek, see him turn his head and I ducked to the floor and stay there silently for 3 mins, then I leave.  I do it this way not because I am a momo, but because I found that when I stirred him and left immediately - I disrupted him even more by leaving and he would wake up.  So, perhaps try that.  Like anything else in sleep training, stick with it for a few days then stop and see.  Wake to sleep is one of the "cures" for habitual wakings.

The amount of A time one needs is a balance.  Too much A and he will be overtired and overstimulated and he won't fall asleep well, and he won't be settled enough to make it through the transitions.  Too little A and he will wake at the 30, or 45 mins mark and now go back to sleep because he isn't tired enough.  It's so difficult, I know.  Thrown in that you are Stacy's twin and well - I don't want to be you! ;) ;) ;) 

Ok he wakes at 7am - you feed him, do very low key A time until around 8am - do your wind down and get him down, and leave.  If he cries go back, settle him with pat/shh, or a hand on his back, or just words - whatever he likes.  Do this until he melts into the mattress, then back it off, slower and slower over a few mins - as he keeps settling.  When he seems to be completely settled and almost asleep stop and leave your hand on him, or just stand there and watch him.  If he continues to be settled, go sit on the floor for a few - then leave if he is asleep.  If he works back up at all, start soothing him again and repeat the slowing.  Ok, now he is asleep and you are sipping some tea and saying your prayers to the sleep Gods.  If he usually wake at the 40 min mark - go in QUIETLY at 30 mins and stir him gently (less is more) and ducked to the floor (it feels goofy but try not to laugh!), wait a few mins then sneak out using your stealth like abilities.  Pray some more, it can't hurt.  If it didn't work this time, take heart we have other naps to try!  If he cries properly, go in and begin your pat/shh or variation and proceed like before.  Make a mental note (or notebook) of the time.  We started the wind down at 8am, hopefully he was asleep by 830 the latest.  He woke at 910am, you are going to pat him until he is asleep again, or until close to his 10am feed.  IF he falls asleep again say at 930am - I personally would let him sleep until 1015, then wake him and feed him.

Add up how much he slept.  If the total was an hour or under an hour, I (I, me - my opinion) would feed, then do a 10min quiet activity then begin the wind down, and repeat the above.  Always wake to feed, but I feel its ok to let him go 15mins past if he fell asleep late.

Call the pharmacist and ask about the 30min Zantac thing.  I honestly think it doesn't make a difference, and I know it won't hurt him to not do the 30 min thing.  Again, I don't want you to go against the MD, but I have done a ton of research on this med because Owen takes it and I have never come across this rule. 

One other thought then Ill shut up lol:
Have you tried another type of swaddle?  Like the Aussie, or the Tuck In?  I mean, what would you have to lose at this point, to try another swaddle method for a day or two?  Both methods are in the props FAQ section.

Love,
Zoey

      

...its what you do when you get back up.