4Hr EASY saves the day and NIGHT!!!!!

[MJMom]

Sami - do me a favor, can you post your routine and we can take another look?  But would you mind starting a new thread?  PM me the link and I'll check it out for you.

If you think he can handle going longer, then you can try to drop the 4-6 feed.  Do you think he's getting a good DF?

[pbmom]

Hi Sarina,

Ok, so I tried to drop the DF...didn't work.  Granted it was only one night, but I waited until the night after she took 1.5 oz DF and slept through until 6:15.  She had gone down that night at 7:30.  So, not too bad.  Last night looked like this:

E 7pm (fell asleep at bottle - never happens, go figure)
S 7:30 (in her own crib - for 1st night all night (she's been in bassinett for bed, but crib for naps)
E 3 am - YUCK - a full 3 oz
S until 6:00
E 6:30

So, now our day will be different than usual - we'll see how it goes.  She did not feed well at 6, she was a very fussy eater this morn.  Probably b/se she just ate at 3 am.

Maybe I should move the DF back?

[MJMom]

pbmom-

I would keep the DF for now.  A wake up at 6:15 is still pretty good.  I dropped my DF when my LO was about 4.5 mos and it literally made no difference.  Either way she woke around 4ish.  So, if there is a difference, I would keep it in.  Apparently that little bit is making enough of a difference in her sleeping!  If she's going from 10ish to 6ish, that is really quite good at that age!!

[pbmom]

Just read this so tonight I already tried to cluster at 5 and final feed at 7 instead of DF.  We'll see if it works...if not, I will return to our little 1 oz DF and hope she goes back to sleeping from 10 until 6:15.  I really shouldn't complain...I'm just so darn tired with 2 lo's.  I know there are others who have it worse off at this age.  But the first 10 weeks of her life made up for it with all the crying!!!  Poor lo...

[kris dg]

Just an update from our end:

After switching to the 4Hour EASY, our day naps are just great!  2 2-hour naps and a catnap.  And she goes down so easily.  (She still can't sleep on her own yet though so I still carry her on my shoulder - maybe because of the reflux - but it's much quicker now).

But the NWs are just stressful!!  Last night:

- she wouldn't sleep till 9 and I fed her (as a last resort Cluster Feed)
- then she woke up at 12 (I settled her)
- then she woke up at 1am (I fed her since last feed was at 9)
- then she woke up at 530am (I tried to settle but she wouldn't stop crying so I fed her)
- then she wouldn't go back down until 7

I'm so tired!  a week ago, she would go down at 8, wake up at 2 then wake up at 730.

I think I'm going to try your way Sarina and keep feeding her during the day.  I think that's the problem.  She's way too distracted.  I think she's done after 10-15 minutes but maybe she's not and she's waking up from hunger at night.

[MJMom]

pb mom and kris dg... other thing to consider is if your LOs or going through GS's.  The NW's may resume for a couple of nights and then subside.  Or in my case, they went as long as a week as it would take that long for my production to kick up.

Just something to consider.

[pbmom]

Update - my cluster attempt didn't work and I ended up DF anyway since I was up...and she still got up at 3am for a feed.  Hoping it is a GS.  I'm going to give it a few days with the cluster and see.

Kris - just relooked at this and noticed you said your lo still doesn't fall asleep on own.  Do you carry her on your shoulder until she's asleep?  If so, that may be your NW cause if she wakes up and says "hey, where's that mum of mine."  Just a thought.  I AP'd my first one all the way to 8 mos...so I am an expert in putting a child down asleep.  I'm just lucky it didn't affect her nightime sleep until she was older and I did PU/PD (which was hell).  Do you use a wedge for the reflux? 

[Cory'stiredmommy]

kris dg... Sorry, I haven't been online for a few days:-)

1) Josh wakes just before 7am - or I wake him at 7 - we always start the day at this time. If he wakes at 6:30 - I will try and distract until 7am for a feed. Of course, if he is crying, he gets fed!:-)

2) Definately encourage the day feeds - I had to committ to this ... I have a 2 yr old running around and I felt guilty having him wait for us to finish. It is worth it! A well rested mommy is the best thing you can do for your babies.

Sarina

[Cory'stiredmommy]

PBMOM,
Are you on a 4 hr routine during the day?
I noticed that you fed at 3am and then at 6am/6:30am.... Was baby hungry or was baby done sleeping but not necessarily hungry?

Sarina

[pbmom]

Hi again - yes, we are on a 4 hr routine, but it was weird 2 nights ago.  She was starving at 3 and then up again at 6:15 and practically bobbing my shoulder off while I tried to distract her.  I wanted to wait until 7, but gave in as she was hungry.  Prior to that I would DF at 10 and then she'd wake between 4-5:30 to eat and then go back until 7-7:30.  Maybe GS like Alissa said.  I like the 7 am start, but our daytime sleep is all over the place.  One day she naps great, the next she doesn't.  She usually is fine with waiting 4 hrs for feed though, so I keep that constant.  Sometimes we have A time before E and after.  Sometimes she can go 2 hrs A time, sometimes only 1.5 hrs.  She goes from happy to OT very quickly with little signs.  If I hit it right she sleeps for 1.5-2 hrs (sometimes longer if she went down early due to an earlier short nap).  I can't figure it out.  At first the 4 hr routine was a dream (for like 2-3 weeks)...now I'm confused! 

[kris dg]

If it's a growth spurt, how come it only causes NW?  Shouldn't it also affect her day naps?  She sleeps well for 2 hours twice a day and a catnap before the last cycle.

pbmom - yes, i think I am still doing AP on her!  I'm guilty!  =)  But she really can't fall asleep.  She just cries and cries.  She does have a wedge and she takes Zantac twice a day.  I have to start weaning I know.  I don't think she's looking for me as before, she used to sleep for 6 hours regularly and a few times 8-9 hours.  But maybe as she's growing up, she's getting more attached?  I don't know.  It's so hard to be a mom =)  But when she smiles, it's so worth it.

[pbmom]

Kris - I hear ya on the NW.  They must eat normal during the day and then realize at night "hey wait a minute...I'm still hungry." 

Last night this was us...
5pm cluster
7pm feed before bed
7:30 out like a light!
9:00 wake - who knows (that went on for a little bit)
10:00 DF (2 little ozs)
3:00 am wake - again, who knows...did not feed
5:45 awake for the day...held her off until 6:00 to E

If I could count on 10-6 every night I'd be thrilled!!!!!!!!  But who knows.  It was her third night in her room over night (she's always napped there, but slept in our room in bassinett).  Maybe she's just getting used to it.  The first 2 nights I had that darn monitor turned all the way up in fear that I wouldn't hear her (I know, paranoid).  Last night, I put it at a normal level so I think I slept through her noisy sleeping (she turns her head a lot and makes little sighs and laughs).  The first two nights I literally slept about 2 minutes as I heard everything and thought she constantly needed me.  Maybe I was waking her?  That's why I moved her from my room in the first place - I know I thought she was waking when she'd just be getting comfy or something, so I'd wake her by touching her or bothering her.  I miss her in my room, but for all our sleep I think it's probably best   Plus, the longer you wait the worse it gets (I know...I waited until almost 6 mos with my 1st...that was rough!) 

I might need to wean that swaddle though...early morn. she managed to get the miracle blanket all wrapped around her neck as she got her legs out and then wiggled her arms until it was all wrapped around her neck - YIKES!  Don't think she can sleep without it...anyone have success without swaddle at this age?

[MJMom]

I stopped using the swaddle at 3 mos for night sleep and 4 for naps.  My LO was a thrasher and it freaked me out.  At least naps, I could look in on her every 10 minutes.

pbmom- seems pretty common that the tired signs get harder and harder to see the older the LO gets.  Its a pretty darn cool world out there that they want to learn all about!!!  but the swings in A time are common too.

kris dg- as pbmom says, the older your child gets, the harder it is to break any AP going on. 

[pbmom]

Alright girls - please tell me I'm not insane...my lo has only napped today for 2 hr total and it's 5:30 and she's been up since 5:45 - HELLO?  I'm not sure what I am now doing wrong.  Nothing has changed except she's teething (I think) and trying really hard to roll herself over.  We now have NW and can't get naps consistent.  One day she does 2 1/5 -2 hr naps and the next she does one good nap and crap the rest of the day.  At first 4 hr easy was great...I though it was a miracle.  Before I switched to 4 hr easy I had a 12 hr night (later bedtime 8:30ish) and 45 minute naps.  Then I had better napping, but now, I have this:

NW 3-4 am NW (ate at 4am)
A   5:45 up for the day
E   7:00 am
S   7:30 - 9 nap (1.5 hrs - YEAH!)
E   11:00 E (falling asleep at bottle)
S   11:30 - 12:20 (tried to extend - no luck)
     Tried to put her down again at 1:30 based on cues...no luck (spent a long time)
A    12:30 - 2:15
S    2:15 - 2:35 (in swing - that's never happened before - oops)
E    3:00 (falling asleep again - tried to put her down...not having it)
A    3:30 - 5:15
S    5:15 - still sleeping now (it's 5:40)

What is going on??? 

Thanks for letting me vent - I feel better now

[momofclaire]

pbmom,
Do you have your own post going somewhere as well? If not, would you mind starting one?  I would like to be able to see the whole story together...KWIM?